Support NeoGAF

[Plinko]

Apparently Mitt Romney didn't fully disclose all of his tax returns for 2010.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/...2010_n_1683084.html?utm_hp_ref=elections-2012

Mitt Romney has not released his full tax records from 2010, including key documentation connected to his Swiss bank account.

L

O

L

This guy is screwed on the tax issue alone. I have a feeling people are going to go crazy when they finally see the bookwork done so he can evade taxes.

It's actually a good thing this is coming out now, as it might bring more mainstream attention to how most corporations do this and get away with it. Would be nice to see some real, actual NEEDED tax reform.

 

[empty vessel]

Can someone explain to me how does it makes sense to tax consumption rather than income?
This makes zero economic sense to me.

It doesn't make sense. Taxing consumption--or, rather, eliminating the income tax--eliminates the government's ability to use tax policy to enhance equality. (Of course, the government over the last two decades has been using tax policy to reduce equality, but that's a political problem.)

 

[GhaleonEB]

Effectively, we're seeking a similar outcome. The majority must be respected and the Senate allowed to function, yet we must also protect the deliberative process. If we could ensure the access of the minority party to the debate, I'd support the fifth provision. Alternatively, as I noted earlier, the second provision would largely solve the problem. Further, the procedural filibuster should be eliminated as its only purpose is to impede legislation and inhibit the Senate from functioning properly. It does not enhance the deliberative process.

I felt the need to get specific because our dialog had become somewhat abstract. I think we agree on the desired outcome, but I wanted to illustrate some specific means by which that can be achieved. In particular, while deliberative debate should be preserved, the minority party should not have veto power over the majority's ability to govern.

 

[Chichikov]

I think it brings in more revenue. I also think there are refunds for lower income.

I don't really understand that statement.
Like, a 1% VAT doesn't bring more revenue than a 40% flat income tax, right? (picking numbers out of my ass).

The government need a certain level of revenue, we can get it through numerous forms of taxation, we can do it through VAT, income tax or a combination of both.
I just think that consumption taxes are economically stupid.

 

[Jackson50]

Juche was meant as a joke, you can use other ways. Historically Republican's are viewed in polls as being more capable in FP than Dems, and Demos in Domestic than FP. I think it's an area of usefulness for them to play around with especially to the more Ron Paul end of the field (drones, "Killing" a US Citizen, etc). They shouldn't concede it.

Oh, riotous joke. And although Republicans were typically perceived as stronger on defense, Obama consistently polls well on foreign affairs. Moreover, I don't think it's useful. Obama receives approval from the public, and it's mostly inconsequential electorally. Obviously, Romney will have to present a counterpoint. But they're not going to solicit Paul and his acolytes. That's diametric to mainstream Republican foreign policy.

When has that stopped anyone, same with the truth of the claim?

Where did I claim it stopped anyone? The lack of credibility is one the principal reasons everyone has ignored their fatuous attacks on Obama. Please, attack Obama relentlessly for being cravenly apologetic-actually, they already have. They're simply being disregarded.

I felt the need to get specific because our dialog had become somewhat abstract. I think we agree on the desired outcome, but I wanted to illustrate some specific means by which that can be achieved. In particular, while deliberative debate should be preserved, the minority party should not have veto power over the majority's ability to govern.

Yeah. The proposals you listed would adequately preserve the deliberative process while respecting the majority.

 

[Baraka in the White House]

Some interesting senate floor action this morning:



http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs...san-impasse-more-ceos-need-to-lobby-congress/

Mitch McConnell is such a fucking turd. He's literally a shit stain on the Republican party.

 

[Loudninja]

Mitt Romney Still Undecided on V.P. Pick, Wife Says

"We're not quite there yet," Ann Romney told ABC's Robin Roberts of her husband's thinking in an exclusive interview to air Thursday on "Good Morning America."

"We are certainly talking a lot. This last week, this last weekend, there was a lot of discussion," she said. "There was a lot of talk. We're not quite there yet. And we're going to be there soon."

http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/mitt-romney-undecided-vp-pick-wife/story?id=16802807#.UAcBPaDdf6S

 

[Crisco]

So is the amnesty thing basically confirmed at this point? That would be a helluva an October surprise.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

Romney’s New Plan To Go After Obama’s Biography Is A Gamble

Republican activists have long complained that their leaders are too timid in going after President Obama. For better or for worse, they may finally get their dream campaign.

Romney surrogate John Sununu raised eyebrows Tuesday by bringing up President Obama’s teenage marijuana use and suggesting his time in Indonesia as a child may have given him a muddled sense of America. But subsequent reports suggest it was no accident, as the Romney campaign preps a more personal line of attack against the president.

Unamed aides to Romney told both Buzzfeed and NBC that they plan to step up their game, possibly including attacks on Obama’s biography that have up to this point been solely the domain of right-wing media.

“Obama is setting a trap, and Romney is not a Chicago street fighter,” unaligned GOP consultant Ford O’Connell told TPM. “If Romney dabbles in this tit-for-tat style of political warfare for too long, he will lose.”

O’Connell called on Romney to stick to his existing script, “focused on the problems affecting Americans and the president’s abysmal record.”

“All of the polling shows that the public approves of Obama’s character by even greater amounts than his issue numbers,” Eddie Vale, a spokesman for labor super PAC, said in an e-mail. “These attacks won’t stick because they don’t fit into a frame people believe.”

A June Gallup poll showed 60 percent of voters described Obama as “honest and trustworthy,” one of his higest rated personal characteristics, and higher than 50 percent for Romney.

###

 

[Black Mamba]

With the tax-filing deadline looming, Republican Senate candidate Mitt Romney yesterday challenged Sen. Edward M. Kennedy to disclose his state and federal taxes to prove he has ‘nothing to hide,’ but another GOP rival, John R. Lakian, called Romney’s move ‘bush league’ ‘It’s time the biggest-taxing senator in Washington shows the people of Massachusetts how much he pays in taxes,” said Romney, a business consultant from Belmont. Romney said he would disclose his own state and federal taxes for the last three years ‘on the very day that Kennedy turns over his taxes for public scrutiny.’ [Boston Globe, 4/19/94]

LOLOL

Oh Mittens. You just can't do anything right. You even flip flopped on releasing tax records!

 

[RDreamer]

###

Was just about to post this. Seems like a really LOL strategy to me. Also seems like precisely where the Obama campaign wants to lead them.

It's just funny that amidst all the "Why isn't he running on his record?" and "We should be attacking him on his record" stuff the republicans have rightly been throwing around, they're still going to come to this again...

 

[PhoenixDark]

I'm not a fan of speculation based on no evidence, although the amnesty story is interesting. We'll find out soon enough. If it's true, it wouldn't be far fetched to believe the Obama administration knows all the details, considering the IRS crack down happened in 2009.

 

[worldrunover]

Was just about to post this. Seems like a really LOL strategy to me. Also seems like precisely where the Obama campaign wants to lead them.

It's just funny that amidst all the "Why isn't he running on his record?" and "We should be attacking him on his record" stuff the republicans have rightly been throwing around, they're still going to come to this again...

Exactly. Obama has already been vetted to the hilt, been called everything from a Muslim to a terrorist to a socialist, etc... and that was just during the '08 campaign. People didn't care then, they won't care now.

 

[RustyNails]

Pleeeease go after Obama's biography! It's quite literally the only thing missing in this election.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

I'm not a fan of speculation based on no evidence, although the amnesty story is interesting. We'll find out soon enough. If it's true, it wouldn't be far fetched to believe the Obama administration knows all the details, considering the IRS crack down happened in 2009.

What amnesty story?

 

[Aaron Strife]

I'm not a fan of speculation based on no evidence, although the amnesty story is interesting. We'll find out soon enough. If it's true, it wouldn't be far fetched to believe the Obama administration knows all the details, considering the IRS crack down happened in 2009.

I feel like if it were true, Obama's campaign would be saving it for after the convention. They're building a narrative about Romney being secretive about his tax returns, and then oops, he committed a felony!

Reveal it now and the GOP might opt to pick someone else at the convention.

I don't think OFA would be saying "What is in that guy's tax returns anyway" unless they could see an endgame where Romney's tax returns are released or leaked somehow and there's some shady shit in there.

 

[Black Mamba]

What amnesty story?

The IRS announced in 2009 a partial tax amnesty for unreported foreign bank accounts, in light of the Justice Department's criminal investigations involving several Swiss banks. To date, some 34,500 Americans have taken advantage of such amnesty programs. Did the Romneys avail themselves of any of these amnesty programs? One hopes that such a suggestion is preposterous, but that is what disclosure is for -- to replace speculation with truth-telling to the American people.

cnn

 

[RDreamer]

Lol, from here:

"[Romney] has said Obama's a nice fellow, he's just in over his head," the adviser said. "But I think the governor himself believes this latest round of attacks that have impugned his integrity and accused him of being a felon go so far beyond that pale that he's really disappointed. He believes it's time to vet the president. He really hasn't been vetted; McCain didn't do it."

Besides the stupidity of thinking Romney was being accused of being a felon... Romney's own advisers are sticking with the "he has never been vetted" crap, too.

Also this partial quote

...and highlight questions about the the Obama campaign's transparency, the Romney adviser said.

Uh... You may not want to get into a transparency pissing match... you know... considering the whole tax release thing. Just saying.

 

[Al-ibn Kermit]

Then shouldn't people claiming Amazon should collect sales taxes realize that they are only hurting the middle and lower class?

The main argument is that not having to charge tax gives Amazon an unfair advantage over the competition.

Obviously states can set their own sales taxes so a consumption tax/VAT isn't really relevant to the situation with Amazon since it still gives them cheaper prices than the local retailers.

 

[electricpirate]

VAT taxes have some nice features, for example they are dirt simple and hard to dodge (like with swiss bank accounts). It's cheap to enforce, and the taxes are paid along every step of the way (ending up at the consumer.) Building an entire taxation system around them would be dramatically less progressive though.

The other argument I hear a lot is that it rewards saving and investment. I'm not totally sold here, as right now our economy probalby needs more consumption, and less saving, especially in the business sector.

It's also extremely flat, which conservative econmists see as a feature, not a bug. Though there are ways to get around that.

I dunno, if we used a regressive VAT that helped fund liberal goals I'd be okay with it personally.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

The main argument is that not having to charge tax gives Amazon an unfair advantage over the competition.

Obviously states can set their own sales taxes so a consumption tax/VAT isn't really relevant to the situation with Amazon since it still gives them cheaper prices than the local retailers.

Charity and compassion to the poor!

 

[markatisu]

Pleeeease go after Obama's biography! It's quite literally the only thing missing in this election.

The circle back to 2008 will be complete then LOL

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Guys something is happening to me. The more I research politics and history the more "radical" I become with my viewpoints. Is this normal?

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Reveal it now and the GOP might opt to pick someone else at the convention.

doing so would basically guarantee that person lost. It's too late in the cycle now to replace the candidate without it being basically handing the election to Obama.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

Guys something is happening to me. The more I research politics and history the more "radical" I become with my viewpoints. Is this normal?

Aren't you still in College?

 

[The Technomancer]

doing so would basically guarantee that person lost. It's too late in the cycle now to replace the candidate without it being basically handing the election to Obama.

It would be hilarious though.

 

[adamsappel]

I'm not a fan of speculation based on no evidence, although the amnesty story is interesting. We'll find out soon enough. If it's true, it wouldn't be far fetched to believe the Obama administration knows all the details, considering the IRS crack down happened in 2009.

You're not suggesting Obama knows anything via the IRS, are you? That's Nixonian levels of illegality.

 

[Aaron Strife]

doing so would basically guarantee that person lost. It's too late in the cycle now to replace the candidate without it being basically handing the election to Obama.

True, but they could always put someone "respectable" up as a consensus candidate and mitigate any losses downballot. They can't do much worse than Romney.

 

[PhoenixDark]

You're not suggesting Obama knows anything via the IRS, are you? That's Nixonian levels of illegality.

Yes, I am. It doesn't have to be direct: it could have been leaked to the White House. I'm not justifying it, just saying it's possible for them to know this information

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Aren't you still in College?

No.

 

[Chichikov]

Yes, I am. It doesn't have to be direct: it could have been leaked to the White House.

Let me go on the record and say that he's should be impeached and thrown to jail if he done this.
Also, you're crazy, but that was already on the record .

 

[PantherLotus]

If it was via the IRS, that would seem like an abuse of power. If it was via the McCain (or other) op-ed dump, then it would be obvious to go after it.

Remember though: amnesty means you can't be prosecuted!

 

[Chumly]

Guys something is happening to me. The more I research politics and history the more "radical" I become with my viewpoints. Is this normal?

That happened to me once I started into politics.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

No.

Hmm, that usually is one of the causes. Partially it's viewing things and attempting to apply them to current day situations even when it doesn't really fit and feeling a course of action/solution is needed due to history. Learning the lesson's of history is important, but just as important is learning how to analysis and apply it correctly.

 

[RustyNails]

Yes, I am. It doesn't have to be direct: it could have been leaked to the White House. I'm not justifying it, just saying it's possible for them to know this information

Does the Obama campaign look that desperate to you? They're waging a full blown insurgency on Romney campaign. Romney is drowning out and swinging wildly. It would either have to be IRS coming forth or some ex-McCain staffer tell-it-all.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Obama dominating among Latinos

 

[Flying_Phoenix]

Hmm, that usually is one of the causes. Partially it's viewing things and attempting to apply them to current day situations even when it doesn't really fit and feeling a course of action/solution is needed due to history. Learning the lesson's of history is important, but just as important is learning how to analysis and apply it correctly.

I completely realize this. Its actual part of my core beliefs. Also nice new avatar.

EDIT - To be fair though that isn't really a left wing issue as the right wing has serious problems with this is as well (Many Libertarians are a basket case for this). I don't know while my views are radical they are far different than your typical Noam Chomsky, save the environment by riding bikes, and Political Science 101 liberal.

 

[luoapp]

Let me go on the record and say that he's should be impeached and thrown to jail if he done this.
Also, you're crazy, but that was already on the record .

It's very unethical, but is it really illegal? Why shouldn't the President be able to see the IRS record, which is part of the Federal government. How does the firewall work here?

 

[The Librarian]

Let me go on the record and say that he's should be impeached and thrown to jail if he done this.
Also, you're crazy, but that was already on the record .

Obama would not be that goddamn stupid.

 

[RustyNails]

It's very unethical, but is it really illegal? Why shouldn't the President be able to see the IRS record, which is part of the Federal government. How does the firewall work here?

Well ask yourself if the President should have unlimited authority to go over the tax records of you and me.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Obama would not be that goddamn stupid.

He might be desperate enough

 

[luoapp]

Well ask yourself if the President should have unlimited authority to go over the tax records of you and me.

I don't want a lot of things by the gov, but that's not the point here.

 

[PantherLotus]

Has anything Obama has done during the entirety of his political career make anyone think he would do that? I'm not being naive here, I'm looking at strategy and the long-view.

This goes back to a post I made last week I think -- when's the last time a President had this spotless* of a record? Say what we will about some of the Bush policies he's continued, I see nothing to indicate he would overstep his power to attack his political enemies. Talk about hysteria.

*Not including birtherism and made up controversies like F&F.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

I completely realize this. Its actual part of my core beliefs. Also nice new avatar.

Thank you!

EDIT - To be fair though that isn't really a left wing issue as the right wing has serious problems with this is as well (Many Libertarians are a basket case for this). I don't know while my views are radical they are far different than your typical Noam Chomsky, save the environment by riding bikes, and Political Science 101 liberal.

I agree, I didn't mean to imply only one end of the spectrum, though I think the tilt towards the far left is more common, but also that people tend to feel, an almost high of you will, that they can change the world, they are being exposed to the truth and so, regardless of the actual side. I just think it's pretty common and that many people lose that when they leave, for either the realities of the working world and/or that radical solutions (of one subset) are real approaches to issues.

 

[Manos: The Hans of Fate]

Obama would not be that goddamn stupid.

Kennedy was apparently as him and Nixon, both liked using the IRS for political means.

made up controversies like F&F.[/I]

Made up? Really?

 

[NathanMcMahon]

uhoh:

Mitt Romney Never Thought He'd Have To Release Tax Returns: Bain Sources

WASHINGTON -- Mitt Romney has been determined to resist releasing his tax returns at least since his bid for Massachusetts governor in 2002 and has been confident that he will never be forced to do so, several current and former Bain executives tell The Huffington Post. Had he thought otherwise, say the sources based on their longtime understanding of Romney, he never would have gone forward with his run for president.

 

[gutter_trash]

Obama dominating among Latinos

LOL at the GOP erasing the efforts made by Bush 43 with his Texan Governor experience.

only Jeb in 2016 could ever get the Latino vote back to Bush 43 levels

 

[AlteredBeast]

uhoh:

Mitt Romney Never Thought He'd Have To Release Tax Returns: Bain Sources

Sounds retarded.

 

[cartoon_soldier]

LOL at the GOP erasing the efforts made by Bush 43 with his Texan Governor experience.

only Jeb in 2016 could ever get the Latino vote back to Bush 43 levels

Polling right now is useless. Ignore it.

 

[ClovingWestbrook]

uhoh:

Mitt Romney Never Thought He'd Have To Release Tax Returns: Bain Sources

loll if this is true, I really REALLY want to see these returns.