GeekyDad
Member
Just search around for enemies to kill.
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Resident Evil Revelaitons |OT| 3D Jill Sandwiches
- Thread starter cvxfreak
- Start date
Just search around for enemies to kill.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
I just finished chapter 3.
In other news...Raid mode? Super fucking fun.
The boss fight was meh. It was a lot of shooting. Not because he needed a lot of bullets (gas tank + fully charged melee = win), but because of all the stupid other enemies.
I stand by my argument that this game is good, but not RE2 good. This much shooting bothers me in a RE game, which is probably why I won't grab the new one coming out for PS3/360.
I stand by my argument that this game is good, but not RE2 good. This much shooting bothers me in a RE game, which is probably why I won't grab the new one coming out for PS3/360.
In other news...Raid mode? Super fucking fun.
lazybones18
Banned
About to try out Raid Mode for the first time
Should I bother trying to buy all the weapons & upgrades with the amount of BP I have or should I wait?
Should I bother trying to buy all the weapons & upgrades with the amount of BP I have or should I wait?
GeekyDad
Member
LOL
I can't imagine that anyone would suggest such a thing. And honestly, Resident Evil 4 and beyond are different games, there's no getting around that. Comparing these modern action games to the very adventure-centric REs of old is almost apples and oranges.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
I agree, believe you me.
I guess it's me more saying that if Capcom can really figure out how to bring the RE series back to true survival horror and not the action game genre, I think they'll really be onto something amazing.Mm managed to finish chapter 3 and liking the game a lot more now. The ship segment is the real game and the flashbacks/forwards just simple hollow filler. I wish they'd leave that stuff completely off. The first boss was quite fun and pretty strong too...
And I think I've missed the shotgun...
And I think I've missed the shotgun...
GeekyDad
Member
I agree, believe you me.
I don't even think it's a matter of them figuring out "how to bring the RE series back to true survival horror," but simply realizing that a lot of fans want that.
Or do they...
I mean, a lot of us do, but I'm guessing Capcom are merely tracking sales. In an instant-gratification world, will the mainstream bother with a more classic-style RE? I don't think they forgot how to make a great survival-horror game; I'm thinking they don't feel confident enough people want one over the more action-focused games. ORC is, at the very least, a good indication of what they think people want.
Davey Cakes
Member
I figured you'd feel better about it as you continued playing. The first three chapters let on the feeling that the ratio of non-ship to ship segments is larger than it is, but in reality the non-ship (or non-Jill/Parker) parts are a small part of the overall experience.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
This is something I was actually wondering...Would a true survival horror do well in this market? I think Amnesia did pretty amazingly via Steam, but that's the PC market, which I'm pretty sure is an entirely different animal.
Davey Cakes
Member
If Capcom developed it with a reasonable budget (more like Revelations than RE6), a true survival/horror Resident Evil game could definitely be successful. Hell, I think just a worldwide fanbase of oldschool RE fans would support a game like that, never mind a potential new audience.
lazybones18
Banned
Up to Stage 9 in Raid Mode....that Pale Rider man
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
In chapter 3? If so, spoiler alert.
Take it - it's the best way to wreck the chapter boss.
Had two glitches in stage 18 while playing online co-op.
The first happened when there was a bridge you need to cross, but instead of my character crossing, I clipped through the bridge and fell down to the water below. There wasn't any ladder to climb back up as the player is clearly not supposed to be down there. Had to quit :/
The second happened with a different partner the next day on the same stage at the part when a sword guys bursts through the flames at the bottom of a ledge. My partner tried to quickly turn the valve to turn off the steam but he got interrupted. Once we killed the sword guy I turned the valve and the steam dissipated but I still couldn't get through but my partner could. The steam was gone but the game acted as if it was still there, my character would walk up to it and get hit buy it. Once again, since there is no direct voice chat, I couldn't tell my partner was was happening and I had to quit. I tried everything.
It sucks having to quit after making it halfway through a stage only to have a glitch impede your progress. And you get nothing even though it was the games fault.
The first happened when there was a bridge you need to cross, but instead of my character crossing, I clipped through the bridge and fell down to the water below. There wasn't any ladder to climb back up as the player is clearly not supposed to be down there. Had to quit :/
The second happened with a different partner the next day on the same stage at the part when a sword guys bursts through the flames at the bottom of a ledge. My partner tried to quickly turn the valve to turn off the steam but he got interrupted. Once we killed the sword guy I turned the valve and the steam dissipated but I still couldn't get through but my partner could. The steam was gone but the game acted as if it was still there, my character would walk up to it and get hit buy it. Once again, since there is no direct voice chat, I couldn't tell my partner was was happening and I had to quit. I tried everything.
It sucks having to quit after making it halfway through a stage only to have a glitch impede your progress. And you get nothing even though it was the games fault.I think i'm on chapter 4, but it could be 3. I've been playing this chapter on and off for about 3 days (lots of college work), so I don't remember.
I'm at the part where you go to find a key, and on the way you're supposed to look for Raymond's partner. I think she's the girl you witness being killed earlier in the game in the crew quarters.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
Maybe that is four...I can't remember. Strategy spoiler...
But that's where I was thinking. That weapon is awesome for the boss. You can just unload on her and it will be pretty ezmode (stop shooting when she screams and starts running at you...she's retreating).
Alright sounds good. What weapon should I switch it out for?
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
I switched it for the shotgun. I'll switch back later, but I didn't need it for what I spoiler tagged.
Yea true. I find the pistol to be very reliable, but right now it isn't dealing as much damage as i'd like it too, and it isn't really good for crowd control at all, so I may trade the pistol for the smg.
woo and indeed hoo
Banned
It doesn't really matter as you do not 'lose' any weapons that you decide to swap out for a new one. Any weapon you have is automatically available in the weapon chests. So, for example, you could drop your pistol in order to pick up the sniper rifle and from that point on both of these will always be available to you in the weapon chests if you do not currently have either equipped.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
Oh also, I would consider using damage+ custom parts on the handgun. You could toss them on the rifle for a really large boost, but the rifle already does mad damage.
GeekyDad
Member
Yeah, I generally never gravitate to rifles in a game -- not the sniping type -- but it's hard to resist the dmg those things do in this game. It's one of the reasons I love using Jessica so much in Raid. Put the double-shot perk on that thing and it's silly fun.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
I didn't realize you could double-shot the rifle. That's gross, ha. The rifle seriously destroys. I've also grown keen on left or right biased body shots. On higher health enemies, ~2 of those will stun and allow me to fully charge melee for lolwreck.
Speaking of that, I love how Raid mode shows damage values and shows red numbers for weak points. It is actually helping me pick my equipment and better aim my shots for story mode (which will pay off in my non-herb run). I've actually learned how insanely powerful a fully charged melee is, too.
Despite Raid mode not feeling very RE-like, it is an incredible amount of fun to play. I haven't played multiplayer yet, just solo. How does it actually deal with multiplayer?
It's so epic. I've been playing Raid mode all day. I only have stages 1-7 though because i've only done chapters 1-4, but I can't wait to unlock and play the rest.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
So they opened a Jack In The Box here yesterday. The line was INSANE, but my friend and I both brought our 3DS + RE:R and played co-op Raid Mode in line and while waiting at our table for food. The dude in line behind us kept starring over my shoulder to watch us play (kinda creepy), and the girls working there all complimented us for being smart and bringing something to do.
That aside, co-op Raid is SO good. So. Good.
That aside, co-op Raid is SO good. So. Good.
The enemies do have weak points. Most of the time is the head, though shooting in other parts of the body will get different effects. For the first few chapters focus on the chest until you get use to the way the enemies move and aim for the limbs/head easily.
lazybones18
Banned
Anyone have a list of all the enemy names (including bosses)?
Want to familiarize them for the Raid Mode missions
Want to familiarize them for the Raid Mode missions
Wolfe
Member
The cpp goes off after so long of not getting a signal from the 3DS so no worries there.
Didn't realize that Nintendo's site sold CPPs, ordered one at lunch yesterday and it was delivered today. Guess I'm going to have to open up my typo'd copy of RE:R and get to playing.
I've not been playing for long, just cleared Chapter 3 and a few raid stages, but so far it's been phenomenal. Especially Ch 3's boss. I know heart-pounding's an adjective that gets thrown around a lot, but jesus christ that boss! So scary! So tense!
Also liking the cheesy dialogue, but that's not nearly as frightening...
Also liking the cheesy dialogue, but that's not nearly as frightening...
You know, I felt exactly the same after that chapter.
Now that I finished the game I can tell you, that I keep coming back for more, I'm in my fourth playthrough and near the level cap in raid mode. But i'm not stopping. I just love this game so much.
lazybones18
Banned
Finished up Chasm, trying out Trench
The Pale Rider.....fucking love that gun.
The Pale Rider.....fucking love that gun.
BTW, can someone post a list of all the rare/legendary weapons that would be needed to complete the mission that unlocks Norman? And do I need to have them all in my weapon case to ensure the mission's completion?
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
So I'm starting Chapter 11.
Spoiler free stuff:
- I really love this game, a lot. I've said it a few times, but while it's not RE2 good, it definitely kept me interested and playing better than RE4 (I didn't get much further than the first lake boss in that game). A nice change of pace.
- I'm not a fan of having to use the Genesis (I think that's what it's called) to scan things so much. I feel like it's taking away from the experience. As a result, I've sort of stopped going crazy with the scanning and hunting for
. It's a cool idea, but it's far too detached for me at points.
Spoiler stuff:
I'll be finishing the final two chapters this weekend I think, so I'll be able to comment on the story and what I think about that as soon as I'm done!
Spoiler free stuff:
- I really love this game, a lot. I've said it a few times, but while it's not RE2 good, it definitely kept me interested and playing better than RE4 (I didn't get much further than the first lake boss in that game). A nice change of pace.
- I'm not a fan of having to use the Genesis (I think that's what it's called) to scan things so much. I feel like it's taking away from the experience. As a result, I've sort of stopped going crazy with the scanning and hunting for
hand prints
Spoiler stuff:
- I really am not enjoying the super action sequences. This is where, as it's been mentioned, they went a more "action game" route, and while it's not terrible, it's not what I want when I pick up a RE game. I want survival, I want scares, I want to be worried about how I'm going to make it in my next encounter.
- I'm not a fan of the Hunters or Vagina monsters (not sure what these are...the water things, haha). 1v1 isn't bad for the Hunters, maybe even 2v1. But 4v1? C'mon...It makes sense given the nature of the enemy, but they soak up a LOT of damage
and cause more frustration than fun for me. It goes back to the whole SURVIVAL horror. I feel weird unloading 100 machine gun bullets into a few enemies to kill them, or wasting 8 magnum bullets, or 20 shotgun blasts. It aggravates me to no end. The Vagina monsters are just annoying and cheap, haha.
- This is not a fault of the game, but I don't like the 3DS nub very much. I need to see if there's a mod to make it hold your thumb more when playing.
- I'm not a fan of the Hunters or Vagina monsters (not sure what these are...the water things, haha). 1v1 isn't bad for the Hunters, maybe even 2v1. But 4v1? C'mon...It makes sense given the nature of the enemy, but they soak up a LOT of damage
and cause more frustration than fun for me. It goes back to the whole SURVIVAL horror. I feel weird unloading 100 machine gun bullets into a few enemies to kill them, or wasting 8 magnum bullets, or 20 shotgun blasts. It aggravates me to no end. The Vagina monsters are just annoying and cheap, haha.
- This is not a fault of the game, but I don't like the 3DS nub very much. I need to see if there's a mod to make it hold your thumb more when playing.
I'll be finishing the final two chapters this weekend I think, so I'll be able to comment on the story and what I think about that as soon as I'm done!
So I'm starting Chapter 11.
Spoiler free stuff:
- I really love this game, a lot. I've said it a few times, but while it's not RE2 good, it definitely kept me interested and playing better than RE4 (I didn't get much further than the first lake boss in that game). A nice change of pace.
- I'm not a fan of having to use the Genesis (I think that's what it's called) to scan things so much. I feel like it's taking away from the experience. As a result, I've sort of stopped going crazy with the scanning and hunting for. It's a cool idea, but it's far too detached for me at points.hand prints
Spoiler stuff:
- I really am not enjoying the super action sequences. This is where, as it's been mentioned, they went a more "action game" route, and while it's not terrible, it's not what I want when I pick up a RE game. I want survival, I want scares, I want to be worried about how I'm going to make it in my next encounter.
- I'm not a fan of the Hunters or Vagina monsters (not sure what these are...the water things, haha). 1v1 isn't bad for the Hunters, maybe even 2v1. But 4v1? C'mon...It makes sense given the nature of the enemy, but they soak up a LOT of damage
and cause more frustration than fun for me. It goes back to the whole SURVIVAL horror. I feel weird unloading 100 machine gun bullets into a few enemies to kill them, or wasting 8 magnum bullets, or 20 shotgun blasts. It aggravates me to no end. The Vagina monsters are just annoying and cheap, haha.
- This is not a fault of the game, but I don't like the 3DS nub very much. I need to see if there's a mod to make it hold your thumb more when playing.
I'll be finishing the final two chapters this weekend I think, so I'll be able to comment on the story and what I think about that as soon as I'm done!
The genesis will be an important part of your hell run (if you ever do one). The game is harder in hell and fewer herbs will force you to scan monsters to get an extra herb to survive(scanning enough monsters to get a 100% in the genesis will get you an herb). The worst part? you need to scan them while they are alive and close to you, since that gets you the most % you can get from a monster. That for me, was the best part of Hell, increased use of the Genesis, in a high risk/high reward way.
About your second point in spoilers
I had trouble with the hunters in my first playthrough. But then I discovered they have a flaw in the way they attack. This game is more about learning how to deal with every enemy type, most of the time you will face a new mosnter alone, or a group comes to you one by one.
If you do a second run for a mission, you'll notice this. At this point I can handle many hunters with just a pistol.
If you do a second run for a mission, you'll notice this. At this point I can handle many hunters with just a pistol.
Edit : Ugh forgot some spoiler tags
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
Yeah, the 100% herb thing has been huge for dealing with larger groups of hunters. If by flaw you mean
when they leap at you
Also, you are invulnerable while
performing a melee attack.(Not invulnerable while charging though)
Their attack animation is way too obvious and take too much time to start. After hitting one when they leap, start a charge attack and release it just as onother hunter jumps at you. The attack will miss.
Their attack animation is way too obvious and take too much time to start. After hitting one when they leap, start a charge attack and release it just as onother hunter jumps at you. The attack will miss.
Headshots do heavy damage to the hunters, more than to any Ooze. So try to land some.
And one more thing : any of the stages that has hunters have some sort of place that helps you to deal with them. The ideal position is
at the end of any corridor, so they come in a straight line to you, and do not have to move around too much to look for the next one. Even the second elevator at the first flashback, you can go back to the door you came from and wait there for them.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
Just finished the game! I'm going to start playing much more Raid now, and will probably do the casual no herb run next.
Overall, I'm very pleased with the game. I'm pretty sure this is the first game I've beaten with a real story (read: not Mario 3D Land or the main game of Pokemon Rumble Blast) since...uhh...I seriously don't know. I haven't beaten a game in a very very long time. The game definitely had me interested and wanting to know more. Awesome stuff.
I'm really happy all of the characters survived. I was really hoping Quint and Keith made it, and they did. Awesome.
Also, the final area of the game had me on the edge of my seat. For whatever reason, it was by far the creepiest feeling the game managed to give off. The final boss was "meh" at best. I can see where he'll be a bitch for a no herb run...But I really really don't dig the whole teleporting shit. I realize the game is already pretty unrealistic, but this bothered me a LOT in terms of "what the fuck" moments.
And that last scene was pretty interesting. I'm not sure if it ties into something, but if it does, I'd be interested in at least reading a bit about it. Very interesting, haha.
Also, the final area of the game had me on the edge of my seat. For whatever reason, it was by far the creepiest feeling the game managed to give off. The final boss was "meh" at best. I can see where he'll be a bitch for a no herb run...But I really really don't dig the whole teleporting shit. I realize the game is already pretty unrealistic, but this bothered me a LOT in terms of "what the fuck" moments.
And that last scene was pretty interesting. I'm not sure if it ties into something, but if it does, I'd be interested in at least reading a bit about it. Very interesting, haha.
Overall, I'm very pleased with the game. I'm pretty sure this is the first game I've beaten with a real story (read: not Mario 3D Land or the main game of Pokemon Rumble Blast) since...uhh...I seriously don't know. I haven't beaten a game in a very very long time. The game definitely had me interested and wanting to know more. Awesome stuff.
The last scene,
the one with Jessica,
looks like connects with RE6, though we won't be sure until the game is out.
About the final area:
About the final boss:
About Quint and Keith.
I didn't notice until my second playthrough! There are many thing you miss the first time. Like some chapters having two ways to get to your objective.
Glad you enjoyed the game!
Run! The smaller fish are anoying, the ones that look like oozes, you can kill them from afar, most of te time they get out of the water, and if they see you then dive to get to you.
About the final area:
Making the "vagina" monsters into a One Hit Kill beast was interesting, that's like turning a Goomba invencible and
About the final boss:
I never felt that the teleportation was out of pace in the RE universe. Maybe because at first I belived that he was just really fast and used the flash to distract you to get to another position
About Quint and Keith.
The Quint and Keith bit, in the same chapter they dissapear it's clearly implied , that they survive. You just had to pay attention to the cuscene with O'Brian. After he says 'What a dissaster' you can see the ProgressBar starting again.
Glad you enjoyed the game!
Run! The smaller fish are anoying, the ones that look like oozes, you can kill them from afar, most of te time they get out of the water, and if they see you then dive to get to you.
woo and indeed hoo
Banned
Glad you enjoyed it so much nicoga3000 .
You can run past them/dodge them as it pleases you but that is much easier once you know where they will be and are used to their movement patterns! If you don't I recommend walking slowly forward with the shotty already aiming ahead and slightly upwards so if they do jump you you can blast them. Unless they surprise you they tend to pop up at a distance and can be sniped if you are quick enough. Also, one of the grenades is designed to finish them off rather nicely. I want to say the Pulse grenade but you might want to check that. I would also recommend wearing headphones and having the 3DS set to surround sound as that really helps to pin-point their location or direction of attack. Given that they tend to swim underwater and attack you from a different direction than you are facing that is very helpful. Lastly, they are only one hit kills if they drag you under water on a higher difficulty level, if you are already injured or don't press the button to release yourself from their grip quickly enough. I was dreading that stage on my last no herb run but using the above tips I managed to get through it with nary a problem. I do agree that they are a particularly annoying enemy though since they require a degree of care.
Yes. I mis-read this earlier but my advice above still stands .
.You can run past them/dodge them as it pleases you but that is much easier once you know where they will be and are used to their movement patterns! If you don't I recommend walking slowly forward with the shotty already aiming ahead and slightly upwards so if they do jump you you can blast them. Unless they surprise you they tend to pop up at a distance and can be sniped if you are quick enough. Also, one of the grenades is designed to finish them off rather nicely. I want to say the Pulse grenade but you might want to check that. I would also recommend wearing headphones and having the 3DS set to surround sound as that really helps to pin-point their location or direction of attack. Given that they tend to swim underwater and attack you from a different direction than you are facing that is very helpful. Lastly, they are only one hit kills if they drag you under water on a higher difficulty level, if you are already injured or don't press the button to release yourself from their grip quickly enough. I was dreading that stage on my last no herb run but using the above tips I managed to get through it with nary a problem. I do agree that they are a particularly annoying enemy though since they require a degree of care.
Yes
. I mis-read this earlier but my advice above still stands .My impression is that the final boss doesn't physically teleport, merely scramble the player's vision so that it appears that he does. Chris says something about his vision being affected, as he starts to use that tactic afterall.
nicoga3000
Saint Nic
I didn't think about the fact that the final boss wasn't teleporting. That's a good point...Except what about when there's the stream of 3 or 4 that attack you (with the last being the real vision of him)? It seems...sketchy. I don't know - I respect the idea of the boss, but I personally didn't find him satisfying. But as a whole package, it's a small complaint!
And I'll have to keep an eye out for the Quint/Keith thing my second run. I do remember it showing the transmission starting up again, but I didn't know if that meant they survived and finished or if it restarted after a hiccup and cut to black afterwards. It was hard for me to tell.
The final area having one-hit kill was loldumb. I swam too close to one on accident and got eaten. Oops...
And I'll have to keep an eye out for the Quint/Keith thing my second run. I do remember it showing the transmission starting up again, but I didn't know if that meant they survived and finished or if it restarted after a hiccup and cut to black afterwards. It was hard for me to tell.
The final area having one-hit kill was loldumb. I swam too close to one on accident and got eaten. Oops...
Also, I'm happy that last scene wasn't something I was supposed to fully understand. I really hope the next RE game continues this path towards a more survival horror feel. More survival and horror, more ammo management, more creepy!
Regarding the no herb run...I can already tell the final boss will present me with some issues given the nature of the fight
(mostly because of the non-standard teleports)
woo and indeed hoo
Banned
Well if my impression about him having the ability to warp one's perceptions is correct then presumably he could make you see, or not see, whatever he wanted. Given that the abyss virus was developed from a form of sea life it may be that that original 'fish' had some chameleon ability that formed the basis for the final bosses' ability, albeit mutated in some way.
However, this is RE so I don't worry too much about the real world feasibility of it. As long as it makes sense and is feasible within that game world I couldn't care less if it is 'realistic' or not.
I hated the final boss at first but after facing him several times he is one of my favourite stages because I can now almost toy with him *evil laugh*.
However, this is RE so I don't worry too much about the real world feasibility of it
. As long as it makes sense and is feasible within that game world I couldn't care less if it is 'realistic' or not.I hated the final boss at first but after facing him several times he is one of my favourite stages because I can now almost toy with him *evil laugh*.
Hopefully we shall see them again in a future RE
. The might explain it or just leave it as one of those RE mysteries!The final area having one-hit kill was loldumb. I swam too close to one on accident and got eaten. Oops...[/spoiler]
I didn't even know that was the case until someone mentioned it on here. Ironically, the next time I encountered them [on my fourth playthrough IIRC] they did in fact one hit kill me
Also, I'm happy that last scene wasn't something I was supposed to fully understand. I really hope the next RE game continues this path towards a more survival horror feel. More survival and horror, more ammo management, more creepy!
I concur!
Regarding the no herb run...I can already tell the final boss will present me with some issues given the nature of the fight. Any protips for it? Most of the game, if I can remember correctly, shouldn't be too terrible. The first action stage with Quint/Keith may pose a threat, but I don't think it'll be harder than said final boss!(mostly because of the non-standard teleports)
He's a pussy once you get used to him
. I only died once in my no herb run with him and that was only because I was being careless.I have posted about him a few times already up the thread so if you do a thread search for my username you will find plenty of advice to sort him out. I would normally hunt them out for you but I am severely behind schedule today! Sorry.
I found the second flashback scenario with Parker and especially the Quint and Keith scenario with the downloading pc to be far, far more problematical than the final boss in my no herb runs!
EDIT - I just noticed that this is on page 99 which is funnily enough how many hours I have put into this game!
My thoughts exactly. He tricks you somehow into seeing ilusions. You can see a purple gass coming out of his mouth which, while it gives you a clear hint on who is the real one, may also explain the halucinations on chris and jill.
Yeah, those are really hard, in both No herb and Hell runs.
The final boss won't be hard, don't worry. You will have better upgrades and it will be easy to stop him before he moves. The Quint & Keith, and the terragrigia parts will be Hell as I said.
That was discussed here to, I thing is the way one hold the 3ds. Though I cant tell since I dont have the CCP.
I just used the Rocked launcher you get in a previous stage. And we better leave the mystery to be.. a mystery. I really don't want to rationalize RE enemies :lol.However, this is RE so I don't worry too much about the real world feasibility of it
I hated the final boss at first but after facing him several times he is one of my favourite stages because I can now almost toy with him *evil laugh*.
Hopefully we shall see them again in a future RE
He's a pussy once you get used to him
Yeah, those are really hard, in both No herb and Hell runs.
The final boss won't be hard, don't worry. You will have better upgrades and it will be easy to stop him before he moves. The Quint & Keith, and the terragrigia parts will be Hell as I said.
That was discussed here to, I thing is the way one hold the 3ds. Though I cant tell since I dont have the CCP.
lazybones18
Banned
*completes Stage 1 (Abyss)*
"Is that your best?"
*starts Stage 2 (Abyss)*
....Fuck me
"Is that your best?"
*starts Stage 2 (Abyss)*
....Fuck me
Abyss.. You don't imagine the horrors you will have to face...