Really? I guess that makes sense. So they'd just make certain games native 4K compatible if they're played on the Scorpio.
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PS, I Love You- Greg Miller's new PlayStation Podcast
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Really? I guess that makes sense. So they'd just make certain games native 4K compatible if they're played on the Scorpio.
Actually Microsoft backed a bit on that and said "if companies want to make exclusives, they can".
I fully expect them to announce their own exclusives at next year's E3.
I fully expect them to announce their own exclusives at next year's E3.
MS is saying that there won't be exclusive Scorpio games http://gamingbolt.com/xbox-one-scorpio-wont-have-any-exclusives-phil-spencer-reiterates
Microsoft have been very clear that the only Scorpio exclusive titles allowed are VR titles.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1233987
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1232993
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1265085
And many more threads where Microsoft continues to insist that there will be no Scorpio exclusive titles.
This exactly.
AmuroChan
Member
It's not though. Phil Spencer clearly said at E3 that all games must play on X1 and Scorpio. Even in the Scorpio reveal video, it was emphasized that ALL games will work on both.
I agree with Colin that Sony did a piss poor job of properly communicating what the pro is and does. Way too much focus on the 4K and HDR stuff.
That said, this thing is still going to sell like hotcakes. Once these things start getting into the hands of press and influencers and people see that their games will look and run better on a standard 1080p set, word of mouth will take it from there. At some point, Sony's poor marketing be damned, people will realize that its just a $100 difference to get better looking games on their standard HDTV.
That said, this thing is still going to sell like hotcakes. Once these things start getting into the hands of press and influencers and people see that their games will look and run better on a standard 1080p set, word of mouth will take it from there. At some point, Sony's poor marketing be damned, people will realize that its just a $100 difference to get better looking games on their standard HDTV.
That's why I'm curious to that people will think when it's showcased, and I wonder how games will truly look on it since the software will still be married the OG XB1
I still don't believe it, but I'm glad they clarified it.
No way they won't make exclusive games for something over 400% more powerful.
AmuroChan
Member
Scorpio exclusives at next year's E3 before the console even releases and exactly one year after they emphatically said on stage no one gets left behind? Can't wait to see the internet reaction when that happens. That's going to make the NMS's backlash look like child's play.
And that's my whole point of it all. There will be benefits to people with 1080p sets. But at the end of the day it's just $400. Sure more people will gravitate to the cheaper Slim but for $400 you get what's being billed as a PS4 will more power. During the holidays and with bundled games people will shrug at that difference.
Omnistalgic
Member
Backlash will be strong..pretty sure it's just Vr titles
ShooterMcTavish
Banned
For the last fucking time to people who are mad about this.
Sony is giving you a revision of there console with a bigger hd, just like the Xbox 360 elite did last gen Except instead of just more HD space and maybe a die shrink, we are getting a console that is more fucking powerful.
Think about how sweet this is compared to last generations of hardware revisions, we are getting the same stuff we did previous generation but graphical improvement thrown on top and at the same price or close to what a revision would normally cost.
For fuck sakes, this is fucking great.
Person who has ps4- " aw man my ps4 broke, guess I'll go buy a new one, oh wait this ps4 is just like my old one except it has more HD space and what's this, oh shit I can play with ultra settings in BFone. Holy shit this is awesome"
And to the same person but doesn't want to spend the same price he did when the console launched
-aww man my console broke, oh cool they have a new one for 299 now. Sweet
Sony is giving you a revision of there console with a bigger hd, just like the Xbox 360 elite did last gen Except instead of just more HD space and maybe a die shrink, we are getting a console that is more fucking powerful.
Think about how sweet this is compared to last generations of hardware revisions, we are getting the same stuff we did previous generation but graphical improvement thrown on top and at the same price or close to what a revision would normally cost.
For fuck sakes, this is fucking great.
Person who has ps4- " aw man my ps4 broke, guess I'll go buy a new one, oh wait this ps4 is just like my old one except it has more HD space and what's this, oh shit I can play with ultra settings in BFone. Holy shit this is awesome"
And to the same person but doesn't want to spend the same price he did when the console launched
-aww man my console broke, oh cool they have a new one for 299 now. Sweet
Oddvintagechap
Member
I always wondered why the second edition of a console didn't have improvements.
Now we have them. Better Wifi, upscaling(native?) to 4K. Are wonders for me.
The fact its not a huge gap means previous owners won't be left in the dust.
Thats what 2017/2018 PS5(PS4K Pro?) is for.
The real question is.. is Sony going to release an update every year and face the Xbox next holiday... or is gonna do a 2 year update cycle.. questions.
Now we have them. Better Wifi, upscaling(native?) to 4K. Are wonders for me.
The fact its not a huge gap means previous owners won't be left in the dust.
Thats what 2017/2018 PS5(PS4K Pro?) is for.
The real question is.. is Sony going to release an update every year and face the Xbox next holiday... or is gonna do a 2 year update cycle.. questions.
andythinkpad
Member
I think the difference between PS4 slim and PS4 Pro is about on par between iPhone 32GB and 128GB. These guys are shitting on 4Pro so hard.
The weird thing about Colin's point that this new iteration won't make games play better or make innovations to story or gameplay can essentially be made about the PS5. Why do we need a PS5 if the Pro isn't worth your time and isn't pushing gaming further, if that console will do the same sort of thing but bigger?
Not being interested in 4K is perfectly understandable, and I can agree on that being something not everyone is interested in. But having more power in your console is also going to potentially beef up the visual fidelity of these games, at least for developers who support that, and that is something I'm sure gamers are interested in.
I am perfectly cool with them being down on the console, and at first I was, as well. But writing off something based on one feature (4K) is not giving it a fair shake. The Rise of the Tomb Raider graphics options are actually a really neat look at what can be done.
Not being interested in 4K is perfectly understandable, and I can agree on that being something not everyone is interested in. But having more power in your console is also going to potentially beef up the visual fidelity of these games, at least for developers who support that, and that is something I'm sure gamers are interested in.
I am perfectly cool with them being down on the console, and at first I was, as well. But writing off something based on one feature (4K) is not giving it a fair shake. The Rise of the Tomb Raider graphics options are actually a really neat look at what can be done.
Serenitynow
Member
The problem is, it's just a $100 difference to get better looking games IF you don't already own a PS4 and you're in the market for one. If you already have one, then the proposition becomes $400 for an upgrade to a machine you already spent $350 on to get better visuals. It's no longer just a $100 difference. Certainly a tougher sell than hotcakes.
As to the aforementioned group - the group that doesn't already own a PS4 - my argument would be that if they haven't picked one up 3 years into the console's life, then they're probably not the people who feel like they need to pay more for a premium machine.
Of course, there are outliers, as with everything else. But I personally just don't see how this appeals much farther than the enthusiast crowd and have yet to be sold on PS4 Pro's hotcake potential.
Sony said this is not a generational change for them, and House also said that they are not annualizing or bi annualizing consoles. So don't expect 1 or 2 year consoles, they dont even have the logistics for that. This iterative unit was specifically to take advantage of the PS4 parts they already had.
PS5 will be a brand new ball game, while prioritizing perfect BC with NEO and PS4 games most likely
andythinkpad
Member
Actually a lot of first time SLR buyers don't buy entry level SLRs. I don't have number to back me up but as an avid amatuer photographer I have seen this many time in person. In theory, people who buy into system cameras should buy entry level bodies. But a lot of time they skip over it and go for an more advanced model.
There are many reasons, I will just throw some out there: people in general just like newer stuff even if it's' not "better"; people think they can save the upgrade trouble and go straight to the "better version"; $100 is really not a lot of money. People buy gopro camera for more than 399. I really don't see the issue of diversifying the product line if you have sold 40 million+ of a single product.
Thats pretty much how I feel
Colin is getting pretty fucking iritating with the pro ,his whole arguments about haves and have nots is fucking childish,I can enjoy the og ps4 knowing the pro exists he seems to have the glass is half empty approach and keeps harking on about how its not been done before like anyone gives a fuck.
His first words after the conference were "nobody wants this" seriously wtf
ShooterMcTavish
Banned
Yeah I listened to the podcast today while doing yard work, and it made me so angry, Sony is giving you something extra that they don't need to and you don't have to take it but your still angry. So these people would rather have less I guess in a console revision, boggles my freaking mind
Lord of Ostia
Member
I wouldn't really say Sony is 'giving' you anything; rather, they are selling you a newer version of an older product with some incremental upgrades for a slightly higher price point. When considered that way, it makes sense that many people would want to buy the newer and more powerful model, especially if they don't own a PS4 yet. That said, don't treat this as a 'gift' from Sony. This is a way for them to maintain the $400 price point for the PS4 until the PS5 is released.
VanCityGamer
Member
I love these guys but holy smokes do they ever not understand the power differences! They thought the PS4 Pro is similar to the Xbox One S?? I mean I know Sony did a bad job of selling this system, but what the hell?? Some basic research reveals the major power difference.
lowhighkang_LHK
Member
It's pretty telling that journalists that were there in person to play those games - all have come away very impressed. Digital Foundry, Giant Bomb etc.,
But those who just have the streams to go by maybe weren't. And for obvious reasons, 4k / HDR won't come across in that fashion. To be honest, I think Colin should have realized that simple notion and not have taken such an antagonistic stance against it, until seeing it for himself in person.
Besides, how much does Kinda Funny take in per year? Close to a million dollars when you add up everything from all avenues - I'm sure he's getting it day 1, don't worry guys.
wapplew
Member
What if average gamer who don't do basic research also think the same?
It's a hard job for Sony to carry the message, people who watch at home without 4K HDR felt underwhelm, people at the venue with hands on seems impress.
I don't blame anyone think PS4 Pro is similar to Xbox one S. They both use 4K and HDR as marketing buzz words, they both are more "powerful" than their predecessor.
Yeah that was a headscratcher. The Xbone S isn't even as powerful as the base PS4 lol
RedAssedApe
Banned
perfect example of the casual hardcore
VanCityGamer
Member
Right...except for the fact that the Kinda Funny crew should be more informed than the average gamer. And if they looked at any specs online, they would see how asinine their XB1S and PS4 Pro comparisons are. And it's not like the actual specs are different than what had been rumored for months either.
AquaWateria
Member
I mean options are good, but honestly the PS4 Pro is entirely worthless to me so I can understand where Collin is coming from. Upgraded specs whoo hoo amazing, seriously though its a waste of money to buy the pro when you already have a PS4. Use that money for something that's actually worth your time. Still I guess having options are great.
Still I don't like the direction gaming is heading especially when two companies are just increasing specs. I wouldn't be surprised if the PS5 is the same shit just upgraded specs lol.
Still I don't like the direction gaming is heading especially when two companies are just increasing specs. I wouldn't be surprised if the PS5 is the same shit just upgraded specs lol.
I've never understood why the Scorpio is OK for Colin, and the Pro is bad. He says its so much more powerful than the X Box One so its like a new generation. Except it isn't, all games run on all X Box's, so what is the point of the extra power? There is only so far they can go while making games run on the older consoles. The leap in power is far more likely to alienate older console owners, and make people feel like they have to upgrade because the improvements will be more obvious. Its also more work for dev's.
The Pro is a take it or leave it option, I have an OG PS4, and have no intention of getting a Pro, and i'm ok with that. If I was just getting a console now, then I would get the Pro.
I just feel like MS is doing everything that Colin didn't like about Neo, except he's fine with it? I don't get it. Unless I've misunderstood his point from the get go.
Rain City Gamer
Member
Not sure how anyone takes Colin seriously anymore. Every since his PSVR rant after 2015 E3 (where the PSVR was "Sent to die" and was "Probably being abandoned by Sony" because it didn't have a ton of stage time at E3 Although 70% of their floor space was PSVR) his opinions have become irrelevant to me. I was shocked because he is an educated guy and I didn't expect him to say something that was so uneducated about the industry he has had such a presence in.
I have heard him bitch about Sony's lack of exclusives, then minutes later say how excited he was to play The Tomorrow Children. Then Today he went on his rant about how Power doesn't make games better blah blah, then said that the WiiU didn't have enough power. I can't even make that up.
Greg Miller is the celebrity in this group and I honestly think Colin is doing whatever he can to stay relevant. Has been doing it over the last 18 months.
I have heard him bitch about Sony's lack of exclusives, then minutes later say how excited he was to play The Tomorrow Children. Then Today he went on his rant about how Power doesn't make games better blah blah, then said that the WiiU didn't have enough power. I can't even make that up.
Greg Miller is the celebrity in this group and I honestly think Colin is doing whatever he can to stay relevant. Has been doing it over the last 18 months.
AnthonypUK
Member
He has also talked up the Scorpio - because of its higher power.
These days we get a lot of "i'm not sure" or "maybe" from him when discussing actual details and he also hides behind the "i'm not journalist anymore" when not having enough detail.
He has said before that its ok for MS because xbox is behind and they have to do something. I don't get it either you are against something or you are not.
Yangshouwen
Banned
Well last night I was watching the PS I Love You podcast. The guys were mumbling over if the PS4 Pro had 4K BLu ray player or not. I CC'd them in an article on Twitter at the time to show them it doesn't. Then Colin blocked me..
Dirtyshubb
Member
The thing about Colin's argument about - will it makes games better? - that bothers me is that it just simply doesnt make sense because this has nothing to do with Sony.
There are exactly 2 things Sony can do to help "make games better" and thats:
Increase the power so devs can do more than before (which apparently is the wrong approach to Colin)
Make it easier to develop games on the console which Sony have been really focusing on with the PS4 because of the PS3 Cell issues.
Other than that the onus is for devs to make sure games are released in a better state or have new gameplay styles/elements since its them thats actually making the games.
Its like he is blaming Sony saying 'what your doing isnt helping to make games better' when his actual argument is 'devs arent coming up with new ideas or are releasing buggy/problematic games'. Also im getting real tired of the there are still Snes games that are classics point, its true but that is true of every single console in existence. Hell there are games that I would still consider classics on C64 but that doesnt make me think 'gaming is shit and was much better'. Its literally 'things were better in my day' and thats never a factual argument to be made.
There are exactly 2 things Sony can do to help "make games better" and thats:
Increase the power so devs can do more than before (which apparently is the wrong approach to Colin)
Make it easier to develop games on the console which Sony have been really focusing on with the PS4 because of the PS3 Cell issues.
Other than that the onus is for devs to make sure games are released in a better state or have new gameplay styles/elements since its them thats actually making the games.
Its like he is blaming Sony saying 'what your doing isnt helping to make games better' when his actual argument is 'devs arent coming up with new ideas or are releasing buggy/problematic games'. Also im getting real tired of the there are still Snes games that are classics point, its true but that is true of every single console in existence. Hell there are games that I would still consider classics on C64 but that doesnt make me think 'gaming is shit and was much better'. Its literally 'things were better in my day' and thats never a factual argument to be made.
SprachBrooks
Member
The problem with this Sony keynote isn't so much that the product itself (PS4Pro) was bad, but they really did a terrible job communicating what it can do and what it's for.
They just sat there going through the motions saying it can do 4K (maybe) but also do HDR and HDTV. It's confusing to even those that are well-versed in performance related gaming products.
I found it too low-key -- sadly it was a poor attempt at aiming at the gamers and it just made the messaging diffuse. I look forward to clarity around the PS4Pro in the upcoming months however, and I think it can offer a lot; that wholly depends on how the developers choose to utilise the extra horsepower.
They just sat there going through the motions saying it can do 4K (maybe) but also do HDR and HDTV. It's confusing to even those that are well-versed in performance related gaming products.
I found it too low-key -- sadly it was a poor attempt at aiming at the gamers and it just made the messaging diffuse. I look forward to clarity around the PS4Pro in the upcoming months however, and I think it can offer a lot; that wholly depends on how the developers choose to utilise the extra horsepower.
GribbleGrunger
Dreams in Digital
And yet it's been sitting at #01 on Amazon since the pre-orders went live. That suggests a great deal of people got the message.
SprachBrooks
Member
That's not the point -- and they didn't posit the argument this way either.
Yes the average gamer won't know, but the panel should which wouldn't preclude them from mentioning the bolded.
SprachBrooks
Member
We'll see how it sells throughout the year. I wasn't saying it wouldn't sell, I was criticising the messaging; hell I'm glad it'll continue to sell as that'll incentivise more developers to update their games and even I'm thinking of getting one.
wapplew
Member
I mean if their opinion reflect how average gamer think, Sony could be in big trouble.
ST2K
Member
I think Colin had a point about Sony pushing this bizzare hardware angle while completely dropping the ball in game development and using their resources effectively there. I do think he went off the road with the "all games are the same now" point, as games are more diverse than they've ever been, but he seemed to just be speaking out of the emotion of the moment.
Regardless, PS4 Pro will either be useless to a ton of people or make PS4 feel obsolete. I don't see a successful path forward with this for Sony. I guess if it's a half-step for 4K support and they release PS5 in 2018, it'll be alright. But for now, it definitely feels like Old Sony. It's a solution to a problem that virtually no one has. PS4 Slim should have just supported 4K upscaling. Then they could have axed the Pro altogether and skipped the bluster and confusion.
Regardless, PS4 Pro will either be useless to a ton of people or make PS4 feel obsolete. I don't see a successful path forward with this for Sony. I guess if it's a half-step for 4K support and they release PS5 in 2018, it'll be alright. But for now, it definitely feels like Old Sony. It's a solution to a problem that virtually no one has. PS4 Slim should have just supported 4K upscaling. Then they could have axed the Pro altogether and skipped the bluster and confusion.
Forever Changes
Banned
That's the hardcore Gaffers right there.
andythinkpad
Member
This guy is just outage youtube outage-man. Think I will drop the podcast feed.
The average game can keep the OG PS4, buy the new Slim for only $299 or get the Pro if they want better performance. Options are nice.
Clear
CliffyB's Cock Holster
That's the most idiotic rationale I've ever heard! You have to be behind in sales before you freshen/improve your product line?
The arguments for Pro's existence seem no different to me than that for PSVR - a product incidentally that it synergizes well with.