If they want to push higher resolution/effects/framerates more bandwidth is a requirement.
PS4K information (~2x GPU power w/ clock+, new CPU, price, tent. Q1 2017)
- Thread starter OsirisBlack
- Start date
Why GDDR5X? Couldn't they just use the chips they are using in the PS4 now. Sounds easier, they are not increasing the amount of Ram.
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
So maybe they doubled the bandwidth. I am sure that is possible on the memory controller with the current configuration.
I am also starting to chuck the whole $499 thing out the window. I feel like reverting back to this being the new 'slim/upgrade' all in one.
I thought Nintendo was not competing with the other two? Wasn't that the whole narrative from them and their fans for over a decade now?
Same
I think it'll be more like the PSP 2000 spec upgrade than anything bigger with a strong emphasis on expanded media capabilities.
Negotiator
Banned
Engineering-wise, it's a smarter choice to use GDDR5X and 256-bit than GDDR5 and 512-bit.
You need way more APU pins and traces on the PCB... that's a costly process.
Also, you need 16 chips for 512-bit bus (32-bit x 16). Chassis C revision has 8 chips.
ps: Increasing chips also increases circuit noise. Remember the 4GB 192GB/s -> 8GB 176GB/s speed downgrade?
THE:MILKMAN
Member
I was going to ask the same question about PS4K in the NX thread!
DeepEnigma
Gold Member
I am starting to feel exactly like this. Possibly some tricks to make 4K scale better, etc.. that they evolved from the X1 scaler experience in the Bravia XBR's.
Exactly what I was thinking.
potatohead
Member
As long as they can say looks great (by upscaling) in 4K 95% of the laymen will barely be able to know the difference between what that means.
It'll be 4K to them, and I bet Sony is counting on that.
It'll be 4K to them, and I bet Sony is counting on that.
Negotiator
Banned
Just like XBOX 360 games were 1080p vs 720p on the PS3.
Wut??? Generally speaking Sony 1st and 2nd party games were 720p and higher. The 360 1st and 2nd party games were 720p and lower.
Negotiator
Banned
We were talking about upscaling.
720p upscaled to 1080p -> "XBOX 360 games are better than PS3 games, because my TV says so".
family_guy
Member
Could the secret piece be PS3 chips for BC? A man can dream.
How frustrated will everyone in this threw be after E3 comes and goes and we still don't hear anything else about this thing ? In order to avoid tanking sales at all , it's not likely a ps4K gets announced until PSX in December. So does that mean this thread will continue floating around until next fall ?
My soul would be super cheesed.
Having just sold my PS4 (found a buyer who was willing to pay a stupidly high amount) in anticipation for PS4K, I want a tsunami of news about this thing at E3.
Vanillalite
Ask me about the GAF Notebook
If this is real I don't see them not announcing it before PSVR drops as the whole point seems to be to add in extra HP for VR which has quite a bit of overhead.
This might be reality too.
I'm guessing, if they announce a PS4K that's not going to be out within a month of announcement, they'd probably reduce PS4 price effective immediately after the announcement to keep up the momentum.
You all are setting yourselves up for a big disappointment if you're expecting a big E3 reveal. Everything we know from rumors points to this being fairly early. Hell the CPU hasn't even been locked down yet going by the OP in this thread. Sony's not going to reveal this thing until the can tout its specs, which they love to do.
CPU has been confirmed locked down now midway through thread, also he said later this year, so not super early. Double GPU speed and double CPU speed explains the 100 dollar hike.
Also already confirmed that Sony is heavily leaning towards keeping the ps4 price right where its at.
Mr. Pointy
Member
If Sony want the 4K to maintain a relative amount of compatibility with the OG PS4, it'll have a Puma+ CPU (>2GHz clock) and probably a customised Tonga Pro GPU. I don't think it'll have a full 3.6TF of processing power, but they probably could get 2x performance without going that high with some tweaks.
Who confirmed these two aspects? Do you have a rough estimate of what page(s) this was on?
bitbydeath
Gold Member
Unless they need to announce it before PSVR arrives to let people know the PS4K will receive some PSVR exclusives.
Who confirmed CPU and GPU stuff being locked down? If that's the case, RAM bandwith will have to increase symmetrically to take advantage of the increase in GPU perforamnce to mantain that --- I hate this word: "balance".
2X GPU performance- means 100% performance boosts across the board? So are we looking at a 1080p 30 game officially running at 1080p 60?
2X GPU performance- means 100% performance boosts across the board? So are we looking at a 1080p 30 game officially running at 1080p 60?
This and this is how I see them still
If people that even worked at Sony had no clue and dev kits are known to not be out yet... Y'all are gonna be eating shoes or still carrying on a dead dream
Anytime is still too early then until near the end of a normal cycle
Panajev2001a
GAF's Pleasant Genius
Or at least announce the ps5 with vastly superior performance gains than what this bump is showingJust wait two more years and release PS5 then
tokyocrusher
Banned
I really hope so day 1 buy if you get to play all the ps3 ps plus games
Too late for that my brother and I were going to buy a ps4 before I read about ps4k I told him about it we are not spending a dime until this comes out I am sure we are not alone.
What post confirmed this, I'd like to read it. Also, a 2x performance bump costing an extra $100 makes zero sense. Between architecture improvements and the 14nm die shrink an APU with 2x performance would likely cost less than or very close to what they are paying for their current 28nm APU. The only way a performance bump of that size would increase the cost would be if they are including the old APU to handle compatibility as well as a new APU to be used in games programed for it. But, if that is what they have to do to have compatibility, then they are heading down a potentially very expensive path.
Simply Sami
Member
They are going to have to announce it some time. Unless they do a Apple style release, which I highly doubt.
Popular devices like iPhones still sell very well in August despite new ones usually being announced in September.
They'd give the current PS4 a price cut when they announce it and that should boost sales.
Popular devices like iPhones still sell very well in August despite new ones usually being announced in September.
They'd give the current PS4 a price cut when they announce it and that should boost sales.
JonathanPower
Member
But all those people who already bought a PS4 wanting to upgrade to the deluxe model will produce new sales. And many people who don't care about spending more for the upgraded model will still go for the cheaper base PS4 model.
Or cause confusion which is bad
JonathanPower
Member
If you think about it, there isn't much of a choice; going the hUMA Puma route is the only way, really. An 8 core Zen would be too much expensive and would consume too much power. It would be perfect if they could have an 8 core Puma running at 3GHz though.
bitbydeath
Gold Member
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=199878466&postcount=8963
Compiled with-
OsirisBlack said:
JumPeRJumPzZ
Banned
I really dont think that Sony will reveal that thing at E3.
TheLegendOfMart
Banned
Why would they need the old APU for compatibility?
If they had any sense the new APU would be almost identical architecture wise so all they would do is lock the framerate on PS4 games.
The added cost isn't simply just cost of parts, there are R&D costs as well as a premium price margin.
Indeed - the bigger problem would seem to be 2x memory bandwidth.
Given that it's an AMD chip, it's also possible that the GPU would have adaptive sync over HDMI support.
THE:MILKMAN
Member
Why not a 4 core Zen? Wouldn't that be cheaper and still perform much better than a 8 core Puma?
Currently though, very little of any of the info in this thread or what Kotaku/DF have said makes much sense and in the absence of any additional info nothing more can be gained.
I'm now leaning toward hoping this is just a slim+ with UHD and a refinement of the current APU. I don't think I'd want to pay £350-£430 for a brute force 2X upgrade of the current tech in the APU.
MatthewTrujillo
Banned
The real performance is going to be what the CPU and GPU are going to be clocked at. At higher spec and running cooler I suspect a pretty big performance boost. If only examples of the current PS4 chipset were available running at higher clock speeds I'm sure with that alone we'd see significant performance gains from the dated hardware.
JohnnyFootball
GerAlt-Right. Ciriously.
I haven't gone through this whole thread, but what's the point of upgrading the GPU? I've always been under the impression that the PS4s biggest bottleneck was the CPU. So if they're upgrading the CPU, I'd be excited.
My thoughts on this are this:
It's awesome. As long as new games are being developed to take maximum advantage of PS4 specs and all games remain playable on that system then nobody should have an issue and keeps 100% BC. Leave it up to developers to determine what extra bells and whistles will b added to the PS4K system.
My thoughts on this are this:
It's awesome. As long as new games are being developed to take maximum advantage of PS4 specs and all games remain playable on that system then nobody should have an issue and keeps 100% BC. Leave it up to developers to determine what extra bells and whistles will b added to the PS4K system.
Kremzeek
Member
I'm surprised Sony is not shipping this until after Christmas, in Q1 2017.
You'd think they'd want to have this for holiday spending season.
There's no way they'd announce this until after Christmas then because it would jeopardize OG PS4 sales.
Negotiator
Banned
Going from 8 physical cores to 4 physical cores could potentially break BC...
Btw, is Zen such a power hog?
8 Jaguar cores @ 1.6 GHz consume 30 watts at 28nm lithography. How many watts would an 8-core Zen @ 14nm need?
SneakyStephan
Banned
Why would it break bc?
Zen has SMT so a quad core zen can run 8 threads and the software would never know the difference.
I agree with the person you quoted, a quad core zen would be way more powerful than an 8 core puma.