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PoliGAF 2014 |OT| Kay Hagan and the Terrible, Horrible, No Good, Very Bad News

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So, the VA hospital story. Now that's a scandal.

As it should be. It's amazing that administration after administration promises so much with respect to the VA yet does nothing.

There are so many areas of government that could work better, it's a shame the Obama administration seemingly has no interest in this (IT contracts come to mind).
 
What kind of libertarian, like cares about rights libertarian or free market asshole libertarian?

Anti-imperialist Chomsky type, they care more about curtailing power and abstract theories than helping people's day to day lives (their claim is that you can't have the second without the first ). I work with one, its a weird mix of resignation that their goal is futile and a constant zealous devotion to achieving it.

As it should be. It's amazing that administration after administration promises so much with respect to the VA yet does nothing.

There are so many areas of government that could work better, it's a shame the Obama administration seemingly has no interest in this (IT contracts come to mind).

Isn't much of it due to inadequate funding?
 

bonercop

Member
. That glenn feels they should agree with him and be concerned with exactly what he's concerned with. I just got a general whine out of that that belittles those that don't see his way.
For the record, I definitely get that out of him myself. Nobody's perfect.

What kind of libertarian, like cares about rights libertarian or free market asshole libertarian?
Whether you think Greenwald's an asshole or not, saying he's the latter kind of libertarian is just plain horseshit disgruntled democrats made up.

Anti-imperialist Chomsky type, they care more about curtailing power and abstract theories than helping people's day to day lives (their claim is that you can't have the second without the first ). I work with one, its a weird mix of resignation that their goal is futile and a constant zealous devotion to achieving it.

Buh...? I don't think Chomsky deserves to be lumped in with Greenwald in that regard at all. Chomsky spent most of his life highlighting the suffering of people who get completely ignored. His obection to US imperialism isn't just based on principle or abstractions like you could say about Greenwald.
 
Cato Institute Koch Brother Cliven Bundy libertarian.

He blogged a lot about the public option. He's definitely a socialist but doesn't like 'government'

He just care about one singular issue and only ever wades into others when he attacks others who oppose him or disappoint him on that issue.
 
Buh...? I don't think Chomsky deserves to be lumped in with Greenwald in that regard at all. Chomsky spent most of his life highlighting the suffering of people who get completely ignored. His obection to US imperialism isn't just based on principle or abstractions like you could say about Greenwald.

I think Chomsky is to theoretical. I'm generally dislike those that would rather focus on their perfect world and constantly insult or demean real incremental positive changes as not being perfect or 'compromised.'

Chomsky is a lot more enjoyable to read and seems like a nicer guy even if I disagree completely with him. I think Chomsky cares more. Glenn is far to self obsessed and self righteous. Watch how quick he responds to people who insult or slight him on twitter.
 

bonercop

Member
I think Chomsky is to theoretical. I'm generally dislike those that would rather focus on their perfect world and constantly insult or demean real incremental positive changes as not being perfect or 'compromised'

Chomsky is always very, very knowledgeable and consistent about what he condemns. His strong advocacy for the people in East-Timor is a great example of that. And if you doubt his sincerity or think he's too "theoretical" and doesn't understand what real people go through, I'd like to point you to this anecdote.
 
Chomsky is always very, very knowledgeable and consistent about what he condemns. His strong advocacy for the people in East-Timor is a great example of that. And if you doubt his sincerity or think he's too "theoretical" and doesn't understand what real people go through, I'd like to point you to this anecdote.

Oh I think he's sincere and cares about real people, just that his solutions and writings seems to concerned with not day to day problems people face.

I'm sure you can find counter examples but that's what I gather. Admittedly I don't really follow his career.
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
That's unfair on his part, but that's not quite the same thing as thinking Americans agree with him on this. I'd even say it's the exact opposite.



Well, I gotta say I do agree with him on that part. I think her record as a senator and as secretery of state is completely unremarkable, especially from a liberal perspective.

It's a ridiculous statement. Even if everyone got together and agreed on a schedule where we're going woman next, then gay, then Hispanic, and so on, it still doesn't make any sense to act like this is the only reason you're losing. I mean Tammy Baldwin is a female, and she's a lesbian, and she's pretty good on privacy issues, so why doesn't she just run for president and win easily?

I share your frustrations with Hillary's undeserved popularity, but to focus on her gender as the reason is wrong, and is never going to get us anywhere. I would say the problem lies more in democrats not doing enough inward critiquing, too busy making fun of Glenn Beck and Hannity or abandoning the party at the first sign of trouble with "both sides are the same" excuses, not that Hillary Clinton is a woman.

Glenn Greenwald has put up a good fight against the establishment democrats with privacy concerns, but honestly privacy is the weakest issue to fight them on going by public opinion polls. There's a lot more room for victory on other fights.

I think Chomsky is to theoretical. I'm generally dislike those that would rather focus on their perfect world and constantly insult or demean real incremental positive changes as not being perfect or 'compromised.'

Chomsky is a lot more enjoyable to read and seems like a nicer guy even if I disagree completely with him. I think Chomsky cares more. Glenn is far to self obsessed and self righteous. Watch how quick he responds to people who insult or slight him on twitter.

Change requires multiple types. Dreamers to know what we're fighting for, instigators to turn the dream into a real political issue, and leaders to turn the issue into a working reality. I think of Chomsky as a dreamer and Greenwald as an instigator.
 

Chichikov

Member
Glenn Greenwald has got opinions:
BncyRlKCAAAn4ng.png:large


Why is it that these types don't realize the fact people don't often agree with them?
I don't know about her banality of passion levels, but he's mostly right.
With that being said, she's also smart, hard working and qualified, and that's pretty much the best that you can hope to come out of the Democratic establishment these days. Yeah, it's a bit sad, but I don't see it changing without massive outside push from the base.

Also, while it's true that electing a female president is mostly symbolic, he's underestimate the power and importance of such symbol.

p.s.
I would vote Hilary over a male white candidate with similar positions in a fucking heartbeat, and I'm not ashamed to say that and there is nothing wrong with that.
 
I don't know about her banality of passion levels, but he's mostly right.
With that being said, she's also smart, hard working and qualified, and that's pretty much the best that you can hope to come out of the Democratic establishment these days. Yeah, it's a bit sad, but I don't see it changing without massive outside push from the base.

Also, while it's true that electing a female president is mostly symbolic, he's underestimate the power and importance of such symbol.

p.s.
I would vote Hilary over a male white candidate with similar positions in a fucking heartbeat, and I'm not ashamed to say that and there is nothing wrong with that.

My problem is just the tone and sense of greenwald that comes from that rather than his opinion of clintons politics.
 

KingK

Member
Greenwald always comes off as an arrogant, self-absorbed asshole whenever he opens his mouth, even when I agree with him.

I'm not a fan of Hillary and won't vote for her in the primary, but to say that women will only vote for her because she's a woman is just as bad as all the racist shit I heard after Obama won about how "he only won because he's black." And to imply that much of the opposition to Obama and Hillary isn't a result of racism or misogyny is absolutely fucking ridiculous. Nobody says that everyone who criticizes Obama is a racist. He gets plenty of legit criticism, especially from the left, that's never depicted as racism.
 

Chichikov

Member
He doesn't say that women only going to vote for Hillary because she's a woman, he says they're going to be invested in her candidacy because of that, which is true and there is nothing wrong with it.

Fuck, I'm a guy whatever excitement I have about her candidacy stem from the fact that she's a woman.
 
NZn8oD6.jpg


dat podhoretz totally upfront with the right's view rich people deserve their purchase

@jpodhoretz
@RyanLizza if government weren't wrapped around every aspect of American life there would be less spending on campaigns.

oh and

Karl Rove stunned a conference when he suggested Hillary Clinton might have brain damage.

Onstage with Robert Gibbs and CBS correspondent and “Spies Against Armageddon” co-author Dan Raviv, Rove said Republicans should keep the Benghazi issue alive.

He said if Clinton runs for president, voters must be told what happened when she suffered a fall in December 2012.

The official diagnosis was a blood clot. Rove told the conference near LA Thursday, “Thirty days in the hospital? And when she reappears, she’s wearing glasses that are only for people who have traumatic brain injury? We need to know what’s up with that.”

Rove repeated the claim a number of times to the audience. Clinton’s rep said, “Please assure Dr. Rove she’s 100 percent.”
 
People also associate the Clintons with good times and a thriving economy. That's why Bill's endorsement of Obama was so effective in 2012 (he went from having a 1-point lead on Romney to a 7-point one. Romney didn't get any such bump), he has credibility with voters even if he signed a lot of dumb shit during his presidency.
 
Speaking of Greenwald, this is a good piece that mirrors my views to a large extent (not fully though)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...a45dee-d628-11e3-8a78-8fe50322a72c_story.html

At a meeting with his British counterparts in 2008, Keith Alexander, then head of the National Security Agency, reportedly asked, “Why can’t we collect all the signals, all the time?” The NSA has since sought to dismiss that remark as a quip taken out of context. In his new book, “No Place to Hide,” Glenn Greenwald, one of three recipients of the voluminous, top-secret material that NSA contractor Edward Snowden chose to leak, uses those documents to prove that this was indeed the agency’s guiding principle.

In one remarkable slide presented at a 2011 meeting of five nations’ intelligence agencies and revealed here for the first time, the NSA described its “collection posture” as “Collect it All,” “Process it All,” “Exploit it All,” “Partner it All,” “Sniff it All” and, ultimately, “Know it All.

Much has been written about the NSA’s omnivorous appetite for personal data — much of it by Greenwald for the Guardian and other outlets. In his new book, however, he offers a revealing and disturbing overview, illustrated by dozens of reproduced secret documents, of just how far the NSA has gone to achieve Alexander’s vision of collecting and knowing it all. Relying on newly disclosed and already disclosed documents, Greenwald shows that the scope of the NSA’s surveillance not only exceeds our imagination but the agency’s capacity even to store, much less analyze, it all.

In a one-month period last year, for example, a single unit of the NSA, the Global Access Operations unit, collected data on more than 97 billion e-mails and 124 billion phone calls from around the world; more than 3 billion of those calls and e-mails were collected as they passed through the United States. As of 2012, the agency was processing more than 20 billion telecommunications per day. In a single month in 2011, the NSA collected 71 million calls and e-mails from Poland alone — not a major hub of terrorist activity, the last I checked. The NSA has admitted that “it collects far more content than is routinely useful to analysts.” These numbers call to mind Sen. Everett Dirksen’s quip about government spending: “A billion here, a billion there, and pretty soon you’re talking about real money.”

The NSA achieves these ends by working hand in hand with private telecommunications and Internet service providers. One NSA document describes an unnamed corporate partner as “aggressively involved in shaping traffic to run signals of interest past our monitors” and reports that in a single month, this top-secret, public-private partnership yielded more than 6 billion records of telephone calls and Internet activity. Under another program revealed here, the NSA intercepts routers, servers and other network equipment being shipped overseas; installs back-door surveillance bugs; rewraps the packages with factory seals; and sends them on their way, thereby ensuring that the agency will have clandestine access to all information that passes through them.

Other documents describe X-KEYSCORE, the NSA’s most powerful tool, which, as its name implies, enables the agency to track every keystroke on a computer, permitting the agency to monitor in real time all of a user’s e-mail, social-media and Web-browsing activity. In a single month in 2012, X-KEYSCORE collected 41 billion records for one NSA unit. Greenwald contends that this is the program Snowden was referring to when he said that, with an e-mail address, he could tap into any American’s communications. (The NSA has accused Snowden of exaggerating, but the documents suggest that he may be right.)

Some of Greenwald’s most disturbing disclosures concern not the NSA but its British counterpart, the Government Communications Headquarters (GCHQ). His documents reveal that the GCHQ engages in “online covert action” against loosely defined “hacktivists” designed to disrupt, degrade and discredit their online presence. Taking a page from COINTELPRO, the FBI’s 1960s campaign against U.S. radicals, the GCHQ’s tactics include luring targets to sexually compromising Web sites, posting false blogs and launching other “info ops to damage reputations.”

Other revelations are less surprising, although Greenwald tends to deliver them as if they were all equally scandalous. He reports, for example, that the NSA cooperates with other countries’ spy agencies, even as they spy on us and we on them. Is anyone other than Greenwald “shocked, shocked” by this news? He notes that the NSA collects data not only for counterterrorism purposes but for economic and diplomatic advantage. Again, did anyone think otherwise? Since 1978, the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act has expressly authorized the collection of “foreign intelligence information,” defined to include any information about a foreign power or territory that “relates to . . . the conduct of the foreign affairs of the United States.” Surely oil supplies and trade negotiations are as relevant to our foreign affairs as terrorism is. And it hardly follows that, as Greenwald claims, “stopping terror is clearly a pretext” for the NSA.

Some disclosures raise more questions about Greenwald’s judgment than about the NSA’s activities. One document, for example, identifies the specific methods used to bug 24 named foreign embassies. The document reveals top-secret methods and targets, and its disclosure is likely to undermine legitimate intelligence-gathering and cause serious diplomatic problems. Yet it is difficult to see what possible value it adds to the public debate. It is one thing to disclose secret government practices that raise serious moral, political and constitutional concerns — as many of Snowden’s disclosures have done. But bugging foreign embassies is at the core of foreign intelligence, and there is nothing illegal or particularly surprising about the fact that we do it.

Greenwald does not always recognize the difference between justified and unjustified disclosures. And that’s too bad, as Snowden placed his trust in Greenwald to make such calls.

Greenwald’s descriptions of NSA programs can also be misleading. He never mentions, for example, that there are significant “back-end” limits on how the agency can search and use much of the data it collects. These limitations constitute the core of the NSA’s defenses of its programs. While I don’t find those defenses entirely convincing, a serious effort to grapple with the issue would not simply ignore them.

The force of Greenwald’s argument is sometimes undermined by his hyperbolic style and more-radical-than-thou attitude. He depicts the NSA, for example, as part of a grand scheme by elites to control the masses, of a piece with what he sees as “the response to the Occupy movement . . . to crush it with force, through tear gas, pepper spray, and prosecution.” Really? Maybe I’m imagining things, but I recall seeing Occupy demonstrations for months on end throughout the country, including in the nation’s capital.

And he asserts that “both the United States and the United Kingdom have made clear that there are no limits — ethical, legal, or political — that they will observe when they claim to be acting in the name of ‘terrorism.’ ” Has he read the substantial debates in Britain over preventive detention, control orders, complicity in torture and the like? Has he seen the Obama administration’s brief to the U.S. Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit insisting that the laws of war must limit detention authority at Guantanamo and urging the court to reverse a statement to the contrary? Or President Obama’s orders barring the use of enhanced interrogation techniques? Such overstatement weakens Greenwald’s credibility, which is unfortunate, because much of what he has to say is extremely valuable.

Part of the problem is that Greenwald sees the world in black and white. As he puts it, “There are, broadly speaking, two choices: obedience to institutional authority or radical dissent from it.” For him there is apparently nothing in between. Anyone who does not share his radical dissent is, therefore, a tool for the political elite. When the New Yorker’s Hendrik Hertzberg and The Washington Post’s Ruth Marcus question the significance of metadata collection, Greenwald concludes that “journalists who devote their careers to venerating the country’s most powerful official — the president . . . and defending his political party rarely, if ever, risk alienating those in power.” I, too, think Hertzberg and Marcus fail to adequately appreciate the dangers of metadata collection, but one need only read a random sample of their hard-hitting columns to see that they are hardly averse to alienating those in power.

Similarly, Greenwald blasts the “establishment media” for consulting with the government about disclosing secret information and accuses them of wanting only to make the government look good. But then how does one explain the disclosures of the Pentagon Papers, Watergate, Abu Ghraib, the CIA’s black sites and torture program, renditions to torture, the NSA’s warrantless wiretapping, the New York Police Department’s spying on Muslims and the drone program? Most of what we know about the government’s most troubling national security measures comes from what Greenwald dismisses as “the establishment media.”

This is an important and illuminating book. It would have been more important and illuminating were Greenwald able to acknowledge that the choices we face about regulating surveillance in the modern age are difficult and that there are no simple answers. (He notably suggests virtually nothing in the way of positive reforms, sticking instead to criticism.)

Snowden handed Greenwald the story of a lifetime. Along with Laura Poitras and Ewen MacAskill of the Guardian and Barton Gellman of The Washington Post, Greenwald shared this year’s Pulitzer Prize for public service. . He has done the world a service by helping to explain the significance of the disclosures for everyone’s privacy. He has helped spark a much-needed national and worldwide debate about how to preserve privacy when we do so much online, and when the NSA and others have the technological means to track virtually all we do there. But his book would have been more persuasive had he confronted what is difficult about the issue and not simply been satisfied with lobbing grenades at all who are less radical than he is.
 

Chichikov

Member
Speaking of Greenwald, this is a good piece that mirrors my views to a large extent (not fully though)

http://www.washingtonpost.com/opini...a45dee-d628-11e3-8a78-8fe50322a72c_story.html
Yeah, I can tell from your bolding, you agree with everything bad they say about Greenwald but not with any of the NSA criticism or praise of this book, right?

Shit man, this -
This is an important and illuminating book. It would have been more important and illuminating were Greenwald able to acknowledge that the choices we face about regulating surveillance in the modern age are difficult and that there are no simple answers. (He notably suggests virtually nothing in the way of positive reforms, sticking instead to criticism.)
Is pretty comical.
 
Yeah, I can tell from your bolding, you agree with everything bad they say about Greenwald but not with any of the NSA criticism or praise of this book, right?

Shit man, this -

Is pretty comical.

Well, I was posting it in that context as the flaws I've seen in greenwald as that was the topic. I still read the guy and think he's an important voice. And agree the book is important and contributes to the debate providing important information. I've been pretty clear I think the NSA's phone data collection and a lot of the PRISM stuff is wrong and the lack of accountability is ridiculous. Its just become, it seems that every tradecraft is now evil.

I tend to focus on greenwald a lot because I'm generally opposed to radicalism. and he's just a prolific voice for it when it comes to national security and privacy.
 
I tend to focus on greenwald a lot because I'm generally opposed to radicalism. and he's just a prolific voice for it when it comes to national security and privacy.

Dunno man, you do seem to lose your cool when it comes to Greenwald.

Hillary is indeed hawkish and surrounded by sleazy money, btw.
 
Dunno man, you do seem to lose your cool when it comes to Greenwald.

Hillary is indeed hawkish and surrounded by sleazy money, btw.

I never did till he became a man who holds undemocratic power over my country's foreign policy. There's a fine line between acceptable leaks and unacceptable and before its asked, to be honest I don't know where the line is. But I know this is over it.

One document, for example, identifies the specific methods used to bug 24 named foreign embassies. The document reveals top-secret methods and targets, and its disclosure is likely to undermine legitimate intelligence-gathering and cause serious diplomatic problems. Yet it is difficult to see what possible value it adds to the public debate.

Other leaks like those about Pakistan and Afghanistan have also gone to far.
 

Metaphoreus

This is semantics, and nothing more
From USA Today today: The media ignores IRS scandal

Paul Caron said:
To paraphrase Matthew McConaughey in A Time to Kill: Now imagine the president is a Republican.

We've already seen that movie, and it was called Watergate.

In that scandal, aggressive reporting by the media and thorough investigations by the FBI, Justice Department and a Senate Select Committee painstakingly uncovered the facts of the illegal break-in at the Democratic National Committee's headquarters months before the 1972 presidential election. One of the three articles of impeachment charged that President Nixon had attempted to use the IRS against his political opponents.

Today's news media are largely ignoring the IRS scandal, and it is impossible to have confidence in the current investigations by the FBI, Justice Department, and House committee. I am not suggesting that the current scandal in the end will rise to the level of Watergate. But the allegations are serious, and fair-minded Americans of both parties should agree that a thorough investigation needs to be undertaken to either debunk them or confirm them.

Step one should be to give Lois Lerner full immunity from prosecution in exchange for her testimony. And then let the chips fall where they may.

The author of the article has been posting daily news updates regarding the IRS scandal to his TaxProf blog since the story broke a little over a year ago. Here's the most recent update (with links to all the others).
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
From USA Today today: The media ignores IRS scandal



The author of the article has been posting daily news updates regarding the IRS scandal to his TaxProf blog since the story broke a little over a year ago. Here's the most recent update (with links to all the others).

Is this guy kidding? Watergate? Really?

I like how he knows and admits it's nowhere near the same level and yet goes ahead and makes the comparison anyway. That's not exactly intellectual honesty.

Then there's the fact that almost every update cites the Washington Times, often more than once. Yes the Washington Times, a bastion of ethical journalism with a history of great reporting. No wait, that's The Washington Post. The Washington Times wouldn't know journalistic integrity if it smacked it in the face with it's dick.
 

Metaphoreus

This is semantics, and nothing more
Is this guy kidding? Watergate? Really?

I like how he knows and admits it's nowhere near the same level and yet goes ahead and makes the comparison anyway.

He's comparing the investigations into the scandals, not the scandals themselves. Thus, he compares "aggressive reporting by the media and thorough investigations by the FBI, Justice Department and a Senate Select Committee" with respect to Watergate to "[t]oday's news media," which "are largely ignoring the IRS scandal," and "current investigations by the FBI, Justice Department, and House committee" in which "it is impossible to have confidence."

I think he can be fairly read as implying that a similar scandal breaking under a Republican president would have faced more aggressive investigations, but I don't think he should be misunderstood as comparing Watergate with the IRS scandal (except in the sense I pointed out above).

EDIT:

I think it's silly to fault him for the thoroughness of his updates.
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
He's comparing the investigations into the scandals, not the scandals themselves. Thus, he compares "aggressive reporting by the media and thorough investigations by the FBI, Justice Department and a Senate Select Committee" with respect to Watergate to "[t]oday's news media," which "are largely ignoring the IRS scandal," and "current investigations by the FBI, Justice Department, and House committee" in which "it is impossible to have confidence."

I think he can be fairly read as implying that a similar scandal breaking under a Republican president would have faced more aggressive investigations, but I don't think he should be misunderstood as comparing Watergate with the IRS scandal (except in the sense I pointed out above).

Except that the two aren't similar in any way. There's a good reason one got more attention than the other. Watergate involved actual breaking of laws that could be traced back to a sitting president. IRS-gate has no proof of anything and looks to be nothing more than just some over-zealous employees. Comparing the two in ANY way is intellectually dishonest. The fact he knows this and does it anyway is laughable.

EDIT: There's thoroughness and then there's citing a known joke of a paper. It would be like citing the NYPost or the National Enquirer. Sure, be thorough but at least know that not all information is created equal. I'm not going to cite a conspiracy website when writing an essay on the Kennedy assassination.
 

Metaphoreus

This is semantics, and nothing more
Except that the two aren't similar in any way. There's a good reason one got more attention than the other. Watergate involved actual breaking of laws that could be traced back to a sitting president. IRS-gate has no proof of anything and looks to be nothing more than just some over-zealous employees. Comparing the two in ANY way is intellectually dishonest. The fact he knows this and does it anyway is laughable.

EDIT: There's thoroughness and then there's citing a known joke of a paper. It would be like citing the NYPost or the National Enquirer. Sure, be thorough but at least know that not all information is created equal. I'm not going to cite a conspiracy website when writing an essay on the Kennedy assassination.

I agree with your first two sentences, but I disagree with the remainder of your first paragraph. The difference between Watergate and the IRS scandal that Caron is highlighting is valid: one had thorough investigation by the media, Congress, and others; and the other has had none of that (though the media seemed interested early on). The fact that you can point to law-breaking in the case of Watergate that is traceable to the president is because there was a thorough and serious investigation. Of course, that's not to say that the president was involved in this scandal--it's to say there should be a thorough and serious investigation. Caron asks for no more.

As to your second paragraph, Caron doesn't "cite" anything in his updates. He links to just about anyone of any consequence who posted on the topic. Nowhere does he cite any of those sources as authoritative.

But, tell me, what do you believe his linking to the Washington Times proves?
 

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
I agree with your first two sentences, but I disagree with the remainder of your first paragraph. The difference between Watergate and the IRS scandal that Caron is highlighting is valid: one had thorough investigation by the media, Congress, and others; and the other has had none of that (though the media seemed interested early on). The fact that you can point to law-breaking in the case of Watergate that is traceable to the president is because there was a thorough and serious investigation. Of course, that's not to say that the president was involved in this scandal--it's to say there should be a thorough and serious investigation. Caron asks for no more.

As to your second paragraph, Caron doesn't "cite" anything in his updates. He links to just about anyone of any consequence who posted on the topic. Nowhere does he cite any of those sources as authoritative.

But, tell me, what do you believe his hyperlinks to the Washington Times proves?

Other than his mindset? Nothing.

Look, every journalist worth their salt probably looked for something bigger. If they could tie this to anyone of any importance it would make a career. The journalist that could tie this to the White House would be able to write their own check, they'd never have to worry about losing their job or making a mortgage payment again.

The reason that there hasn't been more focus on this is that there has been no evidence to warrant the effort. There are other things going on in the world and only x number of column inches. If anyone had any proof of anything it would have blown up.

Why exactly do you think this warrants a more thorough investigation? What piece of evidence?
 
He's comparing the investigations into the scandals, not the scandals themselves. Thus, he compares "aggressive reporting by the media and thorough investigations by the FBI, Justice Department and a Senate Select Committee" with respect to Watergate to "[t]oday's news media," which "are largely ignoring the IRS scandal," and "current investigations by the FBI, Justice Department, and House committee" in which "it is impossible to have confidence."

I think he can be fairly read as implying that a similar scandal breaking under a Republican president would have faced more aggressive investigations, but I don't think he should be misunderstood as comparing Watergate with the IRS scandal (except in the sense I pointed out above).

EDIT:

I think it's silly to fault him for the thoroughness of his updates.

You mean if the IRS, during a republican administration, looked into progressive/liberal groups closely before ultimately granting them tax exempt status...while also looking closely at a large amount of conservative groups too?

There is no conspiracy, no connection to the White House, no nothing.
 

SmokeMaxX

Member
NBC also had polls showing Nunn and Grimes running competitively in their respective races. Gotta say I'm surprised by all this, especially by how safe Pryor currently is. The last month or two seemed like it would be the most dangerous for him due Obamacare; it's going to take a few months for it to become a neutral issue IMO, and I'd expect another shock period of bad media coverage in the summer (small business mandates).

In some policy ways I dislike the private insurance take on the Medicaid expansion, but it seems pretty damn popular politically in red states due to eliminating the "free healthcare" stigma, even if people are only paying $10-20 copays. Cotton seems completely confused and is beating around the bush; same thing is happening with Scott Brown in NH.

There's still plenty of time for Cotton to rebound considering Obama will remain unpopular in Arkansas...but if the people who have benefited from the law show up to vote Pryor could win by 3-4 points.
Here in Arkansas, even my most conservative friend (who's running for a Republican position) knows in his heart that Cotton has zero chance of winning. Just completely dismissed Cotton as a legit candidate.
 
Here in Arkansas, even my most conservative friend (who's running for a Republican position) knows in his heart that Cotton has zero chance of winning. Just completely dismissed Cotton as a legit candidate.
Is there a reason? On paper Cotton seems like a really good candidate, but hasn't been able to make strides thus far in polls.
 

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
LOL at that Ann Coulter Twitter/#BringBackOurChildren backfire.

What an idiot.
 
LOL at that Ann Coulter Twitter/#BringBackOurChildren backfire.

What an idiot.

Conservative Comedy just comes off as mean spirited.


Only people like Rush and Ann Coulter will find ways to make jackasses out of themselves with their partisanship over such a tragedy.

I really have to say, I'm relieved that so far there has been no major tragedies under the Obama administration (other than the fact that tragedies are bad..mmkay).
When you see how the conservatives turned on our commander in chief with the Russia-Ukraine debacle and Benghazi, we can only imagine how batshit insane they would get if there was a successful terrorist attack on American Soil.
 
Is there a reason? On paper Cotton seems like a really good candidate, but hasn't been able to make strides thus far in polls.
Chuck Todd was saying the other day that Cotton's campaign has been terrible. That he built his entire campaign around his military record and Obamacare repeal and expected to skate into office on that alone.

Btw NC Senate from PPP: Hagan 38-36 with the Libertarian taking 11. The undecided went for Obama 55-37 in 2012 though.
 
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