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PoliGAF 2012 |OT3| If it's not a legitimate OT the mods have ways to shut it down

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That quote was from codhand.

The general sentiment though - that Romney was going to flail - was endorsed by most people in this thread.

I don't think you have a good grasp on what the overall sentiment was before going into the debate. I'll just quote some of my posts:

I don't think you have a grasp on how our media responds to presidential debates. When they give analysis they are not that open ended. What normally happens is that they present the two sides and point out where they think the candidates did a good job or bad. They don't talk about how a campaign is in shreds unless they already lean politically one way. That gives the impression that it is over. Also, Obama does have a higher bar. He is the president. He has to answer rightly or wrongly for what has happen in the last four years. All that is expect of Romney in the first debate is that he be competent and appear like he can be president. That is it. If there is any tightening in the polls afterwards, then the media is going to attribute it as a success for Romney. And I believe the polls are going to tighten. There is no way that Obama gets above 53 or 54 percent unless Romney has a complete meltdown.

Also, I think Obama is going to be very conservative in the debates. He is not going to stick his neck out. He'll just do average because he is ahead in the polls and doesn't really need to do anything.

Romney is going to be perceived as the winner of the first debate barring any major gaffe. It will be the first time he has been elevated to that position and will appear right next to the president himself. That alone carries weight with some. As also mention the bar for Obama to clear will be higher than Romney's own. More is expected of the man in charge. The question we should be asking is he going to do something dramatic to shake the race up?

The question in that last quote is the one we should be asking and not who won the debate. Has Romney actually done anything to change the overall trajectory of the race? My answer would be no. I could get what Romney was selling tonight from any 24-hour news channel with a Republican surrogate. The only difference was that he had to say that to Obama's face. But what he said will not have the level of impact on non-partisan voters as some claim.
 
Wow @ the chicken littles.

Romney won a debate but he didn't hurt Obama. There is a big difference, there.

Also, Romney didn't win on medicare (vouchers will not go over well). I think it was the tax thing that Obama should have nailed him for but didn't.

I think Obama will do better on the town hall when things like abortion, gay rights, etc are brought up.
 
Seeing some new Obama Facebook and web ads, starting to think he did not really give a shit about winning and was mining Romney for enough stupid to run more ads lol

Would not be shocked to see ads over the next few days surface with things Romney said

I think they are really happy with his voucher line.
 
This time last year I was deployed, so I missed the last go-around but are all Presidential debates this superficial? I'm reading reviews and comments around here and other places as I watch and honestly its shocking.

People are talking "crushing victories" and/or "game-changers" but honestly I found both of the canidates lacking in anything resembling substance. Can anybody elaborate to me what they found so great in the performances?
 
Does anyone here think that Obama should have gone all in on Mitt and dropped things the American people already know, i.e. 47% and whatnot?

Not sure what good it would have done him to come off like that.

The more I think about it, he probably could have done a better job calling him out on his lies but, the reality is, Mitt would have just continued to rebuke it and it would have gone nowhere at all.

Obama prolly scored the most damage by detailing what he would do and letting the fact checkers do the rest.
 

XenodudeX

Junior Member
Does anyone here think that Obama should have gone all in on Mitt and dropped things the American people already know, i.e. 47% and whatnot?

Not sure what good it would have done him to come off like that.

The more I think about it, he probably could have done a better job calling him out on his lies but, the reality is, Mitt would have just continued to rebuke it and it would have gone nowhere at all.

Obama prolly scored the most damage by detailing what he would do and letting the fact checkers do the rest.

I think he should of pushed back a bit harder on mitt lies.
 

Averon

Member
Does anyone here think that Obama should have gone all in on Mitt and dropped things the American people already know, i.e. 47% and whatnot?

Not sure what good it would have done him to come off like that.

The more I think about it, he probably could have done a better job calling him out on his lies but, the reality is, Mitt would have just continued to rebuke it and it would have gone nowhere at all.

Obama prolly scored the most damage by detailing what he would do and letting the fact checkers do the rest.

He also got Romney to admit he's for vouchers for Medicare. That will not go well in Florida.
 
This time last year I was deployed, so I missed the last go-around but are all Presidential debates this superficial? I'm reading reviews and comments around here and other places as I watch and honestly its shocking.

People are talking "crushing victories" and/or "game-changers" but honestly I found both of the canidates lacking in anything resembling substance. Can anybody elaborate to me what they found so great in the performances?

Paraphrasing here but Mitt Romney was louder, ruder, and more obnoxious than Obama. Seriously don't see why anyone thinks he's won the debate when half of the stuff Romney spouted off has already been debunked or exposed as half truths by fact checkers already and I am sure they'll find more by tomorrow. As we all know though Romney's campaign will not be dictated by fact checkers.
 

Zabka

Member
Does anyone here think that Obama should have gone all in on Mitt and dropped things the American people already know, i.e. 47% and whatnot?

Not sure what good it would have done him to come off like that.

The more I think about it, he probably could have done a better job calling him out on his lies but, the reality is, Mitt would have just continued to rebuke it and it would have gone nowhere at all.

Obama prolly scored the most damage by detailing what he would do and letting the fact checkers do the rest.

Romney probably had several responses prepared for the expected attack lines.
 
I think he should of pushed back a bit harder on mitt lies.

I watched some of the replays.

Each time he did, Mitt just pivoted, calling the President a liar. It got increasingly fruitless to continue with that line of argument.

He moved on to just spelling out his platform, making voters aware that they could read up on his proposals online.

A "no, u" back and forth would have just muddled the debate even further.

Romney probably had several responses prepared for the expected attack lines.

Also, this.
 

kaching

"GAF's biggest wanker"
The more I think about it, he probably could have done a better job calling him out on his lies but, the reality is, Mitt would have just continued to rebuke it and it would have gone nowhere at all.
Right, and there was already enough of that in the debate anyway, thanks to the almost complete lack of moderation.
 
Does anyone here think that Obama should have gone all in on Mitt and dropped things the American people already know, i.e. 47% and whatnot?

Not sure what good it would have done him to come off like that.

The more I think about it, he probably could have done a better job calling him out on his lies but, the reality is, Mitt would have just continued to rebuke it and it would have gone nowhere at all.

Obama prolly scored the most damage by detailing what he would do and letting the fact checkers do the rest.

I sort of do, but in an offhand way. I would have said (which I posted earlier) that I bailed the auto-industry out, for example, and helped thousands of middle class families that didn't vote for me because I thought it was important to help everyone. You have to lead for everyone. I would never claim that I don't work for them.

Something like that.


Obama screwed up with the tax policy by not taking it head on earlier.

"Governor Romney is claiming he'll cut taxes across the board and it won't lose revenues. But that's simply not true. If you cut out all the deductions by high income earners, it's not enough. And if you read the studies he claims support his tax plan they say 2 things. First, that you have to raise taxes on people Mitt is on record as saying are Middle Class and second, it requires a wild assumption of economic growth in a best case possible scenario. Now this is what the studies that he claim support him says. But we've already seen that argument in 2001 and 2003 and the fact of the matter is it was proven wrong. We had the worst period of jobs growth, investment, and income inequality since WWII as a result. Contrast that to the 90s under Clinton and the tax rates on the wealthy I'm talking about when we grew blah blah. So we have a clear choice. We can either try again something that's been proven not to work on the false promise of magical growth or we can do what we know has worked in the past - what works for the middle class."

Later I would have said "The Governor is proposing to cut taxes by 20%, increase the military by $2 billion, and somehow the american people are supposed to believe the Governor's plans will reduce the deficit? This is a a real choice here and the Governor believes the American People are inept at math. I don't believe that."

He touched on some of that but it took him a long time and it wasn't cohesive.

I'd get all up in him with his taxes. And I swear he should have asked "Do you think it's fair when you, governor, pay less in taxes than a middle class family making $45k?" What could Mitt's response be here that is positive? He'd be fucked.


And another thing...you call out the lies by demanding answers. "The Governor says he'd repeal Obamacare, but he won't say what he'd actually replace it with. I'd like to know. What is Mitt Romney's plan to put people into insurance?" When it inevitably is leave it to the states "Well, we already left it to the states for years and nothing got done in almost all of them. One that did something was the Governor's and that's why we adopted that model."
 
Does anyone here think that Obama should have gone all in on Mitt and dropped things the American people already know, i.e. 47% and whatnot?

Not sure what good it would have done him to come off like that.

The more I think about it, he probably could have done a better job calling him out on his lies but, the reality is, Mitt would have just continued to rebuke it and it would have gone nowhere at all.

Obama prolly scored the most damage by detailing what he would do and letting the fact checkers do the rest.

I don't know if he should have, but I wanted him too.
 

jiggle

Member
I think he should of pushed back a bit harder on mitt lies.

obama's not the one looking for a hail mary with the debates
no reason to take a very aggressive stand
esp when even his tone of voice will be scrutinized
saying "you lied!" in a debate is not exactly effective imo

it would've been more entertaining though!
 
As I went to play some basketball to clear my head after the debate I realized I had this feeling earlier this year during the Nintendo presser at E3. Nintendo (Obama) had E3 (the election) in the palm of their hand and it was their's to give away. A less than stellar showing (both were far from the best but I didn't think either was as bad as some) set a narrative of despair and gave the show to Sony (Romney) nearly by default (though Romney had a better performance while Sony had much more substance). The media narrative was not kind to Nintendo and the Wii U was declared dead in the water. But then preorders went up and quickly sold out and now you can't find one anywhere. E3 has become increasingly unimportant to the general public and Nintendo (Obama) kind of treated it that way. So while we have our story coming out of the show, it will not become the lasting moment that dictates the trajectory of the Wii U (Obama's campaign).

At least there weren't Nintendo Land fireworks (though I will have fun with that game).


(This is far from a 1:1 analogy and please leave any 'well I like Obama and am not buying a Wii U' or similar comments out, that's not my point)
 
Ironic how much of the media narrative is about how Obama sucked because he didn't call out Romney's lies instead of the fact that Romney lied.
 

HylianTom

Banned
I think that this Big Bird thing might have legs. It's all over Twitter & Facebook. Looks like the Dems are trying their best to make hay out of it. At the very least, this might not help his cold image..

Quite a curiosity. This could dog him for a while, or die-off in 72 hours.
 
Who knows? Obama and Romney may have made a gentlemen's pact to keep it strictly on the topics and not drag in campaign messages.

No 47% and no 5 year old Rev. Wright video.

Leave that stuff for tomorrow, on the trail.
 
Ironic how much of the media narrative is about how Obama sucked because he didn't call out Romney's lies instead of the fact that Romney lied.

lol, too true.

But I think the point here is that the undecided voter is pretty...well fill in the blanks there...and from that perspective not calling out lies that person is unaware of is bad form.
 

isoquant

Member
I don't think you have a good grasp on what the overall sentiment was before going into the debate. I'll just quote some of my posts


Well done. Except that a single person's comments aren't at all indicative of general sentiment.

Are people really forgetting the endless snark about Mitt and his debate skills: 'Mitt is a robot' (in fact I think someone suggested the debate thread be called 'Obama v Deep Blue'); 'Mitt needs to be empathetic but the trouble is he can't relate to real people'; 'Mitt needs to take risks on stage but last time he tried he ended up making that $10,000 bet'; 'trouble with a debate is that Mitt can't lie because he will get called out on it by Obama'; 'lolol Mitt couldn't even beat Santorum/Cain/Gingrich'?


Anyway, although the race will probably tighten as a result of this, Obama is too far ahead in key states like Ohio to lose it from here. Debates, gaffes etc. are usually way overblown by the media.
 

Chichikov

Member
I thought Romney did win the debate, pretty handily, though he was aided by no small amount by being fast and loose with the fact.
I have no idea how this will play out, but then again, my brain can barely comprehend how people can truly be undecided at this point.

p.s.
I went to see a movie and when the new (and by the looks of it, hilariously awful) Red Dawn trailer came out, someone shouting "Thanks Obama!".
Good times.
 

bananas

Banned
Best thing to come out of the debate thread:

f8Ytw.jpg
 
ugh i have a friend who is just retweeting uninformed black voters tweets. Never though even the republicans friends I had would fall into the racist game.
p.s.
I went to see a movie and when the new (and by the looks of it, hilariously awful) Red Dawn trailer came out, someone shouting "Thanks Obama!".
Good times.

Manos should be allowed back for that one thread.
 

isoquant

Member
The debate thread is glorious.

Obama voters proclaiming it's all over, they're giving up on politics etc.

flippymittens trolling by saying that everyone on gaf could do a better job as president than Obama
 
Paraphrasing here but Mitt Romney was louder, ruder, and more obnoxious than Obama. Seriously don't see why anyone thinks he's won the debate when half of the stuff Romney spouted off has already been debunked or exposed as half truths by fact checkers already and I am sure they'll find more by tomorrow. As we all know though Romney's campaign will not be dictated by fact checkers.
Obama should have pushed back a bit more and spoke faster.

Romney would spew out a bunch of misinformation. Obama would push back on 1 of 5 points of nonsense then start on his own material. The leaves the impression of the other 4 bits of nonsense going unchallenged are presumably valid points.

This reminded me a lot of theist v. atheist debates with William Lane Craig. He's a theist that spouts a lot of well-polished nonsense that sounds good to the casual listener. He does it in rapid fire form. And in his responses, he tends to hit on every point the other person said. Thus, he is a very very good debater even though what he is saying is a lot of poppycock.
 

watershed

Banned
Seriously people...

page0_blog_entry205-obama-i-got-this.jpg

His campaign is far superior to Romney's but tonight Romney was the better candidate on that stage. He understood the debates as a matter of performance not nuance or complexity of ideas. Romney sold policies he's never even detailed before, but he sold them in an effective way. An incumbent President in this economic environment was always going to be at a disadvantage heading into the first debate but tonight Romney was on while Obama was sleeping.
 

Jackson50

Member
I just watched the debate on delay. Haven't had a chance to read this thread yet. It was clearly a crushing win for Romney.

After all the shit poligaf has been talking for months about Obama being the 'best debater in a generation' and how Romney was going to get slammed etc... Methinks the following picture is appropriate:

eating-crow.jpg
I'll season it with the salt of every pessimist on Election Day. Yum! Yum!
I'm actually a bit infuriated that the only person to address this image in the past six hours has been troll-mode PD.
It conflicts with their desire to create mountains out of molehills. So they ignore it.
yea ok whatever The complete denial of reality here is stunning. Obama looked completely lost, and EVERY poll shows that.

Let me get this straight: you guys believe there is no way Obama loses this election (barring some colossal event/scandal/etc). Debates don't matter, the campaign doesn't matter, nothing matters - Obama is up, and will stay up. He's ahead in swing states, and will remain ahead in swing states.

Obama winning in of itself would be a reversal of previous trends: presidents with bad economies and 8% unemployment usually don't get re-elected. He's currently on the path to proving that trend wrong. Yet you guys cannot acknowledge that we could instead see another reversal of a trend: the candidate ahead at this point almost always wins.
You're trolling, and I understand that. Tonight is your night. So it's not worthwhile to refute every erroneous point you've made. But it is instructive to address your last point as it's a recurring notion despite having been refuted multiple times in this thread. Obama's victory would not be a reversal of previous trends. The mistake with your premise is it ignores the context of the economy. The proximate performance of the economy correlates with an incumbent's performance. The overall level of unemployment is uninformative outside that context. And the proximate performance has been moderately positive. Hence, Obama's actually the modest favorite based on the economy. So, have you seen the polls lately?
If we're going to post songs I heard unceasingly while riding the bus in junior high, this is apt for cartoon_soldier, diablos, and a surprising number of posters.
 

Allard

Member
His campaign is far superior to Romney's but tonight Romney was the better candidate on that stage. He understood the debates as a matter of performance not nuance or complexity of ideas. Romney sold policies he's never even detailed before, but he sold them in an effective way. An incumbent President in this economic environment was always going to be at a disadvantage heading into the first debate but tonight Romney was on while Obama was sleeping.

What policies? The lies that will be fact checked later this week, or the non-answers he expertly dodged once again?
 

Doc Holliday

SPOILER: Columbus finds America
Obama should have pushed back a bit more and spoke faster.

Romney would spew out a bunch of misinformation. Obama would push back on 1 of 5 points of nonsense then start on his own material. The leaves the impression of the other 4 bits of nonsense going unchallenged are presumably valid points.

This reminded me a lot of theist v. atheist debates with William Lane Craig. He's a theist that spouts a lot of well-polished nonsense that sounds good to the casual listener. He does it in rapid fire form. And in his responses, he tends to hit on every point the other person said. Thus, he is a very very good debater even though what he is saying is a lot of poppycock.

God this man is annoying as hell. I watched him debate Harris and it was maddening. Its weird because he uses logic to argue the illogical.
 
“A guy with a tax account in the Cayman Islands is attacking other people for not wanting to pay income tax?” Bill Clinton asked Wednesday. “That’s like Congressman Ryan attacking President Obama for having the same Medicare savings he did. When you really bust somebody for doing what you did, it takes a lot of gall.”

God, Bill would have wiped the floor with Mittens, tonight.

http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-pn-bill-clinton-romney-taxes-debt-20121003,0,6581196.story

Need to get Bill out there more and more. Also coach Obama a bit. There's a couple lines he should have used tonight.

"“So their debt plan is to make it $7 trillion worse!” he said. “How can you take this seriously?”
 

Badgerst3

Member
His campaign is far superior to Romney's but tonight Romney was the better candidate on that stage. He understood the debates as a matter of performance not nuance or complexity of ideas. Romney sold policies he's never even detailed before, but he sold them in an effective way. An incumbent President in this economic environment was always going to be at a disadvantage heading into the first debate but tonight Romney was on while Obama was sleeping.

Perfectly put.
 
God this man is annoying as hell. I watched him debate Harris and it was maddening. Its weird because he uses logic to argue the illogical.
Yeah, isn't he? He's got these neat little packaged arguments that each have camouflaged fallacies in them. But if you are not familiar with them they'll sound good. And he is very effective at just point by point addressing EVERYTHING. He is very annoying but he is certainly good at what he does.
 

Averon

Member
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/10/04/u...ohio-voters-are-less-than-thrilled.html?_r=1&

At Debate-Watching Party in Suburban Ohio, Voters Are Less Than Thrilled

The first night of truly must-see TV this fall season for the Gardner and Jernigan families in this suburb of Columbus was the first presidential debate Wednesday evening between President Obama and Mitt Romney, the Republican challenger.

Mr. Gardner was open to being swayed, but said he was leaning toward Mr. Obama.

Brent Jernigan, 48, a business consultant who is married to Ms. Jernigan and likes Mr. Obama, is the ultimate solo fact checker. It was his fact-checking on Facebook that cost him his aunt’s friendship. What did those gathered here want out of the candidates’ performance?

“I want to see an actual plan from Romney,” Mr. Jernigan said. “I’d like to see Obama be very forceful in defending his own actions as president. And I wouldn’t be opposed to a highly entertaining moment from Romney, something like, ‘I can see Russia from my house!’ ”

After the debate, the group did not shift their views. “I don’t know the specifics of these things, so some of it didn’t mean a lot to me,” said Mr. Gardner, the host. “Like I said before we started, I hate the ‘I’m going to repeal what you did and do something that’s better!’ Who doesn’t want to hear that? Basically nothing changed for me.”

...

“I was really kind of hoping Romney would say some stuff that I’d understand, as far as what his plans are,” Ms. Jernigan said. “And I don’t feel that this has clarified anything for me.”

Ms. Gardner, a homemaker and dog breeder, said, “I felt that Obama lost some of his passion. This time, when he was speaking, he just didn’t have that.”
 
So I listened to this on the radio at work (Fox News Radio, which never helps).

What the fuck happened?

Obama looked like he didn't want to be there, and the campaign thought they could play defense the whole time. How we got through that debate without Romney's 47% comments being brought-up, I'll never know
 

Wall

Member
I really hope that that President Obama at least tries to show up for the next debate. I said in the other thread that I didn't think Romney did as well as everyone thought in terms of convincing voters to vote for him (as opposed to convincing people that he won the debate), but that doesn't mean that I thought President Obama did well.

President Obama looked tired and listless and came across as unprepared. He missed several opportunities to hit back at Romney for his lies and call him out for not articulating his positions. I realize that might have been by design because the Obama team might think they have a better chance of beating conservative Romney as opposed to moderate Romney, but letting Romney get away with repeating the lie about the Medicare cuts and letting Romney dance all over the places with his tax plans was inexcusable. A person I watched the debate with came away with the initial impression that both candidates had the same plan for Medicare. If Romney continues to move to the center the Obama team will have to come up with a plan to address that anyway.

President Obama just wasn't clear on his messaging and didn't respond to Romney's attacks well. For example, he could have easily rebutted Romney's weak attacks against the Affordable Care Act on federalism grounds by noting that the Affordable Car Act allows states to opt out of the law and set up their own systems provided the states still offer full coverage. He should have hit Romney harder on the Medicaid cuts by noting that they would effect seniors in nursing homes. Worse, he basically ceded the jobs argument to Romney. Instead of touting his jobs bill, he let Romney basically become the Keynesian when Romney pointed out, correctly, that the best way to close the deficit at the moment is through economic growth. I seriously wasn't sure who the Democrat was and who the Republican was at that point. President Obama needed to do a better job of explaining why tax cut aren't a good way to stimulate the economy, and why measures like his jobs bill are better. Instead, he ended up making the bizarre argument that balancing the budget will somehow create jobs. God help us if he really believes that.

Overall, Obama suffered from a lack of energy and preparedness, but above all he suffered from a lack of vision. It really is the same problem that has dogged him since his election. Every issue seems to exist in isolation to him. Taxes, balancing the budget, the environment, education, health care: every issue seems to exist in a hermitically sealed box to him. He can't seem to tie everything together in way to create a narrative that will convince the American voter he has an idea of how to solve this country's problems. Clinton could do it (for better or worse), Reagan could do it, JFK could do it, and both Roosevelt’s could do it. Obama apparently can't, and it hurts him. The most he does is attempt philosophical defenses of social programs. That is nice, but it just comes across as overly academic and abstract. I sure wasn't reassured by anything he said in the debates. It's just that the other guy is so much worse. Or at least his party his.

President Obama is not going to lose the election because of the debates. I'm not even convinced the debates will move the polls much. I am concerned that more listless performances in the debates by President Obama will harm the Democratic Party. I'm concerned that it will cause Democrats to lose Senate and House races that they might otherwise win. Above all, it’s just not a good thing for a party to have its standard bearer appear so listless and disinterested in public. It saps energy, it saps enthusiasm, and it imparts a sense of aimlessness. Does he want a Republican House (and Senate?) so he can strike his "grand bargain"?
 
Transcript is here.

Romney: Second, in that line that says, we are endowed by our Creator with our rights — I believe we must maintain our commitment to religious tolerance and freedom in this country. That statement also says that we are endowed by our Creator with the right to pursue happiness as we choose. I interpret that as, one, making sure that those people who are less fortunate and can't care for themselves are cared by — by one another.

We're a nation that believes we're all children of the same God.

So you are all for religious tolerance and freedom . . . as long as every believes in the same Christian God as you.
 
I really hope that that President Obama at least tries to show up for the next debate. I said in the other thread that I didn't think Romney did as well as everyone thought in terms of convincing voters to vote for him (as opposed to convincing people that he won the debate), but that doesn't mean that I thought President Obama did well.

President Obama looked tired and listless and came across as unprepared. He missed several opportunities to hit back at Romney for his lies and call him out for not articulating his positions. I realize that might have been by design because the Obama team might think they have a better chance of beating conservative Romney as opposed to moderate Romney, but letting Romney get away with repeating the lie about the Medicare cuts and letting Romney dance all over the places with his tax plans was inexcusable. A person I watched the debate with came away with the initial impression that both candidates had the same plan for Medicare. If Romney continues to move to the center the Obama team will have to come up with a plan to address that anyway.

President Obama just wasn't clear on his messaging and didn't respond to Romney's attacks well. For example, he could have easily rebutted Romney's weak attacks against the Affordable Care Act on federalism grounds by noting the Affordable Car Act allows states to opt out of the law and set up their own systems provided the states still offer full coverage. He should have hit Romney harder on the Medicaid cuts by noting that they would affect seniors in nursing homes. Worse, he basically ceded the jobs argument to Romney. Instead of touting his jobs bill, he let Romney basically become the Keynesian when Romney pointed out, correctly, that the best way to close the deficit at the moment is through economic growth. I seriously wasn't sure who the Democrat was and who the Republican was at that point. President Obama needed to do a better job of explaining why tax cut aren't a good way to stimulate the economy, and why measures like his jobs bill are better. Instead, he ended up making the bizarre argument that balancing the budget will somehow create jobs. God help us if he really believes that.

Overall, Obama suffered from a lack of energy and preparedness, but above all he suffered from a lack of vision. It really is the same problem that has dogged him since his election. Every issue seems to exist in isolation to him. Taxes, balancing the budget, the environment, education, health care: every issue seems to exist in a hermitically sealed box to him. He can't seem to tie everything together in way to create a narrative that will convince the American voter he has an idea of how to solve this country's problems. Clinton could do it (for better or worse), Reagan could do it, JFK could do it, and both Roosevelt’s could do it. Obama apparently can't, and it hurts him. The most he does is attempt philosophical defenses of social programs. That is nice, but it just comes across as overly academic and abstract. I sure wasn't reassured by anything he said in the debates. It's just that the other guy is so much worse. Or at least his party his.

President Obama is not going to lose the election because of the debates. I'm not even convinced the debates will move the polls much. I am concerned that more listless performances in the debates by President Obama will harm the Democratic Party. I'm concerned that it will cause Democrats to lose Senate and House races that they might otherwise win. Above all, it’s just not a good thing for a party to have its standard bearer appear so listless and disinterested in public. It saps energy, it saps enthusiasm, and it imparts a sense of aimlessness. Does he want a Republican House (and Senate?) so he can strike his "grand bargain"?

Best post tonight. Stick around.

(that's not sarcasm).
 
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