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Retro AV Club Thread 2: Classic Gaming Done Right!

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P

Peagles

Member
It's 4 in the morning and I just had a dream that there was a retro shop at the mall (unbelievable in itself in NZ) and they had PVMs I was staring longingly at through the window after hours. I was with my Mum though and she was like "No honey you don't need those, you've already got some of those at home don't you?" Lol.
 
L

Laevateinn

Member
Peagles said:
It's 4 in the morning and I just had a dream that there was a retro shop at the mall (unbelievable in itself in NZ) and they had PVMs I was staring longingly at through the window after hours. I was with my Mum though and she was like "No honey you don't need those, you've already got some of those at home don't you?" Lol.
Click to expand...

CRTs invading our dreams
 
N

NormalFish

Banned
Peagles said:
It's 4 in the morning and I just had a dream that there was a retro shop at the mall (unbelievable in itself in NZ) and they had PVMs I was staring longingly at through the window after hours. I was with my Mum though and she was like "No honey you don't need those, you've already got some of those at home don't you?" Lol.
Click to expand...
Is this what parenting does to people?
 
S

Splash Wave

Member
Can anyone link me to a reliable seller for Euro SCART RGB cables for Saturn? It looks like every place I could think to check is out of stock, unfortunately.
 
F

Fuzzy

I would bang a hot farmer!
Splash Wave said:
Can anyone link me to a reliable seller for Euro SCART RGB cables for Saturn? It looks like every place I could think to check is out of stock, unfortunately.
Click to expand...
They'll all be OoS until they're not then they will be OoS a day later again. You need to be proactive. Welcome to our wonderful world. :lol
 
V

Vespa

Member
Galdelico said:
Thank you! Any additional test would be extremely useful, at least in order to narrow down a list of 'safe' models.
My monitor is a newish LG, so it can be that, even though it's a known widespread issue since a while, now, affecting a variety of devices... IPS New Nintendo 3DS XL screens aren't immune either, and I could see it myself on my own console.
If I can give you a couple of suggestions on how to trigger the problem, just play a full arcade with VF2 - VS/watch mode don't work, as the constant resolution swapping somehow prevents image retention from happening - and then, after the credits roll, let the intro movie with Shun Di doing his exhibition moves roll through... On my monitor, I can clearly see the white outlines of the life bars and fighters names, sticking out of the blue sky on the background. OSSC is set to 480i Line X and bob deinterlace, both with/without scanlines.

Other games I tested, that cause the same problem are: Fighters Megamix (Saturn, NTSC-J), KoF Maximum Impact 2 (PS2, NTSC-J), Ridge Racer V (PS2, NTSC-J) and Tales of Symphonia (Game Cube, PAL).
Click to expand...

Well there it is, I've got retention on my old IPS monitor. I had the game paused for ages and I can see the hud on other screens now.
 
E

empo

Member
I just got my cable from thefoo.83 today. Won't have time to crack it open etc but the build looked solid and the picture seemed good.
 
G

Galdelico

Member
Vespa said:
Well there it is, I've got retention on my old IPS monitor. I had the game paused for ages and I can see the hud on other screens now.
Click to expand...

Can't say I'm happy to hear that... It sucks. :/
It's temporary, though. Leave your monitor off for a couple of hours and everything will get back to normal.

empo said:
I just got my cable from thefoo.83 today. Won't have time to crack it open etc but the build looked solid and the picture seemed good.
Click to expand...

I've got all my retro RGB cables from him, during the last year or so... Everything worked and still works perfectly, and he's a very kind and helpful guy. +1 recommended. :)
 
V

Vespa

Member
Just tested on a VA panel and was playing for about half an hour and paused it for a few minutes, couldn't see any retention. It's an Asus PT201Q, not a gaming monitor at all so there was smearing/overshoot on the darker colours. I'm guessing there are decent VA monitors now?
 
Kawika

Kawika

Member
Vespa said:
That's a shame it didn't sort out the retention issues. Strange thing is that I've used an IPS monitor whilst playing Virtua Fighter 2 on the Saturn via OSSC and haven't seen any retention artifacts. I can only think that it's the 'type' of IPS being used in your 4k screen (PLS? Newer IPS tech?) since the one I'm using is an old ass monitor.

I'll check on my newer 1440p IPS Dell monitor to see if it shows any issues when I have time. 480i switching is still a pain, same for the use of light gun games, keeping a CRT around makes sense.
Click to expand...

I have a 1440p Dell TN G Sync Monitor and the OSSC didn't work with it at all. I can't remember the model number of my display but ymmv.

My OSSC worked fine on my 4K if you wanted the image to be 4 inches below the top margin of the tv. This device really nice a better way at dialing in the signal to modern displays because it seems only my 1080p tvs/monitors would accept the signal.

Someone mentioned HD Retrovision cables. I really wonder if that would be the answer to a lot of SNES issues on the OSSC. SNES Sync seems to be very odd and if you could just bring in the component output to the OSSC it might work with TVs that the OSSC couldn't previously work with.

If it wasn't for the poor compatibility, I would say the OSSC is probably the best choice for the future or retro gaming period. As CRTs fail and become hard to find it really captures the feel of retro consoles on modern displays. I will probably buy the new OSSC in the future, as I sold mine because it wasn't compatible with my new 4K. That or individual HDMI mods or cables for each of the consoles I enjoy.
 
P

Peltz

Member
Two great things happened to me this week. I got Windjammers today.

And back on Monday, I became an uncle to a very beautiful baby girl. Hard to believe my sister is a mom now. Going to help raise her on tons of great games. :)
Edit: woops meant to put this in the retro thread.
 
socksfelloff

socksfelloff

Member
Peltz said:
Two great things happened to me this week. I got Windjammers today.

And back on Monday, I became an uncle to a very beautiful baby girl. Hard to believe my sister is a mom now. Going to help raise her on tons of great games. :)
Click to expand...


Congrats! 2 gifts you'll cherish for the rest of your life.
 
G

Galdelico

Member
Vespa said:
Just tested on a VA panel and was playing for about half an hour and paused it for a few minutes, couldn't see any retention. It's an Asus PT201Q, not a gaming monitor at all so there was smearing/overshoot on the darker colours. I'm guessing there are decent VA monitors now?
Click to expand...

Kawika said:
I have a 1440p Dell TN G Sync Monitor and the OSSC didn't work with it at all. I can't remember the model number of my display but ymmv.

My OSSC worked fine on my 4K if you wanted the image to be 4 inches below the top margin of the tv. This device really nice a better way at dialing in the signal to modern displays because it seems only my 1080p tvs/monitors would accept the signal.
Click to expand...

Did anyone here ever do a direct comparison between the OSSC and the Framemeister, specifically on 480i handling, on a fully compatible PC monitor? It's quite difficult to me to judge how well the FM works as a de-interlacing device, compared to the OSSC.
I start wondering if the Mini, in the end - and in spite of its shortcomings - could be a better all in one solution, to me personally.

Edit - Congrats Peltz! Being an uncle is awesome. :D
 
V

Vespa

Member
Congrats, Peltz!

@Galdelico Framemeister uses a different method of deinterlacing, right? My bet is that you wouldn't get the retention issue that bob deinterlacing has on IPS screens but it comes at the cost of a small amount of lag. OSSC with its own frame buffer is the dream. Have you looked into an iscan VP30? might be worth chaining that with the OSSC.
 
socksfelloff

socksfelloff

Member
Vespa said:
Congrats, Peltz!

@Galdelico Framemeister uses a different method of deinterlacing, right? My bet is that you wouldn't get the retention issue that bob deinterlacing has on IPS screens but it comes at the cost of a small amount of lag. OSSC with its own frame buffer is the dream. Have you looked into an iscan VP30? might be worth chaining that with the OSSC.
Click to expand...


I feel like I sort of stumbled into the best setup with my ossc +dvdo edge combo.
 
G

Galdelico

Member
I'm still kinda clueless about additional devices to chain to the OSSC/Mini. What kind of advantage would something like a DVDO or a VP30 bring to my setup?
Are such things readily available, or are we talking about vintage/rare/super expensive pieces of hardware?

I'm gonna do a quick google and see what I come up with. Thanks for the suggestions, guys. ^_-
 
socksfelloff

socksfelloff

Member
Galdelico said:
I'm still kinda clueless about additional devices to chain to the OSSC/Mini. What kind of advantage would something like a DVDO or a VP30 bring to my setup?
Are such things readily available, or are we talking about vintage/rare/super expensive pieces of hardware?

I'm gonna do a quick google and see what I come up with. Thanks for the suggestions, guys. ^_-
Click to expand...


The benefit to the edge is it takes the oddball resolutions and frequencies the ossc spits out and turns it into standard ass 1080p/60hz(or whatever the hell you want it to)

The edge also accepts pal and converts it to ntsc(not entirely relevant for most)

The edge also has overscan and underscan settings so you can zoom the picture to fit your display the best.

The edge also does audio mixing allowing you to mix analog, optical, coax or hdmi audio into your hdmi output (great for ossc without digital audio)

The edge is top tier with 480p and has multiple deinterlacing methods to suit your needs and input delay requirements for 480i.

The edge has every picture adjustment you could imagine however many of them are disabled when game mode is enabled.

The edge is also a super handy automatic video switcher for hdmi, component, RGBs, RGBHV, svideo and composite.

Most of my gaming stuff is packed away so all I've got is a snes mini w/rgb to play with but I've found having my ossc set to 480p out (2x I belive) and having the edge scale to 1080 gives me the best picture on my tv.
 
G

Galdelico

Member
Yeah, it seems like the ideal solution, but I'm not sure I want to drop another 4/500 euros into my retro setup, instead of just trying to sell my (still relatively new) monitor and swap it for something that hopefully won't give me any issue. On top of that, I'm doing it wrong or it's almost impossible to find an Edge anywhere on sale, right now. I guess it's exceptionally rare, isn't it?
 
P

Producer

Member
the past few years i've been playing retro titles on my 3ds, but last week someone was giving away a sony kv-36fv16 , so i picked it up. I still had my old consoles stored away, so i picked up an s-video cable for my snes / n64, and i've always had a wii with component cables and several VC titles. I bought some more VC games and i had a somewhat ok snes library, and have spent the last week and this one just re-playing old games and some news ones. I know i have a pretty basic poverty setup but i've been having a blast. I want to get an older curved crt and find some good cables for my ps1 / ps2, but for now i'm content. Just wanted to share i guess, lol.
 
B

bobble

Member
Producer said:
the past few years i've been playing retro titles on my 3ds, but last week someone was giving away a sony kv-36fv16 , so i picked it up. I still had my old consoles stored away, so i picked up an s-video cable for my snes / n64, and i've always had a wii with component cables and several VC titles. I bought some more VC games and i had a somewhat ok snes library, and have spent the last week and this one just re-playing old games and some news ones. I know i have a pretty basic poverty setup but i've been having a blast. I want to get an older curved crt and find some good cables for my ps1 / ps2, but for now i'm content. Just wanted to share i guess, lol.
Click to expand...

This set up rules! And having fun playing games is what it's all about. Congrats, enjoy, and welcome!
 
P

Producer

Member
bobble said:
This set up rules! And having fun playing games is what it's all about. Congrats, enjoy, and welcome!
Click to expand...

you're being too nice heh, but thanks. And yeah playing games is what matters, but i would like to have a real nice setup, sometime in the future.
 
G

Galdelico

Member
Kawika said:
I couldn't find an edge. The MLiG guys made it seem fairly easy to come by but I haven't seen it on ebay (at a normal price) in months.
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Exactly.
Right now I could only get a VP30, here in Italy, which goes for 150 euros, but the seller probaly wanted to make the most out of his set and sold the remote separately, so it's 150 for the unit alone. I guess it's not worthy, for that price, am I right?
 
socksfelloff

socksfelloff

Member
Kawika said:
I couldn't find an edge. The MLiG guys made it seem fairly easy to come by but I haven't seen it on ebay (at a normal price) in months.
Click to expand...


Funny enough, when I first saw this episode I looked on ebay and saw several for under 200cad. Now there's nothing. MLIG spiking prices?




Producer said:
you're being too nice heh, but thanks. And yeah playing games is what matters, but i would like to have a real nice setup, sometime in the future.
Click to expand...

Rad setup. If you're not too picky just look for a CRT with component inputs. That will allow you to run component or scart (with a simple converter) to get the most out of your consoles.
 
R

RadarScope1

Member
Producer said:
the past few years i've been playing retro titles on my 3ds, but last week someone was giving away a sony kv-36fv16 , so i picked it up. I still had my old consoles stored away, so i picked up an s-video cable for my snes / n64, and i've always had a wii with component cables and several VC titles. I bought some more VC games and i had a somewhat ok snes library, and have spent the last week and this one just re-playing old games and some news ones. I know i have a pretty basic poverty setup but i've been having a blast. I want to get an older curved crt and find some good cables for my ps1 / ps2, but for now i'm content. Just wanted to share i guess, lol.
Click to expand...

That's nothing to sneeze at! Real consoles and official emulation via s-video and component fed into a 36-inch Sony CRT is a great setup. You don't have to spend hundreds to play old games.
 
B

bobble

Member
Producer said:
you're being too nice heh, but thanks. And yeah playing games is what matters, but i would like to have a real nice setup, sometime in the future.
Click to expand...

Svid and component gaming on a huge Sony CRT is legit awesome! Wii VC is one of the easiest and imo best ways to play a ton of classic stuff on a CRT
 
N

NormalFish

Banned
ephemeral said:
Is there any difference in image quality between an RGB modded N64 with deblur vs the Ultra HDMI mod?
Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
As with all analog sources, an RGB N64 will still be subject to interference. Ultra HDMI is basically as clean as it gets, but if your cables are good then you won't see a massive difference.
 
E

ephemeral

Member
NormalFish said:
As with all analog sources, an RGB N64 will still be subject to interference. Ultra HDMI is basically as clean as it gets, but if your cables are good then you won't see a massive difference.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. It's not a cheap upgrade by any means so it's good to know it's not that superior.
 
C

Conezays

Member
BocoDragon said:
Ohhh Dogbone. I have like 4 of those but they're the AV Famicom ones, so I always associate them with too short cords. The NES one is superior.
Click to expand...

Nice. Yeah, I love mine (mainly play on AVS) and found a listing that was offering a super reasonable price for this sealed boxed version.
 
D

davidwhangchoi

Member
it's ok, i use them bc it's the only 2 controllers i have.
1 from 7dollarhagne's rgb toploader and 1 from a toploader i got at a local store.

i have a hard time pressing A,B together at times.

(play Zanac often)
 
R

RedFox85

Member
About to go pick up a triniton for 25$ that popped up on Craigslist, I've heard good things. I've been retro collecting for a little while now it's an expensive hobby but I enjoy it. Any people here use a triniton? I know many of you have probably moved on to frame meisters and what not but I still love a CRT.
 
L

Laevateinn

Member
RedFox85 said:
About to go pick up a triniton for 25$ that popped up on Craigslist, I've heard good things. I've been retro collecting for a little while now it's an expensive hobby but I enjoy it. Any people here use a triniton? I know many of you have probably moved on to frame meisters and what not but I still love a CRT.
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CRT is the only way.
 
A

alr1ght

bish gets all the credit :)
RedFox85 said:
About to go pick up a triniton for 25$ that popped up on Craigslist, I've heard good things. I've been retro collecting for a little while now it's an expensive hobby but I enjoy it. Any people here use a triniton? I know many of you have probably moved on to frame meisters and what not but I still love a CRT.
Click to expand...

CRTs are amazing. They look so good.

Make sure it's 480i max. I put together a picture list of the late model Sony CRTs with component input here: http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=238196943&postcount=4247

You can see a (mostly complete) list of FD Trintrons/WEGA here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FD_Trinitron/WEGA
You don't want Super Fine Pitch or Hi-Scan.
 
B

bobble

Member
saw a 20FS120 at the thrift store yesterday for $8... i already have 5 crts in this apartment... might end up with it anyway lol
 
R

RadarScope1

Member
RedFox85 said:
About to go pick up a triniton for 25$ that popped up on Craigslist, I've heard good things. I've been retro collecting for a little while now it's an expensive hobby but I enjoy it. Any people here use a triniton? I know many of you have probably moved on to frame meisters and what not but I still love a CRT.
Click to expand...

You are on the path to enlightenment, grasshopper. Accept no substitutes.
 
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