Claiming that individuals should be held accountable for the actions of other members of their race is the very basis of racist thought. What the fuck is going on here?
-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Post-Women's March: white women, working class, and people might need to reflect
- Thread starter Messofanego
- Start date
- Status
Claiming that individuals should be held accountable for the actions of other members of their race is the very basis of racist thought. What the fuck is going on here?
blu
Wants the largest console games publisher to avoid Nintendo's platforms.
The white female participants in the march should have been angrier and/or more violent? I'm not sure I follow you.
Jmanunknown
Member
People need to get over themselves if signs and comments like the one in the op make you not stand up for your own rights and the rights of your fellow citizens. As an example Bill Clinton specifically championed and got a bill passed (with the support of the other democratic presidential canidate bernie sanders) that literally help destroy black families and communities and Hilary Clinton supported the bill and literally called young black men super predators and yet the most reliable voting block for Hilary Clinton and democrats in general are black people.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
Didn't Stump say that was based on exit polls? Saying half (of voting) white women would be more fair and closer to the truth.
clockworkinyou
Banned
Great post showing that you support throwing 47% of women who didn't vote for him under the bus. Glad you don't live here OP. Glad you just sit there and post shit to stir the pot from across a fucking ocean.
Man Called Aerodynamics
Member
Instead of just trashing it, tell us what white people can do better. Genuine question. I went to the march, I'm white, I'd really like to know from a black person's perspective what should be different next time.
CrocMother
Banned
Yeah, I simply can't deal at PoC opinions, man
We always have to handhold people that are apparently allied with us
If you are trying to shame the white women who marched at these protests because the other 53% of them voted Trump, than you are a complete moron. Especially if you use some anecdotal "I knew some black women and they were dissapointed", discounting all the other PoC who were there and possibly had different opinions, than you are a moron.
Alligatorjandro
Banned
Why was it only 47%?
I'm just gonna keep saying "blame the Christians, leave the women alone" because that makes waaaay more sense on so many levels, imo. I mean, if we're looking to make someone feel guilty about this. If that's how we produce progress...
Sixfortyfive
He who pursues two rabbits gets two rabbits.
I mostly checked out of PoliGAF threads not too long ago, when I saw people getting banned simply for expressing incredulity when other people were telling them that to be white was to be inherently racist.
People are way more invested in droning on about their own perceived moral superiority than they are in actually solving problems.
I really wish people would ask themselves "am I helping?" before firing from the hip for no reason in particular.
He lost the popular vote
Krauser Kat
Member
Great sign. We need to keep calling attention that probably more then half of all women voters still voted for a guy that grabs pussies.
I see that sign as a call to action.
FIND A WAY to get that 53% back on our side.
White women should be at the front of that fight.
White women and whites in general need to own the fuck up that the majority of us are hurting the rest of the country.
Be the ones that convince that 10-15% of us that could go either way to keep coming to the left.
I see that sign as a call to action.
FIND A WAY to get that 53% back on our side.
White women should be at the front of that fight.
White women and whites in general need to own the fuck up that the majority of us are hurting the rest of the country.
Be the ones that convince that 10-15% of us that could go either way to keep coming to the left.
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
So now we are going from collective ethnic guilt to collective religious guilt?
ElBoxyBrown
Banned
Funny how when Samantha Bee talks about this everyone is in agreement. What changed?
Dash_Riprock
Member
Unfortunately a main facet of being Progressive is an inherent belief that you better than those who aren't with you 100%, so thats not gonna happen.
Maintenance
Member
Shit's crazy.
KO Traveling Hobo
Member
For me, the tweet Messofanego posted skewed the entire discussion.
I don't have a strong opinion one way or the other about the sign, since the whole point of protest is to be heard, but that tweet is unambiguously telling white women to stay home instead of marching.
Did any of you guys actually go to one of the marches? This infighting narrative seems way overblown and not at all representative of what was actually on display on Saturday, at least in the march that I was in.
It's incredible to me that not 48 hours after the largest demonstration in U.S. history, with support on all seven continents, and thousands of people -- including people I personally know who have been politically apathetic, if not totally ignorant, until now -- are now mobilizing themselves into grassroots activism and taking action in ways they never even considered before, there are some practically desperate to find any fault lines that they can split them open and then complain about how progressives are their own worst enemy.
Concentrate your time and energy into something more constructive.
It's incredible to me that not 48 hours after the largest demonstration in U.S. history, with support on all seven continents, and thousands of people -- including people I personally know who have been politically apathetic, if not totally ignorant, until now -- are now mobilizing themselves into grassroots activism and taking action in ways they never even considered before, there are some practically desperate to find any fault lines that they can split them open and then complain about how progressives are their own worst enemy.
Concentrate your time and energy into something more constructive.
What did she say?
Collective ethnic responsibilty is not a fact. And your post is pretty lightweight. No need for any help.
fart town usa
Member
Maybe I'm crazy but I'm pretty sure you thinking that every white woman is privileged and blinded to the realities of the world is something that might need to be applied to yourself.
To assume that all white people are better off, in my opinion, is a form of privilege in itself. Because it clearly is a privilege to be so ignorant to think that an entire group of people have such a better life based solely on their gender and skin color.
I think the sign puts the wrong people on the defensive and defeats the point.
It should definitely be said though that White Women did not step up here, so a sign like saying, White Women need to do better or along those lines would probably be better. Called out, but not shit on, at least not there at the March.
All that said, the woman is entitled to her sign. She's not wrong.
It should definitely be said though that White Women did not step up here, so a sign like saying, White Women need to do better or along those lines would probably be better. Called out, but not shit on, at least not there at the March.
All that said, the woman is entitled to her sign. She's not wrong.
I don't think it was the sign alone, I think its the followup tweets in the OP that piss people off.
It's one thing to say the majority of white women voted for Trump and that we shouldn't forget that fact despite the success of the March, it's an entirely different thing to say that it's the fault of the white women that showed up to the March that all those other white women voted for Trump.
Steeped in a Sea of Games
Member
As a white male democrat living in the suburbs of a state that's 90%+ white, I feel alienated as hell and this kind of stuff just discourages me. I won't betray my values, but it sure sucks when both sides pretty much treat you like the enemy.
Unspeakable Evil
Member
A black woman held the sign that was too real.
The sign is fine (the framing of the picture is a little more dubious but whatever).
The tweet though is out of line imo. I wouldn't ask latino men to go "look in the mirror" as if they're directly to blame for 1/3 of them voting Trump. Hell, men voted in majority for Trump, is that guy tweeting "looking in the mirror" too ? It would be out of line there and it's out of line here. Specially when the people you're targeting were the very same day pretty much protesting against Trump and everything he stands for.
I'd bet 99% of those women were religious. I'd bet somewhere near that portion despise the idea of abortion. I'd bet It's the steepest of hills to climb, changing their minds.
jakonovski
Member
At this rate you're getting 12 years of Trump, and that's only because he's old.
How is a white woman on the east coast going to convince a white woman Trump supporter in the middle of the country of anything?
Can Crusher
Banned
I bet some people would change their vote to trump after reading this trite, out of spite.
He does it all the time along with Lime.
WaffleTaco
Wants to outlaw technological innovation.
Why the fuck are people still posting that picture? As a white woman who voted for Hillary, it just seems mean and makes me feel like shit.
You pointed to the sign in the OP as the reason "allies" would stop supporting PoC, so yes it was one tweet. A true ally would not abandon support just because some people hurt their feelings.
I should be introspective about white people and their feelings so they'll be on our side? Okay..
Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
Dash_Riprock
Member
Most just wouldn't vote at all.
by the time you lot sort yourselves out Barron Trump will be on his 2nd term
I mean, one is a gender you're born with and the other is a belief system you choose to ascribe to. One narrowly went to Trump while the other goes, heavily, for Trump and Republicans consistently.
The white women who went for Trump went that way for a reason. The same reason a large percentage of them consistently vote against women's health issues. The same reason they're consistent Republican voters.
Imp the Dimp
Member
One would think the majority of protesting women were from the 47% non-Trump crowd
CrocMother
Banned
At the annual White Women Convention of course
Aaronology
Member
First, you keep repeating "it's really not that hard to understand" as if we aren't all engaged in a discussion with very evident differences in opinions. You already made a point of attacking me for not understanding because you assumed I was white. Maybe you should tone it down a bit.
White women are exactly the people who should be having that dialogue with other white women. I encourage it, without antagonism, from the outside. This is what we want, for white people to realize they have to address racism and bigotry from their end and to do what they can in their power to oppose it. And that's exactly what these protesters were doing. I fucking applaud that woman you posted, and don't particularly have a problem with the sign she held any more than I do with this:
But that same sign held up by a white person at a BLM rally would evoke a completely different reaction, for reasons that should not have to be expounded on. Context matters. Stop pretending it doesn't. It's really not that hard to understand.
fart town usa
Member
I got banned in that thread because my post on social issues correcting themselves via advocacy was taken out of context and I called someone out for it. Therefore I was banned because "I didn't know how to frame a response."
I think sentiments like this are cowardly. Lazy, more accurately. I see it often in these sorts of threads. There is a time for pragmatism, coalescing your support, and achieving a goal even if it ain't pretty or exactly how you would like it to be. But throwing "guess trump is getting reelected and Dems are done gg rip" in the face of criticism is reductive. Especially in a context of there being no election, no candidates to analyze particularly, and most of the discussion is surrounding the ideology of the party and how we can run better campaigns. This is when you would most want some introspection and problem solving, and to have the hard discussions.
Ghostshark
Member
This rhetoric isn't helpful at all. The reality of the situation is that there's a lot of shit people that are willing to trample on minority rights, but we need relief NOW and not waiting for a major group (old racist voters) to die off. The truly "deplorables" are too far gone to engage with constructively, but not every Trump voter is a malicious racist. A lot of them are ignorant.
We need to keep protesting, fighting against Trump's poison administration, and start appealing to the ignorant Trump voters. Emotional response is a powerful apsect of humanity, and we need to appeal to that. Coddling to "avoiding hurting white feelings" should never be required, but we need to be realistic. The language we use is critical in successfully combating this White House.
We need to keep protesting, fighting against Trump's poison administration, and start appealing to the ignorant Trump voters. Emotional response is a powerful apsect of humanity, and we need to appeal to that. Coddling to "avoiding hurting white feelings" should never be required, but we need to be realistic. The language we use is critical in successfully combating this White House.
SlimySnake
Flashless at the Golden Globes
There is nothing wrong with calling out people who voted for this vile racist sexist man. I find that democrats are very reluctant to get into arguments and have this let's all just get along mentality that contributed to Trump winning. Obama and Hillary were all like let's give him a chance. Ummm no.
I find it hypocritical for any woman (white or black) to attend these women's march organized by feminists when the guy they voted for not only allegedly sexually abused them, but admitted to doing it on leaked audio, on howard stern, and has repeatedly judged and insulted women on their looks.
So those signs dont offend me that much. maybe they can modify them to say 53% of white women voted for him. or only 43% of white women voted for her. But the point stands, these women made an awful choice and they dont get to go to these marches and pretend they stand for women's rights after the guy they voted for said on live tv that they should be punished for having abortions.
I find it hypocritical for any woman (white or black) to attend these women's march organized by feminists when the guy they voted for not only allegedly sexually abused them, but admitted to doing it on leaked audio, on howard stern, and has repeatedly judged and insulted women on their looks.
So those signs dont offend me that much. maybe they can modify them to say 53% of white women voted for him. or only 43% of white women voted for her. But the point stands, these women made an awful choice and they dont get to go to these marches and pretend they stand for women's rights after the guy they voted for said on live tv that they should be punished for having abortions.
fart town usa
Member
lol
- Status
Similar threads
- Locked
- Locked
- Locked