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[RustyNails]

So who's orders was Lois Lerner acting on?

Do you really have to ask?

#ButcherOfBenghazi

 

[PhoenixDark]

I just don't get it. These groups were given clearance eventually (which was the wrong decision imo given how blatantly partisan many were), and liberal groups also received scrutiny. So what's the conspiracy, outside of attempting to invalidate Obama's re-election? Shit is pathetic.

 

[benjipwns]

Trey Gowdy offered up the possibility that there might have been a conspiracy at the IRS to make teabagger groups sad that didn't involve the White House.

So who's orders was Lois Lerner acting on?

Notice Obama's been going for a lot of walks lately...these aren't "involving the White House" same with all sorts of foreign overseas trips you have to parse these lieberal lies to not get bamboozled.

 

[B-Dubs]

I just don't get it. These groups were given clearance eventually (which was the wrong decision imo given how blatantly partisan many were), and liberal groups also received scrutiny. So what's the conspiracy, outside of attempting to invalidate Obama's re-election? Shit is pathetic.

It is just a continuation of the exact same shit they've been doing since Obama started running for President.

 

[benjipwns]

Do you really have to ask?

#ButcherOfBenghazi

So she's knee-capping Obama so she can run against his failed policies, including shifting the blame for Benghazi onto him along with his opposition to sound and strong Iraq policy like she voted for while deflecting every crushing Republican attack against her except for the one where she helped rape children or whatever it was she recently did in Arkansas.

 

[AndyD]

I just don't get it. These groups were given clearance eventually (which was the wrong decision imo given how blatantly partisan many were), and liberal groups also received scrutiny. So what's the conspiracy, outside of attempting to invalidate Obama's re-election? Shit is pathetic.

The idea I have seen floated is that the "extra" scrutiny served as intimidation in the run-up to the election. That they were granted status later is irrelevant.

I really wish the IRS had the funds/time/dedication to crack down on some of these groups. Just yesterday I was listening to a story on NPR where they discussed a local organization that has just 10 employees, 8 are registered lobbyists, of its own admission all it does it advocate for legislation favoring charter schools and has tons of money funneled to it due to its tax exempt 501c3 status. The way around the 50% rule was that some of the services are consulting for charter companies and not direct lobbying. Made no sense to me.

 

[Wilsongt]

The idea I have seen floated is that the "extra" scrutiny served as intimidation in the run-up to the election. That they were granted status later is irrelevant.

I really wish the IRS had the funds/time/dedication to crack down on some of these groups. Just yesterday I was listening to a story on NPR where they discussed a local organization that has just 10 employees, 8 are registered lobbyists, of its own admission all it does it advocate for legislation favoring charter schools and has tons of money funneled to it due to its tax exempt 501c3 status. The way around the 50% rule was that some of the services are consulting for charter companies and not direct lobbying. Made no sense to me.

Crocks and liars gonna crock and lie.

 

[benjipwns]

A real cracking down on major party associated (er I mean completely separate independent non-coordinating citizen) political groups would get their "bosses" in Congress and the White House involved even more. You can pick off groups here and there but once you start blocking up the incoming revenue too much...

 

[NYCmetsfan]

http://www.c-span.org/video/?c4501848/funnest-scene-congress

 

[Arksy]

Sorry for ruining your thread; but can someone explain this whole Benghazi scandal to me? The US embassy got overrun by a violent mob, and a few good people died...anything further than that and I have no clue what's going on or why it's such a scandal that's still dogging politics over there...

 

[Tamanon]

Sorry for ruining your thread; but can someone explain this whole Benghazi scandal to me? The US embassy got overrun by a violent mob, and a few good people died...anything further than that and I have no clue what's going on or why it's such a scandal that's still dogging politics over there...

http://www.vox.com/cards/benghazi-ambassador-stevens-attack/benghazi-basics

All you really need to know. But you've pretty much got all the actual bits already.

 

[kehs]

Sorry for ruining your thread; but can someone explain this whole Benghazi scandal to me? The US embassy got overrun by a violent mob, and a few good people died...anything further than that and I have no clue what's going on or why it's such a scandal that's still dogging politics over there...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S-uXPjbvw0I

 

[GaimeGuy]

The idea I have seen floated is that the "extra" scrutiny served as intimidation in the run-up to the election. That they were granted status later is irrelevant.

I really wish the IRS had the funds/time/dedication to crack down on some of these groups. Just yesterday I was listening to a story on NPR where they discussed a local organization that has just 10 employees, 8 are registered lobbyists, of its own admission all it does it advocate for legislation favoring charter schools and has tons of money funneled to it due to its tax exempt 501c3 status. The way around the 50% rule was that some of the services are consulting for charter companies and not direct lobbying. Made no sense to me.

They weren't given extra scrutiny for intimidation. You don't need pre-authorization to file as a 501c4. You do stuff as an organization, then you file your taxes as a 501c4, THEN the IRS checks your numbers.

There was no intimidation. There was no hold up, or attempted hold up. And there were no organizations that were 501c4 eligible but unfairly revoked or denied 501c4 status.

There's no scandal. There's never been a scandal, just conservatives rasing an uproar over basic Quality Assurance.

 

[Mario]

There's no scandal. There's never been a scandal, just conservatives rasing an uproar over basic Quality Assurance.

Both the IRS and Obama said there was inappropriate behaviour validating the claim of wrongdoing. They should have just owned it, denied any wrongdoing, and rode the uproar til it blew itself out rather than giving the claim an ounce of credibility.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Sorry for ruining your thread; but can someone explain this whole Benghazi scandal to me? The US embassy got overrun by a violent mob, and a few good people died...anything further than that and I have no clue what's going on or why it's such a scandal that's still dogging politics over there...

The scandal is that a black democrat president's State Department, run by a female democrat frontrunner for the 2016 presidential election (and not just any female democrat, but the witch Hilary Clinton, second only to Nancy Pelosi in her wickedness and evil), saw one of its foreign diplomatic missions, in a recently war-torn nation, attacked, with casualities and fatalities, as so happens to be one of the risks a diplomatic official of any nation posted anywhere may face.

It also provides some semblance of ammunition, however faked, for the GOP to paint democrats as hippie pussy mocha starbucks sippers without a backbone.

Also, the CIA and the department of defense may or may not have had some classified stuff going on under guise of the diplomatic compound that was attacked, so there was also internal squabbling between the CIA, white house office of the press secretary, state department, and department of defense on how to manage the issue from a PR standpoint, resulting in non-unified messaging from the administration in the immediate aftermath of the incident, which the GOP has used to create a smoke and mirrors show to distract from other issues, use as a political weapon against their enemies, which they identify as anyone not in agreement with their ideology.

 

[Ecotic]

You are implying that owning stock translates into this, which it completely doesn't. I think you are operating under a false assumption. You can absolutely have interest in these things, you can have knowledge about these things, without owning any stock. You can own stock and be completely uninformed about these issues, just as you can be informed about these issues without owning stock. The two are not mutually exclusive. That's what I'm saying, which you didn't seem to get.

Then you misunderstood me, I don't dispute any of that. My original post expressing alarm at Biden's statement was because it fit a pattern of him over the years describing how little he has despite pulling in a top-drawer salary for over 40 years, which either means he's disinterested in finance or guilty of gross financial malpractice, neither of which inspires much confidence in me that he's all that knowledgeable about any of it. And making a statement about how little he has in the context of Hillary's 'dead broke' remarks makes me believe he's possibly trying to score mindshare by pointing out his ignorance of economics in a sort of anti-intellectual way.

I really don't think this is true at all, mainly because I don't think people who are passionate for business news and finance have any real understanding of the American economy. Business news and finance is heavily slanted towards a worldview in which business news and finance are net benefits to society that deserve to exist. This is not an uncommon worldview, but I think that the evidence of the American economy in the last fifty years generally suggests that it's not an accurate one.

Don't let 90% of that subculture being morally bankrupt mislead you into thinking that it's still not something absolutely crucial to know, and gives you an edge in politics. One of the biggest deficiencies in the Democratic Party today is that there are few people who can not cede the 'knows business' high ground to Republicans in voter perception.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Both the IRS and Obama said there was inappropriate behaviour validating the claim of wrongdoing. They should have just owned it, denied any wrongdoing, and rode the uproar til it blew itself out rather than giving the claim an ounce of credibility.

Inappropriate behavior doesn't necessarily mean wrongdoing, malice, illegal, or unethical behavior, which is what the GOP has been tyring to paint this as. Their tax boner and persecution complex is the only thing scandalous.

 

[thepotatoman]

http://www.c-span.org/video/?c4501848/funnest-scene-congress

I don't know if they're acting awkward because they're singing a civil rights anthem, being forced to hold hands with the opposing party, or because they're holding hands in a really silly way, but either way, that video's amazing, and the song so fitting.

At least Pelosi knows how to own it and act super into it.

 

[GaimeGuy]

Don't let 90% of that subculture being morally bankrupt mislead you into thinking that it's still not something absolutely crucial to know, and gives you an edge in politics. One of the biggest deficiencies in the Democratic Party today is that there are few people who can not cede the 'knows business' high ground to Republicans in voter perception.

"Knows business" can mean anything from being the chief executive of a fortune 500 company to running a small coffee shop or greasy breakfast joint in a strip mall.

But you're more likely to see the GOP point to the tiling company owner that makes 6 figures while paying his employees $20K under the table (frequently owing each employee hundreds or thousands of dollars in unpaid wages) and misclassifying his employees in his taxes, than you are to see them point to the mom and daughter running a restaurant and making $30K-$50k. They only care about the overseers and capitalists.

 

[speculawyer]

They weren't given extra scrutiny for intimidation. You don't need pre-authorization to file as a 501c4. You do stuff as an organization, then you file your taxes as a 501c4, THEN the IRS checks your numbers.

There was no intimidation. There was no hold up, or attempted hold up. And there were no organizations that were 501c4 eligible but unfairly revoked or denied 501c4 status.

There's no scandal. There's never been a scandal, just conservatives rasing an uproar over basic Quality Assurance.

But the 'scandal' is bigger than ever now. With the missing emails, the conspiracy theorists are going nuts. This is the biggest thing since the missing 'long form birth certificate'.

Anybody trying to look for the other end of those emails? Hell no! . . . It is much more compelling as a story to have them all disappear. If we actually found them, we'd just realize they probably say nothing interesting.

 

[Oblivion]

A Shorewood man has been charged with more than a dozen counts of illegal voting, accused of casting multiple ballots in four elections in 2011 and 2012, including five in the 2012 gubernatorial recall.

Robert D. Monroe, 50, used addresses in Shorewood, Milwaukee and Indiana, according to the complaint, and cast some votes in the names of his son and his girlfriend's son.

According to the complaint:

Monroe cast two ballots in the April 2011 Supreme Court election, two in the August 2011 Alberta Darling recall election, five in the Scott Walker-Tom Barrett recall, one illegal ballot in an August 2012 primary, and two ballots in the November 2012 presidential election.

http://crooksandliars.com/2014/06/scott-walker-fan-indicted-massive-voter

How many innocent Republicans have to go to jail before naive liberals realize there is rampant voter fraud?

 

[benjipwns]

REP. TREY GOWDY (R-SC): You have already said multiple times today that there was no evidence that you found of any criminal wrongdoing. I want you to tell me what criminal statutes you have evaluated.

JOHN KOSKINEN, IRS COMMISSIONER: I have not looked at any.

GOWDY: Well, how can you possibly tell our fellow citizens that there's not criminal wrongdoing if you don’t even know what statutes to look at?

KOSKINEN: I have seen no evidence that anyone --

GOWDY: Well, how would you know what elements of the crime existed? You don’t even know what statutes are in play. I'm going to ask you again. What statutes have you evaluated?

KOSKINEN: I think you can rely on common sense that nothing I have seen --

GOWDY: Common sense. Instead on the criminal code, you want to rely on common sense? No, Mr. Commissioner, you can shake your head all you want to, Commissioner. You have said today that there is no evidence of criminal wrongdoing and I am asking you what criminal statutes you have reviewed to reach that conclusion?

KOSKINEN: I reviewed no criminal statutes.

OH SNAP

 

[Oblivion]

But the 'scandal' is bigger than ever now. With the missing emails, the conspiracy theorists are going nuts. This is the biggest thing since the missing 'long form birth certificate'.

Anybody trying to look for the other end of those emails? Hell no! . . . It is much more compelling as a story to have them all disappear. If we actually found them, we'd just realize they probably say nothing interesting.

But Spec, don't you think it's odd that a year after the IRS investigation started, we learn that the hard drive was destroyed a year before the IRS investigation started? A little too coincidental, isn't it?

 

[GaimeGuy]

But the 'scandal' is bigger than ever now. With the missing emails, the conspiracy theorists are going nuts. This is the biggest thing since the missing 'long form birth certificate'.

Anybody trying to look for the other end of those emails? Hell no! . . . It is much more compelling as a story to have them all disappear. If we actually found them, we'd just realize they probably say nothing interesting.

Of course they disappear. Most organizations, especially large ones, aren't going to back up emails past 3 or 6 months. Which means that you have to manually archive your emails yourself, as a user, if you want to retain information for later reference, and if the drive in which you have those mails archived on is wiped, or dies, or your departments computers get replaced with new ones and the old ones get wiped, well, it's gone.

As I said, it's not a scandal.

 

[AntoneM]

OH SNAP

Well senator, when you washed your hair today did you rinse... and repeat? Yes or no? JUST ANSWER YES OR NO.

Looks like the distinguished gentleman can't follow even the simplest rules. I rest my case.

 

[benjipwns]

Of course they disappear. Most organizations, especially large ones, aren't going to back up emails past 3 or 6 months. Which means that you have to manually archive your emails yourself, as a user, if you want to retain information for later reference, and if the drive in which you have those mails archived on is wiped, or dies, or your departments computers get replaced with new ones and the old ones get wiped, well, it's gone.

As I said, it's not a scandal.

Right, like Watergate the real scandal is the coverup inside the White House and the likelihood it goes all the way up to the President. (Or more accurately Valerie Jarrett.) When did the President order e-mails to be deleted and no backups made? And if not the President, who made this order? What's in the missing 18MB?

 

[Black Mamba]

But the 'scandal' is bigger than ever now. With the missing emails, the conspiracy theorists are going nuts. This is the biggest thing since the missing 'long form birth certificate'.

Anybody trying to look for the other end of those emails? Hell no! . . . It is much more compelling as a story to have them all disappear. If we actually found them, we'd just realize they probably say nothing interesting.

But they did find those emails. Most of them, anyway. They say nothing at all.

 

[benjipwns]

But they did find those emails. Most of them, anyway. They say nothing at all.

Right, it's all in the conveniently missing ones. Which is why they are missing. You always give out all the rest, claim you've released everything, while dropping hard drives off the roof of the Treasury Building and then murdering the go-between in Fort Marcy Park.

 

[kehs]

The thing that makes me laugh about these senators crying about no proper back up system(which I think should be in place), is that they would be first in line to make such a system sound nefarious.

All these records are backed up every day by the IRS. Multiple copies are located off site for "safe keeping". They have YEARS and YEARS of emails and records about your 501 c(4) s.

Do YOU trust the IRS will all that DATA? What EXACTLY are they doing with all that info?!?


Benghazi

 

[speculawyer]

OH SNAP

More vague fear mongering. Does Trey Gowdy have any code in mind that he would like to claim applies? No.

 

[Oblivion]

Valerie Jarrett

Speaking of which, this is such a strange thing to hear Freepers say all the time. Isn't Obama supposed to be the devil himself? Isn't he supposed to be the great, narcissistic, despot who years to put all those before him (Hitler, Stalin, etc.) to shame? Isn't he supposed to represent the highest echelon of evil?

But now we're to believe that what? He's been a mere puppet to the true Anti-Christ this entire time?

 

[benjipwns]

Speaking of which, this is such a strange thing to hear Freepers say all the time. Isn't Obama supposed to be the devil himself? Isn't he supposed to be the great, narcissistic, despot who years to put all those before him (Hitler, Stalin, etc.) to shame? Isn't he supposed to represent the highest echelon of evil?

But now we're to believe that what? He's been a mere puppet to the true Anti-Christ this entire time?

He's a souless and clueless dunce, which is why they won't release his college transcripts and his college papers. He's just an affirmative action figurehead for the real Saul Alinsky trained Marxist plotters.

 

[speculawyer]

Speaking of which, this is such a strange thing to hear Freepers say all the time. Isn't Obama supposed to be the devil himself? Isn't he supposed to be the great, narcissistic, despot who years to put all those before him (Hitler, Stalin, etc.) to shame? Isn't he supposed to represent the highest echelon of evil?

But now we're to believe that what? He's been a mere puppet to the true Anti-Christ this entire time?

She is of Iranian descent . . . and that means she is B-Rock "The Islamic Shock" SuperAllah Hussen Obama's secret conduit in the nefarious world of the Muslim Brotherhood, Al-Qeada, and the Iranian Mullahs.

 

[speculawyer]

Right, like Watergate the real scandal is the coverup inside the White House and the likelihood it goes all the way up to the President. (Or more accurately Valerie Jarrett.) When did the President order e-mails to be deleted and no backups made? And if not the President, who made this order? What's in the missing 18MB?

Jodie Foster's space trip.

 

[Wilsongt]

Ben Carson opens his mouth again. As per usual, shit flies everywhere.

When asked if he could come up with a compromise on marriage equality — one of the “biggest, most contentious” issues of our day — he said that we all have to be willing to “understand that not everybody thinks the same way that they think” and “engage in conversation.”

Carson continued, “I don’t think I can impose my will on any two consenting adults. They can do what they want to do, I am not going to try to stop them from doing that.”

Off to a good start, right? So what is this big compromise Carson has in mind to appease both sides on the issue of marriage equality, since he accepts that he can’t impose his will on any two consenting adults? The solution, according to Carson, is to not let gay people get married. Ben Carson’s big compromise on equal marriage is to not let gay people get married.

http://www.salon.com/2014/06/24/ben...y_compromise_dont_let_gay_people_get_married/

Absolutely stunning compromise.

 

[benjipwns]

Jodie Foster's space trip.

Which was funded by a secretive billionaire and covered up by the White House*! Another free market triumph suppressed by the government.

*A black woman (possibly with Iranian ties?) advisor to the President!

 

[B-Dubs]

Ben Carson opens his mouth again. As per usual, shit flies everywhere.




http://www.salon.com/2014/06/24/ben...y_compromise_dont_let_gay_people_get_married/

Absolutely stunning compromise.

Does he understand how a compromise even works? Someone get this man a dictionary.

 

[Oblivion]

Ben Carson has turned out to be a grave disappointment. I was hoping he would be the new generation's Herman Cain, but unfortunately he lacks all the lovable goofiness that made the Cain Train a powerful force in the conservative movement.

 

[Black Mamba]

Right, it's all in the conveniently missing ones. Which is why they are missing. You always give out all the rest, claim you've released everything, while dropping hard drives off the roof of the Treasury Building and then murdering the go-between in Fort Marcy Park.

I know you're joking.

But what makes this conspiracy so absurd is that Lerner managed to delete every important e-mail from the recipients of all those emails. Like, not a single one of the hundreds of people she sent them to accidentally or intentionally saved one.

Nope. Not one. No mistakes. Lerner is a mastermind the world has never seen before.

The IRS scandal is very much like the Bush planted bombs in the WTC conspiracy to go Iraq.

So many things that could go wrong would have to not go wrong...

 

[benjipwns]

Ben Carson has turned out to be a grave disappointment. I was hoping he would be the new generation's Herman Cain, but unfortunately he lacks all the lovable goofiness that made the Cain Train a powerful force in the conservative movement.

They love him more than Cain before Perry bombed out. Cain, like Michael Steele, was that little fling you have when you're younger. Ben Carson is the type of black man you can take home to the GOP base.

Fun Fact: Hermain Cain actually ran before for President in 2000, but they already had Alan Keyes to get no funding and say crazy conservative things so he dropped out well before the primaries.

 

[Tamanon]

They love him more than Cain before Perry bombed out. Cain, like Michael Steele, was that little fling you have when you're younger. Ben Carson is the type of black man you can take home to the GOP base.

If there's one thing I know about the GOP base, there's no black man you can take home.

 

[RustyNails]

Rangel is a dinosaur. C'mon dude, you're 84. Ride off into the sunset.

 

[speculawyer]

Rangel is a dinosaur. C'mon dude, you're 84. Ride off into the sunset.

He should have left a few years back.

 

[speculawyer]

They love him more than Cain before Perry bombed out. Cain, like Michael Steele, was that little fling you have when you're younger. Ben Carson is the type of black man you can take home to the GOP base.

Fun Fact: Hermain Cain actually ran before for President in 2000, but they already had Alan Keyes to get no funding and say crazy conservative things so he dropped out well before the primaries.

I think common denominator is that you need to be a hardcore Christian Conservative to be black in the GOP. If you stray from that, they'll disown you as they did with Herman Cain & Michael Steele.

 

[Oblivion]

Fun Fact: Hermain Cain actually ran before for President in 2000, but they already had Alan Keyes to get no funding and say crazy conservative things so he dropped out well before the primaries.

:O

Surprised this was never mentioned before.

 

[benjipwns]

Cain was arguably the most socially conservative candidate after probably Santorum and maybe Bachmann, he just had...well...some personal moral failings. Apparently he's mulling running again in 2016.

Steele was way more conservative on everything when he was running for office (like stem cell research which he compared to eugenics), when he became RNC chairman he tried to moderate the party's message a little by allowing some ground for abortion at the state level, same-sex marriage not being an important issue, and talking about stem cells, immigration and gun control as not completely bad ideas. Then he picked a fight with Rush Limbaugh and the Tea Party.

 

[PhoenixDark]

Rangel is a piece of shit.

 

[benjipwns]

:O

Surprised this was never mentioned before.

And he was a bit different candidate then:

After meeting with political consultants and past and present senators, Cain said he had determined that while he has very strong and distinct opinions about business-related matters, he is less clear-cut in his stances on social issues and was not ready to appease voters by taking stands on those issues.

“Too many people in the electorate are single-issue voters,” he commented, “and to try and cater to the single-issue voters and the single-issue pockets out there felt like I was compromising my beliefs. As an example, with the pro-life and pro-abortion debate, the most vocal people are on the ends. I am pro-life with exceptions, and people want you to be all or nothing.”

He added, “I am not a social-issue crusader. I am a free-enterprise crusader.”

"If he runs, Cain says he will advocate market-oriented reforms of health care and Social Security, plus a simpler and fairer tax system. Each of these issues ranks high on the GOP's economic agenda.

"But unlike many in his party, Cain opposes school vouchers for private schools and backs efforts only to 'revisit,' not eliminate, affirmative action. He declined to give his position on abortion rights. In the primaries, Cain's moderate social stances could pose problems."

Cain says his presidential campaign in 2000 was more about making a point than winning. "George W. Bush was the chosen one," Cain told me. "He had the campaign DNA that followers look for." But Cain also added, "I believe that I had a better message and I believe that I was the better messenger."

This quote seems slightly dubious though he did endorse Forbes:

In 1999: When his own run against Bush fizzled, Cain endorsed Steve Forbes, who was (and, likely, still is) known to be quite moderate on the abortion issue and continued his anti-Bush campaign, saying that by electing Bush, Republicans will have "shortchanged ourselves as a party." (Source: Conservative News Service, July 1, 1999) Cain endorsed the liberal Steve Forbes, over the more conservative George Bush, who as a candidate in 2000, presented himself of the champion pro life conservative causes. Cain attacked George Bush for being too conservative.

Since Forbes was pretty pro-life and way more fiscally conservative.

 

[benjipwns]

Actually, came across this, which is funny considering how Carson shot up to conservative stardom:

In 1994, in his first memorable political moment, Cain confronted President Bill Clinton at an Omaha townhall meeting over health-care policy, a tete-a-tete that was caught on tape and attracted the notice of the likes of then-Speaker Newt Gingrich and Republican vice-presidential nominee Jack Kemp.

 

[Piecake]

Don't let 90% of that subculture being morally bankrupt mislead you into thinking that it's still not something absolutely crucial to know, and gives you an edge in politics. One of the biggest deficiencies in the Democratic Party today is that there are few people who can not cede the 'knows business' high ground to Republicans in voter perception.

That's because Republicans pander to what big business want, short-term profits at the expense of our nation's long-term health. Business, then, gives them the mantle of the best party for 'business'.

I don't think knowing what business wants and how best to improve our economy in the future is mutually exclusive. Frankly, it seems a lot more different than similar. I also do not think that understanding of business, the economy, and finance in a general sense translates into an ability to pick stocks. Personally, I think picking stocks is basically all guesswork now. I also disagree that a lack of interest or understanding of personal finance means that that person does not understand business, the economy, finance, etc. I think they are two different things.