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Republique Kickstarter by Ryan Payton - NOW FOR PC AND MAC! [Ended, $555K funded]
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HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
I have a problem with any Kickstarter that says "this is the base amount that we need in order to do this" because they never, ever take into consideration fees or rewards.
It's a sure-fire way to fail.
Anyone who has put more than 5 seconds of thought into their Kickstarter rewards and goal has accounted for this. You seriously think they make up all these rewards, then later on realize "oh fuck we have to make those things? And they cost money? Kickstarter takes 9% too?"
What are you basing this claim on?
It's more of a consideration for this Kickstarter though, because Apple demands a 30% cut on all the App Store revenue. Apple isn't going to give Payton & Company hundreds of thousands worth of Free Download codes and allow Camoflaj to completely circumvent their own rake on the revenue. It may have come up in this thread already in this thread and I missed it, but this aspect hasn't really been addressed AFAIK.
The capricious nature of Apple's App Store policies makes me rather apprehensive. In theory Apple should only demand $3 for every download code issued, but there isn't much to stop them from demanding for 1/3 of the entire $500,000 raised....or at the very least 1/3 of the average donation. Nobody knows what their reaction to crowd-sourcing will be. Have the developers considered Apple's demands as of yet? What has been the policy for other iOS projects launched on Kickstarter?
The capricious nature of Apple's App Store policies makes me rather apprehensive. In theory Apple should only demand $3 for every download code issued, but there isn't much to stop them from demanding for 1/3 of the entire $500,000 raised....or at the very least 1/3 of the average donation. Nobody knows what their reaction to crowd-sourcing will be. Have the developers considered Apple's demands as of yet? What has been the policy for other iOS projects launched on Kickstarter?
Apple met with the team and told them their options before they launched the Kickstarter. It's in their Kickstarter FAQ. They don't demand 1/3 of every app's budget.
Put my bit it. Love the look of Journal so I kicked in 50 + 10 (for O/S delivery) for the PC edition.
Loved Ryans work on MGS4, including his podcast efforts and the trailer for Republique looks quite amazing for what was an iOS game. I enjoy the premise of the story and setting. Lets hope it gets funded
Loved Ryans work on MGS4, including his podcast efforts and the trailer for Republique looks quite amazing for what was an iOS game. I enjoy the premise of the story and setting. Lets hope it gets funded
Wiktor
Member
You're creating generalizations without enough data to make them credible and then ignoring everything that doesn't fit with your theory.
Projects that want to go over 1mln definitely seem to need a lot of nostalgia and incredibly stong one to add, but saying you can't reach 500K without that is flat out wrong. Banner Saga had no nostalgia behind it or recognizable developers, it just looked that awesome. Same with Yogventures!, it's on track to go a lot over 500K solely because people find it's writers funny.
Trying to explain Republique's failure by lack of nostalgia is simply wrong and other projects have proven. It's failing because it started as iOS-only project, nothing more. To this day every single big successful kickstarter project has been PC-centric. So why would you ignore the fact that ambitious non-PC centric projects are flopping left and right right now? Republique isn't the only one. Console-based Class of Heroes II also crashed and burned.
Wiktor
Member
I don't like Apple and I don't like mobile gaming. So why would I ever support project that's not for PC? Do you think iOS gamers are so worthless they can't even fund one decent kickstarter and instead would rather rely on money from people who don't even own iOS device? Great logic
MrCunningham
Member
michaelius
Banned
Why would someone who doesn't have iOS device donate to make iOS only game ?
kruis
Exposing the sinister cartel of retailers who allow companies to pay for advertising space.
With Kickstarter projects, it's not really a donation. People are actually pre-ordering a product that wouldn't have existed otherwise. PC gamers aren't going to pre-order games that require an iPhone or Ipad.
Not just nostalgia, but fitting into a genre with a strong existing following.
Yogventures absolutely has "recognizable developers", given the size of their YouTube audience - not sure what you're talking about there.
I'm not sure why you'd call CoHII "ambitious," though.
Wiktor
Member
Except stealth is such genre :]
Except they never made a game in their life and have zero idea how to do it. Also..Banner Saga had no recognizable devs, in this area they were even worse than Yogventures, and yet they succeeded. Using your logic it should have been impossible. How come they succeeded, while Republique is failing?THe only real difference between those two projects is target platforms.
Money. It was simply the first big Kickstarter that was aimed at console audience
diffusionx
Gold Member
Class of Heroes 2 crashed and burned because it is a sequel to a terrible game and a poorly thought out Kickstarter that was asking for a huge amount of money.
I don't think it has anything to do with iOS. I think it's because Camouflaj is an unknown developer and Logan is an unknown shop too. They might be full of well-regarded people but they certainly didn't go out of their way to tout that. Look at how Banner Saga name-dropped everybody.
Confidence Man
Member
I think it would've failed even if it were a PC project. The interface seems interesting but visually it looks generic, a targeted 4-6 hour playtime is pretty short, and touting it's accessibility is pretty much the opposite direction you want to go in if you want to appeal to an audience that feels underserved and is ready to part with cash to see something materialize.
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
It can be either or both, if it was just a pre-order nobody would pay more than the lowest possible amount either for the digital or boxed releases. Someone giving hundreds or thousands clearly isn't only preordering, the same goes for someone who would be content with just the game but wants to help a little more (but can't afford thousands) and so goes for a different tier that may or may not have goodies fully justifying it as a price (ie, I pledged $65 for the normal boxed Wasteland 2 copy, which is what, double the price of any boxed PC game I've previously bought, including AAA releases, which this most certainly isn't going to be).
I don't think it looks at all generic, and 4-6 hours is like, Portal fine, with a similar enough asking "price" for people who really want it to feel like a pre-order. I don't know if it would have failed or not, but I'm sure it would have been surrounded with much more positive discussion. The TA shit would have never happened, their adamant stance of being iOS only would not have soured anyone, the first impressions would have focused on it being a rather great looking indie game with a unique premise, etc. Even though PC outlets are doing the latter now, like RockPaperShotgun, the user comments are still filled with doubt over the previous shit that happened (again, imo, not justified to that degree, it's one thing to doubt a new developer and another to claim they can't be trusted, are evil, etc, just because they stumbled a bit when deciding platforms, but it's how people feel so, whatever).
Father_Brain
Banned
With this kind of highly abstract control scheme where you have no direct control over the protagonist, and no killing to boot? No, no it isn't.
michaelius
Banned
Banner Saga devs have work at Bioware in their life - and even better they are ex-Bioware stuff - aka the guys who made good Bioware games before company went to emo shooters with branching dialogue lines
(this probably is nowhere near truth but such emotion certainly exist).They also had screenshots and gameplay so the solid base showing game is in development.
I still want to see more of the game outside of that initial trailer. Have they even shown how the game controls yet? It seemed like a big part of the pitch was the way it controls, but I think all they've said is that it will be perfect for touch, and they tell instead of show.
I think they need to show why the game would be fun to play, not how they plan on spending money on motion capture and voice actors. Its kind of like all those videos for Heavenly Sword that highlighted all the motion capture that went into the game--its interesting to some people, but most gamers are probably interested in how something plays, and whether it will be fun or not.
I think that's especially important when they're trying to introduce non-traditional elements--you're not controlling the main character, its stealth via communication, and there's no killing. Interesting premise--but show people that it will be fun to play. Is it a puzzle game wrapped with stealth/action elements and a high production budget, or is it something more?
I think they need to show why the game would be fun to play, not how they plan on spending money on motion capture and voice actors. Its kind of like all those videos for Heavenly Sword that highlighted all the motion capture that went into the game--its interesting to some people, but most gamers are probably interested in how something plays, and whether it will be fun or not.
I think that's especially important when they're trying to introduce non-traditional elements--you're not controlling the main character, its stealth via communication, and there's no killing. Interesting premise--but show people that it will be fun to play. Is it a puzzle game wrapped with stealth/action elements and a high production budget, or is it something more?
Alexios
Cores, shaders and BIOS oh my!
Republique has shown more in game content tbh. Not explaining the gameplay but I don't know how Banner Saga will play either, especially outside the battles, all I can do is speculate. I don't think that sentiment you claim exists. All they ever mentioned is working on The Old Republic, hardly the stuff CRPG fans have in mind. Their Kickstarter page didn't even mention Bioware. It's reaching to claim they're anywhere near having a wanted IP like Wasteland or Shadowrun or known developers like Double Fine. It's no more known or loved that they're "ex-Bioware" than the ties this project has to Metal Gear Solid or whatever.Banner Saga devs have work at Bioware in their life - and even better they are ex-Bioware stuff - aka the guys who made good Bioware games before company went to emo shooters with branching dialogue lines
They also had screenshots and gameplay so the solid base showing game is in development.
diffusionx
Gold Member
I think the Banner Saga thing succeeded in part because they put that really nice art upfront. I don't think it's any insult to say that gamers can get excited about peripheral stuff and that art had a really lovely look that was reminiscient of the old Warcraft 2/Adventures stuff. Also the fact that they were fairly vague on everything outside of the battles tells me that they were leaving it up to their fans' imaginations to fill in the gap - which is the best way of PR, sometimes.
On the other hand, the Republique one made a big deal of their CG, their grand "vision" to push gaming boundaries, filled with utterly rote stuff about nonsexualized heroines and dystopian worlds. It just reminded me of those Ion Storm-esque studios that rose up in the 1990's and went bankrupt a few years later. Just make a damn game!
Interfectum
Member
they get no money and hang their heads in shame
Haunted
Member
On the backer side, no one is charged.
On the developer side, the project is either cancelled or (especially when an established studio is involved) they try their luck pitching the project to traditional publishers/investors until the money runs out.
Vyse The Legend
Member
According to Ryan, this Kickstarter was supposed to "prove" that there's demand for a title of this nature. Sadly, it seems this endeavor blew up in their faces; traditional publishers may take this as an ill omen and avoid it like the plague.
Not likely, I reckon. A game that can drum up $150k in nothing but Kickstarter support (probably at least $200k by the end of it) isn't going to be shrugged off by publishers. That's a lot of money they'd be leaving on the table.
Haunted
Member
They went big and ambitious with their goal. High risk, high reward.
Well, it all depends on how you look at it. The Kickstarter failed. They asked for a specific amount of money hoping to prove that the audience is there, and they didn't get it. On the other hand, this project has managed to get more money pledged than pretty much all other iOS gaming Kickstarters currently running and recently ended combined.
I don't know which side of the argument publishers/investors will land on, but Ryan sounded positive when talking about their previous financial discussions, so I personally think the game will get made either way, mabe not in this form, maybe not with this scope, but Republique will be finished in some form.
But here I am writing as if it's already over. There's still time left.
$150k really isn't much.
Especially considering the people that backed it are the ones that really really want it.
For a game with a planned budget of 1 mil? It's a fair amount. The Kickstarter was obviously mismanaged but any publisher with a brain can see that this is a game that already has a relatively huge amount of mindshare, with all the coverage it's gotten.
The one problem I fear is that the publishers may likely force them to sway from the original vision of keeping iOS as lead platform, since PC is obviously safer. I wouldn't mind this personally but it would be a shame for Ryan and his team.
LSauchelli
Member
Is it just me or are the rewards a little weird? If I pledge $15 I'm pledging more than $10, so I should have the iOS version along with the desktop version, right? So why at $20 the reward is both, iOS+Desktop?
JoshuaJSlone
Member
Saw this on Twitter:
For many projects each reward tier is a superset of the one before it, but that's not always the case. Here, people who want only one version of the game have cheaper choices, or can go the $20 if they want both.LSauchelli said:
Wiktor
Member
Banner Saga devs have work at Bioware in their life - and even better they are ex-Bioware stuff - aka the guys who made good Bioware games before company went to emo shooters with branching dialogue lines
They also had screenshots and gameplay so the solid base showing game is in development.
They were at BioWare Austin and only made the loathed Old Republic
Stoic really won people over on the strenght of their pitch and how well it was aimed.
Republique had the most game-like promotional video out of any big Kickstarter project, they just failed to excite people, because they went iOS only.
Funny thing is, there have been numerous older PC games of this type (ie..you're the man behind camera helping the NPC)
B_Rik_Schitthaus
Banned
There are rumours that a post Jobs Apple will be far more front footed when it comes to games,
the best thing that could happen to this project is to be brought it and made a showpice for the ipad like IF was.
So if they're recruiting people at this stage, where it's almost a given the KS won't go through, I wonder if they know they'll release the game with or without the KS funding. If so that's good for them.
slaughterking
Member
And those 150k are heavily inflated by the higher pledges, too. If we remove those higher donations, which would obviously not exist if the game was only sold through traditional means, the KS would be at 39,700$.
Father_Brain
Banned
Here's hoping.
Well, I guess he's pretty hot on static third-person cameras!
FieryBalrog
Member
So, not these guys.
JoshuaJSlone
Member
He is, though I'm not sure what his regular role is. In the case of Republique, it basically sounds like they drafted him to get input from one of the world's leading Resident Evil experts.
He writes more about it here.HP_Wuvcraft
Banned
Besides Fiery's post, I should have worded my original post better. 99% of the campaigns that I see that make these claims ("this is how much it will cost to make the game") don't talk about how much they'll need to cover fees and rewards as well as hit their target. So there are going to be people that would have donated, but they see that they have hit their required target, so they don't.
There are plenty of more examples than Fiery's post. Kickstarter is not free money, but unfortunately, some people think it is.
Why would someone donate their money to help fund someone's dream? You're right, that sounds completely foolish. Other people helping out other people for nothing in return.
Dog Problems
Banned
Sure, if someone has poor health or suffered some other unfortunate incident. But for a fucking video game*? I'd better be able to play if it I'm to support it.
*exception being if the game does something like help autistic kids, as one game did on Kickstarter. But I guess that falls under "unfortunate incident."
Zeouterlimits
Member
cvxfreak working on Republique?
Excellent news! Even more excited now.
In other news, it's Ryan's birthday today, so Happy Birthday Ryan!
Excellent news! Even more excited now.
In other news, it's Ryan's birthday today, so Happy Birthday Ryan!
AgentCooper
Member
For those of you waiting to see direct feed of the game, a little birdy told me it might be happening soon. Like hopefully tomorrow soon.
And then the birdy flew away.
And then the birdy flew away.
Ice cold.
MrCunningham
Member
Well, pledging has really slowed down on this one...
And 10 days to go too.
And 10 days to go too.
Vyse The Legend
Member
Yeah, they took too long to announce the ports. The PC/MAC announcement seems to have led to a much higher daily average compared to the two weeks prior. If they had gotten in front of it sooner, they'd still be behind, but not disastrously so (as they are now).
Lasthope106
Member
There are kickstarters I want to support. This is not one of them. I'm glad it's up to the fan to decide what gets made through this model. Had this been a PC/Mac game from the beginning they would already have been above a million easily.