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PoliGAF 2017 |OT2| Well, maybe McMaster isn't a traitor.

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G

geomon

Member
https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/841391200322105344

C6041R2U8AALtUL.jpg
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Jesus...
 
S

sc0la

Unconfirmed Member
Does the CBO score do anything wrt premiums? Thought it was strictly federal deficit effect. Where is Ryan pulling that out of his ass that it would lower them?

Or just for rich dudes? lol
 
T

teiresias

Member
Pandora012 said:
Now the health secretary says that we will go back to pre-Obama era. Like that is a good thing....
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Oh yeah, because that really addresses the Senate moderates' concerns about dropping those in their states that gained coverage under expanded Medicaid. These people are morons.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
The CBO is just going to keep scoring them lower and lower each time because their plans do not work. They either need to figure out how to actually insure more people or keep eating these terrible headlines
 
I

ItWasMeantToBe19

Banned
sc0la said:
Does the CBO score do anything wrt premiums? Thought it was strictly federal deficit effect. Where is Ryan pulling that out of his ass that it would lower them?

Or just for rich dudes? lol
Click to expand...

The CBO estimates that premiums will go up hugely in the short term, then all old people will stop getting insurance. Old people not getting insurance will cause premiums to then decrease.
 
B

balladofwindfishes

Member
I don't think I've ever seen a political party trying to own such a terrible news cycle so much.

They want to make it absolutely positively sure that everyone knows they are 100% behind this and fully support it, and it's absolute madness to watch unfold.

This bill is toxic. It's going to fail. Just proposing it and taking it this far they've probably done irrecoverable damage to themselves for 2018.
 
J

JP_

Banned
Starting in 2020, the increase in average premiums from repealing the individual mandate
penalties would be more than offset by the combination of several factors that would
decrease those premiums: grants to states from the Patient and State Stability Fund (which
CBO and JCT expect to largely be used by states to limit the costs to insurers of enrollees
with very high claims); the elimination of the requirement for insurers to offer plans
covering certain percentages of the cost of covered benefits; and a younger mix of
enrollees. By 2026, average premiums for single policyholders in the nongroup market
under the legislation would be roughly 10 percent lower than under current law, CBO and
JCT estimate.
Click to expand...

They predict premiums will eventually go down, but unless there's a more detailed report somewhere else, it doesn't seem like they've tried to give detailed estimates for effects on copays, deductibles, etc.

Because of plans' lower average actuarial values, CBO and JCT expect that individuals'
cost-sharing payments, including deductibles, in the nongroup market would tend to be
higher than those anticipated under current law. In addition, cost-sharing subsidies would
be repealed in 2020, significantly increasing out-of-pocket costs for nongroup insurance
for many lower-income enrollees
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So GOP will probably try to sell the 10% savings on premiums, but dems need to somehow argue the point that total costs could very well go up, wiping out any savings on premiums. Might be ok for healthy people (which would have more incentive to go without insurance under new plan), but it's almost certainly another burden for people that actually need their healthcare.

For those unaware, ACA mandated that all plans (to qualify as health insurance) need to have an actuarial value of something like 60% or more -- meaning they'd pay for roughly 60% of the medical costs for that individual on average. GOP bill basically gets rid of this requirement, so while plans still have to cover things like mental health services, it basically opens up a loophole where they can technically still cover it but really only pay for a tiny percentage of those costs.
 
M

metalslimer

Member
balladofwindfishes said:
I don't think I've ever seen a political party trying to own such a terrible news cycle so much.

They want to make it absolutely positively sure that everyone knows they are 100% behind this and fully support it, and it's absolute madness to watch unfold.

This bill is toxic. It's going to fail. Just proposing it and taking it this far they've probably done irrecoverable damage to themselves for 2018.
Click to expand...

Best case scenario is it passing the house and failing in the senate to tie all the people in the house to it.
 
J

JP_

Banned
Even before this CBO report, there were people suggesting this bill was meant to fail and to fail quickly so they could move on to tax reform.
 
S

sangreal

Member
I still give it 50/50 at worst odds of passing. Unlike the House, the majority leader still has leverage to keep senators in line and McConnell hasn't come out against the bill to my knowledge. He needs to throw a bone to what, 4 or 5 senators who have wavered?
 
A

Abinash117

Member
JP_ said:
Even before this CBO report, there were people suggesting this bill was meant to fail and to fail quickly so they could move on to tax reform.
Click to expand...

I have heard that the GOP needs to do healthcare reform before moving on to tax reform. Don't know why though. Probably something to do with the taxes in ACA and medicaid.
 
S

sangreal

Member
Abinash117 said:
I have heard that the GOP needs to do healthcare reform before moving on to tax reform. Don't know why though. Probably something to do with the taxes in ACA and medicaid.
Click to expand...

I think it's just because of the timeline thanks to the stupid bill they passed right after the inauguration (to get it into the budget reconciliation process)
 
S

sangreal

Member
whyamihere said:
Can someone explain to be the left seeming revulsion to calling the AHCA "Trumpcare"? Besides the fact that Democrats are doing it?
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People on the (far) left don't understand politics and think Democrats should always take the higher ground because it's the right thing to do. Also, they love to beat up on Democrats instead of the right because Democrats are easy targets (because they always take the higher ground...)
 
P

Plinko

Wildcard berths that can't beat teams without a winning record should have homefield advantage
Has anybody ever heard/seen Bernie Sanders refer to the bill as "Trumpcare?" I've seen every other democrat do it (thankfully), but not Bernie.
 
P

Piecake

Member
The CBO offers an example of a single individual with an annual income of $26,500.

If that person is 21 years old, he’ll largely benefit from the Republican health care bill. Under the Affordable Care Act (also known as Obamacare), he would on average pay $1,700 in premiums for insurance. Under the Republican plan, he would pay $1,450.

But if that person is 64 years old, he would be hurt by the Republican bill. Under Obamacare, he would also pay $1,700 in premiums for insurance. But under the Republican bill, he would pay $14,600 — more than half his annual income. That amounts to more than a 750 percent increase in premiums from Obamacare to the Republican bill.
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http://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/3/13/14914596/ahca-cbo-premiums-age

yikes
 
H

Hooligan69

Member
UltimaPooh said:
I'm calling it. It's gonna pass and it's going to ink by.
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This. Too many here dismiss the bizarro reality we're now in and the fact, the utter fact that nobody falls in line like Republicans do, no matter how much they say otherwise.

I don't even think we have a chance in 2018. Too much gerrymandering. Too much idiocy. Too many "my vote doesn't count" snowflakes.

Sad but true. Don't get your hopes up for 2018 or you're gonna have a bad time.
 
U

UltimaPooh

Member
Hooligan69 said:
This. Too many here dismiss the bizarro reality we're now in and the fact, the utter fact that nobody falls in line like Republicans do, no matter how much they say otherwise.

I don't even think we have a chance in 2018. Too much gerrymandering. Too much idiocy. Too many "my vote doesn't count" snowflakes.

Sad but true. Don't get your hopes up for 2018 or you're gonna have a bad time.
Click to expand...

I don't think 2018 is lost... But I do think things are fucked in the short term.
 
R

royalan

Member
Paul Ryan has pushed this bill so hard that it'll be tied to him no matter what it's called.

It needs to be called Trumpcare because Trump is actually trying to distance himself from this bill. Don't let him.
 
T

Third Strike

Member
Hooligan69 said:
This. Too many here dismiss the bizarro reality we're now in and the fact, the utter fact that nobody falls in line like Republicans do, no matter how much they say otherwise.

I don't even think we have a chance in 2018. Too much gerrymandering. Too much idiocy. Too many "my vote doesn't count" snowflakes.

Sad but true. Don't get your hopes up for 2018 or you're gonna have a bad time.
Click to expand...

If we can do it in 2006, we can do it in 2018. We need to remain active and engaged.
 
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