-
Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.
Retro AV Club Thread 2: Classic Gaming Done Right!
- Thread starter Mega
- Start date
- Status
bodine1231
Member
Had socks on too,no fucks were given.
PumpkinSpice
Banned
I assume summer in the south is humid enough that you don't need to worry about ESD.
bodine1231
Member
Exactly
Thanks for this. Now that I watched it, I think I'll hold off. Yours was a lot blurrier from mine (from what I can tell at least in the cell phone footage). But now that I've seen this, I'll probably adjust it next time I have some spare time.
Shin Johnpv
Member
I got the RGB cables I ordered for my PS1 in today. Hooked them up and it looks fucking glorious on my tv, now if only I knew where the fuck I put my PS1 controllers.
Got another RGB cable for one of my extra Saturns here. Finally filled up all three slots on my Selecty
JP21 user? I started off as one too before I realized how hard it would be.
I still have a 1st party SNES JP21 cable if you need one.
Cool. Cheers.
Shin Johnpv
Member
Yeah DO NOT buy your framemeister from Ebay. Buy it from Solaris Japan, they won't be jacking up the price and their shipping is ridiculously good. When I got mine, I ordered it on a Monday morning, by Wednesday evening it was in my hands in NJ.
davidwhangchoi
Member
Still waiting for my Saturn Scart cable from uk. Why is there some tentacle thing there? Looks like it's guarding the cables.Got another RGB cable for one of my extra Saturns here. Finally filled up all three slots on my Selecty
Boy Wander
Member
I have the Samsung KS8000 and I'd love to hook up my old consoles to it. Will the framemeister do the job ?
cyborgnumberblue
Member
Looks like a guardian from BotW, to me.
It should, but the OSSC is fully compatible (as of fw .77), so the additional line scaling modes make it a better buy, IMO.
Boy Wander
Member
Good to know, thanks. I signed up to the OSSC mailing list a few months back but have heard nothing. Is production ramping or could I be waiting years?
I have both SCART and JP21 for all my systems. Just kinda prefer the Japanese cables. I also have an official SFC cable...in the picture so I am good on that. I have 3 Super Famis.
Triforce141
Member
RetroUSB's AVS is getting ready to ship in a week or so.
It's been almost 9 months since I ordered the console, cannot wait
Those who paid for it early on in the listing will get their units shipped sometime this month, those who did not will get their's sent in October
I think you can still order one, but if not, you're likely going to wait a few months
It's been almost 9 months since I ordered the console, cannot wait
Production ramped up recently, everyone was able to pre-order them from 2 separate batches rather than be on a waiting list for only 1 batch.
Those who paid for it early on in the listing will get their units shipped sometime this month, those who did not will get their's sent in October
I think you can still order one, but if not, you're likely going to wait a few months
Boy Wander
Member
bodine1231
Member
On my way back from my third road trip pvm pickup. Got about twelve 20inch ikegamis and a few jvcs. Also got about 20 9 inch monochrome ikegami security cameras lol. Sorry for the big pic.
Your inventory sounds insane.
polyh3dron
Banned
Don't get fleeced by overcharging eBay sellers. Get one from Solaris.
On my way back from my third road trip pvm pickup. Got about twelve 20inch ikegamis and a few jvcs. Also got about 20 9 inch monochrome ikegami security cameras lol. Sorry for the big pic.
Holy shit, how many do you have now?
Aaah that would explain the weird price range. Thanks. Gonna just need to see how much customs tax is gonna be if I order one from Solaris.
socksfelloff
Member
man i wanna see a rgb ikegami screen IRL so bad!! if youre doing friendly gaf discounts i've got a dock for freight!!
Danny Dudekisser
I paid good money for this Dynex!
"Well, it was either PVMs or children going in that van"
davidwhangchoi
Member
On my way back from my third road trip pvm pickup. Got about twelve 20inch ikegamis and a few jvcs. Also got about 20 9 inch monochrome ikegami security cameras lol. Sorry for the big pic.
i don't think that's enough monitors, you need to get a few more.
RadarScope1
Member
Seriously. Mods asleep at the switch.
bodine1231
Member
Ok,well here's the lot of it. I'm tired as shit and my backs on fire,lol. Trip was 5hrs each way and I met the head engineer at the station. He kinda knew what I wanted them for but really didn't care,he just wanted them out of the basement and said "good luck on your sales" when we got done,haha. We had to make a bunch of trips with a dolly on an elevator but it didn't take very long. I'm not sure if any of them work but he said they were just sitting in the basement since they upgraded and he was just about to throw them out!! There was only one PVM in the lot which we found completely by accident (the other two pictured I already had), a PVM 20N6U. The rest are Ikegami's and JVC's. I havent had the chance to take inventory but a couple of the JVC's look really nice. A vast majority of these have multiple RGB inputs and a couple only S-video,but I bet the picture is still outstanding.
Two or three have some minor burn in and I'm not sure what to do with all those 9 inch monochrome monitors. I'm sure someone would buy them if the price was low enough I guess so I took them as well.
Oh yeah,the price.....everything for $50
Two or three have some minor burn in and I'm not sure what to do with all those 9 inch monochrome monitors. I'm sure someone would buy them if the price was low enough I guess so I took them as well.
Oh yeah,the price.....everything for $50
Triforce141
Member
That entire haul must've costed a pretty penny
............................................
............................................
sixteen-bit
Member
racks on racks
bodine1231
Member
Haha,if we did freight you'd have to take more than one (gaf deals) to make it worth it.. I work in a warehouse and can arrange that pretty easily.
Two or three have some minor burn in and I'm not sure what to do with all those 9 inch monochrome monitors. I'm sure someone would buy them if the price was low enough I guess so I took them as well.
Someone could make a pretty good Tony Montana Replica Office with all that and some icing sugar
Laevateinn
Member
Fuuuuuuuck
Speaking of PVM, I got my PVM-14L2 in today and I'm happy to have it, I have no idea how to optimize the picture. Right now the picture from RGB doesn't look much better then my component CRT up close, so I know it not fine tuned yet. Also how do I get the audio to play off plugged in speakers? Right now audio is playing through the unit itself.
Damn, bodine is making me regret that I once got rid of a 13" Panasonic broadcast monitor to "make room".
I was a fool wasn't I?
Anyway, today I finally hooked up my 20l5 at the same time as both my 14m2u and my 20m2u. Guess what I noticed? Even though the m2 units are far more heavily used, they have way warmer and more accurate colors than the 20l5. In fact, the black levels and overall contrast is way better in general.
And I think I know why. When all the screens are shut off, the 20l5 has a much lighter screen than the m2u screens. It's more of a light grey and the m2u's are pure black. And check out this pamphlet:
http://classiccomputers.info/down/monitors/Sony_PVM-20M2U.pdf
So, I think Sony decided to sacrifice some contrast when it started manufacturing 800 line HR Trinitron CRTs. It's something to keep in mind if you're interested in one of their higher-res monitors. They simply don't look as nice for low res stuff.
I was wondering why I thought the 20l5 was "too much" when it came to 240p content. At first I thought it was too sharp and the scanlines made the image look less colorful. But now that I've hooked up all the monitors to the same source, I can easily see that it's the overall contrast ratio that decreased.... and rather dramatically I might add. So even though it's sharper and has heavier scanlines, it also has a much colder picture even at the warmest color temp setting. This makes the CRT sharper but also a bit less colorful than what I'm accustomed to.
Don't get me wrong, the 20l5 is still a CRT and will have deeper colors than every LCD and LED you've seen, but it doesn't compare favorably for low definition content when examined against other standard definition CRTs in the PVM line.
I was a fool wasn't I?
Anyway, today I finally hooked up my 20l5 at the same time as both my 14m2u and my 20m2u. Guess what I noticed? Even though the m2 units are far more heavily used, they have way warmer and more accurate colors than the 20l5. In fact, the black levels and overall contrast is way better in general.
And I think I know why. When all the screens are shut off, the 20l5 has a much lighter screen than the m2u screens. It's more of a light grey and the m2u's are pure black. And check out this pamphlet:
http://classiccomputers.info/down/monitors/Sony_PVM-20M2U.pdf
So, I think Sony decided to sacrifice some contrast when it started manufacturing 800 line HR Trinitron CRTs. It's something to keep in mind if you're interested in one of their higher-res monitors. They simply don't look as nice for low res stuff.
I was wondering why I thought the 20l5 was "too much" when it came to 240p content. At first I thought it was too sharp and the scanlines made the image look less colorful. But now that I've hooked up all the monitors to the same source, I can easily see that it's the overall contrast ratio that decreased.... and rather dramatically I might add. So even though it's sharper and has heavier scanlines, it also has a much colder picture even at the warmest color temp setting. This makes the CRT sharper but also a bit less colorful than what I'm accustomed to.
Don't get me wrong, the 20l5 is still a CRT and will have deeper colors than every LCD and LED you've seen, but it doesn't compare favorably for low definition content when examined against other standard definition CRTs in the PVM line.
Kawika
Member
Between the 4 Monitors I have (or had)
I think my 14M4U is the most colorful, it's really sharp and the contrast is very good. I don't know if I will ever get rid of the best $40 I ever spent on a gaming device. N64 looks really good on it but the scan lines aren't that noticeable. If you have a scan line fetish you will have to sit close.
My JVC DT-V1710CG is very sharp, very cool (color) but I felt it was the happy medium between the size of my larger displays and smaller displays. This monitor is light and doesn't take up a lot of space. If a 20" (19) is too big for your setup I really think this is a really good choice to hunt down over the 14 (13) monitors.
JVC Image. My One Plus 5 hates CRTs so I need to figure out another way to take shots.
BVM 20F1U, the way people talk about this monitor I swear I thought it was going to be the best thing in the world. The colors were muted and I wasn't exactly happy with the professional calibration Savvon-Pat did. I like my reds to be a little more garish but I didn't really feel like messing with the calibration too much and i would just set it back to his settings because my settings were game specific. Only if chroma adjustments worked on RGB. You are totally right about the monitor itself being less dark. It was actually hard to use it any ambient light in the room. I never would use it during the day.
PVM 20L5 According to Pat, they tubes from the 20F1U and the 20L5 are the same part number. But this is by far the best large PVM I have ever seen. My unit is from 2003 and it doesn't look like it had many hours on it. It seems bright and colorful. It was also calibrated by Savon-Pat . The 20L5 looks fine with ambient light and almost everything about it is better (including the resolution). With my 20F1U I would probably use it less than half the time and use my Scaler to play most games on my HDTV. Now, I amusing it almost exclusively and I don't even bother using my framemeister 9/10. By far, the way mine is set up, it exceeds everything I want and I am so happy that this monitor is in my possession. This will likely change when I swap my framemeister for my OSSC.
bodine1231
Member
That should not be the case. Remember these sets are designed to be tweaked to the nth degree,that could be just bad calibration or a weak capacitor. The smaller units will look sharper of course but blacks and contrast should be about the same. Also from what I've read the lighter or darker the monitor is when off doesn't effect the picture. It's different levels of phophor that you see. Don't quote me on that,just something I remembered reading a long time ago.
This is definitely not a calibration or age issue. The screen simply has different tech that gives the image a different feel. It's hard to explain and I'll delve into it more deeply when I have time later today.
Everything on the 20l5 is super clear and very accurate. But that's not really what I'm talking about. I'm specifically talking about black levels on 240p content exclusively. The blank lines between the spaces are thicker, but also lighter in color because they're essentially not showing any content at all so it defaults to "off". And if the tv's "off" state is lighter in color than another tv, and the scanlines are sharper/create more distance from each other it's going to affect the way colors are represented in 240p content.
I'll try to pick this up in photos today or Sunday.
Everything on the 20l5 is super clear and very accurate. But that's not really what I'm talking about. I'm specifically talking about black levels on 240p content exclusively. The blank lines between the spaces are thicker, but also lighter in color because they're essentially not showing any content at all so it defaults to "off". And if the tv's "off" state is lighter in color than another tv, and the scanlines are sharper/create more distance from each other it's going to affect the way colors are represented in 240p content.
I'll try to pick this up in photos today or Sunday.
bodine1231
Member
No I understand,ive had the same side by side setup. The M2U is only 600 lines and has a different tube so it's going to look different side by side. It's going to have a softer look to the L5,but some people prefer that. I was specifically talking about calibration issues that can be fixed.
I know exactly what you mean. Kinda disappointed to hear it affects the image like that, but it does make me feel better about the fact I'll probably never own a 20L5.
davidwhangchoi
Member
Hey guys, Peltz just texted me some pics to share as he is out of the office and asked if i can post it on his behalf to supplement the conversation:
20L5
20m2u
have at it and continue away on the discussion =)
20L5
20m2u
have at it and continue away on the discussion =)
- Status