• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

PoliGAF 2013 |OT2| Worth 77% of OT1

Status
Not open for further replies.
D

Deleted member 231381

Unconfirmed Member
That's not quite fair on economics. Microeconomics is fairly scientific, in the sense it is perfectly possible to formulate a hypothesis and test it under a controlled situation. It's only macroeconomics that lacks the capacity to do that, because we can't really subject entire economies to tests. Even then, we can extrapolate to a certain extent from micro- to macro-, and we also do have enough empirical data to, if not prove some theories, at least falsify others, fitting the Popperian view of the inductive method to some extent.
 

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
The main problem I have with the whole "the economy is not scientific and cannot be tested or predicted" argument is that it almost always precedes an argument about how the economy could be predicted but one that is founded on a combination of anecdotal evidence and platitudes about human nature. I mean, no-one really believes that trying to predict how the economy will behave is entirely futile.
 

1. This isn't a completely new concept. It's been upheld before that silence, in conjuncture with other evidence, can be part of determining probable cause, IIRC.

2. The boston bombing example is 100% wrong. The suspension of Miranda is only allowed for the questioning of other potential acts of terrorism and the officials may not ask questions regarding the current bombing. Anything asked would not be admissible, including silence, in this case because they aren't allowed to ask about it.


3. That said, I think this is a bad idea because while it's "technically" right, there's too much abuse by law enforcement officers in this realm to justify it. The whole point of Miranda is so people know not to say anything. Even if you're not being arrested and just questioned, most people don't know you have the right to remain silent by invoking the 5th. This is especially true among immigrants and minorities where most of the abuse occurs. People should always be explicitly told about their 5th Amendment rights prior to questioning in all cases, even for witness testimony.

So today the Supreme Court found 7-2 that Arizona's Proposition 200 -- requiring voters to show proof of citizenship when registering to vote and to present identification when they do vote -- is preempted by the National Voting Rights Act and thus illegal. Some interesting quotes:

According to SCOTUSBlog post, it's a 2 way decision and also 6-3 in one part.


The part of the Scalia opinion that went the furthest in Congress’s favor — and on which the majority was only six to three, because Justice Anthony M. Kennedy would not join on this point — laid down a seemingly very broad rule on when state election law requirements must yield to those enacted by Congress.

There is a customary rule that courts are to operate on the basic premise that, when Congress and the states act in the same field, state laws won’t be displaced unless Congress explicitly says they must yield. That “presumption against preemption,” in technical terms, does not even apply to the joint enterprise of Congress and the states in regulating elections, according to the new decision. Thus, in this one field, states do not get the benefit of the doubt when they pass election laws that appear to be, or are, different from what Congress has mandated.

If a reader of the Scalia opinion stopped at the top of page 13, the impression would be very clear that Congress had won hands down in the field of regulating federal elections. But from that point on, there is abundant encouragement for what is essentially a states’ rights argument: that is, that the states have very wide authority to define who gets to vote, in both state and federal elections.

On the particular point at issue in this case — Arizona’s requirement of proof of citizenship before one may register to vote or actually vote — the Scalia opinion said that a state was free to ask the federal government for permission to add that requirement. And, Scalia said, if that doesn’t work — either because the federal agency that would deal with such a request is either not functioning or says no — then a state would be free to go to court and make an argument that it has a constitutional right to insist on proof of citizenship as an absolute qualification for voting, in all elections.

The opinion seemed to leave little doubt that, if Arizona or another state went to court to try to establish such a constitutional power, it might well get a very sympathetic hearing, because that part of the Scalia opinion laid a very heavy stress on the power of states under the Constitution to decide who gets to vote. Indeed, that part of the opinion said that the Constitution simply does not give Congress the power to decide who can qualify, but only how federal elections are run procedurally.

It will be up to lower courts — and election-law specialists — to sort out just how to reconcile the two parts of the Court’s majority opinion. And it appears there may well be quite a few opportunities to do so, because of the rising number of efforts — particularly in states in which Republicans have control of state governments — to impose new voter ID and other restrictions on the right to vote.

If the Arizona ruling turns out, in the future, to widen the power of states to limit the right to vote, the decision might turn out to have been far more decisive than its internal contradictions suggested on first reading on Monday.

http://www.scotusblog.com/2013/06/opinion-recap-one-hand-giveth/

Also, yet another decision where scalia and thomas are apart. That's 3 in just the last 2 weeks!

edit: more on that one, pigeon: http://www.scotusblog.com/2013/06/p...-arizona-voter-registration-case/#more-165173
 

AndyD

aka andydumi

Fuck me, what is wrong with people. Time to make a "FIF" business card, just in case.

I don't think its quite as portrayed. Apparently he was talking and answering with no reservations, then stopped at one pointed question. Like a "pregnant silence" directly and only for that question. Quite different from refusing to talk at all.
 
I don't think its quite as portrayed. Apparently he was talking and answering with no reservations, then stopped at one pointed question. Like a "pregnant silence" directly and only for that question. Quite different from refusing to talk at all.

Correct.

BTW, you should always invoke your 5th anytime you talk to the cops, really, unless you're the victim or you clearly witnessed something (or driving violation, but still don't answer the Qs properly).

Never trust cops in other situations.
 
Just saw the headline on him having 54% disapproval and his numbers on trust plunging. He's officially a lame duck president now.

All that talk of avoiding controversies and getting things done in the second term? Nope. And when immigration dies in the House I bet republicans will blame the "culture of scandal" around the White House for dooming it ha.
I still think its gonna pass. The stakes are too high and leadership realizes it.
 
I count just one philosophical reference in the whole thing, to Rawls. That's a good choice, if you have to go with just one, but Rawls is invoked only to bring up "the veil of ignorance", which Mankiw then beats up on.
He doesn't even give Rawls's "veil of ignorance" a proper treatment. The treatment that he does give the concept makes him sound like someone who's just read a summary of Rawls without having read his entire work.
 

Jackson50

Member
My foreign policy isn't not israeli I don't know where you get that. I greatly dislike the current israeli administration. I defend it from the insane hyperbole and often play devils advocate for the sake of not having every israeli decision being some racist, evil action even if I disagree with them personally

Your statement might have been true 2 years ago. He is a threat to the US, there would never be normalized relations if he stays in power, and he'll continue to support Hezbollah, Iran who are our enemies. He represents a illegitimate leader. As long has he stays there will be a civil war. That's a threat to the US and the stability of the religion.

I've never understood this "secular leader" being preferable to religiously inspired leaders. In the west I completely understand, in the middle east they're all Islamist when it comes to the changes the US would want in their culture.

Assad's regime will not and can not last. The quicker he goes the quicker this conflict is over. Which is better for the US, the region and the people of syria. We can put pressure on whatever regime comes after to not become another assad. The examples of Afghanistan were the fact that we left them after the soviets left. We had no engagement, we haven't had the problem in Libya, Egypt or Tunisia even those all of those countries have become more conservative. People need to stop pretending that AQ is going to take over the country.
This seems a rather facile analysis that ignores the potentially significant costs of intervention. That Assad is a threat does not warrant our intervention. We must juxtapose the costs of our intervention with the potential benefits, and I find the potential costs prohibitive. First, he is less of a threat today than previously, and even then he was only a peripheral adversary. He is undoubtedly a menace to the people of Syria, and the atrocities he's committed are abominable. But his preoccupation with survival has diminished his ability to threaten American interests. Moreover, the conflagration in Syria is of modest strategic import to the U.S. outside of the consequences for transnational terrorism. If Assad retains power, the region remains in status quo. And although that might be a nominal victory for Iran, the cost of their victory would be considerable. The U.S. can countenance a Pyrrhic victory for the Iranians. Rather than an asset, he's become a burden to Iran. And they have committed a prodigal mistake in dissipating vital assets to merely sustain a crumbling ally. The possibility of removing a weak Iranian ally does not justify our intervention. Regarding normal diplomatic relations, I don't think that's necessarily true; even if it were, normalized relations is perhaps the least compelling reason for intervention. And I am hesitant to begin a crusade to remove illegitimate leaders.

To justify intervention for the dubious prospect of stability, whether in Syria or the broader region, ignores the consequences of another intervention without a concrete design for post-conflict governance. The removal of Assad is not going to magically induce stability. Instead, it will create a vacuum that, if he disappeared at this moment, would be filled by the powerful factions within Syria. That includes rebels who desire a democratic state, but also Islamist factions, many with links to transnational terrorist networks and foreign fighters, and Iran's proxies, notably Hezbollah. I concur that a sustained international effort would be necessary for even a chance at stabilizing Syria. And the UN has administered post-conflict states in the past. But the experiences in Cambodia, East Timor, and Kosovo have made me skeptical of the ability of the international community to successfully stabilize a post-conflict state. Further, who would contribute to the international effort to stabilize Syria? The effort would require civilian administration, law enforcement, and a large multilateral peacekeeping force. Presumably, the U.S., Western Europe, and their allies would contribute the preponderance of forces and materials. But I am unaware of any template that delineates responsibility for post-conflict governance in Syria. Further, the states who would be expected to shoulder the burden have been fatigued from over a decade in Iraq and Afghanistan. Without a plan to administer post-conflict Syria, our intervention would be heedless. The consequences of a power vacuum in post-conflict states are graver than the status quo. Until the West has a plan, and I doubt they'll unveil one soon, our intervention would actively contribute to instability.

Finally, the proposition that we can influence the post-Assad government seems patently Panglossian. Through what mechanism can we influence this hypothetical government? Even prior to our withdrawal from Iraq our influence waned. And that is despite a decade of cooperation and robust material support. The Afghan government is another example of a recalcitrant partner despite our effective subsidization of their entire government. You greatly exaggerate our ability to influence a post-Assad government.

Perhaps there's a humanitarian reason to intervene, although I am skeptical, but I see little evidence that intervention serves our interests.
I just don't like the demonizations and "israel is the worst state ever."

He's a threat to US interests which is a threat to the US. Is he going to attack the country? Probably not. But a threat to the US IMO doesn't = an attack on the homeland.

And the fears of it becoming a terrorist training ground have two problems. It already is and the current situation is worse for this fear as it gives them a boogy man (assad). and that only would be true if there is we topple the regime and then leave. there needs to be a sustained international effort after any regime change.
Indeed, it already is a magnet for transnational terrorist networks. But I disagree on the second point. Although Assad provides an attractive villain for terrorist groups, the presence of Western troops and civilian administrators, which would undoubtedly lead the international effort in post-conflict Syria, would provide an even more attractive boogeyman. Whether in Lebanon, Somalia, or Iraq, the presence of Western troops, especially American troops, is a magnet for transnational terrorists. And unless the international community acts with unprecedented celerity, they will fail to assemble an effective coalition in time to obviate the arrival of foreign fighters.
 
The Republicans don't care because they know that the bill is going to get mostly Democratic votes and get signed into law by a Democratic President.
Perhaps they feel the cost of not passing it would be higher than the cost of passing it.

If it does pass? Obama still gets the lion's share of credit, but Hispanics aren't really outraged at Republicans and turn out in their usual numbers. Could help boost candidacies of any Republicans in the future who support it now, as well (Rubio). Also might contradict the notion that Washington is mired and gridlock and voters don't feel split Congress is a bad thing.

Doesn't pass? Obama gets to go out and stump every day for Dem candidates and there's more pressure by pro-immigrant voters to get more Democrats into office. Even if it wouldn't be enough for Democrats to pick up the House, there are plenty of competitive Senate contests in 2014 where a bolstered Hispanic vote could make the difference.

Democrats will already be able to recreate their coalition of blacks (support for Obama in general) and youth (ENDA, student loan) in 2014. The last thing Republicans would want is for Hispanics to also be pissed off.

PhoenixPause said:
Just saw the headline on him having 54% disapproval and his numbers on trust plunging. He's officially a lame duck president now.

All that talk of avoiding controversies and getting things done in the second term? Nope. And when immigration dies in the House I bet republicans will blame the "culture of scandal" around the White House for dooming it ha.
His approval rating might be crummy now, but he can bounce back. His approval was in the 30s during the debt ceiling crisis and he won re-election a year later.

If the House kills immigration reform it's because they never wanted it to become law in the first place.
 
This seems a rather facile analysis that ignores the potentially significant costs of intervention. That Assad is a threat does not warrant our intervention. We must juxtapose the costs of our intervention with the potential benefits, and I find the potential costs prohibitive. First, he is less of a threat today than previously, and even then he was only a peripheral adversary. He is undoubtedly a menace to the people of Syria, and the atrocities he's committed are abominable. But his preoccupation with survival has diminished his ability to threaten American interests. Moreover, the conflagration in Syria is of modest strategic import to the U.S. outside of the consequences for transnational terrorism. If Assad retains power, the region remains in status quo. And although that might be a nominal victory for Iran, the cost of their victory would be considerable. The U.S. can countenance a Pyrrhic victory for the Iranians. Rather than an asset, he's become a burden to Iran. And they have committed a prodigal mistake in dissipating vital assets to merely sustain a crumbling ally. The possibility of removing a weak Iranian ally does not justify our intervention. Regarding normal diplomatic relations, I don't think that's necessarily true; even if it were, normalized relations is perhaps the least compelling reason for intervention. And I am hesitant to begin a crusade to remove illegitimate leaders.

To justify intervention for the dubious prospect of stability, whether in Syria or the broader region, ignores the consequences of another intervention without a concrete design for post-conflict governance. The removal of Assad is not going to magically induce stability. Instead, it will create a vacuum that, if he disappeared at this moment, would be filled by the powerful factions within Syria. That includes rebels who desire a democratic state, but also Islamist factions, many with links to transnational terrorist networks and foreign fighters, and Iran's proxies, notably Hezbollah. I concur that a sustained international effort would be necessary for even a chance at stabilizing Syria. And the UN has administered post-conflict states in the past. But the experiences in Cambodia, East Timor, and Kosovo have made me skeptical of the ability of the international community to successfully stabilize a post-conflict state. Further, who would contribute to the international effort to stabilize Syria? The effort would require civilian administration, law enforcement, and a large multilateral peacekeeping force. Presumably, the U.S., Western Europe, and their allies would contribute the preponderance of forces and materials. But I am unaware of any template that delineates responsibility for post-conflict governance in Syria. Further, the states who would be expected to shoulder the burden have been fatigued from over a decade in Iraq and Afghanistan. Without a plan to administer post-conflict Syria, our intervention would be heedless. The consequences of a power vacuum in post-conflict states are graver than the status quo. Until the West has a plan, and I doubt they'll unveil one soon, our intervention would actively contribute to instability.

Finally, the proposition that we can influence the post-Assad government seems patently Panglossian. Through what mechanism can we influence this hypothetical government? Even prior to our withdrawal from Iraq our influence waned. And that is despite a decade of cooperation and robust material support. The Afghan government is another example of a recalcitrant partner despite our effective subsidization of their entire government. You greatly exaggerate our ability to influence a post-Assad government.

Perhaps there's a humanitarian reason to intervene, although I am skeptical, but I see little evidence that intervention serves our interests.Indeed, it already is a magnet for transnational terrorist networks. But I disagree on the second point. Although Assad provides an attractive villain for terrorist groups, the presence of Western troops and civilian administrators, which would undoubtedly lead the international effort in post-conflict Syria, would provide an even more attractive boogeyman. Whether in Lebanon, Somalia, or Iraq, the presence of Western troops, especially American troops, is a magnet for transnational terrorists. And unless the international community acts with unprecedented celerity, they will fail to assemble an effective coalition in time to obviate the arrival of foreign fighters.

I don't have the time to even understand everything. But on the cost vs. benefits.

I don't really see the costs of arming the rebels as anything that really hurts the US. I'm not in favor of any troop actions beyond training or no-fly zones. We can afford action in pure monetary terms or at least the action I'm supportive of. Providing support and preventing civilian causalities to the best of our ability without ground troops. The country is already in civil war and the country will be a terrorist breeding ground for the foreseeable future. I just don't know how the US loses any more than it has unless one thinks troops will become involved which I don't. I think the lessons of Iraq were "overlearned"

I do not subscribe to the slippery slope argument that this will lead to greater US involvement. That only works if we don't delineate limits to our support. Obama needs to take any ground troop options off the table even with the hypothetical fall of the rebels.

I'll put in a caveat that certain actions by assad would push me to actual Iraq style regime change and that would be genocidal or extreme ethnic cleansing (like his fathers actions in homs, killing thousands of innocents in a single action) I really am pro-intervention for humanitarian reasons, though I usually would favor more libyan style support roles.

On your point about stability I understand the post conflict question marks and I concede I don't have complete answers at this time. I suppose the goal of intervention is to force assad to the table for a negotiated deal, him leaving but without a purge of his entire administration. Like dayton. There will need to be outside forces maintaining stability and it will be a long drawn out conflict but without intervention you'll IMO have the same low level insurgency against the Assad regime as you would have against a weak central government. Its a lose lose situation but the US can and should work during the arming and helping of the rebels to prepare them for a post-assad syria.

I know you posted more but I'm on my way out the door.

I'll end by saying the biggest oppsitical to syria having a peaceful future is Russia and Iran's full backing of Assad. The have one desire, to prevent the west and other countries in the middle east from doing anything to help the situation as they've got their own internal dissent that forces them oppose all intervention, lest they open themselves up to more criticism. (I'm sure EV will "correct" me and tell me the west doesn't care about humanitarianism on only the interests of the economic elite.)

as I've said before I'm a big proponent of R2P. To some extent, we are the world police (though other countries should join).
 
BM_1raPCMAA_WEV.jpg:large

The President, with Vicky McCammon in the seat alongside him and me in the back,was now driving around in a small blue car with the top down. We reached a steep incline at the edge of the lake and the car started rolling rapidly toward the water. The President shouted, "The brakes don’t work! The brakes won’t hold! We’re going in! We’re going under!" The car splashed into the water. I started to get out. Just then the car leveled and I realized we were in a Amphicar. The President laughed. As we putted along the lake then (and throughout the evening), he teased me. "Vicky, did you see what Joe did? He didn’t give a damn about his President. He just wanted to save his own skin and get out of the car." Then he’d roar.
--Joseph A. Califano, Jr
http://www.nps.gov/lyjo/planyourvisit/presidentialvehicles.htm
 
The Republicans don't care because they know that the bill is going to get mostly Democratic votes and get signed into law by a Democratic President.

The TeaParty Republicans don't care. Because their constituency demands that they don't. They know they're not gonna run for president, so they're happy in their gerrymandered little fiefdoms (except Rubio). The national Republicans do, on the other hand. Marco Rubio for example (even though he's a TPer, he's got ambitions) knows how important the hispanic community is. The passage of immigration bill is not going to reverse the trend, but it's going to at least stop the leakage for GOP.
 
Dean Baker destroyed Mankiw's original example in his horrible article (stick to writing intro to econ textbooks, Gregory).

It’s really hard to explain the outsized incomes of those at the top without pointing fingers at the government. Take N. Greg Mankiw. Earlier this month he produced a paper, “Defending the One Percent,” to be published in a major economics journal.* Mankiw opens with a little thought exercise about a world of perfect equality. He supposes that supply and demand in this world “happen to produce” such a market outcome and that the outcome is one of perfect efficiency.

Mankiw then goes on to suppose that an entrepreneur disturbs this “utopia” by producing new products which everybody likes, and so makes a whole lot of money and income is no longer equally distributed. He then wonders to what extent his or her income should be redistributed to everyone else.

Hilariously, Mankiw’s asks us to think of Steve Jobs, J.K. Rowling, and Steven Spielberg. All three have in real life amassed incredible wealth it is true. But none of the three could have amassed that kind of wealth in a free market. All three owe their incomes primarily due to government interference in the free market.

Spielberg may have great ideas for movies, and it may have cost millions of dollars to film an E.T., but the second copy and third copies cost almost nothing to produce. Yet this 31-year-old movie is $14.96 at Wal-Mart. Rowling’s Harry Potter series is available as an e-book. Copies of the complete series may be produced at zero cost—yet consumers must pay $57.54 for theirs. I enjoy Apple products, but once under production, a new iPod touch costs far less than $299.

In a classroom-economics sense, these kinds of gaps between what it costs to produce another unit and the price in the market should not exist—and is highly inefficient. People can copy DVDs for a couple cents or share e-books for nothing. And people frequently do. But Spielberg and Rowling are able to charge a relative fortune for copies of their work because the government makes it illegal for anyone to produce what they produce. Apple, at least, makes something physical in the iPod, but still suffers no competition. The government does not allow anyone else to make iPods—or indeed anything too similar.

This allows Universal, Sony, and Apple to charge much more than they could in a free market. Of course, all three examples required an enormous amount of up-front costs. The iPod had to be designed and redesigned by some rather creative folks, and setting up a factory to produce them requires large sums of money. Rowling couldn’t know that her stories would be so well received when she wrote them. E.T. cost an estimated $10.5 million to produce. Certainly, granting the creators of these products protection from any competition has allowed them to recoup their losses.

Certainly, these are works of value, and perhaps these works would never have been created but for the promises of government. However, I favor more efficient ways to finance creative works. Artistic Freedom Vouchers could support hundreds of thousands of people producing works for the public domain. The public already finances much of basic pharmaceutical research, and public financing of clinical trials could save tens or hundreds of billions of dollars per year in lower drug prices.

Still, the financial successes Mankiw offers cannot possibly be attributed to the free market. Mankiw should not be wondering if the government should get involved in redistributing income away from these entrepreneurs, but rather the degree to which the government already redistributes income to them. Mankiw surely knows his examples are terrible. Whether he has given it any thought is another matter.
 

Jackson50

Member
I don't have the time to even understand everything. But on the cost vs. benefits.

I don't really see the costs of arming the rebels as anything that really hurts the US. I'm not in favor of any troop actions beyond training or no-fly zones. We can afford action in pure monetary terms or at least the action I'm supportive of. Providing support and preventing civilian causalities to the best of our ability without ground troops. The country is already in civil war and the country will be a terrorist breeding ground for the foreseeable future. I just don't know how the US loses any more than it has unless one thinks troops will become involved which I don't. I think the lessons of Iraq were "overlearned"

I do not subscribe to the slippery slope argument that this will lead to greater US involvement. That only works if we don't delineate limits to our support. Obama needs to take any ground troop options off the table even with the hypothetical fall of the rebels.

I'll put in a caveat that certain actions by assad would push me to actual Iraq style regime change and that would be genocidal or extreme ethnic cleansing (like his fathers actions in homs, killing thousands of innocents in a single action) I really am pro-intervention for humanitarian reasons, though I usually would favor more libyan style support roles.

On your point about stability I understand the post conflict question marks and I concede I don't have complete answers at this time. I suppose the goal of intervention is to force assad to the table for a negotiated deal, him leaving but without a purge of his entire administration. Like dayton. There will need to be outside forces maintaining stability and it will be a long drawn out conflict but without intervention you'll IMO have the same low level insurgency against the Assad regime as you would have against a weak central government. Its a lose lose situation but the US can and should work during the arming and helping of the rebels to prepare them for a post-assad syria.

I know you posted more but I'm on my way out the door.

I'll end by saying the biggest oppsitical to syria having a peaceful future is Russia and Iran's full backing of Assad. The have one desire, to prevent the west and other countries in the middle east from doing anything to help the situation as they've got their own internal dissent that forces them oppose all intervention, lest they open themselves up to more criticism. (I'm sure EV will "correct" me and tell me the west doesn't care about humanitarianism on only the interests of the economic elite.)

as I've said before I'm a big proponent of R2P. To some extent, we are the world police (though other countries should join).
Given the interminable length of the conflict, some of the consequences of arming the insurgents have become outmoded. But it remains that the greater the number of exogenous participants, the longer the duration of a civil war. Thus, rather than hastening the end of the conflict, an infusion of American armaments might prolong the humanitarian plight of the Syrians. Further, the fear is that American armaments would be transferred to insurgents opposed to American interests, and that these armaments would diffuse throughout the region to bolster transnational terrorist networks in other states. This has been a recurring consequence of our attempts to arm insurgents whether in sub-saharan Africa, Libya, or Afghanistan. As I've previously noted in this thread, the dispersion of weapons from Libya throughout North Africa was catastrophic. It bolstered Boko Haram and AQIM, and it precipitated the insurgency in Mali. Until we create a mechanism to not only track the transmission of armaments, but to secure them after the fact, I'm uncomfortable with providing rebels American armaments.

The slippery slope is a legitimate concern, though. Once we commit to the deposition of Assad, we become invested in the outcome of conflict. And the temptation to use our superior military intensifies. A full-scale intervention seems unlikely, but I'd not disregard the threat of mission creep. And the lessons of Iraq, or Afghanistan for that matter, cannot be overstated. Although, the use of force in Iraq, which involved a unilateral preventative attack, is not analogous to Syria.

The goal of intervention seems to contradict your earlier point that Assad's regime cannot and will not survive. Both the opposition and Assad perceive the conflict as zero-sum. A pacted transition is unlikely at this juncture. And the experience in the Balkans is a poor analog. The goal was not to depose the Serbian regime. It was to ensure the sovereignty of Croatia and Bosnia. Once Belgrade acquiesced to independence, they were allowed to retain power. But the survival of Assad's regime depends on defeating the insurgency. And the inattention to post-conflict governance is the greatest impediment to an effective strategy for deposing Assad. Until I receive an answer on post-conflict governance, I will not support our intervention.

The R2P is a recent norm that remains ambiguous, so I've reserved my judgement. But one of the tenets of the doctrine is right authority, or UNSC authorization. And as you are probably aware, that is unlikely.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/BM_1raPCMAA_WEV.jpg:large

http://www.nps.gov/lyjo/planyourvisit/presidentialvehicles.htm

VZS2uaJ.jpg
 
This really grinds my gears


Florida Gov. Rick Scott (R) signed a bill on Friday that blocks local governments from implementing paid sick leave legislation, the Orlando Sentinel reports. He made his decision quickly, only taking four of the 15 days he legally had to review the bill before he signed it.

Florida follows a rash of preemption bills in the states, which cropped up in Wisconsin, Michigan, and Mississippi. These bills are part of ALEC’s efforts to weaken wage and labor standards: Since 2011, 67 such ALEC-affiliated bills have been introduced in state legislatures, 11 of which had been signed into law before Scott signed this bill.

Big business stood in opposition to the Orange County effort on paid sick leave because it claimed such a bill would drive up costs. Yet a study of San Francisco, which enacted a paid sick leave policy in 2007, showed that a majority of businesses saw either no impact or a positive one on profitability. Other research has shown such policies to be good for business and job growth.


http://thinkprogress.org/economy/2013/06/17/2165671/rick-scott-paid-sick-leave/
 

Hitokage

Setec Astronomer
This should as well:

http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/06/14/3451849/gov-rick-scott-signs-bill-to-speed.html
Gov. Rick Scott signs bill to speed up executions in Florida

TALLAHASSEE -- Gov. Rick Scott signed a bill into law Friday aimed at accelerating the pace of the death penalty process in Florida that could make the governor the most active executioner in modern state history.

The measure, dubbed “the Timely Justice Act” by its proponents, requires governors to sign death warrants 30 days after the Florida Supreme Court certifies that an inmate has exhausted his legal appeals and his clemency review. Once a death warrant is signed, the new law requires the state to execute the defendant within six months.
Unfortunately, Florida courts suck at getting capital offense cases right as it is.
 
“This is a subject that I do know something about,” Burgess said, citing his experience as an OB/GYN. “There is no question in my mind that a baby at 20-weeks after conception can feel pain. The fact of the matter is, I argue with the chairman because I thought the date was far too late. We should be setting this at 15-weeks, 16-weeks.”

“Watch a sonogram of a 15-week baby, and they have movements that are purposeful,” he continued. “They stroke their face. If they’re a male baby, they may have their hand between their legs. If they feel pleasure, why is it so hard to think that they could feel pain?”

0az7Jc8.gif




Upon my research of this thanks to your link, I discovered Florida is 1 of 2 states that doesn't requite a unanimous jury to put someone to death. WHAT THE FUCK!
 

Gotchaye

Member
I get that it's mostly the economics response to Mankiw's hot mess that's of interest here, but I still can't get over how philosophically awful it is and how utterly bizarre it is that he both recognized that what he was doing was "amateur political philosophy" and failed to ask a single philosopher to look over what he'd written. This is what political philosophers do. I looked it up on Google Maps - it would have been a five minute walk to get to a professional philosopher. He rips off Nozick, he seems to think that the veil of ignorance is a way of justifying utilitarianism (wtf?), and as far as I can tell he thinks he's invented the famous utility monster argument (also Nozick's).

It was suggested elsewhere that the appropriate response to this would be for a big-shot philosopher to publish a paper about comparative advantage where the economic concept is garbled almost beyond recognition.
 
I didn't even get halfway through Mankiw's piece before I gave up. It was such crap. He sold out hard long ago. For him, it's all about the $$$ and he doesn't care what he puts out there. He's no longer interested in research or real discourse, just making sure that the GOP will continue to pay him to be on their side.
 

The Technomancer

card-carrying scientician
Poll: Majority Supports Gang Of Eight Immigration Bill

A slim majority of Americans support the bipartisan proposal to reform the nation's immigration system currently being considered in the Senate, according to the latest CNN/ORC International poll released Tuesday.

The poll found that 51 percent of Americans back the bill brought forward by the so-called Gang of Eight, while 45 percent said they are opposed.

But a separate question in the survey found far more Americans to be considered about border security — a sticking point for many Republicans on Capitol Hill — than a path to citizenship.

Sixty-two percent said that bolstering security at the border in order "to reduce or eliminate the number of immigrants coming into this country without permission from the U.S. government" should be the primary focus when deailng with immigration, while just 36 percent said the main focus should be providing "a path to citizenship for many immigrants who are in this country without permission from the U.S. government."
http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/poll-majority-supports-gang-of-eight-immigration-bill
I don't see how the House passes this thing.
 

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.co...ig-generational-divide-in-immigration-battle/

Its old racists that are holding the bill back. They're preventing progress in this country. I can't wait till this country is minority-majority.

"There is also a generation gap on this issue, with senior citizens opposed to the bill by a 17-point margin, while younger Americans tend to favor it."

Boehner: I Will Only Push Immigration Through House If We Have Majority GOP Support
http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/boehner-i-will-only-push-immigration-through-house

Might as well throw the Gang of 8 bill in the trash, it's not going anywhere. And whatever comes out of the House won't pass the senate.

They might as well through their 2016 chances in the trash too. They'll lose the hispanic vote by even more this time. And its only growing.

I still think boehner is bluffing. They want the path to citizenship out.
 
Boehner: I Will Only Push Immigration Through House If We Have Majority GOP Support
http://livewire.talkingpointsmemo.com/entry/boehner-i-will-only-push-immigration-through-house

Might as well throw the Gang of 8 bill in the trash, it's not going anywhere. And whatever comes out of the House won't pass the senate.

Lindsay Graham amd McCain know the stakes. If the GOP is the cause of this bill dying they'll suffer politically for decades. The problem for the GOP is that the House doesn't seem to care.
 
Lindsay Graham amd McCain know the stakes. If the GOP is the cause of this bill dying they'll suffer politically for decades. The problem for the GOP is that the House doesn't seem to care.

Money will speak.


also PD forgot this

But asked if he would require majority Republican support on a bill that came out of a formal negotiation with the senate, Boehner said “we’ll see when we get there.”

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/john-boehner-immigration-92967.html#ixzz2WaTA1O7E

He's not gonna vote on the verbatim senate bill. That's all he's saying
 
Btw McConnell said if Reid goes nuclear then when the GOP gets back the Senate, their majority leader will go nuclear on every bill. 51 to repeal the ACA, 51 to pass the pipeline, etc.

We know Reid doesn't have the balls to do it but if he did I'd tell Mitch 'go for it'. By the time the GOP gets the Senate and the White House the ACA will be so ingrained in society that they wouldnt have the balls to do it. Plus the insurance companies wouldn't let them since these companies are going to benefit the most from the ACA.
 
Greg Sargent seems to think that Boehner will let the bill pass with mostly Dem votes. Not that he's right all the time, but he did make the right call on the House GOP's wailing stage after the Senate passed a compromise on the tax cut bill.
 
Btw McConnell said if Reid goes nuclear then when the GOP gets back the Senate, their majority leader will go nuclear on every bill. 51 to repeal the ACA, 51 to pass the pipeline, etc.

We know Reid doesn't have the balls to do it but if he did I'd tell Mitch 'go for it'. By the time the GOP gets the Senate and the White House the ACA will be so ingrained in society that they wouldnt have the balls to do it. Plus the insurance companies wouldn't let them since these companies are going to benefit the most from the ACA.

Veto. its an empty threat. if they take back the house they'll probably go nuclear anyways.
 
A nation continues to wait for final word on the Supreme Court's Big Four cases this term — voting rights, affirmative action, DOMA, and Proposition 8 — but the justices' closest decision arrived first on Monday, in a 5-4 ruling on Salinas v. Texas in which the conservative members of the Court and Anthony Kennedy determined that if you remain silent before police read your Miranda rights, that silence can and will be held against you. Here's what that means.

This drives me crazy. When O'Connor was still on the bench, it was the four conservative members and Sandra Day O'Connor. Kennedy was understood to be solidly conservative. Now it's the four conservative members and Anthony Kennedy. Voila! Kennedy is no longer a conservative jurist.


This is the reason why people have a hard time believing in Greenwald. Really, America is the must brutal sprawling prison state on Earth?

Sounds right to me. Most are wildly ignorant about the breadth and brutality of the US prison industry. We incarcerate more people than China not only per capita but also absolutely. We incarcerate more youths for longer periods of time than almost any other nation.
 
I can't see Boehner keeping the Speakership if he allows the senate bill to pass the House. The knives are already out (again).
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/dana-rohrabacher-john-boehner-speaker-92954.html

The House can't pass a pathway to citizenship with a majority of GOPers supporting it. And while I respect the work that McCain and Graham are doing, ultimately they're wrong about 70 votes in the senate compelling the House to do anything. We'll either get no bill, or a bill with no pathway; it's hard to see Obama signing such a gimped bill, or most democrats or republicans in the senate supporting it.
 
I can't see Boehner keeping the Speakership if he allows the senate bill to pass the House. The knives are already out (again).
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/06/dana-rohrabacher-john-boehner-speaker-92954.html

The House can't pass a pathway to citizenship with a majority of GOPers supporting it. And while I respect the work that McCain and Graham are doing, ultimately they're wrong about 70 votes in the senate compelling the House to do anything. We'll either get no bill, or a bill with no pathway; it's hard to see Obama signing such a gimped bill, or most democrats or republicans in the senate supporting it.

You're wrong. You take the word of these house republicans too seriously. They say this on it seems every bill.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top Bottom