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[bishoptl]

Could McCain have found a more redneck vag?

Not cool, btw.

 

[lil smoke]

and, conversely Democrats would be defending her.

exactly. I really respect folks who lean towards a side, and still be open minded and rational. You know, not have their heads up their ass. But I find that those people are the ones who don't follow politics as heavily. They look at the facts and make a personal judgement. Not simply agree with what everyone else on the team says.

 

[Ihateyouchris]

http://www.icecreamusa.com/products/product.cfm?u=75856-02410&b=3
The folks at Klondike must be happy with McCain's pick. So delicious

 

[BotoxAgent]

all facts aside, McCain just appears to be a creepy old man picking someone like her

 

[pxleyes]

Biden is certainly very qualified to be the VP. Of course, he's had 36 years in washington to prepare to change it!

He works in Washington, yes, but he doesn't even live there. It is a job to him, not a lifestyle *coughMcCaincough*

 

[Hitokage]

Biden is certainly very qualified to be the VP. Of course, he's had 36 years in washington to prepare to change it!

Biden isn't the one who will be pushing for change, he'll be the one to help implement it.

 

[Gaborn]

exactly. I really respect folks who lean towards a side, and still be open minded and rational. You know, not have their heads up their ass. But I find that those people are the ones who don't follow politics as heavily. They look at the facts and make a personal judgement. Not simply agree with what everyone else on the team says.

Yep, partisanship is a major problem for just about anyone who follows politics closely.

 

[lexdysia]

Cue 140.85 defending this piece of news in 3...2....1....


Thankfully Obama displayed better judgment in his VP pick.

Roy Campbell?

The Colonel reveals the reality of the Patriots and the S3 Plan to control human will and consciousness, to save the human race from itself, to stop it drowning in the junk data now available to the individual due to technological advances in communication and information availability. "Unnecessary information and memory must be filtered out to stimulate the evolution of the species."

 

[Gaborn]

Biden isn't the one who will be pushing for change, he'll be the one to help implement it.

Perhaps, but why should we believe he'll do it now? He's had 36 years to work for it and he hasn't yet, so now he's suddenly for changing things and it's more than just a buzzword? Please.

 

[Kildace]

all facts aside, McCain just appears to be a creepy old man picking someone like her

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1RN5xbWtNSU

 

[bishoptl]

"Unnecessary information and memory must be filtered out to stimulate the evolution of the species."

 

[Hitokage]

Perhaps, but why should we believe he'll do it now? He's had 36 years to work for it and he hasn't yet, so now he's suddenly for changing things and it's more than just a buzzword? Please.

Biden isn't the boss. Obama is.

Would I fully support a ticket with Biden at the top? Not really. Would he be better than various alternatives? Probably.

 

[ViperVisor]

To defend Palin this is the kind of nonsense you do when you are a motivated right-wing goofball in Alaska. When it's not wabbit or duck season you gotta fill the time with something. Like Rev. Wright, he is a inspired guy who said some goofy things. Don't like it but I don't like religion so it didn't surprise me that a guy really into it was a bit off.

 

[worldrunover]

Also true, libraries should be funded by private groups and charities

How could that possibly lead to less book bannings?

 

[Fragamemnon]

You know, I hate to say it as a 100% hater but Metal Gear Solid foolery makes more sense than anything out of Sarah Palin's mouth.

 

[Stoney Mason]

How could that possibly lead to less book bannings?

When it's private your allowed to ban books!

 

[Kildace]

How could that possibly lead to less book bannings?

If enough people wanted to find a certain book, the free market would provide it!

 

[scorcho]

Cue 140.85 defending this piece of news in 3...2....1....


Thankfully Obama displayed better judgment in his VP pick.

King_Slender: but why has no one made an issue out of Biden being a heartbeat away from the presidency?

while i hate Richard Cohen with a burning passion, i like the point of his editorial in today's WaPo - McCain's pick was done to make Republicans the entire country over look stupid in defense in the pick.

 

[Tamanon]

How could that possibly lead to less book bannings?

He doesn't care about book bannings. If they wanted to read that book, they'd buy it themselves or go to another library!

 

[Particle Physicist]

Funny thing is, Obama-Hillary was an UNBEATABLE ticket, and they let Obama's wife get in the way - no way she wants to play #2 female in Washington, hence the Biden pick.

Or Obama spoke at the Yearly Kos, oh wait:

http://my.barackobama.com/page/community/post/benvos/CBxr

To be honest, Obama IS going to lose because of racism. I live in a HEAVY union area, and despite the fact that most of the large Unions (Teamsters, UAW) will publically endorse Obama from their leadership, they are mostly made up of lower educated white guys who have racist tendencies.

Think of your average white truck driver or line worker - you think these guys are pulling the lever for Obama? :lol

It's sad, but true.

I know, it's tough to read posts that don't follow the Obama circle-jerk going on here.

No shit - all this is doing is making Palin appear more and more like your average American Mom, which is her appeal in the first place (ability to be the President, aside).

Can you imagine the furor is Fox News ran all day with "The rumors of Obama being a Muslim - is it something we should discuss or not."

holy shit. and i like how he tries to equate the muslim thing to the baby thing.. as if the muslim thing is actually true!

 

[SpeedingUptoStop]

If they catch her kid drinking while pregnant...



GAME OVER:lol

 

[Fragamemnon]

When it's private your allowed to ban books!

Or stuff your bookshelves with whatever crazy bullshit you want to believe. For example, you can have an entire life sciences section with nothing but young earth and climate change denial. BAD IDEA.

 

[Gaborn]

Biden isn't the boss. Obama is.

Would I fully support a ticket with Biden at the top? Not really.

Ok, that's very reasonable.

Worldrunover - it wouldn't, but then I really don't object to private individuals who burn their books on their own either, I certainly wouldn't ban book burnings if I was in charge, but I wouldn't support a publicly owned book from being burned (or, like the constitution has been the last 8 years, used as toilet paper)

 

[Hitokage]

If they catch her kid drinking while pregnant...



GAME OVER:lol

You know, I really don't want this election to be about her daughter boozing it up when there's vastly more pertinent issues to consider.

 

[reilo]

Perhaps, but why should we believe he'll do it now? He's had 36 years to work for it and he hasn't yet, so now he's suddenly for changing things and it's more than just a buzzword? Please.

Biden is only one man, as is Obama.

Neither of them would be on the brink of becoming the two most powerful men in Washington without the support of millions of citizens like us, and hundreds more of politicians that see that Washington does need change. As Obama has said: it starts with us, and we are demanding change. Biden is just listening to his constituency.

I would be a bit worried if one man like Biden was able to influence so much, as it would most likely mean he was a dictator of some kind.

 

[worldrunover]

Ok, that's very reasonable.

Worldrunover - it wouldn't, but then I really don't object to private individuals who burn their books on their own either, I certainly wouldn't ban book burnings if I was in charge, but I wouldn't support a publicly owned book from being burned (or, like the constitution has been the last 8 years, used as toilet paper)

So you would condone private entities banning/burning books? I can't begin to explain the first amendment rights you're crapping on, which I'm sure you're aware of.

 

[jorma]

I am thoroughly convinced that if McCain/Palin gets elected, this country will have turned into everything that 1984 and Fahrenheit 451 and Eisenhower warned us against.

Small addition.

 

[Tamanon]

So you would condone private entities banning/burning books? I can't begin to explain the first amendment rights you're crapping on, which I'm sure you're aware of.

Private entities are allowed to not carry books they don't want to.

 

[Barrett2]

You know, I really don't want this election to be about her daughter boozing it up when there's vastly more pertinent issues to consider.

I also didn't want 2004 to be about whether Kerry 'deserved' some of the medals he got while in 2004... yet that's where we were, and unbelievably, baby-booze-gate looks like where we are headed. Ah the majesty of American politics. :lol

 

[worldrunover]

Private entities are allowed to not carry books they don't want to.

Yes, but when you don't have libraries you're letting these entities control the freedom of press/speech through coporations that have specific interests.

 

[Gaborn]

So you would condone private entities banning/burning books? I can't begin to explain the first amendment rights you're crapping on, which I'm sure you're aware of.

If a private organization owned the books then restricting them from banning or burning them would be itself a violation of the first amendment.

 

[Barrett2]

Yes, but when you don't have libraries you're letting these entities control the freedom of press/speech through coporations that have specific interests.

But now you are arguing about fantasy-land. In the current world, though, private libraries can ban whatever they want.

 

[Hitokage]

I also didn't want 2004 to be about whether Kerry 'deserved' some of the medals he got while in 2004... yet that's where we were, and unbelievably, baby-booze-gate looks like where we are headed. Ah the majesty of American politics. :lol

Speaking of which, it's amazing how "flip-flopping" has suddenly become fashionable.

 

[The Blue Jihad]

There is no doubt that there is tons of moral hypocrisy on the part of the GOP on a regular basis. I just think fixating on a baby and a teen that drinks alcohol is to sort of fall into the same hypocrisy as the republicans do. I mean there is definitely a point to be made here but I think it has more to do with the fact that regular people have regular struggles and their morals and christians values (and patriotism) shouldn't be assaulted by Republicans or Democrats.

I'll get off my soapbox now.

Generally, I agree. Personal lives are more supermarket tabloid fodder rather than genuine and proper political discourse.

But what we have to keep in mind is that even though personal lives shouldn't be used like supermarket tabloids, they still hold extraordinary relevance, because no matter what anyone says, no matter what anyone does, no matter where they go...they're still regular people. With regular struggles.

This bit about Palin's daughter is a prime example of that. No matter how much Palin would posture about her views and political ideologies, she's still a regular person with a regular struggles, and thus her policies must take into account the regular person. But there's still an odd disconnect between what she says (her policies) and what is happening within her own family.

That disconnect illustrates how ineffective and out-of-touch the traditional Republican viewpoint is in society. Preaching abstinence-only very obviously did not prevent her daughter from becoming pregnant. The kids-only-with-marriage ideology means that the daughter is forced to marry the father of her baby; and she will be forced due to the national veep spotlight. And so on. Palin's Republican doctrine removes choice from her own family.

Is it pleasant to point this out about Palin? No, it's not pleasant. But it's certainly relevant, because her life experience is a direct contrast to her political ideology and very easily illustrates the trouble with preaching a restriction-based viewpoint with lofty moral requirements when your life itself is not immune to the struggles of regular people.

 

[Tamanon]

Speaking of which, it's amazing how flip-flopping has suddenly become fashionable.

I think it's just an extension of the "facts on the ground" philosophy.

 

[Hitokage]

I think it's just an extension of the "facts on the ground" philosophy.

I'm more inclined to agree that it's the ongoing narrative that Republicans are authentic but Democrats are not.

 

[ViperVisor]

Yes, but when you don't have libraries you're letting these entities control the freedom of press/speech through coporations that have specific interests.

But the soda pop shops in the south during the 60s should of been able to keep out black people if they wanted. And they would do the right thing eventually. Libertarian kooks had it right. Darn that Civil Rights Act.

 

[Smiles and Cries]

who speaks today at the RNC?

 

[Karma Kramer]

who speaks today at the RNC?

Bush, Thompson, Lieberman

 

[Stoney Mason]

Generally, I agree. Personal lives are more supermarket tabloid fodder rather than genuine and proper political discourse.

But what we have to keep in mind is that even though personal lives shouldn't be used like supermarket tabloids, they still hold extraordinary relevance, because no matter what anyone says, no matter what anyone does, no matter where they go...they're still regular people. With regular struggles.

This bit about Palin's daughter is a prime example of that. No matter how much Palin would posture about her views and political ideologies, she's still a regular person with a regular struggles, and thus her policies must take into account the regular person. But there's still an odd disconnect between what she says (her policies) and what is happening within her own family.

That disconnect illustrates how ineffective and out-of-touch the traditional Republican viewpoint is in society. Preaching abstinence-only very obviously did not prevent her daughter from becoming pregnant. The kids-only-with-marriage ideology means that the daughter is forced to marry the father of her baby; and she will be forced due to the national veep spotlight. And so on. Palin's Republican doctrine removes choice from her own family.

Is it pleasant to point this out about Palin? No, it's not pleasant. But it's certainly relevant, because her life experience is a direct contrast to her political ideology and very easily illustrates the trouble with preaching a restriction-based viewpoint with lofty moral requirements when your life itself is not immune to the struggles of regular people.

I agree with all of that. I think it's more effective at least in this country for regular people and social commentators to say though rather than politicians. I wish it wasn't but it is. Also people have a bad habit of not knowing where the line is when making that point sadly which you eloquently did.

 

[Gaborn]

Speaking of which, it's amazing how "flip-flopping" has suddenly become fashionable.

A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines. With consistency a great soul has simply nothing to do. He may as well concern himself with his shadow on the wall. Out upon your guarded lips! Sew them up with pockthread, do. Else if you would be a man speak what you think today in words as hard as cannon balls, and tomorrow speak what tomorrow thinks in hard words again, though it contradict every thing you said today. Ah, then, exclaim the aged ladies, you shall be sure to be misunderstood! Misunderstood! It is a right fool's word. Is it so bad then to be misunderstood? Pythagoras was misunderstood, and Socrates and Jesus, and Luther, and Copernicus, and Galileo, and Newton, and every pure and wise spirit that ever took flesh. To be great is to be misunderstood.

.

 

[Hitokage]

Gaborn: That isn't what I'm talking about.

 

[jorma]

Btw isnt it sort of telling that the Democrats felt that they needed to conduct "one of the most rigorous vice-presidential vetting processes ever" while the Republicans felt they could get away with a search on google?

 

[bob_arctor]

You know, I really don't want this election to be about her daughter boozing it up when there's vastly more pertinent issues to consider.

Obama, responding to reporter questions, noted his own mother gave birth to him at 18, and said stories about candidates' families should be off-limits.

"This shouldn't be part of our politics," he said. "It has no relevance to Gov. Palin's performance as governor or her potential performance as a vice president."

Classy.

 

[polyh3dron]

Speaking of which, it's amazing how "flip-flopping" has suddenly become fashionable.

Yep, the Repubs went SO hard on the John Kerry Flip Flop crap back in 04 like it made Kerry the worst person in the world, and now they're defending McCain's myriad flip flops.

Republicans am hypocrites CONFIRMED

Classy.

Yet still I just saw some Republican mouthpiece on TV saying that the Obama campaign was somehow covertly instructing the LIBRUL BLOGOSPHERES to spread all this Palingate shit and that he didn't really come out against them even when Obama specifically said that if he found out that anyone working for him had a hand in floating all these rumors that he would fire them personally.

 

[Hitokage]

bob_actor: Like being pro-censorship and exhibiting the same loyalty-uber-alles mentality that permeated the Bush administration. Fuck, that's what gets me upset, not the daughter nonsense.

 

[Gaborn]

Classy.

Definitely it was a classy statement by Obama, it's just a shame so many people want to ignore him.

 

[gcubed]

babygate is more annoying simply because there is a whole laundry list of REAL POLITICAL THINGS that one can argue about Palin being a horrid VP pick, all the while leaving her kid out of it. I mean... seriously, baby-gate is annoying because there are other more pertinent discussions to be had in the MSM.

 

[pxleyes]

Definitely it was a classy statement by Obama, it's just a shame so many people want to ignore him.

I know that's supposed to be a slight against all of us, but you have to remember this a forum and not the real political arena.

 

[scorcho]

babygate is more annoying simply because there is a whole laundry list of REAL POLITICAL THINGS that one can argue about Palin being a horrid VP pick, all the while leaving her kid out of it. I mean... seriously, baby-gate is annoying because there are other more pertinent discussions to be had in the MSM.

as many people have pointed out in this thread, 'babygate' matters because it shines a light on the clusterfuck of Republican policy regarding sex education and contraceptives.