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Presidential Debate #2 |Washington University| Grab me right in the Ken Bone

Who won?

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S

Sydle

Member
RustyNails said:
Once again, reminding everyone that Hillary's answer on Lincoln movie was true.

Cua2hpVW8AASJkG.jpg
Click to expand...

Thanks, I thought she was just making up a poor excuse on the spot.

itsnothing.gif
 
T

Toxi

Banned
RustyNails said:
Once again, reminding everyone that Hillary's answer on Lincoln movie was true.

Cua2hpVW8AASJkG.jpg
Click to expand...
To be fair, it was a terrible answer because most of the people watching didn't know about that context and so Lincoln seemed like a non-sequitor.

Clinton should have just focused on explaining why she is good.
 
J

Jack The Nipper

Banned
I was talking to a few of the extreme trump supporters it becomes a bit strange for me when they see him as holly and hillary as satan. Even though I don't personally feel either are that amazing it's still an interesting insight.
 
D

DontBeThatGuy

Member
kame-sennin said:
As a minority who's watched his people be decimated by Bill and Hillary's mass incarceration: I continually tire of people co-opting the language of the radical left to coerce people into voting democrat.
Click to expand...

Black leaders at the time were highly in favor of that bill, with Bernie Sanders voting in favor of it as well, and Trump was out there calluing for the execution of black teenagers. No one got it right, clearly.

We do need people that learn from their and apologize for their mistakes, and acknowledge these, not double down, or go scorched earth.
 
T

Toxi

Banned
Funny thing about the South Park douche vs turd sandwich joke: It was originally used for the 2004 election.

Hindsight's a bitch.
 
M

Mahonay

Banned
kame-sennin said:
My first arrest was protesting Donald Trump. I've screamed at trumpsters outside of Trump towers on multiple occasions. They're both horrible. The degree varies.
Click to expand...
Ok thank you I was just curious.

And yeah I was super huge on Bernie largely due in part for what he's done for civil rights in the past.

It would be a lie to say I'm not settling by choosing to go with Hillary now. I voted against her with Obama as well.
 
E

Ekai

Member
kame-sennin said:
Who is doing this in this thread?
Click to expand...

If you're denying both sides bs when it's right there then you are no longer worth the time talking to. That you would attempt to belittle my own concerns as a minority was already disgusting but I'm just not going to bother with you anymore now. Thanks for saving me the time.
 
H

HowardRoark

Member
Valonquar said:
Just watched the debate. Took mini-notes while watching and this is what I ended up with:

1. Is Trump a bad man?
H: He is a very bad man
T: I am not a bad man

2. No really, Trump’s bad right?
T: No, I’m not. Her husband raped several women. She is the devil, and should be put in jail.
H: Trump is bad.

3. How would you fix health care?
H: Spend more money to pay for poor people to have health care.
T: Repeal Obamacare. Repeal lines to foster competition.

4. MUSLIMS
T: They need to self-police and RADICAL ISLAM.
H: Muslims are people.

5. Ban Muslims?
T: I mean we need to ban extremists and have better vetting.
H: THINK OF THE CHILDREN.

6. Wikileaks says Hilary is a two-faced liar liar pants on fire.
H: Abraham Lincoln, proposed the 13th Amendment to allow me to carry hot sauce in my purse. THE RUSSIANS don’t like me and are helping Donald.
T: Putin seems ok. I opened a post office recently, and I pay a lot in taxes.

7. Make the rich pay more taxes?
T: Remove carried interest & other loopholes. Hillary could have done this already but didn’t
H: I’m Robin Hood y’all. Rich people owe us more.

8. Trump, you sly tax evading devil!
T: Yup, I used laws that Hillary failed to prevent. Legally I did nothing wrong WHAT. Heck all her friends are doing it too. ¯_(ツ)_/¯ BTW Hillary created ISIS.
H: Golly…I sure love children. After 9/11 I did things I was supposed to do, and helped women in unexplained ways. Also, people voted for me to be senator.

9. Syrian boy died. How do we help dead Syrian boys?
H: Syria is fucked right now. I made no-fly zones. THE RUSSIANS hate me, but I’ll work with them to fix it somehow. War isn’t my thing really. Maybe send some ninjas or offer ninja training. We could also send guns there and let them sort it out themselves.
T: We need more nukes than Russia. At least everyone over there is killing ISIS for us. KILL ISIS. Hillary is stupid.

10. Why will you be the bestest president ever?
H: People voted for me. HAHAHAHA. I’m proud of 30 years. Know your place. Think of the children.
T: Yes because Hillary is a liar. Ethnicity name drops. Education is a disaster. I can’t be worse than her.

11. Why did you call half of us deplorable?
H: My bad, I just really hate Trump. He hates minorities. Me & Bernie are besties <3
T: We are divided. Hillary = Obama.

12. Late night tweeting is bad.
T: When I was tweeting in the middle of the night, Hillary was asleep and Bengazi happened.
H: Trump is mean. My husband did things. Obama is also good and did things.

13. Voting for Supreme Court justice replacement?
H: I want one that will do the things I want. Senate are assholes for not doing their job.
T: I want one that will do the things I want. GUNS.

14. PURE ENERGY
T: American energy is best energy. Less foreign dependence. Fuck the EPA.
H: I failed to prevent China from letting Trump do stuff cheaper. Agree energy independence good. Clean energy superpowers. I had a plan.

15. Now kiss?
H: I hate him, but his kids are ok I guess.
T: Yup my kids are great. You suck, but at least you don’t quit sucking.

I really hate both candidates at this point. No matter who wins, we lose. You can argue who will suck the least, but that's just sad. The moderators did a terrible job limiting answers & responses, but at least they seemed to give equal time to both candidate's drama.
Click to expand...

This is a great summary.
 
C

CraigerGamer

Member
RustyNails said:
Once again, reminding everyone that Hillary's answer on Lincoln movie was true.

Cua2hpVW8AASJkG.jpg
Click to expand...

Even before the Lincoln connection was made public, do we really expect our politicians to hold the exact same ideals as the people who they represent? I don;t mind if Mrs. Clinton feels differently about a certain issue personally than what she espouses publicly as long as she is following the will of the majority of those who elected her. Like, doesn't this actually make her a better choice? That she readily admits she is a voice of the people regardless if she agrees with the issue or not.
 
A

Aaronrules380

Member
HowardRoark said:
It's a distilled/dumbed down version for entertainment, which it succeeds in. I'm not interested in the "they both suck" narrative that it's used for, but it is certainly entertaining.
Click to expand...
A good summary should not be dumbed down like that, and several of the points are horribly unrepresentative of what was actually said
 
S

Steel

Banned
Makonero said:
You know, I love that movie, but wasn't what Lincoln did (offering jobs to people if they voted his way) eventually made illegal? Kinda hard to admire that particular part of the wheeling and dealing.
Click to expand...

Lincoln did a ton of things that were illegal at the time, like suspending Habeas Corpus. Hell, the Civil War itself was illegal. It's simply proof that the ends justify the means.
 
mashoutposse

mashoutposse

Ante Up
Valonquar said:
Just watched the debate. Took mini-notes while watching and this is what I ended up with:

1. Is Trump a bad man?
H: He is a very bad man
T: I am not a bad man

2. No really, Trump’s bad right?
T: No, I’m not. Her husband raped several women. She is the devil, and should be put in jail.
H: Trump is bad.

3. How would you fix health care?
H: Spend more money to pay for poor people to have health care.
T: Repeal Obamacare. Repeal lines to foster competition.

4. MUSLIMS
T: They need to self-police and RADICAL ISLAM.
H: Muslims are people.

5. Ban Muslims?
T: I mean we need to ban extremists and have better vetting.
H: THINK OF THE CHILDREN.

6. Wikileaks says Hilary is a two-faced liar liar pants on fire.
H: Abraham Lincoln, proposed the 13th Amendment to allow me to carry hot sauce in my purse. THE RUSSIANS don’t like me and are helping Donald.
T: Putin seems ok. I opened a post office recently, and I pay a lot in taxes.

7. Make the rich pay more taxes?
T: Remove carried interest & other loopholes. Hillary could have done this already but didn’t
H: I’m Robin Hood y’all. Rich people owe us more.

8. Trump, you sly tax evading devil!
T: Yup, I used laws that Hillary failed to prevent. Legally I did nothing wrong WHAT. Heck all her friends are doing it too. ¯\_(&#12484;)_/¯ BTW Hillary created ISIS.
H: Golly…I sure love children. After 9/11 I did things I was supposed to do, and helped women in unexplained ways. Also, people voted for me to be senator.

9. Syrian boy died. How do we help dead Syrian boys?
H: Syria is fucked right now. I made no-fly zones. THE RUSSIANS hate me, but I’ll work with them to fix it somehow. War isn’t my thing really. Maybe send some ninjas or offer ninja training. We could also send guns there and let them sort it out themselves.
T: We need more nukes than Russia. At least everyone over there is killing ISIS for us. KILL ISIS. Hillary is stupid.

10. Why will you be the bestest president ever?
H: People voted for me. HAHAHAHA. I’m proud of 30 years. Know your place. Think of the children.
T: Yes because Hillary is a liar. Ethnicity name drops. Education is a disaster. I can’t be worse than her.

11. Why did you call half of us deplorable?
H: My bad, I just really hate Trump. He hates minorities. Me & Bernie are besties <3
T: We are divided. Hillary = Obama.

12. Late night tweeting is bad.
T: When I was tweeting in the middle of the night, Hillary was asleep and Bengazi happened.
H: Trump is mean. My husband did things. Obama is also good and did things.

13. Voting for Supreme Court justice replacement?
H: I want one that will do the things I want. Senate are assholes for not doing their job.
T: I want one that will do the things I want. GUNS.

14. PURE ENERGY
T: American energy is best energy. Less foreign dependence. Fuck the EPA.
H: I failed to prevent China from letting Trump do stuff cheaper. Agree energy independence good. Clean energy superpowers. I had a plan.

15. Now kiss?
H: I hate him, but his kids are ok I guess.
T: Yup my kids are great. You suck, but at least you don’t quit sucking.

I really hate both candidates at this point. No matter who wins, we lose. You can argue who will suck the least, but that's just sad. The moderators did a terrible job limiting answers & responses, but at least they seemed to give equal time to both candidate's drama.
Click to expand...

Stealth DJT supporter?

You watched a different debate than I did. Where you saw "THINK OF THE CHILDREN," I noted several serious, substantive, and direct answers to questions and topics on the part of Hillary Clinton.

Alternatively, you seemed to perceive clear and focused Trump answers where I saw clumsy deflections and general inarticulateness.
 
K

Krejlooc

Banned
HowardRoark said:
It's a distilled/dumbed down version for entertainment
Click to expand...

Correct, dumb summary for dumb people.

which it succeeds in. I'm not interested in the "they both suck" narrative that it's used for, but it is certainly entertaining.
Click to expand...

Its only entertaining of you arent taking this seriously, or are desperate to try and normalizs trump. Its dumbed down to lose nuance to arrive at the "both sides" narrative the author was trying to achieve before he even started. If those are the answers he heard while watching the debate, he has extremely poor comprehension.
 
M

Manmademan

Member
RDreamer said:
Can one of these billionaires just pay the 5 mil leak fee and get that other tape out there to put the killing blow in this bastard?
Click to expand...

It's coming regardless.

The issue isn't the expense or the availability, but timing. Dropping another bomb before the last one and the debate have time to play out is just a waste.

Drop another one right before the next debate so there isn't time to formulate talking points against it, and a third before voters go to polls and the GOP has nothing to counter it, or compose anything to rally the base.
 
K

kame-sennin

Member
Setsuna said:
Do explain please
Click to expand...

Why Hilary doesn't deserve the black vote.

DontBeThatGuy said:
Black leaders at the time were highly in favor of that bill, with Bernie Sanders voting in favor of it as well, and Trump was out there calluing for the execution of black teenagers. No one got it right, clearly.
Click to expand...

No they weren't:

WASHINGTON, Aug. 17— In the official Congressional Directory, Representative John Lewis notes that he received a degree from the American Baptist Theological Seminary and lists his profession as "civil rights leader."

Mr. Lewis's self-description helps explain his abiding antipathy toward violence, including what he has long considered to be the state-sponsored violence of capital punishment. For that reason, Mr. Lewis, Democrat of Georgia, voted last week to block anAdministration-backed crime bill that would have greatly expanded the number of Federal offenses that would be subject to the death penalty.

But today, looking sad and saying little, Mr. Lewis stood in front of the White House and announced -- along with another member of the Congressional Black Caucus, Representative Charles B. Rangel of Manhattan -- that he was changing his mind and would vote to allow the House to take up the measure.

The opposition of some black Democrats to the death penalty is so strong that 10 of the 38 black Democrats in Congress voted against the measure that would have allowed the House to consider the crime bill, even though it included millions of dollars in social programs they say their communities sorely need. The measure was defeated 225 to 210.

"I grew up with strong feelings against capital punishment," said Mr. Lewis, who says he vividly remembers a segregated South where black men were often executed both inside and outside the judicial system. "I think it's barbaric and should have been outlawed many years ago. It represents a period of our past and is not worthy of a great nation."

But Mr. Lewis is also politically astute, and, as a deputy House whip, a member of the Democratic leadership. A defeat of the crime bill would wound the President, encouraging the perception that he was too weak to get a legislative priority passed in the House even though it is controlled by his own party.

Later in the day, Representative Cleo Fields, another black Democrat, also announced that he would switch his vote and allow the bill to be voted on by the House.

Mr. Lewis, who once headed the Student Nonviolent Coordinating Committee and marched with the Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King Jr., said, "It's been one of the most difficult decisions I've had to make in the eight years since I've been here. It was much easier to march across the bridge in Selma or go on the freedom rides. Everything then was clearly black and white."

Crime bills are tough votes for black lawmakers. Blacks are far more likely than whites to be victims of violent crime, and some polls have found that they are more afraid than whites of being murdered or mugged. But blacks have consistently been less willing than whites to approve of capital punishment.

This year a tricky vote on a crime bill became even tougher when the $33 billion measure was sweetened with more than $7 billion for crime-prevention programs, including millions for the kind of Federal aid for inner cities that black Democrats have been demanding -- and generally not getting -- for many, many years.

That money -- and the prospect that an even more Draconian crime bill could be enacted, with less money for social programs and without a ban on 19 different types of assault weapons -- was enough to induce 28 of the 38 black Democrats to vote last Thursday to allow the bill to be considered by the full House.

But for some of them, the money was not enough to outweigh their loathing of a bill that would expand the number of Federal crimes punishable by death from a handful to more than 50, including offenses like terrorism, drive-by shootings and drug trafficking.

Recent reports have shown that an overwhelming majority of defendants on death row for Federal crimes are black. The last Federal execution took place in Iowa in 1963.

"To suggest that it's just a matter of how much funding it would take to get somebody to change his mind, I think is an insult," said Representative Robert C. Scott of Virginia, another of the recalcitrant black Democrats. "You wouldn't ask an opponent of abortion to look at a bill with the greatest expansion of abortion in the history of the United States, and argue that he ought to vote for it because it's got some highway funding in it." Going After Votes

In recent days, the White House, which has been accused by some on Capitol Hill of taking the caucus too much for granted, fought to turn around some of the black Democrats who had voted against it.

On Monday, Mr. Rangel suggested that he would change his vote if religious leaders thought that the morally right thing to do would be to let the House vote on the measure. On Tuesday, the White House released a statement by 40 black members of the clergy supporting the crime bill.

Mr. Fields, who met with the President on Tuesday, said he was changing his mind because he had received assurances from Attorney General Janet Reno that the Justice Department would insure that there was no racial bias in deciding when to seek the death penalty.

Purely political considerations may have played a part in persuading Mr. Lewis and Mr. Rangel to change their minds. Mr. Rangel, for instance, is facing a primary challenge from City Councilman Adam Clayton Powell 4th, who says that the incumbent's vote against the bill indicates how out of touch he is with the feelings and fears of his constituents.

And Mr. Lewis saw the Administration shopping for votes among Republicans and conservative Democrats by proposing to reduce the money for social programs, making him fear that his opposition might result in a bill that he would consider to be even worse.

"I was seeing proposals moving further and further to the right," he said in a telephone interview. "What was in the making was something worse than you have now."
Click to expand...

http://www.nytimes.com/1994/08/18/us/blacks-relent-on-crime-bill-but-not-without-bitterness.html

They were cajoled into voting for it with funding for inner cities, false promises that capital punishment would be less racist, and threats that a worse bill would replace it. It's so gross to now use these defeated black leaders as a defense for a law they never wanted to vote for in the first place.

But even if it were true, this is a really offensive argument to make. "Black people were doing it too" is not a defense for racist policy. The Clintons made a deliberate play to racist voters by trying to steal the law and order platform from republicans. And they did a lot of really ugly stuff to make that work - 'super predators' was the least of it.

That some black leaders may also have been caught up in America's racist bullshit is not an excuse.
 
N

Nerokis

Member
Toxi said:
To be fair, it was a terrible answer because most of the people watching didn't know about that context and so Lincoln seemed like a non-sequitor.

Clinton should have just focused on explaining why she is good.
Click to expand...

Even with the context, it was a bad answer. While she did bring up Lincoln as an example of someone who navigated through difficult negotiations with a public position and a private position, that's all he was: an example. Pretending like she was just discussing an amazing movie she had seen was pure deflection, not a great one, and didn't get to the actual point she was making in the leaked speech. A point that, for some, would have reinforced the sense that Hillary is untrustworthy.

Now, I'm not among those, and I agree 100% with what she was saying. I also understand how the point would have been much harder to make during a presidential debate. She bungled her answer, though. Unfortunately, she and her campaign have a knack for amplifying her weaknesses.
 
H

Higgy

Member
Not the most important thing but not one time has marijuana legalization come up. Dumb fuck trump says he's the law and order candidate so does that mean he'll send the DEA into Colorado? Wish someone would pin him down on this.
 
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