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PoliGAF Interim Thread of cunning stunts and desperate punts

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Pakkidis

Member
Slurpy said:
Canada should acts as sort of a barometer. Culturally, the 2 countries are almost identical, so its always interesting the see the large gap in opinion between the 2 countries. Id say Canada is a 'saner' version of the US, devoid of Fox News. All polls Ive seen from Canada on which candidate Canadians would support range anywhere between 75%-88% for Obama. Also, I think its safe to say every other country on Earth would also overwhelmingly support Obama, save possibly for Israel.

We are more liberal than America by far. Even are conservative party is more liberal than the Republican party. Don't get me wrong, Canada has its far share of political bullshit but its a lot more tame, plus politicians here could not get away with the amount of lies like the republican party. We *try* to make the politicians accountable as possible.
 

qwertybob

Member
Hellsing321 said:
I have to find sources for a term paper in my PoliSci class about the 08 election, and I figured what better place to find sources than PoliGaf. Does anyone have any articles that talk about Obama's and McCain's policies on health care, the economy, Iraq War, ect. I'd prefer if they came from newspapers or magazines like NYtimes, or Time. Op/Ed pieces are good too especially some of the ones recently I've seen that have been blasting the McCain campaign for running a dishonest campaign. I'd be really grateful to any help you guys can give.


If you came in here and said,

Im a Republican but still undecided who to vote for, I am leaning towards McCain but figured i would do some research first. Can anyone point me in the direction of some information about Obama's and McCain's policies on health care, the economy, Iraq War, ect. I'd prefer if they came from newspapers or magazines like NYtimes, or Time

you would have had your research done for you in 5 minutes :p
 

avatar299

Banned
Matt Welch, a fairly popular independent writer with some libertarian views is writing 2 interesting articles. A few good things for each candidate. First is McCain.

if it isn't obvious, he isn't voting McCain.

Lord knows, there is a libertarian case to be made against John McCain. Whether it's his hyper-interventionist foreign policy, disregard for constitutional liberties and individualism, or his up-front opposition to "the 'leave us alone' libertarian philosophy that dominated Republican debates in the 1990s," the 2008 Republican nominee has drawn fire from many free-marketeers through (as the Club for Growth has put it), his "philosophical ambivalence, if not hostility, about limited government and personal freedom."


But it would be inaccurate at best to claim that a McCain presidency offers zero potential upside for libertarians. After two years of studying the Arizona senator's habits (and coming to mostly critical conclusions)(he also wrote one of the best McCain books out there McCain: myth of a Maverick. Give it a read),
I can identify seven plausible reasons why a limited-government type might consider voting for the guy, even if I for one won't. Each reason, as you'll see, has as least one serious caveat.
The list:

1) He's a principled free trader, in a year that Democrats and Barack Obama are principled "fair" traders.

If you pore over John McCain's five books (each co-written by longtime aide and alter ego Mark Salter) you will see very little in the way of political philosophy and even less having to do with economic ideas. A notable and timely exception to that is free trade, where McCain for decades has been anti-protectionist and pro just about every trade agreement imaginable. Considering that Democrats have all but killed off their 1990s support for trade agreements, and are being rewarded by increased majorities in Congress, having a principled free-trader in the White House is one of the last best hopes that the single easiest anti-poverty program ever invented can continue and expand.

Caveat: He's also one of the biggest Washington enthusiasts for economic sanctions, which is the opposite of "free trade."

2) Divided government!


As George Will put it in his Washington Post column today, "Divided government compels compromises that curb each party's excesses, especially both parties' proclivities for excessive spending when unconstrained by an institution controlled by the other party. William Niskanen, chairman of the libertarian Cato Institute, notes that in the past 50 years, 'government spending has increased an average of only 1.73 percent annually during periods of divided government. This number more than triples, to 5.26 percent, for periods of unified government.'"

Caveat: McCain, who has a long history of cross-party dealmaking, would surely cooperate with the Democratic majority on any number of potentially questionable measures. Including but not remotely limited to overreactive Wall Street regulation, expensive and ineffective climate change schema, and overly bureaucratic immigration reform.

3) He would veto the crap out of spending bills, particularly those laden with pork.

From a purely theatrical point of view, the specter of McCain using the bully pulpit to shame porkariffic legislators ranks as one of the single greatest prospects of a GOP victory. He has a long and honorable record of at least rhetorically going after unnecessary earmarks, avoiding them in Arizona, and rooting out contractor abuse in defense spending. And he's arguably the Senate's biggest booster of a line item veto, which if nothing else indicates a willingness to use a pen that George W. Bush let gather cobwebs.

Caveat: Pork only amounts to so much of the federal budget. If McCain is successful in increasing U.S. troop levels by 150,000, and boosting defense spending to 4 percent of GDP, he could remove every last slice of pork in the federal budget and still come out deep in the red. And given the way that McCain is now demagoguing any vote against "emergency" supplemental war spending as a Vote Against Our Troops, you can bet that the ahistorical and wildly irresponsible funding of our trillion-dollar wars will continue unabated.( There goes Pork)

4) He's against torture, and wants to close down Guantanamo Bay.

McCain rightly believes that having Washington condone torture reduces America's moral high ground, puts U.S. troops at risk, and produces reams of useless and inaccurate information. He understands that such a policy greatly reduces the country's already-diminishing stock of "soft power," for no appreciable benefit.

Caveat: As a legislator, most of McCain's handful of "reforms" that became law ended up enabling as much as reforming the stated practice. So it was with torture, where McCain's reform legislation ended up jeopardizing habeas corpus, an eight-century-old legal concept he's gone on to officially condemn.


5) He believes in the urgency of reforming, not adding, entitlements.

Another of the few consistent economic principles John McCain has shown is the belief that Washington needs to reform its massive entitlement programs today, instead of leaving a demographic mess to future generations.

Caveat: George W. Bush believed the same thing, had a Republican Congress for more than half his presidency, and couldn't do squat about it.:lol

6) Would conceivably push for a more humane and open immigration system.

One of the more attractive aspects to McCain as a human is his transparent allergy to racism and xenophobia, particularly when directed at Latinos.

Caveat: As mentioned, McCain's previous efforts on this front ended up producing pretty gruesome legislation. After almost losing the Republican primaries over the issue, it's doubtful that a McCain immigration package would improve in 2009.:lol

7) Would, along with Sarah Palin, bring sexual tension back to the White House.

Awkward hugs, an aging flyboy, a jealous wife...bring the popcorn!

Caveat: If you appreciate politics solely as entertainment, there's no caveat at all.


:lol :lol
But if you worry about the accumulation of power in Washington, D.C., you should probably think twice before assuming that John McCain would amass less of the stuff than his opponents. Even if there are silver linings in his presidential clouds.

http://reason.com/news/show/128882.html
 
First dude refuses to testify. Why do Republicans hate America and law & order? Wait . . . I know why he hates America.

Palin's husband refuses to testify in probe
By MATT VOLZ, Associated Press Writer 42 minutes ago

ANCHORAGE, Alaska - Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin's husband has refused to testify in the investigation of his wife's alleged abuse of power, and a key lawmaker said Thursday that uncooperative witnesses are effectively sidetracking the probe until after Election Day.

Todd Palin, who participates in state business in person or by e-mail, was among 13 people subpoenaed by the Alaska Legislature. McCain-Palin presidential campaign spokesman Ed O'Callaghan announced Thursday that Todd Palin would not appear, because he no longer believes the Legislature's investigation is legitimate.

Sarah Palin initially welcomed the investigation of accusations that she dismissed the state's public safety commissioner because he refused to fire her ex-brother-in-law, a state trooper. "Hold me accountable," she said.

But she has increasingly opposed it since Republican presidential candidate John McCain tapped her as his running mate. The McCain campaign dispatched a legal team to Alaska including O'Callaghan, a former top U.S. terrorism prosecutor from New York to bolster Palin's local lawyer.

Earlier this week, Alaska Attorney General Talis Colberg said the governor, who was not subpoenaed, declined to participate in the investigation and said Palin administration employees who have been subpoenaed would not appear.

State Sen. Bill Wielechowski, a Democrat, said the McCain campaign is doing all it can to prevent the Legislature from completing a report on whether the GOP's vice presidential nominee abused her power as governor.

Wielechowski, a member of the panel that summoned the witnesses, told The Associated Press that the witnesses can avoid testifying for months without penalty and that court action to force them to appear sooner is unlikely.

Palin fired Walt Monegan in July. It later emerged that Palin, her husband, Todd, and several high-level staffers had contacted Monegan about state trooper Mike Wooten. Palin maintains she fired Monegan over budget disagreements, not because he wouldn't dismiss her former brother-in-law.

Wooten had gone through a nasty divorce from Palin's sister before Palin became governor. While Monegan says no one from the administration ever told him directly to fire Wooten, he says their repeated contacts made it clear they wanted Wooten gone.

Alaska Senate President Lyda Green, a Republican foe of Palin, said Wednesday that the investigation is still on track.

"The original purpose of the investigation was to bring out the truth. Nothing has changed," she said.

Without the testimony, the retired prosecutor hired to head the investigation could still release a report in October as scheduled, based on the evidence he's already gathered. As of Thursday, Steven Branchflower had interviewed or deposed 17 of the 33 people he had identified as potential witnesses in the probe.

The Legislature does not have the leverage to compel any witness to testify before Nov. 4, said Wielechowski, a member of the Senate Judiciary Committee.

Wielechowski said he did not know whether Branchflower has enough material for a complete and fair report with so few witnesses. But he said delaying the probe, which began as a bipartisan effort, would only politicize the matter more.

"It would be to appease the McCain camp," Wielechowski said. "They're doing everything they can to delay."

Ignoring a legislative subpoena is punishable by a fine up to $500 and up to six months in jail under Alaska law. But courts are reluctant to intervene in legislative matters and the full Legislature must be in session to bring contempt charges, Wielechowski said. The Legislature is not scheduled to convene until January.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/palin_troopergate
 

SRG01

Member
speculawyer said:
Yep, the conservative party in Canada is pro-choice.

I may be mistaken, but the old Reform party (which is like 90% of the current CPC party) may have wanted to put restrictions on abortions. It may or may not matter, as Stephen Harper acknowledges that the CPC must move towards the center in order to win a majority.

LuCkymoON said:
Does the Canadian Conservative party inject tons of religious hyperbole like the GOP does?

Not really. Canada is about as secular as most European countries. On the other hand, the evangelical movement is quite strong in some parts of the country, especially within western canada. Even then, a large portion of religious groups are still very liberal. The Anglican church wanted to permit gay pastors and, despite the vote not succeeding, the very discussion of such a thing makes them far more left than the US.
 

AniHawk

Member
Xisiqomelir said:
0918_mainchart.png

*masturbates furiously*

Also, CO is a nice shade of blue now. NM is a lost cause (for the GOP). OH and VA are about to go. So awesome.
 
Frank the Great said:
But we need to give rich people more money. Get your priorities straight.


Shhh. Don't encourage the rich. They will invest their money into stocks and bonds. They will consume more goods. It's all part of the plan.........
 
speculawyer said:
:lol on thread title change.

Look I really don't want to be lectured about the 'space-time continuum' from a party running a candidate that thinks man walked with dinosaurs around 6000 years ago.

That bit can't be quoted enough - I'm still trying to process it myself. And for a so called expert on fossil fuels, heh.

No dice on her not knowing about the space-time continuum though as her father is a science teacher. But whether she believes in it or not is a different matter.
 

Darth Sonik

we need more FPS games
Jason's Ultimatum said:
A larger tax cut for the middle class will create more consumption, thus economic growth. :)

Think of the Yacht Builders.

Please.

Why would the middle class, having millions to spend, support more people/jobs than the wealthy with the same amount? Madness. ;P
 

VanMardigan

has calmed down a bit.
AniHawk said:
*masturbates furiously*

Also, CO is a nice shade of blue now. NM is a lost cause (for the GOP). OH and VA are about to go. So awesome.

This is all happening so quickly. The McCain campaign seems to be disintegrating before our eyes. I'm not even sure he's got any more big cards to play. Palin was his Ace in the Hole, apparently. Maybe he should've waited until late October to nominate Palin?
 

Amir0x

Banned
The debates are going to solidify this thing.

If Obama can firmly be seen as putting this away to most media outlets, I think then PoliGAF can really begin to get excited.
 
SnakeswithLasers said:
Apparently John McCain owns a Delorean, which is why he is so old. Time travel is a bitch.
OMG McCain must be Biff and Obama's McFly so Biff has fucked up this alternative universe and McFly has to take back the show!
 

tanod

when is my burrito
I really don't think Indiana is gonna tip blue. 100,000 newly registered voters and a solid Red history isn't feasible.

I also think Florida is more likely than Virginia.
 
VanMardigan said:
This is all happening so quickly. The McCain campaign seems to be disintegrating before our eyes. I'm not even sure he's got any more big cards to play. Palin was his Ace in the Hole, apparently. Maybe he should've waited until late October to nominate Palin?

Are you dense? McCain has so many more options left.

For one, he could always kick Palin off the ticket. It would at first be seen as a horrible move, but he could then put her back on the ticket. This would get Palin's name back in the spotlight for a few days, and restore some of the newness of her by making her a sympathetic figure. It would also make women voters like her even more, because she could show that she is used and abused by men just like they are.

Another thing the McCain campaign can do is announce another Vice President. Someone like Mittens would breathe incredible life into the ticket. The campaign can play off some social group dynamics of the threesome; McCain, the old grumpy fathering figure, with Palin and Mittens as his flashy and personable younger counterparts. They would all campaign together, and the dynamic duo would stand formerly and politely while Father McCain is speaking, but make funny faces towards each other and the audience while he's not looking. The audience will start laughing, causing McCain to get confused and grumpy, while Mittens and Palin do innocent gestures as if they didn't upset the grumpy old fart.

A final, obvious thing is to plaster Palin's face with massage oil, and shave her head and put oil on it. This will attract a lot of attention and would restore what some pundits have referred to as "shiny object" syndrome. The nation would be captivated by Palin once again, and McCain's numbers would rise.

So clearly, there are many things McCain can do. You're just not seeing them.

It's amazing the amount of garbage I post when I have a paper to write :-/
 

tanod

when is my burrito
MightyHedgehog said:
AFAIK, Indiana has 500,000 new registered voters...HALF A MILLION new voters THIS YEAR.

The 500,000 included updated registrations. There were only 100,000 new registrations.
 
tanod said:
The 500,000 included updated registrations. There were only 100,000 new registrations.
Ah, so you're right. My mistake. I just scanned this page. That's what I get for jumping the gun and just reading the headline without digesting what it actually says. :sadface
 
Steve Youngblood said:
I bet that guy is a paid staffer. What kind of sleazy campaign is Obama running? First, he won't do the town hall meetings, and now he sends in his goons so that McCain can't even speak at his own events? Shameful.
TheGrayGhost said:
Are you being sarcastic?
Either Steve or Gaborn needs to get an avatar. They make similar posts, and it's only when I see Steve's name that I calm down and realize he's just being sarcastic.
 

BobLoblaw

Banned
Amir0x said:
The debates are going to solidify this thing.

If Obama can firmly be seen as putting this away to most media outlets, I think then PoliGAF can really begin to get excited.
Yup. One thing that he's gonna have to repeat several times in EACH debate is how many people are gonna get a tax cut. That's the most important thing that he needs to get out there because the Repubs are still trying to make it sound like everyone's taxes are going up (they even released a new ad today to continue the tax misinformation campaign).
 

KTallguy

Banned
Amir0x said:
The debates are going to solidify this thing.

If Obama can firmly be seen as putting this away to most media outlets, I think then PoliGAF can really begin to get excited.

He just can't appear too snobbish in the debates.
That killed Al Gore.
 
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