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Rottenwatch: AVATAR (82%)
- Thread starter SCULLIBUNDO
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â Narayan
Member
The Na'vi don't label humans as Dreamwalkers. They label Avatar users as Dreamwalkers.Medalion said:
Puncture said:
Well, the day a story is made that is as interesting as the ones with cliches, I'll check 'em out, but pretty much everything since I can remember is like that. And hey, there are a lot of plot devices. How differently and unaccordingly would everything have to happen if she WASN'T the chief's daughter? If it was just some random chick of the tribe, nobody would listen to her, and the entire story would need work-arounds.
And it was supposed to symbolize his pure spirit, I'm pretty sure. "He's like a baby." There's a reason that was a motif. Not to mention the uncontainable joy of having legs again...
Castle Doctrine
Member
For the most part I agree with Forkball's list, but I still enjoyed Avatar a lot. Over the years I've learned to lower my expectations when it comes to movies because the majority are filled with the usual cliches, stereotypes and phony dialogue. Just gotta accept it or I might as well stop watching movies (the big budget ones anyway). Occasionally a miracle happens and a film rises above the cliches, but that really wasn't Avatar. Still, the CGI and 3D effects were incredible and I enjoyed it for that, and I liked Zoe Saldana's character, Neytiri.
Another cool thing is I somehow managed to know nothing about this movie except that Cameron directed, it was in 3D, and it had those blue creatures. That's it! Nothing better than going in fresh with something as big as this.
If I had to pick the biggest flaw though, it was those villain characters. Wow talk about cartoon bad guys.
Another cool thing is I somehow managed to know nothing about this movie except that Cameron directed, it was in 3D, and it had those blue creatures. That's it! Nothing better than going in fresh with something as big as this.
If I had to pick the biggest flaw though, it was those villain characters. Wow talk about cartoon bad guys.
Karma Kramer
Banned
I think there's something very interesting going on underneath all Cameron movies. I think he has a unique ability to create something completely relatable and universal, filled with cliches... but at its core this is probably one of the more thought provoking films I have seen since the Matrix. Films that put the intellectualism at the fore-front come across as too preachy and it prevents an individual from experiencing the film's message in the form of an epiphany. Do you ever find yourself wanting to re-watch Synecdoche, New York? I'm sure there is a shit-load to take away from that movie, but it fails to provide an experience like Avatar, which you happily enjoy rinsing and repeating.
Kyzer said:
Hey it is what it is. You can argue it all day but there was next to no surprise or mystery in the movie whatsoever. There was a lot of eyecandy, some lovely pacing, among other things. But the story was flat out forgettable.
Period.
Im sorry but it felt a little to much like watching a bastardized cliched fern gully in 2010 3D. And ALOT of people are going to feel that way whether you like it or not. It IMO had a chance to be a completely phenomenal movie. Instead its a phenomenally crafted (visually to be specific) movie with an run of the mill story to tell. And thats perfectly fine btw. But its not going to be nearly as memorable as some of this guys past work.
Neuromancer
Member
That's true. I guess if we knew more about Earth's condition and how unobtainium could have helped, maybe that would have helped us understand the corporation and military's motivation a little better.The-Warning said:
Personally I don't care too much. Yes the story was pretty cliched but the way it was told and the use of the avatars is what made it a little different. Besides as the crazy guy from the 70 minute Phantom Menace review puts it, having a likable protagonist go through a normal story arc isn't a bad idea for most sci-fi movies.
Actually while I'm on the subject, I think it's interesting to compare this movie to the Phantom Menace. Both were hugely CG affairs, billed as epics, and coming from a writer/director who hadn't really made a regular movie in years. But somehow Lucas really and truly screwed up PM and personally I think Cameron hit Avatar out of the park.
a Master Ninja
Member
Just saw Avatar for the first time today. He may be cliché, but scarred general dude's badass displays were damn fun to watch.
In your opinion. The broad arc everyone knew going in. But I thought there was a great deal of originality in the details, and I found the characters to be much stronger than they're painted as. While familiar in the overall arc, I think the quality of the story (and the story telling) is one of the films strengths.Puncture said:
Masks on! MASKS ON!a Master Ninja said:
Agree all around.Karma Kramer said:
Also, I was digging through my GAF bookmarks folder and found this:
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=18296466&postcount=6846
He's banned, alas.
Neuromancer
Member
:lolGhaleonEB said:
HUELEN10
Member
So, my pops wants to drag me to see this movie. I have a lot of it spoiled already, but I don't want any more of it spoiled. I have read in this very thread however that the script and stuff, to many, is average. Again, I have missed the last couple of pages of this thread because I don't want more spoilers. If you are not big on romance or this type of sci-fi, would it be worth it? I am not trying to discredit a film I haven't even seen, I am merely trying to see if it is worth going, after all, no movie is tailor-made for all tastes, right?
Oh, one more thing...
3D is NOT an option.
Oh, one more thing...
3D is NOT an option.
TacticalFox88
Banned
Dude I'm gonna be straight up with you. If you don't see this movie in 3D the first time, you're missing out on an experience of a life time. Just my take on it.HUELEN10 said:
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
HUELEN10 said:
Why isn't 3D an option?
Any way, my mum who hates all things sci-fi loved it when I took her yesterday. Something I have never seen her get excited over. Whether you like the story or not, I guarantee you that you won't feel cheated for your money like with most other films. Many like the story very much, despite its predictability.
Karma Kramer
Banned
Unless your blind in one eye... go see it in 3D
elrechazado
Banned
Forkball said:
yeah, the predictability is what really got me on this movie. I hate films where I can basically narrate it in my head and know what the characters and plot devices are going to be well before they happen.
HUELEN10
Member
He's blind in one eye.Karma Kramer said:
jerk 
Hmm. My question once again is how much of the film's total enjoyment is dependent upon 3D. I mean, obviously it's the same film, but would the experience be any less, or merely different? I really want it to be the latter, you can imagine why.Scullibundo said:
Please understand that I am not trying to drag the film or anything of the sort, but I know that a lot of you loved the movie. Who better to be honest with me right? Would you like to take your father to a half-experience that rubs his weakness it in his face? Of course not, that would be cruel.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
I saw this today.
It was enjoyable, but the 3D didn't feel like 3D at all. Most of the time it only looked like 2D, and when it was obviously 3D it made me feel uneasy.
I think what I'm trying to say is that I don't know if I like this 3D thingamajig or not.
It was enjoyable, but the 3D didn't feel like 3D at all. Most of the time it only looked like 2D, and when it was obviously 3D it made me feel uneasy.
I think what I'm trying to say is that I don't know if I like this 3D thingamajig or not.
Enjoyment is not dependent on 3D. 3D adds another dimension (hurr) to the experience, but other than that, with 2D you still have the exceptional world, amazing action, likeable characters and well done story.HUELEN10 said:He's blind in one eye.
jerk
Hmm. My question once again is how much of the film's total enjoyment is dependent upon 3D. I mean, obviously it's the same film, but would the experience be any less, or merely different? I really want it to be the latter, you can imagine why.
Please understand that I am not trying to drag the film or anything of the sort, but I know that a lot of you loved the movie. Who better to be honest with me right? Would you like to take your father to a half-experience that rubs his weakness it in his face? Of course not, that would be cruel.
elrechazado
Banned
Because he's about as deep as snidely whiplash or the villains in captain planet cartoons.Krev said:
People do what they are paid to do. He's a combat veteran who loves the fight, has been hired to use force, and is surrounded with weaponry galore at his command. And since his injury, he's had a grudge against not just the Na'vi but the entire native population.
But more broadly, he's just doing his job. He's there to use force to get the mineral. So that's what he's going to do.
Grimm Fandango
Member
HUELEN10 said:He's blind in one eye.
jerk
Hmm. My question once again is how much of the film's total enjoyment is dependent upon 3D. I mean, obviously it's the same film, but would the experience be any less, or merely different? I really want it to be the latter, you can imagine why.
Please understand that I am not trying to drag the film or anything of the sort, but I know that a lot of you loved the movie. Who better to be honest with me right? Would you like to take your father to a half-experience that rubs his weakness it in his face? Of course not, that would be cruel.
You'll get increased enjoyment out of 3D but it's just a small factor in the movie. 2D would still look amazingly good.
To not see this movie because you are unable to view it in 3D is idiotic. Go see it.
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
Dead said:
I think I would have liked it a lot more if I had seen it in 2D. I would be four bucks richer and the movie would have looked brighter.
Scarecrow
Member
I think a lot of the criticism (at least for me) is that in this movie Cameron is just mining established cliche's instead of creating the next generation of them. It always seemed to me that he created a lot of what would become movie tropes with stuff like the Terminators and Aliens.
Snowman Prophet of Doom
Member
2D would have the added advantage of increased brightness.
Regulus Tera said:
I actually liked that the 3d was subtle in most parts of the movie, you don't notice it, but it is in every scene, the way I think about this type of 3d is "a 3d room beyond the screen" in a sense that it doesn't pop out of the screen, it adds a feeling of depth of field, as if you are looking into another room, rather than a flat screen
Regulus Tera
Romanes Eunt Domus
tabsina said:
My problem with it is that, if you don't notice it, then what's the point of 3D?
I think the only movie I've seen that actually utilises it as an enhancement that's not annoying or irregular is Coraline.
TacticalFox88
Banned
I think he means you know it's there...but you don't know it's there. It's kinda hard to explain.Regulus Tera said:
OH shit. Avatar am doomed?
http://www.deadline.com/hollywood/
Both Sherlock and Avatar estimated at a 24 million Friday with Sherlock possibly ahead, Poor Cameron
http://www.deadline.com/hollywood/
Both Sherlock and Avatar estimated at a 24 million Friday with Sherlock possibly ahead, Poor Cameron
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
Wow, it only JUST beat Avatar on its opening weekend and was also playing in 174 more theatres. The legs on this motherfucker! Expect to see Avatar back at #1 next week.
LeMaximilian
Alligator F*ck House
I find it funny how narrow the figures are for a film debut against the 2nd weekend. Holmes is a pretty big release, especially if Avatar's able to keep the same box office around its release.
Totally, feels way longer. I've been to Pandora 3 times already...
Combine said:
Totally, feels way longer. I've been to Pandora 3 times already...
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
I want to see the Foreign numbers after the weekend. The WW gross is going to be massive.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
Combine said:
Checking any given time here the true IMAX in Darling Harbour is still sold out for a week in advance.
RSLAEV
Member
I refuse to let this thread convince me that hackey bullshit cliche's are actually 'Familiar Plot Devices'
"A cliché is a saying, expression, idea, or element of an artistic work which has been overused to the point of losing its original meaning or effect rendering it a stereotype, especially when at some earlier time it was considered meaningful or novel. The term is frequently used in modern culture for an action or idea which is expected or predictable, based on a prior event."
So I think the fact that these elements can be seen coming a mile away and are so predictable as to strip them of any emotional impact makes them cliche. You may see similar elements in other *good* movies, but that doesn't excuse them.
"A cliché is a saying, expression, idea, or element of an artistic work which has been overused to the point of losing its original meaning or effect rendering it a stereotype, especially when at some earlier time it was considered meaningful or novel. The term is frequently used in modern culture for an action or idea which is expected or predictable, based on a prior event."
So I think the fact that these elements can be seen coming a mile away and are so predictable as to strip them of any emotional impact makes them cliche. You may see similar elements in other *good* movies, but that doesn't excuse them.
SCULLIBUNDO
Banned
RSLAEV said:
You raise a good point. Anything else?
BruceLeeRoy
Banned
Though I do understand peoples complaints about the story using familiar plot devices and that while I was watching it I had a general idea of where it was going to lead I still thought the journey it took to get there was almost flawless. Yes there is some dances with wolves or some last samurai and such but I think it captured all those elements in such a breathtaking setting and with such great characters that at the end its simply better than all the movies it imitates.
To me anyway.
To me anyway.
Scarecrow
Member
This sounds like something a poster had said a little earlier in this thread.Dead said:OH shit. Avatar am doomed?
http://www.deadline.com/hollywood/
Both Sherlock and Avatar estimated at a 24 million Friday with Sherlock possibly ahead, Poor Cameron
Revelations
Banned
I was actually rooting for Sherlocke Holmes there for a moment. Avatar is a success no doubt and he will continue the franchise but Sherlock was pretty good too.
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