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PoliGAF 2016 |OT8| No, Donald. You don't.

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I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
Most countries with constitutions like America's eventually fall into chaos, but it's bizarre that it's happening when the most establishment politician in the world (Obama) is beloved and unemployment is at 5%.

It's also not good for it to be happening while America has enough nuclear weapons to end humanity and while climate change is at a critical point.

So yeah, I would like to avert the end of the world.
 
U

User 463088

Banned
Ziltoidia 9 said:
Someone that got 46% of the vote/delegates is more use than someone that can speak Spanish. Now, I'm sure Kaine has many much attributes, but the speaking spanish part is what I found funny.
Click to expand...

It's hard to get 46% fo the vote when you're not running!

Like, not being shady, but this is not how politics work.
 
H

Hopfrog

Member
You want your VP to be an ally, a surrogate, and a partner, not a competitor. Anyone thinking that Bernie supporters would be placated if she had named his as her running mate are mistaken, I believe - they would have only encouraged him to challenge her at every opportunity. A VP who thinks they should be the one running things is not what you want as a running mate, despite his obvious popularity.
 
C

Crocodile

Member
Ziltoidia 9 said:
Yes he did well with college age people, But if you take the stance that they didn't go out and vote, then how do you explain the amount of votes he got? Yes he didn't win, but he did get 12 million votes.3 Million behind, not enough to win, but that is more than just college kids. My main grievance is the level of smugness there is, even now.

Sanders is going to push for Clinton.
Click to expand...

I didn't say exclusively college aged voters (that would obviously be false) I said especially college aged voters. That's not an incorrect statement. It wasn't a blowout but the primary wasn't what I'd call close either - she pretty much "won" after March. There's no smugness there. I have no idea why you are reading that.

Fox318 said:
Then maybe Hillary should have just thrown the VP spot to him.

She took the advantage of a running mate who speaks Spanish and is from a swing state over somebody who clearly has a following.
Click to expand...

Ziltoidia 9 said:
Why would Hillary need to have someone who speaks Spanish when she is against DONALD TRUMP.
Click to expand...

These posts are silly. Kaine is 532345253x more qualified than Bernie at the VP position and having strong outreach to major voting blocks is always important. A strong working/cooperative relationship is also key which Clinton and Kaine seem to have - no way you'd get that with Clinton and Sanders.
 
D

Dierce

Member
Boke1879 said:
This man can't be President. His NATO comments, his softeness on Putin and his rhetoric he spouts is dangerous.
Click to expand...
Even taking all that away he is clearly an ignorant narcissist. He believes himself to be right about everything even when he lies. How could any rational human being look up to this garbage of a person and see a leader. He is a coward, a conman and a moron with absolutely no qualifications.
 
T

Tendo

Member
So much of these Bernie Bro's sound like babies first election cycle. Bernie fights hard, pushes the DNC platform to the left, but they'll vote 3rd party or Trump instead? Instead of taking some progress and continuing the push in the future they let Trump walk in and do the exact opposite. Infuriating.
 
B

Boke1879

Member
Dierce said:
Even taking all that away he is clearly an ignorant narcissist. He believes himself to be right about everything even when he lies. How could any rational human being look up to this garbage of a person and see a leader. He is a coward, a conman and a moron with absolutely no qualifications.
Click to expand...

I can understand the racists of our society voting for him, but I can't for the life of me figure out how anyone else can.
 
F

Fox318

Member
Hopfrog said:
You want your VP to be an ally, a surrogate, and a partner, not a competitor. Anyone thinking that Bernie supporters would be placated if she had named his as her running mate are mistaken, I believe - they would have only encouraged him to challenge her at every opportunity. A VP who thinks they should be the one running things is not what you want as a running mate, despite his obvious popularity.
Click to expand...

Ask JFK how much he and LBJ got along?

Or even Regan/Bush or Bush/Dan Quayle

VPs don't have to get along or do jack shit.

Biden and Obama's relationship is more rare when looking back.
 
I

Iolo

Member
Delegates booing Bernie clearly means Bernie needs to step down as head of his campaign. That should placate the most vocal supporters
 
C

cartoon_soldier

Member
pigeon said:
There's a reason Kev wanted to rename diablosing to cartoon_soldiering although personally I think they are different verbs.

Diablosing is when you display completely random anxiety about stuff that nobody is really thinking about (in fairness to Diablos himself he has cut way down on this).

Cartoon_soldiering is when you see a single tweet or comment and immediately extrapolate that out towards armageddon.
Click to expand...

jJJHukc.gif


I post one tweet, but there are 100s like them. 100s I say.
 
B

Black Mamba

Member
B-Dubs said:
Pretty much. He needed to start letting them down easy a lot sooner than he did.
Click to expand...

It's what I said months ago. Bernie's inability to explain the process to these folks and egg on their conspiracy bullshit means that Bernie can't control his monster.

It's just the left's tea party now. Only difference is our politicians, so far, are not bending to meet their desires in the same way the GOP did.


Regarding 538, I'm sorry but I think Nate's model is horseshit. The swings are way too wild to make any sense. Especially since there's been nothing on the state polling level to indicate the big reversal in the NOWCAST.

So I looked into it and he's unskewing polls!? I don't mean putting weights on pollsters but actually adjusting the numbers. I was confused how he has Donald up in Pa and I looked and despite nearly every poll showing Hillary up (9 out of 10 polls), he adjusted them to 6 showing Trump up. A Clinton +8 is now Clinton +3. Clinton + 4 (from PPP) is now Trump +1.

What the fuck is this horseshit modeling? How can 9 out of 10 polls show Clinton with a decent lead (the avg is like +5) be Trump +1? Something he calls "trendline" which I assume he just believes because the trend nationally or something is one way that it means the numbers in the state are wrong? Which would be a stupid way of doing it but i won't comment without knowing exactly wtf that means.

All I know is it makes no sense and would explain why 538 is so bullish on Trump right now and everyone else like Upshot and Sam Wang are not in their modelling.

Honestly, and I don't say this because I support the numbers that are better for Hillary, but I think 538 is trying to create a model so amazing that is sucks. Stay simpler, IMO. Their model isn't good right now, IMO. I would basically ignore it and look at Upshot.
 
K

Kusagari

Member
This is going to be a terrible news cycle.

Trump's going to flood the news cycle talking about how the Bernie supporters have realized Bernie abandoned them, by booing him, and are coming to him.
 
S

Spoiled Milk

Banned
Did they employ Reince Dingus right out of homeschool? Why does he talk like a fucking idiot sixteen year old? What the hell?
ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
Most countries with constitutions like America's eventually fall into chaos, but it's bizarre that it's happening when the most establishment politician in the world (Obama) is beloved and unemployment is at 5%.

It's also not good for it to be happening while America has enough nuclear weapons to end humanity and while climate change is at a critical point.

So yeah, I would like to avert the end of the world.
Click to expand...
I think climate change isn't talked about enough this election cycle. It's approximately apocalyptic.
 
B

Big Baybee

Member
Tendo said:
So much of these Bernie Bro's sound like babies first election cycle. Bernie fights hard, pushes the DNC platform to the left, but they'll vote 3rd party or Trump instead? Instead of taking some progress and continuing the push in the future they let Trump walk in and do the exact opposite. Infuriating.
Click to expand...
Privilege transcends politics
 
D

Dierce

Member
Crocodile said:
I didn't say exclusively college aged voters (that would obviously be false) I said especially college aged voters. That's not an incorrect statement. It wasn't a blowout but the primary wasn't what I'd call close either - she pretty much "won" after March. There's no smugness there. I have no idea why you are reading that.





These posts are dumb. Kaine is 532345253x more qualified than Bernie at the VP position and having strong outreach to major voting blocks is always important. A strong working/cooperative relationship is also key which Clinton and Kaine seem to have - no way you'd get that with Clinton and Sanders.
Click to expand...
And this is the problem with Sander's movement. It is not about getting qualified people elected who can turn things around. It is about letting idiots like Cornel West advice you or denying a qualified individual a role just because at some point in their career they worked at Wall Street:
 
C

Crocodile

Member
Fox318 said:
Ask JFK how much he and LBJ got along?

Or even Regan/Bush or Bush/Dan Quayle

VPs don't have to get along or do jack shit.

Biden and Obama's relationship is more rare when looking back.
Click to expand...

The role of the VP has changed over the years. Clearly Clinton wants something akin to Obama & Biden. I think that's obviously a good thing to aim for. I can't figure out why you don't think the same.
 
G

gutter_trash

Banned
Fox318 said:
Ask JFK how much he and LBJ got along?

Or even Regan/Bush or Bush/Dan Quayle

VPs don't have to get along or do jack shit.

Biden and Obama's relationship is more rare when looking back.
Click to expand...

this debate is pointless becaue Hillary already made her choice,

she is picking a native Mid-Westerner from a swing State with crossover appeal among working class whites, African-Americans, Catholics and Latinos

I'm convinced that Kaine puts North Carolina in play
 
T

thestopsign

Member
Black Mamba said:
It's what I said months ago. Bernie's inability to explain the process to these folks and egg on their conspiracy bullshit means that Bernie can't control his monster.

It's just the left's tea party now. Only difference is our politicians, so far, are not bending to meet their desires in the same way the GOP did.


Regarding 538, I'm sorry but I think Nate's model is horseshit. The swings are way too wild to make any sense. Especially since there's been nothing on the state polling level to indicate the big reversal in the NOWCAST.

So I looked into it and he's unskewing polls!? I don't mean putting weights on pollsters but actually adjusting the numbers. I was confused how he has Donald up in Pa and I looked and despite nearly every poll showing Hillary up (9 out of 10 polls), he adjusted them to 6 showing Trump up. A Clinton +8 is now Clinton +3. Clinton + 4 (from PPP) is now Trump +1.

What the fuck is this horseshit modeling? How can 9 out of 10 polls show Clinton with a decent lead (the avg is like +5) be Trump +1? Something he calls "trendline" which I assume he just believes because the trend nationally or something is one way that it means the numbers in the state are wrong? Which would be a stupid way of doing it but i won't comment without knowing exactly wtf that means.

All I know is it makes no sense and would explain why 538 is so bullish on Trump right now and everyone else like Upshot and Sam Wang are not in their modelling.

Honestly, and I don't say this because I support the numbers that are better for Hillary, but I think 538 is trying to create a model so amazing that is sucks. Stay simpler, IMO. Their model isn't good right now, IMO. I would basically ignore it and look at Upshot.
Click to expand...

It's the same in Florida. It is fucking stupid.
 
R

Roland_Gunner

Member
Ziltoidia 9 said:
This is the DNC's fault. Blame them. Add in that DWS resigned so fast, it gives them even more reason to believe it was completely rigged.

Consider peoples grievances. They are still on your side with a majority of the policy, but you have to also take care of the people that are on your side.
Click to expand...

This is absolutely Sanders fault. He spent months stoking paranoia about the Democratic party and now can't walk it back. These people don't care about electing Democrats they just want to tear the system down.
 
F

Fox318

Member
Crocodile said:
These posts are silly. Kaine is 532345253x more qualified than Bernie at the VP position and having strong outreach to major voting blocks is always important. A strong working/cooperative relationship is also key which Clinton and Kaine seem to have - no way you'd get that with Clinton and Sanders.
Click to expand...

Dan Quayle became VP.

Only thing you need to be qualified for the VP spot is:

  • Have a pulse(not enforced when Quayle and Mondale were VPs)
  • Born in America
  • At least 35
  • Soul is optional (See Dick Cheney)
Crocodile said:
The role of the VP has changed over the years. Clearly Clinton wants something akin to Obama & Biden. I think that's obviously a good thing to aim for. I can't figure out why you don't think the same.
Click to expand...

I think its great to aim for but she is going to have issues with members of her own party. Its a problem that didn't need to really happen.

Plus I don't see (nor want) bernie getting a cabinet job.
 
B

B-Dubs

No Scrubs
Fox318 said:
Dan Quayle became VP.

Only thing you need to be qualified for the VP spot is:

  • Have a pulse(not enforced when Quayle and Mondale were VPs)
  • Born in America
  • At least 35
  • Soul is optional (See Dick Cheney)
Click to expand...

Because following that formula went so well for McCain.
 
B

Black Mamba

Member
I also want to remind people worried about the Trump convention bounce.


Convention bounces are not about more people choosing the person, it's about response rates. After the RNC, more GOP leaners answer polling and visa-versa for the DNC.

Polling now does not matter.
 
J

jmood88

Member
If Bernie fans are still confused about why they lost, the fact that the delegates Bernie spoke to was all white and the protest, in Philadelphia of all places, had nothing but white people should make the actual reason clear.
 
P

pigeon

Banned
gutter_trash said:
this debate is pointless becaue Hillary already made her choice,

she is picking a native Mid-Westerner from a swing State with crossover appeal among working class whites, African-Americans, Catholics and Latinos

I'm convinced that Kaine puts North Carolina in play
Click to expand...

I think he puts North Carolina OUT of play, actually. I'm expecting NC to be solid blue by November.
 
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