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[Cesare Borgia]

Yeah, the late move is sort of annoying, but primaries make better candidates, usually. And Perriello is the better candidate.

He was a way better candidate than McAuliffe and would have beaten him IMO.

 

[Ogodei]

Virginia by its nature is the king of establishment politics. It would be odd to see an insurgent candidate win here.

 

[Joe Shlabotnik]

Right. I don't understand why Crocodile said that people can care about more than one thing >_>

It's like...yeah, we can. But regular americans probably don't care about the grandeur scheme of things. Joe from Arkansas doesn't care who Trump appoints. But he still has a family that needs a doctor, and medicare allows him to do so.

Like...Dems attacking him from this angle is great. It's good. Russia stuff? It didn't stick. Not during the election, and not right now. And hey, I appreciate Dems are doing that, because I myself depend on Medicare, moreso than the Russian lovers Trump might appoint. Yes I care about both, but one is more immediate than the other.

I mean, the GOP just had to un-fuck their fucking of the Office of Congressional Ethics in less than 24 hours because they got inundated with calls from constituents, but OK.

 

[sc0la]

Mike pence is a handsome man should be our next thread name

PoliGAF 2017 |OT1| Mike Pence Is A Handsome Man Should Be Our Next Thread Name

IDK Its kind of wordy tbh

 

[thepotatoman]

People can care about more than one thing at a time and talk about more than one thing at a time.

After this election, I'm no longer sure I believe that. It has been insane how singularly focused the news cycle is, and how quickly things are forgotten after that news cycle moves on.

 

[Retromelon]

PoliGAF 2017 |OT1| Mike Pence Is A Handsome Man Should Be Our Next Thread Name

IDK Its kind of wordy tbh

Oh, you!

 

[thepotatoman]

That big ass twitter picture is actually real lol.

Honestly, I don't see what's the big deal about it. I guess the novelty of Trump's twitter account being very important to US politics has run out for me.

Using a trump tweet for one of your huge CSPAN slides seems like the most normal thing in the world to me now.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

Amy and Sammy from Amy's Baking Company from Kitchen Nightmares are probably the closest parallels to Donald Trump.

Is it possible reality TV normalized these type of fucked up people and made fucked up people confident enough to put a fuck up in office?

 

[Tall4Life]

Amy and Sammy from Amy's Baking Company from Kitchen Nightmares are probably the closest parallels to Donald Trump.

Is it possible reality TV normalized these type of fucked up people and made fucked up people confident enough to put a fuck up in office?

I think its also a boy that cried wolf scenario in that with how much shitflinging and accusations of devil worship there was before in other elections that people now fail to recognize actual evil

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

I think its also a boy that cried wolf scenario in that with how much shitflinging and accusations of devil worship there was before in other elections that people now fail to recognize actual evil

I mean, elections in the past were pretty fucking brutal and people could still see that Barry Goldwater was an evil person in 1964.

Just trying to think up any reality TV angle.

 

[B-Dubs]

Amy and Sammy from Amy's Baking Company from Kitchen Nightmares are probably the closest parallels to Donald Trump.

Is it possible reality TV normalized these type of fucked up people and made fucked up people confident enough to put a fuck up in office?

The truth is Trump is a con man and that's how he won. He's pulled, and continues to pull, a variant of the old rainmaker con. Basically he says he can do something and then when something that looks vaguely like the thing he promised happens he claims credit regardless of if he was in a position to make it happen or not.

While what he's been doing looks different than the traditional rainmaker, the rainmaker con is the bare skeleton of his entire strategy (if not his entire political persona). He promised everyone something incredibly vague (to make America great again) and went on and on about how he could make it happen. Each group that voted for him took that promise and superimposed their own goals onto it, or he'd do it himself. In the rust belt he'd bring back manufacturing jobs and their old way of life, as an example we all know.

He'd then take those promises and when small things that looked like them happened during the campaign, like the Oreo thing, he'd claim credit for the good outcome. Thus the mark is led to believe he can actually deliver on the larger promises. Any bad outcomes are down to people opposing him, and because he already demonstrated the good ones the mark is more likely to believe him.

Basically the only way to beat this is to expose the con for what it is, but the insane partisanship and fractured media landscape of the modern era made that impossible to do. Since everyone was in different bubbles, essentially living in a different reality, it became harder than normal to expose the con for what it is. Anytime someone tried to expose the con his voters would just go "it's just the liberal media again" or "why should I believe the democrats" and retreat into the bubble. Between Fox News and social media the perfect storm was created to allow him to pull a con on the whole country.

The issue now is that he's in a position of power and can pull a more traditional version of the con, which we've already seen him do with the Carrier deal or the House ethics thing.

 

[ItWasMeantToBe19]

My reality TV ideas fall apart with Turkey electing Erdogan who has the exact same personality disorders as Trump. That is, unless reality TV is huge in Turkey also.

But, there should be a Kitchen Nightmares Trump Grill... Maybe the highest rated TV episode of the 2010s.

 

[B-Dubs]

My reality TV ideas fall apart with Turkey electing Erdogan who has the exact same personality disorders as Trump. That is, unless reality TV is huge in Turkey also.

But, there should be a Kitchen Nightmares Trump Grill... Maybe the highest rated TV episode of the 2010s.

Erdogan won in Turkey because that shit was massively fucked up and sadly he was probably the best option at the time if my memory serves.

I'd watch a Trump Grill episode of Kitchen Nightmares, but Ramsay wouldn't do it since he'd probably get thrown in jail or get his visa revoked.

 

[whyamihere]

lol at the number of Democrats running for New Jersey governor this year:

Bill Brennan, activist and former firefighter[15]
Monica Brinson, pharmaceutical sales representative[16][17]
Bob Hoatson, sexual abuse victims advocate and former Catholic priest[18]
Jim Johnson, former U.S. Under Secretary of the Treasury for Enforcement[19]
Lisa McCormick, businesswoman[16]
Phil Murphy, former United States Ambassador to Germany and former Goldman Sachs executive[20]
Titus Pierce, businessman and Iraq War veteran[16][21]
John Wisniewski, State Assemblyman and former Chairman of the New Jersey Democratic State Committee[22][23]

Crazy that not one sitting congressman has declared in either the Dem or GOP primaries.

 

[B-Dubs]

lol at the number of Democrats running for New Jersey governor this year:


Crazy that not one sitting congressman has declared in either the Dem or GOP primaries.

That's how the NJ Governorship goes. One party wins it, the winner gets hoisted by his own petard, then the other party wins it and the cycle repeats. Sitting Congressmen/women don't want it since, like the NY governorship, it tends to be a career ender.

 

[Metaphoreus]

Dear God, make it stop: At Least 50 Trump Electors Were Illegitimately Seated as Electoral College Members.

More than 50 Electoral College members who voted for Donald Trump were ineligible to serve as presidential electors because they did not live in the congressional districts they represented or held elective office in states legally barring dual officeholders.

That stunning finding is among the conclusions of an extensive 1,000-plus page legal briefing prepared by a bipartisan nationwide legal team for members of Congress who are being urged to object to certifying the 2016 Electoral College results on Friday.

“Trump’s ascension to the presidency is completely illegitimate,” said Ryan Clayton of Americans Take Action, who is promoting the effort. “It’s not just Russians hacking our democracy. It’s not just voter suppression at unprecedented levels. It is also [that] there are Republicans illegally casting ballots in the Electoral College, and in a sufficient number that the results of the Electoral College proceedings are illegitimate as well.”

 

[BreezyLimbo]

Dear God, make it stop: At Least 50 Trump Electors Were Illegitimately Seated as Electoral College Members.

can anything come from this?

 

[Metaphoreus]

can anything come from this?

I'm not even going to bother looking into whether their claims have any legal merit, because the answer to your question in any event is no. Even assuming the challenged votes are thrown out and nobody wins a majority of the Electoral College, the House will simply vote for Trump as president. It's a pointless exercise.

EDIT: But from a brief review (I got curious) of their legal citations, which they've helpfully bundled in a PDF, it looks like a bunch of nonsense anyhow. I'd hate to be one of the "roughly" 15 lawyers who has to claim responsibility for this stuff.

2d EDIT: It's so, so bad. I'm cringing reading through this material. Here's a particularly egregious example about one of the Louisiana electors:

You're reading that right. Chris Trahan's Electoral College vote is in violation of Louisiana law because the Alabama Republican Party requires one elector from each district, and Trahan is in some way associated with the Louisiana State Treasury.

 

[Pixieking]

The truth is Trump is a con man and that's how he won. He's pulled, and continues to pull, a variant of the old rainmaker con. Basically he says he can do something and then when something that looks vaguely like the thing he promised happens he claims credit regardless of if he was in a position to make it happen or not.

While what he's been doing looks different than the traditional rainmaker, the rainmaker con is the bare skeleton of his entire strategy (if not his entire political persona). He promised everyone something incredibly vague (to make America great again) and went on and on about how he could make it happen. Each group that voted for him took that promise and superimposed their own goals onto it, or he'd do it himself. In the rust belt he'd bring back manufacturing jobs and their old way of life, as an example we all know.

He'd then take those promises and when small things that looked like them happened during the campaign, like the Oreo thing, he'd claim credit for the good outcome. Thus the mark is led to believe he can actually deliver on the larger promises. Any bad outcomes are down to people opposing him, and because he already demonstrated the good ones the mark is more likely to believe him.

Basically the only way to beat this is to expose the con for what it is, but the insane partisanship and fractured media landscape of the modern era made that impossible to do. Since everyone was in different bubbles, essentially living in a different reality, it became harder than normal to expose the con for what it is. Anytime someone tried to expose the con his voters would just go "it's just the liberal media again" or "why should I believe the democrats" and retreat into the bubble. Between Fox News and social media the perfect storm was created to allow him to pull a con on the whole country.

The issue now is that he's in a position of power and can pull a more traditional version of the con, which we've already seen him do with the Carrier deal or the House ethics thing.

So how do we show people that Trump is a con-man? I think issues of masculinity and "being a man" are going to be pretty deeply against us here. Guys more than girls generally tend to double-down when confronted with being shown to have been played - part fear of looking stupid, part unwillingness to be educated - and Trump definitely played-to and got more men than women based on some traditionally male viewpoints.

So, how many male Trump voters are going to even be open to the idea that Trump is a con-man? How many guys are going to own-up to their mothers/sisters/wives/daughters that they got owned? How do you beat the moronic Alpha Male norms that say that weakness and owning-up to mistakes make you a pussy?

Again, I think education is something that could help here - a company that's entirely separated from the Dems, with "sales-people" who edge towards the Republican "look" (white, older, Christian), going into small towns and saying "Hey, you didn't get played, we got played".

 

[HP_Wuvcraft]

Trumps diehards will never, ever, ever believe he is anything but Jesus.

We need to stop acting like these people are the ones we should be targeting.

 

[Pixieking]

There's a difference between diehards and politically naive/illiterate/stupid. Though whether it's worth targeting the latter group is debatable - how much time/effort/money for how large a group and all that.

I think what isn't debatable in this line of conversation is that knowing how to deal with the diehards - knowing how to spin a narrative that shuts them up, makes them feel stupid, makes them feel embarrassed to raise Trump with their friends/relatives/coworkers - is something that's needed. Control the narrative enough that you shut-down the diehard's easy comebacks, and you have a more manageable situation. For example, saying to someone who's wearing a "Grope This" shirt that someone you know was raped/sexually assaulted means they can't (easily) say that "It's just locker-room talk". They can still argue the point, sure, but at that point they come across as awful human beings, especially if you're a "normal looking" white guy, middle-aged/old. Trump supporters thrive on the perception that they're normal, and everyone else is "wrong" in some way - if you come across as just as normal as they are, they have less to work with.

 

[neurosisxeno]

Not sure if it was posted (or if it's really news) but; Study: racism and sexism predict support for Trump much more than economic dissatisfaction.

“We find that while economic dissatisfaction was part of the story, racism and sexism were much more important and can explain about two-thirds of the education gap among whites in the 2016 presidential vote,” the researchers write.

All that economic anxiety.

 

[kirblar]

Does anyone think this Russia stuff is a loser?

Not sure how they ascended to boogeyman status so quickly, and not sure it helps to continuously hammer this point. They are a fucked up country with a fucked up leader.

There are a lot of countries like this. I understand that we are not crossing lines, but sprinting past them at this point, and its fine to criticize that. Just feel like the left has started down the path of a new cold war, whereas we deal with a lot of fucked up countries.

This isn't a fucking political game. They are attacking us.

 

[Aaron Strife]

Not sure if it was posted (or if it's really news) but; Study: racism and sexism predict support for Trump much more than economic dissatisfaction.



All that economic anxiety.

I mean I get it on the level of certain swing voters, but yeah. Anyone (myself included at times) who thought Trump didn't have 45% of the electorate on lockdown and that Sanders would have scooped up a significant share of his vote was deluding themselves.

It's just that no one wants to admit that - in the most charitable interpretation - that huge of the population is willing to let a white supremacist run the country as long as they get their preferred policy on abortion or tax cuts or whatever. "At least the trains run on time," so it goes.

I'd guess of the people who voted for Trump, maybe 5-10% is winnable for a Democrat. About a third of the remainder are party line Republicans who will hold their nose for anything, and the rest are the deplorables, full-out sexist, racist, xenophobic, homophobic, every word in the book assholes who will go to their graves angry and scared.

The more fertile territory for Democrats would be the people who went third party (good chunks of both Stein and Johnson's voters, although there certainly are people who always vote third party) or just didn't turn out.

 

[PBY]

This isn't a fucking political game. They are attacking us.

I'm not talking only about the political implications, policy as well.

Obama handled it well, but even he took a fairly even-handed approach; I generally feel that escalation is a bad path. Just trying to square that with the rhetoric flying around which strikes me as decidedly alarmist.

 

[kirblar]

I'm not talking only about the political implications, policy as well.

Obama handled it well, but even he took a fairly even-handed approach; I generally feel that escalation is a bad path. Just trying to square that with the rhetoric flying around which strikes me as decidedly alarmist.

We're not the ones escalating it.

They're punching us in the face and kicking our allies. You don't appease this shit, you grab their head and slam it into the pavement.

And a "outspoken progressive" will not work in VA. The Dems win by being boring technocrats.

 

[Wilsongt]

Donald J. Trump‏ @realDonaldTrump

The Democrats, lead by head clown Chuck Schumer, know how bad ObamaCare is and what a mess they are in. Instead of working to fix it, th


The second time he called the senate minority leader a clown.

 

[Diablos]

Paul Ryan's agenda... ugh

Requiring congressional approval for any new regulation...

Democrats aren't going to be able to do anything for like 10 years at least. Man this sucks so bad

Like, say a Dem wins in 2020 and reinstated Obama's FCC rules... if the House is still in GOP hands that would basically be impossible if congressional approval would be required...

They're going to make Congress more important than the WH...

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

So Glenn Beck dropped the facade even quicker than I imagined he would.

 

[Incognito]

wait, who's the 'establishment stooge' in the VA Gov primary?

 

[Carpe Libertatem]

And a "outspoken progressive" will not work in VA. The Dems win by being boring technocrats.

Perriello lost by like 3.5% in a R+5 district in southern VA in 2010, which is remarkable

If he wins the primary I think he has a good a chance as anyone to win the general.

It'll be interesting to see what his views on guns and abortion are, though. He wasn't particularly liberal on those issues in 2008-2010.

 

[RustyNails]

Anyone watching the Senate hearing on cyber threats? It looks like Senator Snowball wants to talk about everything but the Russian involvement.

 

[Plinko]

Not sure if it was posted (or if it's really news) but; Study: racism and sexism predict support for Trump much more than economic dissatisfaction.



All that economic anxiety.

Finally. Sexism was obviously a huge factor here, and the media never said a peep about it. It was ridiculous. Midwesterners in specific have a huge issue with a woman running things.

Guess what? It isn't changing any time soon. Even in 2016, we live in a sexist/racist country.

To be totally honest, if I was the democrats, I'd be discouraging Warren and Harris from running in 2020. Let an older guy like Biden take it and see if we make any progress in those areas in 2024.

 

[balladofwindfishes]

I think sexism wasn't mentioned because it wasn't as overt as racism. "She's shrill" "Why doesn't she smile more" "Why is she wearing those colors?" and all the double standards she was held to were rooted in sexism, but could easily mask as not being sexist.

Sexism likely played a huge part in why places like 4Chan latched onto Trump. The Internet is really, really, really, really, really sexist. REALLY sexist. Young people online are probably the most sexist people in the entire country.

 

[kirblar]

I think sexism wasn't mentioned because it wasn't as overt as racism. "She's shrill" "Why doesn't she smile more" "Why is she wearing those colors?" and all the double standards she was held to were rooted in sexism, but could easily mask as not being sexist.

Sexism likely played a huge part in why places like 4Chan latched onto Trump. The Internet is really, really, really, really, really sexist. REALLY sexist. Young people online are probably the most sexist people in the entire country.

The "CORRUPT/CROOKED" tag sticking to her is sexism in action. Same exact language as w/ Gamergate.

 

[Tall4Life]

I think sexism wasn't mentioned because it wasn't as overt as racism. "She's shrill" "Why doesn't she smile more" "Why is she wearing those colors?" and all the double standards she was held to were rooted in sexism, but could easily mask as not being sexist.

Sexism likely played a huge part in why places like 4Chan latched onto Trump. The Internet is really, really, really, really, really sexist. REALLY sexist. Young people online are probably the most sexist people in the entire country.

Do you have any actual statistics or facts to back this up, or are you just basing this on one contained community?

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

Trump didn't catch anywhere near as much shit as he should have for the "nasty woman" comment.

 

[Dubbedinenglish]

Trump can't be sexist, look at all the platinum blondes speaking for him!

 

[Finalizer]

So Glenn Beck dropped the facade even quicker than I imagined he would.

Dare I ask what he's up to now?

 

[Brawly Likes to Brawl]

Dare I ask what he's up to now?

His two cents on the Chicago torture story.

 

[cooljeanius]

Virginia by its nature is the king of establishment politics. It would be odd to see an insurgent candidate win here.

Eric Cantor was from Virginia and look what happened to him.

 

[studyguy]

Twitter doing a fantastic job overnight of turning that torture story into #BLMkidnapping

Fucking US twitter trends overnight immediately become prey to whatever assholes set up bots during the slow period. Really shitty stuff ends up trending with low posts till regular people start things trending around noon PST

 

[TestOfTide]

So Glenn Beck dropped the facade even quicker than I imagined he would.

What happened?

 

[NYCmetsfan]

Republicans hate democracy

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/312766-gop-aims-to-rein-in-liberal-cities

They fundamentally believe that rural conservatives have a natural right to power and liberal urban city dwellers should have no say over their own lives

 

[balladofwindfishes]

Republicans hate democracy

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/312766-gop-aims-to-rein-in-liberal-cities

They fundamentally believe that rural conservatives have a natural right to power and liberal urban city dwellers should have no say over their own lives

"States rights"

But a lot of this (most of this? All of this?) will be chucked out by the SC. The Federal Government doesn't have the authority to tell states to do some of the things the GOP wants to believe it can.

 

[Veritigo_X]

Republicans hate democracy

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/312766-gop-aims-to-rein-in-liberal-cities

They fundamentally believe that rural conservatives have a natural right to power and liberal urban city dwellers should have no say over their own lives

What's going on in Arizona is insane. The fact they want to do this in every state in the country is a bit scary.

 

[The Technomancer]

Republicans hate democracy

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/312766-gop-aims-to-rein-in-liberal-cities

They fundamentally believe that rural conservatives have a natural right to power and liberal urban city dwellers should have no say over their own lives

I do not understand these people

 

[Rebel Leader]

Republicans hate democracy

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/312766-gop-aims-to-rein-in-liberal-cities

They fundamentally believe that rural conservatives have a natural right to power and liberal urban city dwellers should have no say over their own lives

The "smal government party" is at it again

 

[Bonen no Max'd]

Republicans hate democracy

http://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/312766-gop-aims-to-rein-in-liberal-cities

They fundamentally believe that rural conservatives have a natural right to power and liberal urban city dwellers should have no say over their own lives

This is already my life lol, every time my college town wants to do something (minimum wage hike, plastic bag ban) the state legislature and it's lovingly 80+% Republican members go LOLNOPE and place a ban on whatever it is we wanted to do.

 

[dramatis]

Do you have any actual statistics or facts to back this up, or are you just basing this on one contained community?

One contained community? Twitter, Facebook, the other major social media platforms—it's everywhere. Even a place that is more moderated like GAF is not exempt from sexism.