Scorpio isn't their next generation console, it is still tied with this generation and the Xbox One. It can't have exclusive games, unless Microsoft completely backpedals on what they're saying, which isn't foreign to them I suppose.
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PS, I Love You- Greg Miller's new PlayStation Podcast
- Thread starter EdReedFan20
- Start date
Scorpio isn't their next generation console, it is still tied with this generation and the Xbox One. It can't have exclusive games, unless Microsoft completely backpedals on what they're saying, which isn't foreign to them I suppose.
Exactly.
Maybe they do, which I feel would be really bad press wise for having lied about it then. But if thats what they decide to do, then...sure. But then its no longer a "Premium" option. Its a flat out, NEW option.
But, as of right now, that is nothing more than a guess and goes against everything we currently know. So the PS4 Pro vs Scorpio is still the true comparison consoles as opposed to a slim model which is more similar to what we currently have.
That is also a complete guess lol. You can make any uneducated guess you want to say that, but everything they've said so far is both platforms will play the same library of games. And until that's proven false (which it could very well be, I don't know), we have to take them at their word from what they've announced so far.
You can't just materialize scenarios based on a hunch haha.
theindieboy
Member
Hey I enjoyed the episode, but thats me, I regulary disagree with Colins opinions expecially polotics but that does not stop me enjoying hearing him speak, and like my views to be challanged. Having meet him know him to be a nice person and can't understand why so much of the last 2 weeks is aimed at him and not others saying the same thing, but that's just me. Also I think it is improtant to note the PSILU has nothing to do with Pateron (no early access etc) and is monotised via ad reads only.
So I read through every post from Colin's asking for time stamps to his final post. I never saw any name calling or vitriol or any of the other things he said. I saw a few posts mentioning their lack of knowledge on the technical aspects of video games, myself included. If that is what he is referring to it is a valid critique, with you guys saying ps4pro is on par with xbox 1s. I did see multiple posts challenging his points. Someone point to me the type of posts he was referring to in his final post. I just am not seeing them.
No but I can use common sense and stop believing people in suits who are trying to sell me shit.
What do you think of when you think of Xbox One? Failed Kinnect 2.0, always online amd no used games debacle, under powered and overpriced.
MS wants to be as far away from the Xbone One as possible with the Scorpio. They understand how badly the fucked up and are looking for a clean slate. It may be backwards compatible, but I do not believe the Xbox one will stay forward compatible for more than 18 months to 2 years max.
Just as long as you recognize you're inherently making a scenario up.
I can say with 100% honesty, that's not what I think of when I think of the Xbox One lol.
Actually I need someone to sit me down for this one too, I haven't quite figured out what's so hype about For Honour yet but I fully trust the Easy Allies. More crossover between the two would be hype, Brandon last week was cool but I want more.
S and Pro are not comparable.
Exactly what?
"We said we're not going to have console-exclusive games for Project Scorpio. It's one ecosystem--whether you have an Xbox One S or Project Scorpio, we don't want anyone to be left behind, Now, with the power and capabilities we have, we'll be able to do high-fidelity VR. Now, that space, we don't think of that as console gaming, we think of that as high-fidelity VR, and so with the VR experiences those will be new things that you will get on Project Scorpio."
quote from Aaron Greenberg.
No exclusives outside of VR. how is that a new generation and not an iteration. They even went as far as to say it was the end of generations.
"We think the future is without console generations," Greenberg said. "we think that the ability to build a library, a community, to be able to iterate with the hardware -- we're making a pretty big bet on that with Project Scorpio.
"We're basically saying, 'This isn't a new generation; everything you have continues forward and it works.' We think of this as a family of devices."
Again Aaron Greenberg goes as far as to say this isn't a new generation.
And yet they are not doing any of those things. They are not talking about a clean slate. Read the quotes i posted.
I think you're really underplaying the success of the XB1. Yeah, the PS4 is dominating, but the XB1 is still holding its own very well and *is* a success. The average gamer doesn't even know about the DRM drama or really care about Kinect at all. That's why I don't think Microsoft will be ready to cut this generation short next year. There's still a lot of room for growth and they want to build on that, not risk a new separate piece of hardware. That's my take on it anyway.
Bolivar687
Banned
Had to bring this to the front. It's sad because when they transitioned from Podcast Beyond over to KFG, Greg came here saying how he never bought into the negativity other journalists have towards Gaf. We proved them right by taking it as an invitation to impose opinions on them. Greg stopped coming here a while ago and now Colin is likely gone as well. None of you could identify a single objective factual error on his part and instead dragged him over coals because a) he won't admit how technically significant the Pro is, which misses his point entirely, or b) because he thinks Scorpio is a better value proposition, which really says it all.
In reality, the consensus around the Internet and even in other Gaf threads I've seen is that Microsoft positioned Scorpio at E3 much better than Sony did here with the Pro. The messaging was clearer, it's more powerful, and it's not disrupting the console cycle only three years in. If anyone disagrees that's fine but you can't say this is based on misinformation or a lack of research.
Darryl M R
Member
Isn't this incorrect? People did list objective factual errors, like the Ps4Pro being useful for 1080 TVs.
Am I on crazy pills? Are people reading a different thread? There is a large post with timestamps of factual errors.
so no factual error when he and the others say the xbox 1s is on par with the ps4pro? that is a factual error.
Neuromancer
Member
Fantastic, quotes from a PR person. You see how many threads we have here about when people say shit, and then do the opposite? Or just lie.
Neuromancer
Member
Try the Official Playstation Magazine UK podcast. They are knowledgeable and pleasant. It's not every week though.
So you think they are just gonna lie for a year or more? then do another 180? I hope they have learned that doing those kinds of things are the reason they are where they are today.
AquaWateria
Member
I don't blame Colin for not coming to this thread anymore.
I mean after reading the last couple of pages.....yeah it was kinda excessive. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to dismiss some of y'alls posts, but damn some of them are kinda of rough.
I mean after reading the last couple of pages.....yeah it was kinda excessive. Don't get me wrong I'm not trying to dismiss some of y'alls posts, but damn some of them are kinda of rough.
Darryl M R
Member
Are these "rough" posts between Colin's request for feedback and his final post in this thread?
Dirtyshubb
Member
You are indeed correct, many people did reply with factual and logical points but those were all ignored and instead the focus was put on one or two negative posts and the narrative changed to people attacking opinions instead of the points people were actually tackling.
I thought the episode was fine. no one ever has all the facts straight, and theres still a lot of misinformation on here.
Some Facts:
The "processing" box of the PSVR is not a processing box, it's a breakout box. it splits the video signal to the VR headset and the TV. It also handles unwarping the image for the TV, and handles 3D audio to the headset, thats all it does, and that's why it exists. you could put it all into one housing but that may make things way more confusing for buyers and make yet another SKU.
PS4pro is $400, includes a 1TB hard drive and has 2x the flops of a $300 500GB PS4 that you can get with a game. it's position in the market is above an Xbox One S for games, but for media it is slightly below that of the S. imo that's odd.
Scorpio is just an idea at this point but what microsoft has said is that it's not a new platform, or next generation. Microsoft has said that it wont have games that cant be played on the regular Xbox One. Even if you feel like they will change that, that is not their current message. which again is just an idea at this point.
My Opinion:
Sony shouldn't have streamed the meeting like how they didn't stream the PSVR meeting at GDC this year. On paper the Pro is fine, but nothing i feel i need. When my PS4 dies i'll consider getting a pro. Theres nothing wrong with not needing a Pro, you wont be left behind. I don't get upset when they announce new TVs, i'm perfectly fine with my 1080p 55" Vizio. I don't get upset when apple announces the s versions of their phones, hell im not even really impressed with the 7 and i only have a 6. I typically don't spend more than $50 on headphones. If i want something better that doesn't change or limit what i can do it's my choice if i want to upgrade. There's people that will buy it, i'm sure it will do fine, but it's not going to light the world on fire. Frankly i believe over reactions on both side are unnecessary.
Some Facts:
The "processing" box of the PSVR is not a processing box, it's a breakout box. it splits the video signal to the VR headset and the TV. It also handles unwarping the image for the TV, and handles 3D audio to the headset, thats all it does, and that's why it exists. you could put it all into one housing but that may make things way more confusing for buyers and make yet another SKU.
PS4pro is $400, includes a 1TB hard drive and has 2x the flops of a $300 500GB PS4 that you can get with a game. it's position in the market is above an Xbox One S for games, but for media it is slightly below that of the S. imo that's odd.
Scorpio is just an idea at this point but what microsoft has said is that it's not a new platform, or next generation. Microsoft has said that it wont have games that cant be played on the regular Xbox One. Even if you feel like they will change that, that is not their current message. which again is just an idea at this point.
My Opinion:
Sony shouldn't have streamed the meeting like how they didn't stream the PSVR meeting at GDC this year. On paper the Pro is fine, but nothing i feel i need. When my PS4 dies i'll consider getting a pro. Theres nothing wrong with not needing a Pro, you wont be left behind. I don't get upset when they announce new TVs, i'm perfectly fine with my 1080p 55" Vizio. I don't get upset when apple announces the s versions of their phones, hell im not even really impressed with the 7 and i only have a 6. I typically don't spend more than $50 on headphones. If i want something better that doesn't change or limit what i can do it's my choice if i want to upgrade. There's people that will buy it, i'm sure it will do fine, but it's not going to light the world on fire. Frankly i believe over reactions on both side are unnecessary.
Bolivar687
Banned
If you're referring to Planet's time stamped post, there is not a single factual error in it.
Whether current games could be designed for old hardware or what the Pro is comparable to are abstract arguments with different conditions and qualifiers based on someone's perspective. You guys are getting bent out of shape on the teraflop math when they were purely discussing how the products are being positioned in the market and what the messaging takeaways have been.
Similarly, what would make the Pro worthwhile and whether it's smarter to split the base is purely opinion based. There is no definition in any dictionary which could help you misconstrue this as a factual error.
Similarly, the last two points are alleged contradictions which I don't personally find mutually exclusive at all and under no criteria could they be categorized as misinformation.
This is like when Gaf had that minimalist box art thread, there's just some words out there which a great deal of you genuinely don't know what they mean.
Some Nobody
Junior Member
This is true. That said, I'm definitely on the boat that Xbox has given up on the One and will be trying to make Project Scorpio into a new thing. I'll stay on that boat until a few things happen:
- They announce a price higher than $399. If they're aiming at mass audiences and this is a new generation for them, then there's no way they price this out of the range of your average consumer. But if its just for enthusiasts, they can charge what they want so long as they make them feel its worth the money.
- They name it Xbox One ______. If its still got the "One" attached to it, then yeah its definitely a revision. But if they sneak that out of there and it has an entirely different name then they'll start out publishing titles that can run on both but eventually switch over. There's just too much power under the hood not to--everything we know about the Scorpio says its an enormous leap in terms of CPU, GPU, and possibly/probably even RAM. You don't create that much of a leap just to run games at 4K--the Pro's doing that already.
AmuroChan
Member
Then wait 'til they lie to make the argument. Otherwise there's no possible way to have a real discussion when one side is already assuming that Microsoft lied about the Scorpio.
darthsontin
Member
Scorpio is starting to remind me of No Man's Sky. We only have vague notions of what it is, but people keep asserting that they know exactly what it's going to be like and how it works. It's even stranger when it's presented as a hard fact that it will be the exact opposite of the things Microsoft has said so far.
Right, yes, sorry. I meant 4K Blu-ray
Markitron
Is currently staging a hunger strike outside Gearbox HQ while trying to hate them to death
The events of the last week have shown me that a shocking number of people on NeoGAF don't know the difference (not that I'm saying you don't know the difference ofc).
meanspartan
Member
Hey Colin, big fan. Sad to hear you don't wanna come to NeoGaf anymore, I think this is just a particularly bad example of when Gaf can be a bit harsh haha, I hope it doesn't permanently alienate you.
My only quibble is that your argument about gameplay and story improving seems to not be that relevant to the Ps4 Pro's existence. You're not wrong really, but taken to an extreme that's an argument for us not needing any more console generations or improvements.
The Ps4 Pro has a GPU roughly twice as powerful than what is in the OG Ps4, that is a fact we all know. Whether or not developers take advantage of it for anything other than 4k scaling remains to be seen, we only have a small list of games now that will be better at 1080p with framerate and stuff like that.
Ignorant just means you don't know something. It's completely different from being called dumb or Stupid.
Dirtyshubb
Member
Some people really take it as an insult for some reason when all it means is you are commenting on something you don't know about which can be fair to say. Strange really.
H.Cornerstone
Member
Shadows of Mordor with the nemesis system is not possible on PS3/360, which is why it is not in those versions. That is a fact.
Half-Life 2 with the gravity gun is not possible on the PS2/Xbox. This is a fact (in fact it was barely possibly on PS3/360).
The PS4 PRO is closer to the Scorpio in power than the PS4. This a fact.
And you don't see the irony in after a 30 minute rant against how power doesn't make games better getting all giddy with the Bioshock remastered release?
He has acknowledged his ignorance of the technical side of gaming. Has ignorant been used outside of that aspect? He has been commenting on that aspect comparing the pro and 1s. People have been calling him out on that.
Omnistalgic
Member
We could all (including myself) display some more humility. Argument has been pointless last few pages now.
Maybe we should go and play some video games now...🤔
I get annoyed too when well thought out posts get lumped together with the drivel, but it's the nature of forums. Colin has read the good ones guys. Just suggesting a bit of moving on at this point unless he updates.
Maybe we should go and play some video games now...🤔
I get annoyed too when well thought out posts get lumped together with the drivel, but it's the nature of forums. Colin has read the good ones guys. Just suggesting a bit of moving on at this point unless he updates.
Well I'd suggest people look up the definition of the word ignorant.
Wut. You don't see that these two things are not the same?
meanspartan
Member
Not only is that a shitty thing to say, it's also plainly wrong. Colin is clearly either their biggest draw, or second to Greg.
I agree that he overreacted here a bit given that several responses were quite measured and polite, but that's not really a reason to just tear into someone.
mckmas8808
Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
I remember people 4 years ago saying that there's no way the current consoles would have 8 GBs of RAM too.
Could you imagine how confusing that would be! Especially if they think people will be confused over PS4 vs PS4 Pro:
OG PS4 Gamer: "I'd like to buy the PSVR please"
GS Employee: "Would you like the PSVR-Regular, or the PSVR-Pro version?"
OG PS4 Gamer: "What's the PSVR-Pro?"
GS Employee: "It has less auxiliary hardware, the graphics are better, and it costs less?"
OG PS4 Gamer: "Well, I'll take that."
GS Employee: "Do you have a PS4 Pro"?
OG PS4 Gamer: "No"
GS Employee: "Well, you'll need the PSVR-Regular then"
OG PS4 Gamer: "So it costs more for worse graphics?"
GS Employee: "Yup"
OG PS4 Gamer: "Sony is screwing me because I've supported them since the PS4 launch?"
GS Employee: "Yup"
H.Cornerstone
Member
They are. If you don't really care about graphical fidelity/framereate/etc. Why not just go back and play the PS3 version you already own? Why buy a new version that is better looking?
Kenzodielocke
Banned
JStein0222
Member
All of that takes processing power, nothing more. It could all be done internally but that would reduce the amount of resources available to make the games. That's why it exists, not because it has specialized hardware inside that the PS4 doesn't.
BrianRoyale
Member
I'd say that maybe a couple games that I'd say work better on newer tech would be Shadows or Mordor, I'm sure some of that is due to not trying, but man on the ps3 (and to an extant on 360) that game ran at like a steady 14 fps, and no nemesis system, which was a big part of the game. As they put it out that game did not work on last gen.
Also I don't know if Dayz gone would work on last gen, the amount of zombies on screen at one time is amazing. Maybe there are games that had that level of enemies on screen at one time, not totally sure. But it seems to me that the hoards is a big factor in how they want you to experience the game, so if that wasn't there you'd not get what the devs want you to experience.
It might seem like little things but i'd say improved specs could allow new experiences.
That said I'd say that colin is right, I'm sure most Devs don't opt for using more power for new applications in a game, but to make it more pretty. However I can't say that a blanket statement of that only being the case is also right.
Overall I'd on the fence of PS4Pro, I do think it has some things to offer, but is it enough? Not sure. They hands down should not have streamed the announcement, it did them no favors. Just have outlets report on it and then put out the 4K (and HD) screens and videos after.
Also I don't know if Dayz gone would work on last gen, the amount of zombies on screen at one time is amazing. Maybe there are games that had that level of enemies on screen at one time, not totally sure. But it seems to me that the hoards is a big factor in how they want you to experience the game, so if that wasn't there you'd not get what the devs want you to experience.
It might seem like little things but i'd say improved specs could allow new experiences.
That said I'd say that colin is right, I'm sure most Devs don't opt for using more power for new applications in a game, but to make it more pretty. However I can't say that a blanket statement of that only being the case is also right.
Overall I'd on the fence of PS4Pro, I do think it has some things to offer, but is it enough? Not sure. They hands down should not have streamed the announcement, it did them no favors. Just have outlets report on it and then put out the 4K (and HD) screens and videos after.
Bolivar687
Banned
No, those are abstract arguments with a million vantage points to look at and rationalize them. Shadow of Mordor's proprietary Nemesis system could not run on PS3 but Sid Meier's Pirates is a 25+ year old open world action game filled with characters, all of which you could engage in your own procedurally generated narratives.
Half-Life 2 is not a current generation title and you completely glossed over the numerous, inarguably opinion-based positions which Planet attacked.
TheCowboyPoet
Member
JStein0222
Member
That would be incredible, I'd be all:
An episode of HUBER SYNDROME in the Kinda Funny studio and all the guys just sit in the background and watch him work lol
Speculation isn't fact. Scorpio is an iteration of Xbox One. It plays the same products that Xbox One does and unless Microsoft wants another PR disaster they aren't backpedaling. Xbox One S and Pro aren't even close to the same horsepower inside. That's like saying Scorpio and Pro are the same horsepower.
Your whole post is speculation out Colin's ass and that's why people are stating this is misinformation and ignorance.