Rise of Skywalker premiere press impressions are streaming in

Zefah said:
I'm guessing it's this. Just like the prequel trilogy probably didn't create many new lifelong Star Wars fans, I can't see this trilogy doing that very well, either. On its own, it's just not very memorable.

I can totally imagine new viewers with no nostalgia coming into these movies and wondering why anyone ever liked this shit, assuming the original trilogy was basically the same thing.
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Actually the prequel trilogy did just that. Lots of kids who grew up with them love them dearly to this day. You can fault the prequels and Lucas for many things but not getting a new generation into Star Wars isnt one of them.
 
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This movie proves that JJ should have done the whole trilogy. I loved RoS but I imagine this would have been JJ's 2nd movie with the 3rd focused on Palpatine and his creepy temple thingy.
 
Hans Bubby said:
This movie proves that JJ should have done the whole trilogy. I loved RoS but I imagine this would have been JJ's 2nd movie with the 3rd focused on Palpatine and his creepy temple thingy.
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Yeah I have no issue bringing Palpatine back. I loved in fact and it's a love letter to the Dark Empire EU.

But so much more could have been done here. One hack pretty much destroyed the foundation.
 
Darkmakaimura said:
Yeah I have no issue bringing Palpatine back. I loved in fact and it's a love letter to the Dark Empire EU.

But so much more could have been done here. One hack pretty much destroyed the foundation.
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Yeah, I loved seeing Palpatine back and would have loved them to expand more on what he has been up to. All the scenes with him and Rey were great.. The way JJ shot his scenes were a visual/audio orgasm.
 
I'm not sure where the general consensus is at this point, but this was my favourite of the trilogy. I did not expect that. Yes, there were plenty of laughable, cringy moments, but it felt like a fucking movie. Things happened and they looked good (even compared to other JJ movies). Traumatized droid buddy was cute, and I think Babu Frik is my top Star Wars character now.

RIP Kijimi
 
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From box office mojo:

Of this weekend's audience, 59% were male and 64% of the crowd was aged 25 or older, all of which pretty much lines up with the last four Star Wars releases, though the film's "B+" CinemaScore is the first Star Wars film outside of 2008's animated Clone Wars to receive a CinemaScore outside the "A" range.
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Beyond the bad cinemascore, the breakdown of the audience gender & age says all we need to know: Disney Star Wars is made for the wrong target demographic.

- Men like Star Wars, whereas women? Not so much.

- Fans are no longer children, ergo the actual "kiddies flick" nature of the Disney movies isn't working. I'd venture Star Wars needs its Christopher Nolan Dark Knight trilogy moment because the people who pay to see this stuff are no longer children waiting for Santa Claus to bring them an Ewok cuddly toy for Christmas.
 
ruvikx said:
From box office mojo:



Beyond the bad cinemascore, the breakdown of the audience gender & age says all we need to know: Disney Star Wars is made for the wrong target demographic.

- Men like Star Wars, whereas women? Not so much.

- Fans are no longer children, ergo the actual "kiddies flick" nature of the Disney movies isn't working. I'd venture Star Wars needs its Christopher Nolan Dark Knight trilogy moment because the people who pay to see this stuff are no longer children waiting for Santa Claus to bring them an Ewok cuddly toy for Christmas.
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Don't agrer with you on the Christopher Nolan part but everything else you said is spot on.
 
Darkmakaimura said:
Don't agrer with you on the Christopher Nolan part but everything else you said is spot on.
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I could have used the recent Joker movie as an example as well, i.e. the point remains: Star Wars is one of the only movie franchises out there caught in a time capsule whereby the people making this stuff believe the movie needs to be made like it's the 70's & 80's forever & its audience is around 10 years old ad infinitum. Same screen wipes transitions, same slapstick comedy, same music, same dialogue ("I have a bad feeling about this!") same tone basically. It's not just about political agenda, overall scenario (or lack thereof in this trilogy), rubbish characters or whatever else is in the story, no, it's the actual kaboom fanfare Star Wars scrolling text with mind numbingly stupid exposition aimed at kids followed by cuddly toys, bad jokes & imbecility from minute one to the end credits.

Why do these movies flop like hell in China? Maybe because they like their medieval fantasy epics & violent stories over there, not glorified Saturday morning cartoons. People listed everything wrong with The Last Jedi but the thing which made me mentally nope out was the offensively stupid overuse of silly comedy, i.e. from the Hux scenes to the freaking "ship is landing... nope it's an iron!" joke. It kills me when I see people actually debating the plot or "dramatic" moments when these movies are basically $200 million Spaceballs-esque flicks which do everything to undermine their own dramatic potential because they don't trust their audience to sit in the movie theatre & watch an actual real action adventure science fiction fantasy without a gag or something loud, obnoxious or obvious every 5 minutes.
 
ruvikx said:
Why do these movies flop like hell in China? Maybe because they like their medieval fantasy epics & violent stories over there, not glorified Saturday morning cartoons.
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Nope, it's because they didn't grow up with Star Wars. If you roll back time do you think that Chinese people in the 70's and 80's were spending money on going to see the latest movies? Shit was pretty bad over there. You've got the younger generations that did gain access to western movies, but that window of them being able or willing to go to a modern multiplex theater on a weekend only became possible with the youngest of that demographic.

Theres a whole lot of cultural, political and historical stuff to unpack to give a really detailed explanation. But to say Star Wars bombed in China because it was bad isn't true, even though that's the narrative that's getting pushed this week.
 
Listening to Coast to Coast AM (good show tonight btw) and during the news break the anchor mentioned it's the worst rated SW movie after Phantom Menace. Oof.
 
ruvikx said:
I'm pretty certain China didn't grow up with Transformers either. But the Michael Bay movies still did far better than Stars Wars over there.
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New franchise as far as most Chinese know, although they did have TV broadcasts of the 80's animated TV show but not any of the toys. TFA drops the audience in expecting they know what's going on, so much so that the SE Asia version of TLJ had subtitle introductions to explain who the returning character are to correct this problem. They didn't even bother to do this for ROS.
 
Zefah said:
I'm guessing it's this. Just like the prequel trilogy probably didn't create many new lifelong Star Wars fans, I can't see this trilogy doing that very well, either. On its own, it's just not very memorable.

I can totally imagine new viewers with no nostalgia coming into these movies and wondering why anyone ever liked this shit, assuming the original trilogy was basically the same thing.
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It kinda was.
 
ruvikx said:
I could have used the recent Joker movie as an example as well, i.e. the point remains: Star Wars is one of the only movie franchises out there caught in a time capsule whereby the people making this stuff believe the movie needs to be made like it's the 70's & 80's forever & its audience is around 10 years old ad infinitum. Same screen wipes transitions, same slapstick comedy, same music, same dialogue ("I have a bad feeling about this!") same tone basically. It's not just about political agenda, overall scenario (or lack thereof in this trilogy), rubbish characters or whatever else is in the story, no, it's the actual kaboom fanfare Star Wars scrolling text with mind numbingly stupid exposition aimed at kids followed by cuddly toys, bad jokes & imbecility from minute one to the end credits.
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Sorry, but you are completely wrong here..

SW flopped in China, because they have no history in watching these movies. And if oyu have no nostalgic feelings these movies don't really stand on their own.
And Rian Johnson tried the dark and pretentious "Nolan"-Thing with TLJ, and that led to the shittiest movie in the whole franchise, almost destroying it.

Mainline Star Wars needs to be a "fun adventure romp".
You can do your arthouse shit on the side stories. But pushin this into a mainline Star Wars film was disastrous.
 
Stiflers Mom said:
Sorry, but you are completely wrong here..

SW flopped in China, because they have no history in watching these movies. And if oyu have no nostalgic feelings these movies don't really stand on their own.
And Rian Johnson tried the dark and pretentious "Nolan"-Thing with TLJ, and that led to the shittiest movie in the whole franchise, almost destroying it.

Mainline Star Wars needs to be a "fun adventure romp".
You can do your arthouse shit on the side stories. But pushin this into a mainline Star Wars film was disastrous.
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All I could think during Canto Bight was "wow, just like TDK"
 
Yo, where the people who said this movie will smash the box office, like every third one in a trilogy does, after the lower opening of the second one?
Cause it looks like TLJ will have the last laugh if these numbers won't pick up. Should rename the movie to The Last Joke, cause it's laughing how RoS is trying to generate $$
 
Doczu said:
Yo, where the people who said this movie will smash the box office, like every third one in a trilogy does, after the lower opening of the second one?
Cause it looks like TLJ will have the last laugh if these numbers won't pick up. Should rename the movie to The Last Joke, cause it's laughing how RoS is trying to generate $$
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Well, TLJ almost destroyed the franchise and split up the fan base.
I know lot of fans that don't want to give Disney money for that move.
 
Stiflers Mom said:
Oh wow, such a clever response.
You truly are the most sophisticated poster on this board.
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The Last Jedi is the most infantile, imbecilic childish nonsense (with some gags in the Spaceballs/Jackass territory) which made Revenge of the Sith look like a film noir by comparison. It's no surprise Empire Strikes Back is everyone's favorite, i.e. it's closer to the Lord of the Rings trilogy in tone (fantasy with serious drama) than every Star Wars since (bar Episode 3) which shoots for the 10 year old demographic. 64% of the audience is over 25 years old according to data? Well it's time they made a movie for the adults in the room.

Star Wars has so much potential (infinite lore, basically) yet it's constantly let down by their aim for the lowest common denominator.
 
Stiflers Mom said:
Well, TLJ almost destroyed the franchise and split up the fan base.
I know lot of fans that don't want to give Disney money for that move.
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Sure it did. It made Solo bomb, an ok and entertaining movie - not the second coming of Christ but still servicable (as was Rogue One).
It made Disney panic and revive Palps in hope this would help (yeah i know about the 2016 after TFA theories Rey was a Palp, but the hints had not a satysfying payoff).
It made Disney try to make a quick PR stunt and cash grab with Baby Yoda.

But most importantly - it made them less money they wanted. So yeah, TLJ is like a bad joke for them
The fucked eith the fanbase a little bit too much.
 
ruvikx said:
From box office mojo:



Beyond the bad cinemascore, the breakdown of the audience gender & age says all we need to know: Disney Star Wars is made for the wrong target demographic.

- Men like Star Wars, whereas women? Not so much.

- Fans are no longer children, ergo the actual "kiddies flick" nature of the Disney movies isn't working. I'd venture Star Wars needs its Christopher Nolan Dark Knight trilogy moment because the people who pay to see this stuff are no longer children waiting for Santa Claus to bring them an Ewok cuddly toy for Christmas.
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Are you misreading the quote? I'd say that 41% of the audience being female is a large chunk of the audience.
Also, too much emphasis on the B+ rating from Cinemascore. It's a "bad"score? Joker has a B+ rating through Cinemascore and that film is the second coming of Christ on this forum.
 
sol_bad said:
Are you misreading the quote? I'd say that 41% of the audience being female is a large chunk of the audience.
Also, too much emphasis on the B+ rating from Cinemascore. It's a "bad"score? Joker has a B+ rating through Cinemascore and that film is the second coming of Christ on this forum.
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For a Star Wars, B+ the lowest it has been. So yes it's bad. But your "damage control" is noted. Likewise the 60/40 gender split is important considering Kathleen Kennedy specifically tergetted the female demographic with this trilogy. The recent Rambo Last Blood movie had an even closer gender split (54% male, 46% female) in its opening weekend yet no one in their right mind would make a female led Rambo movie.
 
I think Rogue One is a good example of a more mature themed Star Wars movie that caters to their main demographic. I wish more of the Star Wars movies treated its subject matter like Rogue One did. Throw in the force, lightsabers, jedi, and sith into a movie made like Rogue One and I feel the fan base will eat it up.
 
Stiflers Mom said:
Mainline Star Wars needs to be a "fun adventure romp".
You can do your arthouse shit on the side stories. But pushin this into a mainline Star Wars film was disastrous.
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i agree

i think there is a contingent of SW fans who are slightly ashamed of it. they think it's dumb to like "kiddie movies". they hate the prequels because they "look like cartoons". these are people who want to be adults consuming adult movies but they still want their SW because they have their own unexamined arrested development. so they demand SW be serious. this is why Mando is such a hit right now, it looks serious, it has that prestige tv look.

the problem is, that goes against what SW was. it was pulp. it was silly. you don't like screen wipes? sorry, that is one of the formal foundations of the genre. you don't like text crawls? or cheesy one liners? black and white heroes? again, all these things are fundamental to pulp fantasy. main thing i disliked about TLJ was it had this elitism about it, like it thought it was better than those things. OG SW was always earnest and awkward by comparison.

kind of baffled that they don't have more kid centric stuff with this franchise, reboot Droids, or Ewoks, do things like that. it feels like they are ignoring that market and targeting nostalgia 30 something. perhaps this is why there are so many TLJ style "Film must be art!" stans, the Alamo Drafthousing of culture. "don't worry, adults, you can still watch your childhood favorite franchise, and now it's for grown ups!" is a bit pandering IMO would rather them just dive into the silliness. (one reason i sort of enjoy ROS tbh)
 
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#Phonepunk# said:
i agree

i think there is a contingent of SW fans who are slightly ashamed of it. they think it's dumb to like "kiddie movies". they hate the prequels because they "look like cartoons". these are people who want to be adults consuming adult movies but they still want their SW because they have their own unexamined arrested development. so they demand SW be serious. this is why Mando is such a hit right now, it looks serious, it has that prestige tv look.

the problem is, that goes against what SW was. it was pulp. it was silly. you don't like screen wipes? sorry, that is one of the formal foundations of the genre. you don't like text crawls? or cheesy one liners? black and white heroes? again, all these things are fundamental to pulp fantasy. main thing i disliked about TLJ was it had this elitism about it, like it thought it was better than those things. OG SW was always earnest and awkward by comparison.

kind of baffled that they don't have more kid centric stuff with this franchise, reboot Droids, or Ewoks, do things like that. it feels like they are ignoring that market and targeting nostalgia 30 something. perhaps this is why there are so many TLJ style "Film must be art!" stans, the Alamo Drafthousing of culture. "don't worry, adults, you can still watch your childhood favorite franchise, and now it's for grown ups!" is a bit pandering IMO would rather them just dive into the silliness. (one reason i sort of enjoy ROS tbh)
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Star Wars was the literal pioneer blockbuster of its era & shaped the industry for the following decades. But the problem is the other stuff evolved, changed & got better at selling its suspension of disbelief whilst Star Wars sticks to the exact same formula. Star Wars was great because of the universe Lucas created & its massive possibilities + lore, not because of the actual filmmaking style in & of itself. There's just too much cheese, too much cringe & far too many missed opportunities because the moviemakers are terrified of deviating from the same 1970's style.

I say Star Wars needs its own Casino Royale moment (the first Daniel Craig bond movie). Not reverence to an outdated formula.
 
ruvikx said:
There's just too much cheese, too much cringe & far too many missed opportunities because the moviemakers are terrified of deviating from the same 1970's style.
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see i think 100% the opposite. i think they are trying too hard to be modern. i'd rather then full on cheesiness. all the meta crap in TLJ was purely modern. you wouldn't do that in the '70s. it's a modern movie. had the film just been a light space adventure it would have been far more well received.

they aren't deviating in art design, for that they are just ripping off the '70s, but as far as story, film technique, character arcs, meta commentary, etc. all of that is modern. they are modern movies meant to look like '70s films.

interesting, i checked Rotten Tomatoes again, still 36% audience score, now up to 37,000 reviews. insane how that percentage just doesn't change.
ruvikx said:
But the problem is the other stuff evolved, changed & got better at selling its suspension of disbelief whilst Star Wars sticks to the exact same formula.
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not a problem. SW should be able to do what it does and do it well. suspension of disbelief was never a problem in SW, i'd argue it's a franchise marketed to people who don't care about that stuff. the same people who like monster and ufo movies in the 60s. nobody was going around saying "You know aliens aren't actually real?". well maybe people were, but they were normies, harshing on geeks for liking sci fi and comic books because they were silly and not real. LOL now the series has to appeal to those people, no wonder it loses it's soul.

i'd rather not have it chasing trends. it doesn't need to be Aliens. it doesn't need to be Blade Runner. this is part of that "All things to all people" fallacy. people want to make it this grand all appealing thing that fits with other movies and it's like, no, that's just going to water down what makes it special. it's a cheesy 70's space movie and that's FINE. it shouldn't be ashamed of it. there is a reason Rian's existential crisis rubbed people the wrong way.
 
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Explosive Zombie said:
The your mom jokes, porgs and whatever the fuck those alien caretakers on Luke's island were were also pure TDK level grim dark stuff.
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How about bum luke who was once th rebellions shiny hero.
Or the resistance annihilated and reduced to a mere 12 people at the very end.

But just take those tonally wrong marvel like shit jokes in the movie and pretend that's what it was all about.
 
Stiflers Mom said:
How about bum luke who was once th rebellions shiny hero.
Or the resistance annihilated and reduced to a mere 12 people at the very end.

But just take those tonally wrong marvel like shit jokes in the movie and pretend that's what it was all about.
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Oh shit they gave Luke a character arc? TDK as fuck. Oh also the Resistance gets whittled down, that's true, but it's almost like the movie ends with a hopeful message showing children inspired by the deeds of Luke Skywalker and the Resistance, really dark stuff.
 
Zefah said:
I'm guessing it's this. Just like the prequel trilogy probably didn't create many new lifelong Star Wars fans, I can't see this trilogy doing that very well, either. On its own, it's just not very memorable.

I can totally imagine new viewers with no nostalgia coming into these movies and wondering why anyone ever liked this shit, assuming the original trilogy was basically the same thing.
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The prequel trilogy definitely did create new fans. Episode 1 was my first Star Wars movie and I became a fan after it. I'm sure most kids liked the prequels when they were released.
 
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PrimetimeKnight said:
I think Rogue One is a good example of a more mature themed Star Wars movie that caters to their main demographic. I wish more of the Star Wars movies treated its subject matter like Rogue One did. Throw in the force, lightsabers, jedi, and sith into a movie made like Rogue One and I feel the fan base will eat it up.
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On one hand I disagree because I found Rogue One to be the dullest SW movie so far, exception being the Scarif battle. Too dour and it did not feel like SW to me.

However in the other hand I love KOTOR 1 and 2. Best SW after the OT and it feels like SW. It's also the most mature "adult" SW so far imo.

I guess it's just how well it can all be done.

Im dreading that a KOTOR movie series is very likely happening (ROS Visual Dictionary very strongly hints at it) because Disney is just going to butcher the hell out of it.
 
Well, I went to see RoS this weekend. It is pretty much exactly what I expected. TLJ basically shit on everything, destroyed all story threads and momentum and RoS tried to put the pieces back together as best it could, often pulling random stuff out of nowhere in order to get there.

RoS is not a great movie, but it is leagues ahead of the flaming turd known as TLJ. I actually feel sorry for the team working on RoS, considering what RJ did to then franchise going into the final film.

It is also quite funny to read the shill media's take on RoS, considering they doubled down on the shitfest that came before it. RoS is way better than TLJ, but it is being panned because it doesn't put any bullshit identity politics at the forefront to garner enough of those woke points that carried its predecessor.
 
Ironic thing is ROS has better POC roles in Jannah, Finn, and Lando all competent warriors contrasting to Rose's bipolar extremist and DJ's walking stuttering plot device
 
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Darkmakaimura said:
On one hand I disagree because I found Rogue One to be the dullest SW movie so far, exception being the Scarif battle. Too dour and it did not feel like SW to me.

However in the other hand I love KOTOR 1 and 2. Best SW after the OT and it feels like SW. It's also the most mature "adult" SW so far imo.

I guess it's just how well it can all be done.

Im dreading that a KOTOR movie series is very likely happening (ROS Visual Dictionary very strongly hints at it) because Disney is just going to butcher the hell out of it.
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I think Rogue One is an extremely beautiful looking film. The characters are ok but everything else makes up for it.
Also, regarding Dark Reven, I haven't seen/read the visual dictionary but unless it says in the book, having Dark Reven doesn't automatically mean he'll be from the Old Republic era.

They brought back Thrawn and he is totally different to the Legends version in terms of setting. Original Thrawn was after Return of the Jedi, new Thrawn is set before A New Hope from what I can tell.
 
sol_bad said:
I think Rogue One is an extremely beautiful looking film. The characters are ok but everything else makes up for it.
Also, regarding Dark Reven, I haven't seen/read the visual dictionary but unless it says in the book, having Dark Reven doesn't automatically mean he'll be from the Old Republic era.

They brought back Thrawn and he is totally different to the Legends version in terms of setting. Original Thrawn was after Return of the Jedi, new Thrawn is set before A New Hope from what I can tell.
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My main issue with RO was the characters. Other than the droid and the two Asian gentlemen, I found tge characters unlikable and boring.

Regarding Revan, there are other hints KOTOR seems like a massive possiblity.

Either way I kind of hope they don't go through with it, even with Keanu Reeves (which would be awesome nonetheless)
 
Darkmakaimura said:
My main issue with RO was the characters. Other than the droid and the two Asian gentlemen, I found tge characters unlikable and boring.

Regarding Revan, there are other hints KOTOR seems like a massive possiblity.

Either way I kind of hope they don't go through with it, even with Keanu Reeves (which would be awesome nonetheless)
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The only problem with Keanu Reeves is that he is a bad actor.
^_^

They need to ensure his character doesn't need to do too much acting but plenty of action.
lol
 
sol_bad said:
The only problem with Keanu Reeves is that he is a bad actor.
^_^

They need to ensure his character doesn't need to do too much acting but plenty of action.
lol
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He is but he's infinitely more entertaining than 90 percent of RO's characters.
 
The epilogue I would love: If the Disney board had any balls, they would force out Iger, Fire Kathleen Kennedy and the rest of the Marxist story group girl power brigade running Lucasfilm, and sue Rian Johnson for losses to their brand.
 
#Phonepunk# said:
Ironic thing is ROS has better POC roles in Jannah, Finn, and Lando all competent warriors contrasting to Rose's bipolar extremist and DJ's walking stuttering plot device
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Finn's character had so much potential. Good grief a storm trooper that defects to the rebels? Could have been legendary. I feel bad for John Boyega. Dude's character got railroaded in TLJ. Glad to hear they gave him more to do in this one.
 
Someone asked about the Lando and Jaana scene...

From what I read somewhere, there was actually supposed to be more backstory for Lando and why he was on that planet.
He actually retired and started a family... His baby girl was taken by the first order ... He talks this to the group after he saves their hides.

The scene at the end is meant to insinuate that Jaana is his daughter... Or could be.

"Let's find out" .. that's why he's smiling and she's looking so hopeful.


BTW, Jaana is frakking gorgeous!
 
DeafTourette said:
Someone asked about the Lando and Jaana scene...

From what I read somewhere, there was actually supposed to be more backstory for Lando and why he was on that planet.
He actually retired and started a family... His baby girl was taken by the first order ... He talks this to the group after he saves their hides.

The scene at the end is meant to insinuate that Jaana is his daughter... Or could be.

"Let's find out" .. that's why he's smiling and she's looking so hopeful.


BTW, Jaana is frakking gorgeous!
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Oh, damn. That would have made that all feel much more meaningful.
 
Saw it last night. What a piece of shit.

One third of the movie was desperately trying to correct the failures of 8, one third was JJ shoving every remaining piece of Star Wars nostalgia that hadn't yet been whored out down your throat to try and tug at your heartstrings, and the remaining third was a really boring by-the-numbers plot to do something to the bad space lasers.

It looks fantastic, I can't take that away. It's very flashy and well choreographed, everything looks wonderful. But it's nothing inside. It's a hollow shell.

I thought 7 was a fine reboot, I was never against the idea of a new trilogy because I like to see cool new things, but it's been a fucking trainwreck.
 
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