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PoliGAF 2016 |OT8| No, Donald. You don't.
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VendettaRed07
Member
People are over reacting to that. It isn't a big deal. But I still stand by that I don't believe he'll actually push for or fully get behind this agenda Hillary and other dems have said they are committing to.
Anti-bank sentiments have a long history in this country going back to the 18th century. So yes - some people just knee-jerk when they hear the word bank.
metalslimer
Member
It's kind of frustrating because I feel like liberals sometimes interpret any regulation as good regulation which plays into the republican hand of saying democrats just want to stifle business. There is a lot of shitty regulation out there which means well, but doesn't actually provide any benefit to the American people.
First off, I think that's stupid. Biden was always one of the more conservative Democrats and he got behind Obama.
Secondly, WHO GIVES A FUCK IT'S THE VICE PRESIDENT
Yeah, basically. Most people don't have any clue about how the financial sector works, so anything around it just allows their "this concerns me!' siren to go off.
Most "Wall Street reform" or "tax on speculation" talk falls apart immediately when you get to specifics.
Well, that's the problem when people drafting the legislation don't know what the hell they're talking about. That's one of the reasons why I feel the biggest obstacle to progress in our country is the fact that politics has to be a career, and thus subject-matter experts are never likely to be in any decision-making positions. Hence, the necessity of lobbyists to inform, and the corresponding downsides of that information often being biased.
Seriously. Not worth a "bucket of warm piss," as John Nance Garner once supposedly quipped.
Did you even consider the optics of this post before submitting it?
VendettaRed07
Member
Biden got behind Obama because he was there. You will care about the VP if something happens to Hillary and he is the guy for an entire term or more.
Hillary's entire reason for picking him is that he can be a "day 1" president. So it isn't unfair to make an assumption or guess as to what it would be like or how he would handle domestic policy if he actually was.
This. So, so, so much this. Especially the bolded. VP is super boring.
I think saying "he can speak Spanish so he automatically excites Latinos" is a bit much but I don't think its wrong to say that his ability to speak Spanish + his record on immigration issues and the outreach he has done in the past (to my knowledge at least) makes him the best person to appeal to Latinos that isn't Perez or Baccera.
Did we expect the same of Joe Biden back in 2008? Picking Biden didn't influence my opinion of Obama at all one way or the other nor can I say I particularly remember the Democratic platform from 8 years ago. This feels like a big nothing-burger.
Yeah I get that sense sometimes and its kind of depressing.
I suspect a lot of people have already forgotten about what kind of a Democrat Biden was presented as in 2008.
Also, because Clinton ran against the most liberal senator in the primaries, people see her as a conservative democrat, (Even though her track record provides evidence to the contrary that she is in fact quite liberal when held among her peers.) So now that Clinton is trying to pick a VP who would appeal to the more conservative democrats people see them both as a neocons, and instantly lash out whenever something doesn't meet their own standards of liberalism.
It's political purity tests at their finest imo.
VendettaRed07
Member
The climate was different 8 years ago. We were coming off of 8 years of a republican, not a democrat. So picking a centrist Dem like Biden was not as off-putting to much of the democratic base that it might possibly be today. A guy who ran as a socialist came in second this cycle, because people are desperate and want bigger change and feel the need that the government has to push through massive legislation. Bernie would have gotten less votes than Ron Paul if he ran 8 years ago.
Yes, hopefully this position isn't actually used and doesn't come into play but the choice here is assuming something does. There has unquestionably been energy on both sides to "break from the norm" or push farther, either right or left. I don't have faith that Kaine will be a guy anyone is happy with should he actually get the call and become President.
Aaron Strife
Banned
It's ironic because I feel there's a lot of pressure on Clinton to pick someone "historic," but it's like, she's the first female major party nominee. She's already broken a rather significant barrier, but she's been in politics for like a million years so hardly anyone thinks it's as big a deal.
That being said I hope she picks Warren or Booker just so I don't have to deal with millennials fucking whining to me about it for months.
PantherLotus
Professional Schmuck
(I think the Kaine / deregulation thing is a wink/nod to Wall-Street types worried about Clinton, showing that she'd consider him)
(but I also think she won't pick him)
(but I also think she won't pick him)
A+ post.
I was going to argue with this more but I need the energy today.
I understand where you're coming from with being doubtful about Kaine. I am not 100% happy with the pick either. But honestly the truth is I really don't know shit about Kaine or why Hillary wants to pick him.
Unlike Trump, Hillary's campaign is actually organized. My expectation is that they will make the case in the next week, if it's Kaine, to fully explain exactly why Kaine is the right pick -- including, I have no doubt, a very public backtracking on abortion rights.
I'm going to give Hillary the chance to convince me that this is the right decision. If she can't do it, that's on her.
nature boy
Member
With what's happening in Germany, don't expect a VP announcement today.
metalslimer
Member
I can't believe this. We were actually discussing whether Clinton would have delayed their announcement after Nice and now there is another event.
This bank & finance talk makes me remember a question I had earlier, what can realistically be done about the citizens united case after Hillary's in office? Is it just "appoint liberal justices and wait for a campaign finance case to be brought up so the supreme court can repeal it?"
RustyNails
Member
Avon Barksdale
Member
There's shootings every day in the U.S. You think one in Germany is going to stop an announcement?
That's a Trump move. Clinton is not going to delay for a foreign event.
cartoon_soldier
Member
All these shootings help Trump, he is telling people to be scared and this shit will scare them.
NYCmetsfan
Banned
It also seems that this kind of attack is much worse in Europe. though it does happen in the US.
VendettaRed07
Member
Despite the fact that crime is going down, in the US and even Europe, the media's reporting of crime has absolutely changed and definitely is influencing the way people are viewing the world.
Random shootings, or stories of a cop killing an unarmed black man, was not national news that the networks focused on or covered all day when it happened.
So I am not sure exactly how to handle this. But I don't know if Obama's telling everyone that murder and crime are at historic lows really will work with anyone because watching the news this year it legitimately looks like the world is falling apart.
Random shootings, or stories of a cop killing an unarmed black man, was not national news that the networks focused on or covered all day when it happened.
So I am not sure exactly how to handle this. But I don't know if Obama's telling everyone that murder and crime are at historic lows really will work with anyone because watching the news this year it legitimately looks like the world is falling apart.
metalslimer
Member
If this kind of thing continues unabated for the next few months, I will be very scared. It sucks but no one cares that people have been dying in Chicago for years when its black on black, but white people dying dominates the news cycle.
It's terrible that these shootings are happening more in Europe now, but I will say it is notable that the more serious gun control regimes have not apparently been sufficient to prevent them from happening.
The main thing that seems to have happened is that homogeneity has dropped in Europe recently, while it's been pretty low in America all along.
The main thing that seems to have happened is that homogeneity has dropped in Europe recently, while it's been pretty low in America all along.
nature boy
Member
She delayed her appearance with Biden because of Nice, so no.
She might go ahead and announce, but I wouldn't count on it.
Aaron Strife
Banned
Orlando was carried out by a Muslim individual pledging allegiance to ISIS, happened in our country and killed 50 people. Not to be so blunt but it was practically gift wrapped for any competent Republican candidate.
It didn't help him.
Give this a rest. Trump does not have the political acumen to capitalize on anything. The only thing that's helped him recently is Clinton's email snafu.
DataStream
Member
So did his AA numbers drop from 0% to -13%?
If he's the VP pick, he'll just get a private flight out tonight.
Aaron Strife
Banned
lol convention bounce
VendettaRed07
Member
I hope if he is the choice that Hillary does make a convincing argument; but last thing I'll say about this before it's officially announced. If this is a strategy of not making an unforced error, or playing it safe because the position doesn't really matter, wouldn't Vilsack be the better pick so we won't have to worry about the senate at all? Both the governor seat and senate seat will be up for election in 2017 in Virginia, and we could lose both.
Umm, no. Chris Christie is gonna make one last pitch at midnight hoping she changes her mind.
cartoon_soldier
Member
A shooting in a LGBT club vs. in a mall will affect the people he is targeting very differently.
Though I am hoping this is not ISIS
DataStream
Member
If it wasn't a gay nightclub I'd agree with you. But the fact is that anyone with half a brain knows that attack wasn't about expanding a caliphate or middle eastern foreign policy.
Spoiled Milk
Banned
EDIT: I take it back. I think the gun control didn't work in this scenario because this is an organized terrorism incident where guns have been smuggled in from Eastern Europe and the middle east. People who live in Germany probably have an extraordinarily hard time getting guns, themselves. Gun control works!
Aaron Strife
Banned
I think this matters significantly less than you think it does.
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