remember the M2 'Dungeon' or doom-like 1st person demo ?????

X

xexex

Banned
does anyone have images or perhaps even video footage of the 3DO M2 first person 'Dungeon' demo ? also sometimes referred to as the 'Doom' or 'Shooter' demo. circa 1995-96. This demo was either a pre-rendered sequence or real-time sequence on an SGI workstation, simulating the M2's capabilities.

more discription: there was a warrior like monster fighting you. I remember it had a shield. I think maybe the monster blocked the players attack (shot or strike with sword) with that shield. it all took place in a tight cave environment. it was so cool. seemed super smooth, 60fps.

I rememeber seeing this demo on television and being totally blown away, thinking that M2 games would look like this. The quality of this demo sequence was probably around Dreamcast graphics level, probably more than the real M2 could handle.

this demo is probably the 2nd most famous demo for the M2. the most famous would be the "M2 Car Demo" aka
"M2 Racing Demo"


Now that I've researched this more (thus my editing of this post) I can say that both of those M2 demos (Car and Dungeon) were really simulations of M2 on an SGI workstation. supposedly done on-the-fly, realtime, and not prerendered.



Help! I am desperate to find images or video of the 1st person 'Dungeon' demo for M2. I used to have a VHS recording of it back when it was shown off in 95-96 but that's looooong gone.
 
I'm not sure if my memory is serving me correctly, but I think I remember seeing it on that Gamepro TV show.

I might have the wrong name of the show though...
 
btw, gawd! this makes me so fucking upset. a major reason or reasons why we never got the M2 console.

Me too. BTW, the M2 didn't launch because it was too expensive. It was
very competitive price wise (the thing was made up of three chips plus RAM
plus glue so it wasn't expensive at all) but Panasonic got cold feet. They
believed Nintendo was going to dominate the market and they thought
bringing out a unit that was twice as powerful as the N64 (and a lot easier
to develop for) wasn't good enough. They didn't anticipate that cartridges
were going to really stunt the N64's growth. In hindsight, I can safely
say the M2 would have buried the N64 if Panasonic actually launched it.
The reasons are pretty simple. The dev system was dirt cheap and easy to
use (Sony released the Net Yarouze because it got some early info on the
M2's dev system which was essentially an M2 unit with an extra ROM and a
parallel port cable for the PC). A developer familiar with an API like
Glide would be right at home so ports of 3DFX games would be easy. The OS
made streaming a dream. Today I have trouble getting Windoze with a
PII-450 and a TNT card to do what I could on an M2 four years ago. Every
developer that used the final M2 system preferred it to any other console
for ease of development. Unfortunately, everything in the universe (or so
it seemed) conspired to keep the unit off the shelf. The main causes were:

1. Panasonic was overly worried about Nintendo. They couldn't see that
cartridges were going to doom that system to being a (relative) niche
market.
2. Trip Hawkins had a mid-life crisis and wanted to get out of the console
hardware business. He wanted to go back to what he believes he knows best-
games. Of course looking at some of the stinkers coming out of Studio (New
World and Cyclone excluded) you have to wonder. He basically told
Panasonic they would have to pay for any help with M2 (in addition to the
$100 million). Trip wouldn't be evangelizing the system anymore and 3DO
could theoretically nickel-and-dime Panasonic to death. After all, the
braintrust for the M2 was still at 3DO (before being amputated into
Cagent). Panasonic would have to put their faith in something they didn't
invent nor knew all that much about. For all they knew, there could have
been a fatal flaw in the system that wouldn't reveal itself until after
they spent a billion dollars on a launch.
3. The guy who was head of the Interactive Media division of Panasonic
(actually MEI) was retiring shortly after the time M2 was originally to
have launched. Only he could authorize the money (500 million to a billion
dollars) needed to launch the unit. He didn't want to commit his company
to such an expensive venture and then leave. So he didn't do it. His
successor inherited M2 and was reluctant to commit to it since it wasn't
"his baby". He was interested in MX but apparently he couldn't work out a
deal with Cagent (the M2 hardware group) for it. This was probably due to
an arrogant individual at Cagent who shall remain nameless who said "I
don't like MEI's table manners, so I don't want to deal with them." I
swear to God that I'm not making the last sentence up!

These are, I feel, the main reasons we never saw the M2. Scary isn't it?
It wasn't technology or costs or the market. It was key individuals that
deprived the world of a great game console. We often hear how an
individual can have a profound impact for good on the rest of the world (or
at least a large chunk of it). If it weren't for John Carmack, game
developers be doomed to using an inferior version of Direct3D for game
development instead of having a choice (Thanks, John!). Unfortunately, an
individual can bring an equally negative effect on the world. An
individual can undo the work of thousands of man-years with the stroke of
pen. Remember that when you work on a project. Don't let a few
individuals (if you can) undo what you and your fellow workers have slaved
months and years for.

Don't even get me started on how the M2/Sega deal fell through.
Click to expand...


FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK YOUUUUUUUUU arrogant Cagent guy!

:(
 
M2 was much, much, more impressive than the PSX or Saturn.
Click to expand...


indeed it was. the M2 was more powerful than PS1, Saturn and N64 combined.


M2 was probably around 1/6 to 1/3 as powerful as Dreamcast, very impressive for 95-96.
 
there was an M2 racing demo / car demo, shown at E3 1995 which looked awfully pre-rendered and was claimed by 3DO to be a realtime simulation done on an SGI workstation, with M2's limitations & capabilities taken into account on the SGI.

later, in 1997 there was the totally unrelated IMSA Racing, a real racing game for M2, covered by Next Generation Online, NG Magazine, GameFan and no doubt other media

IMSA Racing for M2 - 30fps 640x480 doesnt look terribly impressive but...
racere3b.jpg




i'm looking for pictures and/or video of the M2 simulations from 1995, the "Car Demo" aka "Racing Demo" aka "M2 Racing" and the 1st person "Dungeon Demo"
 
What was the one action adventure game that takes place in a snow-covered village? It was really ugly.
Click to expand...

that was Power Crystal, and it was not ugly. well, not that scene anyways.

pcrystale.jpg



the ugly part you almost *have* to be thinking of, was the close-up of one of the monsters, an orc.

img121.gif



still, the other screens show that M2 was indeed powerful, since it was pulling this off at 60fps, and this was when M2 was still a single PowerPC 602 CPU system. later upgraded to twin PowerPC 602s.
 
btw, the Xbox 2 / Xenon probably has some M2 dna in it. PowerPC CPUs and input/patents from Microsoft, who owns the guys who built M2 and its sucessor, MX. as well as owning the MX technology itself.
 
Sure, I've said it before...but if you look at the actual released M2 games, you wouldn't be so impressed with the hardware. :)

I'll ask one of my friends what he thought of developing on the M2, curious to see what he thought of it...
 
yeah those Konami M2 arcade games were not too impressive, but that does not mean a whole lot. we see crappy software on ANY platform, even the best hardware.


btw, here's what really got me stoked about Power Crystal and M2

from Intelligent Gamer magazine:

One exceptional title under development off site is what is being described by IG sources as the first-ever virtual reality RPG, Power Crystal. According to those who
have witnessed the game in motion, the early version of the graphics engine is blazingly fast despite its use of beautiful visual effects: You can walk up to the shore line of a river or lake and see glimmering translucent water splashing the shoreline without polygon breakup, and you can then look into the water and see pebbles and sedimentary rocks in the basin. Early versions allow the player to fully walk around and explore a village.
Click to expand...

technically it would've been a Zelda OoT killer. technically. so I would've loved it if Nintendo had gotten ahold of M2 and made a follow-op to OoT on it, instead of MM on N64.
 
xexex said:
yeah those Konami M2 arcade games were not too impressive, but that does not mean a whole lot. we see crappy software on ANY platform, even the best hardware.
Click to expand...

Proof's in the pudding, in my opinion. Personally, I don't see why anyone would get worked up over games that were never released for a platform that was barely released...
 
Proof's in the pudding, in my opinion. Personally, I don't see why anyone would get worked up over games that were never released for a platform that was barely released...
Click to expand...

well in truth, we hardly even got to taste the pudding. we did not see the potential of M2 other than from the unreleased games like Power Crystal. the Konami stuff looks like PS1 or PS1+ and I'll bet they were coded by Konami's least proficient teams, with little time or money spent.
 
I remember seeing that FPS running on M2... I was blown away by the graphics and the action on the screen. It was 60fps and had, at the time, a very interesting kind of first person view. The camera kind of bobbed and swayed... looked like you could have got motion sickness. Wish I could see some pics.
 
I remember seeing that FPS running on M2... I was blown away by the graphics and the action on the screen. It was 60fps and had, at the time, a very interesting kind of first person view. The camera kind of bobbed and swayed... looked like you could have got motion sickness. Wish I could see some pics
Click to expand...


we might be thinking of the same demo, or maybe different ones. but either way, I want to see some pics like you, and even if possible, a video. probably asking too much though :/
 
*cries inside*

I remember being so hyped for this thing when it was announced as an add-on..I'd stare at the expansion slot on my Goldstar 3D0 for hours at a time just dreaming of the power it would afford me.

It seemed like a great way to keep the 3D0 alive and provide a kind of "premium" gaming option for those of us willing to spend the bucks. Makes it all the more heartbreaking now to hear how close it was to fruition.
 
another Power Crystal town screen
Power_Crystal_08.jpg




btw, a pretty hefty amount of M2 pics & info
http://tuvgm.free.fr/Dossiers/3DO/

still, not what i am looking for. (E3 1995 M2 simulations)


heh... it's funny. we say that M2 did not come out...but it did....just not in the way many of us wanted.... instead of being like a Playstation....M2 was released in the form of some 'meh' arcade games, and as a multimedia / industrial / educational 'tool'.


The M2 System offers a vast array of applications, including:

* Public Information and Display Terminals - By effectively combining sound, still images and full-motion video with 3-D computer graphics, the M2 enables retail stores and malls to highlight sales and events with eye-popping results. Public facilities can display directions, schedules and other vital information and services with interactive capability and complete reliability.

* Sales Promotion and Exhibit Presentations - The M2's superb graphics and MPEG1 full-motion video capabilities allow for incredibly impressive and effective sales presentations. It is also ideal for directories and exhibit information at museums, art galleries and showrooms. In both cases, it is easy to set-up and use, and offers trouble-free operation.
* Education - The M2 can be used as an internet terminal and video server for schools or industry. Its startlingly clear color images enable it to display life-like images and graphics that help enhance the learning experience.
* Virtual Reality Simulation - For exercise and physical therapy, operation of industrial robotics, automotive or flight instruction, and other circumstances where realistic simulations are desired, the M2 provides virtual-reality interactivity.
* 3-D Viewing - When used in manufacturing operations, realistic images of machine parts make them easier to identify. Thanks to the M2's high-performance 3-D graphic processing, images of products and components can be displayed and freely manipulated to show and examine a part's dimensions.
* Housing Design - The M2 can produce a realistic display of building exteriors, even while still in the design stage, as well as floor plans and interiors in 3-D with virtual walk-through. These simulations during the design and layout stage of a building are a dramatic and valuable aid in displaying precisely what the finished product will look like, long before the first board has gone up.
Click to expand...


all this, yet too CHICKEN SHIT to take on Sony

.....Matsushita fuckwits

[.....]
 
I think I still have screenshots of M2 tech demos in an old magazine somewhere, and I think it has a screenshot of the FPS dungeon game you're talking about, I clearly remember a red dragon-like monster in a very detailed room... I could theoritically look for it and scan them, but it would be somewhat of a hassle and my schedule is tight today, so maybe in a day or two if you still want them badly.
 
Ok I found the magazine(s), the FPS demo looks much better than anything seen on Dreamcast IMO, not in polygon counts, but in texture resolution and image quality, also the monster model looks like it's bumpmapped! I would say it's very safe to assume that was completely prerendered on an SGI and not indicative of what the M2 was really capable of. Some aspects of it look too good even by today's standards.

Sorry I can't scan them right now, but will do so later if nobody else does until then.
 
poly_a.png

*strokes Polystars*

M2 - i won't let anyone hurt you....

The game looks really nice , 60fps *most* of the time (a weird glitch where it pauses for a split second or two especially when turning and panning), nice smooth 3d graphics, game is fairly decent too...
 
If it really was that much more impressive than PSX and Saturn, don't you think it would've been much more expensive too?
 
Kiriku said:
If it really was that much more impressive than PSX and Saturn, don't you think it would've been much more expensive too?
Click to expand...

No, the design was really well done: some key PlayStation 2 people at SCEI have had some M2 knowledge, btw (or so I have heard... at least in team Nishi).
 
Ok I have 3 screenshots from the 1st person M2 "Dungeon" demo, they're digital camera shots not scans (can't be bothered to install scanner), but they look very good (I resized and color adjusted them to look as close to the print as possible), but I can't host them anywhere online, so if someone is willing to host and post them in this thread, PM me an email address to send them to.
 
M2 would've been interesting. It could have dominated the market, because at the time, not all third-parties were firmly entrenched in Sony's camp.

Enix was still backing Nintendo, but eventually would leave.

Capcom was kinda split between the Saturn/PSX.

Squaresoft might have sided with Panasonic over Sony seeing as how M2 was far more powerful than the Playstation.

Namco would've loved that chipset, with the Dreamcast still a ways off it would've given them the ability to do almost arcade perfect ports.

When was the M2 supposed to launch? 1997? I believe the GameCube also has some remnants of M2 tech inside of it.
 
Naked Snake hooked me up with the images. Here ya go -

M2FPS1.jpg

M2FPS2.jpg

M2FPS3.jpg


Looks pretty good for a circa Dreamcast era FPS.
Particularly the middle one.
Obviously a very early build though.
 
I sent off a PM just to be sure, but I think they'll check.

In other news, wasn't this system featured pretty heavily just before NextGen magazine went bye-bye? I seem to remember some of these shots from somewhere, and I wasn't on the net then, and my only real videogame info came from that mag.

Ahh.. the good days.
 
For the record, these shots come from a short-lived UK magazine called "Ultimate Future Games", published by Future Publishing (same house as Edge), I really really loved that mag and used to buy every issue, but the plug was pulled on it when it was less than 3 years old I think, the Editor in Chief, Markus Hawkings, moved on to Computer & Video Games.

Anyone else read UFG back in the day?
 
Naked Snake - wow thanks! I remember this. yet now, this has made me realize that there was yet another demo. it was more like an AD&D dungeon with an orc-like creature and i think either it or the guy you played had a shield.

or maybe my memory is completely fucked..

anyway, thanks a bunch for putting these images online :D
 
When was the M2 supposed to launch? 1997? I believe the GameCube also has some remnants of M2 tech inside of it.
Click to expand...

M2 was supposed to launch first possibly as early as late 1995. definitally for fall 1996, then delayed to 1997 and sometime in 1997 it was cancelled as a games console.

I might be wrong, but I think GameCube's only real shared techology with M2 was the PowerPC architecture.

before Nintendo went with ArtX for graphics, Nintendo was working with M2's beefy brother, the MX, and wanted MX to be combined with MIPs CPU instead of M2/MX's PowerPC CPUs. this would have been N2000 launch in fall of 1999 in Japan. the deal with Samsung and CagEnt (3DO Systems) fell through and Nintendo went to ArtX.

ArtX's Flipper GPU has embedded RAM and MX was supposed to also have embedded RAM.

there are probably many things I don't know about how these chipsets are all related or unrelated. yeah I think there is some M2/MX heritage in GameCube.
 
xexex said:
yeah those Konami M2 arcade games were not too impressive, but that does not mean a whole lot.
Click to expand...

Which Konami arcade games were these?

M2 was another one of those Sega "what if's?" that I always look back on with a small sense of wonder. From all accounts they were right on the brink of acquiring it, before the deal fell through. I imagine at least a few people know the story behind it. Still not sure how it would've been sold though...a Saturn upgrade didn't really seem feasible, and releasing it as a standalone would've been a tough sell over here a mere two years after the Saturn (nevermind the Sega CD/32X stuff).
 
:lol Quality stuff. :lol As much as I disliked their Cobra stuff, it obviously ate that shit for lunch.

I always thought that M2's version of D2 looked better then the DC version, at least from what I saw of it.
 
Ned Flanders said:
*cries inside*

I remember being so hyped for this thing when it was announced as an add-on..I'd stare at the expansion slot on my Goldstar 3D0 for hours at a time just dreaming of the power it would afford me.

It seemed like a great way to keep the 3D0 alive and provide a kind of "premium" gaming option for those of us willing to spend the bucks. Makes it all the more heartbreaking now to hear how close it was to fruition.
Click to expand...

we were a lot alike heh, i was a 3do diehard fan. when m2 never came i left consoles for the pc until xbox brought me back. it was very upsetting heh.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

Resident Evil Requiem - hand on previews (1st and 3rd person perspective option confirmed)
2 3 4 5
212
1K
Project EVE replied
Labyrinth of the Demon King released today - King's Field-esque retro first person horror dungeon crawler (PC, PS, Xbox, Switch)
2
79
1K
TerribleAtThisGame replied
  • Poll
DOOM 2016 OR DOOM ETERNAL
2 3 4 5
201
9K
DryvBy replied
Game Sack: The Games of M2
Analysis Trailer Game Dev 
6
144
buenoblue replied
  • Locked
We are like one person, how does it affect you
1
93
Calverz replied
Top Bottom