DynamiteCop!
Banned
I still don't see this system being a thing.
Significantly cheaper GPU,smaller SSD, no disk drive.But "HOW" can the SSD and CPU be the exact same AND Lockhart cost $299 compared to XSX being $500-$550?
Thankfully it's over 10TF eh?Too bad you wont be able to experience true next-gen on a 9TF console at all![]()
4tf should be able to do about 1/2 the resolution of the PS5.
Pretty good idea considering PS5/XSX are rumoured to be $449/499
Moreover, if Sony had something like that, wouldn’t they release it, instead of taking this ‘PS5 is weaker’ thing on the chin? If there was some kind of ‘Secret Sauce’, it would make sense to promote that absolutely everywhere, and especially during Cerny’s event.
They’re okay with being less powerful. Their priorities are likely elsewhere, as we saw with the PS4 Pro.
Well, if they can use GDDR5 then all of the components could be the same or cheaper than the One X, apart from the storage. Since the One X used a 367mm^2 chip and required some exotic cooling, and Lockhart could be 200mm^2 with a more straightforward setup.You think this will equal to a $200 savings for MS though? I'm not so sure.
Be smarter than this. I'm talking about the marketing. We of course know why a 4TF Lockhart is better than a 6 TF XBX.
How does this look?
XSX
APU 52(56CU) $120
RAM 16GB 14gbps $80
SSD 1TB $150*
BD $20
PSU $20
HSF/CENTRE ALU BLOCK $20
WIFI/BT/MISC CHIPS $15
CASE/ASSEMBLY $20
Controller $15
Total $460
XSS
APU 18(20CU) $72 (-40%)
RAM 12GB 14gbps $60 (-25%)
SSD 500GB $100* (-33%)
PSU $10
HSF $10
WIFI/BT/MISC CHIPS $15
CASE/ASSEMBLY $15
CONTROLLER $15$
Total $297 (+$15 if BD drive included)
*Bloomberg estimate. May be way overestimated.
You are telling me to be smarter after multiple people have you told you exactly how it can be $200 cheaper than the XSX? Oh the irony.
The marketing really isn't that difficult? How does any other product in the tech world that has multiple skus with different levels of hardware market? Its not hard at all. The biggest difference that people will see instantly is the price and then ask questions. People that see the price difference and then have to ask questions are not going to fall down a hole of Teraflops and Xbox One X GCN TF vs Lockhart RDNA TF. You are creating scenarios that just don't exist.
How can MS expect people to see or even care about the PS5 being 15% weaker in GPU power than XSX when Lockhart is 200% less powerful than XSX?
Wow why sosocrates is banned dude
Would you have any idea how much shipping, retail percentage, distribution, etc cost on top of that BOM?
I think you overestimate their need to demonstrate anything at all regarding comparisons to PS5. Everything depends on price point, if XSX is substantially more expensive it will have a lot to prove.
The other way to look at Lockhart is what happens if everyone sees the same games running at similar framerates as PS5 and XSX but at lower resolutions? Will they continue to not care about resolution and buy the cheaper option (as they've been doing with One S and PS4 Base)? Would this make the premium consoles seem "niche" and unnecessary to the general market? Does MS care if they are the only ones serving that market with a low cost option? Many questions.
That was a really benign post to get banned on, wasn't it?
Ive seen that poster (sosocrates) quite alot
Is there any reason for his ban?
It appears to be the post you quoted, that's the one referenced in the "bans" area. Might have been more of cumulative thing however, that poster is funny to me, but can be a bit of a console warrior.
I think you overestimate their need to demonstrate anything at all regarding comparisons to PS5. Everything depends on price point, if XSX is substantially more expensive it will have a lot to prove.
The other way to look at Lockhart is what happens if everyone sees the same games running at similar framerates as PS5 and XSX but at lower resolutions? Will they continue to not care about resolution and buy the cheaper option (as they've been doing with One S and PS4 Base)? Would this make the premium consoles seem "niche" and unnecessary to the general market? Does MS care if they are the only ones serving that market with a low cost option? Many questions.
Would you have any idea how much shipping, retail percentage, distribution, etc cost on top of that BOM?
THE:MILKMAN is the only person to show how it could be cheaper and by how much. I'm literally creating scenarios that everyone has been talking about on GAF and every other videogame forum, social media site, blog, and podcast between the XSX and PS5.
Like what are you talking about? There's a high possibility that MS will have the Xbox One S, Xbox One X, Xbox Series S, and Xbox Series X on store shelves all at the same time. And the "and then ask questions" is the part I'm talking about. You don't think it can be kinda confusing to some casual gamers?
Thats quite unfortunate...
I hope someday he will reapear..reborn..under new name...
I see no place for Lockhart. People are arguing 1080p, but that metric in PC circles is associated with PC kit that can do 4k 30-60fps on PC, but people prefer to play at high frames and lower rez for fluidity with no sudden framerate tank falls.
Consoles are supposed to move the entire paradigm forward: resolution, framerates, fidelity, ai, physics, gameplay.....Offering scaled down experiences after 7 years of mostly sub parts XBONES hardware is not ideal......
Most console gamers don't have or game on 1080p 144-240hz monitors, they game on a 4k set.... I've had my 4k set for the balance of this current gen, next gen consoles are going to do 4k like PS4 did 1080p this gen, there is no way why Any console gamer should be gaming in 1080p next gen with reduced RT effects and compromised parts to hit some low tier price point.... It won't work and if MS releases this, they would have misread the market yet again.
Look at XBONEX, that thing just came out, not so long ago actually, hyped to heavens, it's now sub $300, but in reality no one should have bought it at $500, because it was discounted almost immediately after launch due to low sales....... But MS has no problem stopping production and moving on to the next thing they hype, no longevity for their products as history confirms...
Now, that Xbonex is premium just as series, but look how quickly it got cheap and discounted everywhere, why would Series X be any different? Why would anyone go buy a Lockhart for $299, a 1080p console in late 2020, when 4k tv's are as cheap as roadkill since years ago, when Series X may very well be 299-399 on sale in early 2021.....What type of value will a Lockhart hold in 2021 for resale when a series x a 4k console may be close to Lockhart asking prices in a sale.
Lockhart is going to be a hard sell, even to the poor folk..... People have to remember, people don't just buy stuff because it's cheap, they are quicker to buy cheaper products with lots of value, hence PS4 vs XBONES and Ryzen vs Intel.....
His butt.Latest statistics show that nearly 70% of U.S. households still have 1080p televisions (or a resolution other than 4k). Could not find world wide numbers but I’m not expecting a wide variance.
![]()
4K Ultra HDTV US household penetration 2014-2018 | Statista
As of 2018, around 31 percent of U.S.www.statista.com
What data are you relying upon to support your claim that “most” console players have 4k televisions?
Latest statistics show that nearly 70% of U.S. households still have 1080p televisions (or a resolution other than 4k). Could not find world wide numbers but I’m not expecting a wide variance.
![]()
4K Ultra HDTV US household penetration 2014-2018 | Statista
As of 2018, around 31 percent of U.S.www.statista.com
What data are you relying upon to support your claim that “most” console players have 4k televisions?
They arent focusing on it. They have a product for both markets.Yeah but 4K is the future and more and more people will be adopting 4K TV
Whats the point of focusing on 1080p TV in 2020 onwards
I wonder how this thread would be different if Sony had a cheaper system coming this gen also![]()
They arent focusing on it. They have a product for both markets.
They arent focusing on it. They have a product for both markets.
I understand that but launching a nextgen system weaker than current gen is just ridiculous for me
Lockhart nextgen xbox is weaker than Xbox One X imagine that
The problem is that PS5 will be 100 or 150 dollars more and give you much more....
People know they can connect any console to a 1080p TV anyway.... I will do it
And when they decide to change that TV they will have a Premium console ready to use
Its not weaker by any means. Its stronger.
Lockhart 4 tf (RDNA 2, Zen 2 CPU, NVMe SSD) Xbox One X 6 tf (dated GCN, embarrassing CPU, mechanical HDD)
?
Fixed to update details.![]()
Well, you refuse to believe something about a device (allegedly coming out, no confirmation) that we know nothing about. Until we get official word on what is in this supposed Lockhart, we won't know so you are totally allowed to refuse to believe that and it is just a legitimate to refuse to believe it will be superior to the One X.I still refuse to believe that lockhart is superior to one x
No matter what theres no excuses to put a new console with less tf than the older one
Latest statistics show that nearly 70% of U.S. households still have 1080p televisions (or a resolution other than 4k). Could not find world wide numbers but I’m not expecting a wide variance.
![]()
4K Ultra HDTV US household penetration 2014-2018 | Statista
As of 2018, around 31 percent of U.S.www.statista.com
What data are you relying upon to support your claim that “most” console players have 4k televisions?
The number of households with a 4K TV to grow from 28 million in 2015 to 335 million in 2020. However, not all of these households will have a 4K TV content service
Lockhart 4 tf Xbox One X 6 tf
?
I still refuse to believe that lockhart is superior to one x
No matter what theres no excuses to put a new console with less tf than the older one
Ok, a report which mostly consists of data from the years 2014/2015 and most part of 2016 before any of the pseudo 4K consoles made it to the market is your up to date data...For your information we are in the year 2020, the year of our lord and by the time these new consoles make it in, we will be near the year 2021.....A 1080p console in late 2020/ early 2021, good luck with that.....The PRO consoles will be targeting 8K and 8K CB, you will even get 8K games on PS5 and series X, but you think a 1080p Lockhart is a good idea.
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https://technology.informa.com/609782/4k-tv-and-uhd-the-whole-picture
https://4kuniversenow.com/pages/4k-market-research
I still refuse to believe that lockhart is superior to one x
No matter what theres no excuses to put a new console with less tf than the older one
Except it's not. Nice try though. Cannot have it both ways.That spin was tried already on a previous page nice try though.
Your figure is not even for just 2018 or adoption would have been higher YOY...…...It starts from 2014, when most people were using 1080p consoles, hell even 720p-900p consoles in case of the XBONE......Lockhart is not launching till late 2020......Adoption rate of 4K will be magnitudes higher and 8K will be hitting the shelves.....Good luck selling a 1080p console...….And always remember consoles set trends, the masses will be living 1080p behind, just like they left 720p behind when PS4 came along.....Next gen will be 4K country...…..both true next gen consoles will do 4k natively on the majority of their titles, even 4K tv content and sub service content will be a massive driver...……….Funny enough, it's also when 4K UHD discs makes most sense......Funny how MS always misreads the market and don't understand when certain specs are viable, when certain marketing monikers are most apt....The numbers I gave you were current through 2018. And you still haven’t answered my question. Or didn’t you think I would notice? Where is the worldwide data for console players?
Why this when One X is more powerfull?
buying a console never qualify as "investment" unless you speculate on its price to resell it at an higher price down the road.Lockart would be 21 to 82% more expensive than the XSX performancewise, making it a terrible investment dollar per teraflops (excl. missing features like no BD, smaller SSD etc.).
Be smarter than this. I'm talking about the marketing.
Latest statistics show that nearly 70% of U.S. households still have 1080p televisions (or a resolution other than 4k). Could not find world wide numbers but I’m not expecting a wide variance.
![]()
4K Ultra HDTV US household penetration 2014-2018 | Statista
As of 2018, around 31 percent of U.S.www.statista.com
What data are you relying upon to support your claim that “most” console players have 4k televisions?
Least?Marketing should be MS least concerns, they would have the most powerful next-gen console and the cheapest next-gen console, it's impossible to have any simpler and more obvious massage for the consumers.
I told you exactly how it can be cheaper using a 2060 vs 2080 and you chose to ignore the comment. Not my fault you are picking and choosing what to respond to.
And again you are talking about the 1 percent who go to blogs, listen to gaming podcasts, gaf etc.
The casual gamer as you call it isn't going to walk into a store, see the supposed layout of 4 different xbox's and just get so overwhelmed and have a melt down. They will either ask a friend, do a google search, see the Series X and S are new and pick that up if they choose. When a consumer goes and buys an iPhone and see the iPhone X, iPhone SE, iPhone XR, iPhone 11 Pro, iPhone 11 Pro Max and the iPhone 11 do they get confused and just leave without a phone?
Your figure is not even for just 2018 or adoption would have been higher YOY...…...It starts from 2014, when most people were using 1080p consoles, hell even 720p-900p consoles in case of the XBONE......Lockhart is not launching till late 2020......Adoption rate of 4K will be magnitudes higher and 8K will be hitting the shelves.....Good luck selling a 1080p console...….And always remember consoles set trends, the masses will be living 1080p behind, just like they left 720p behind when PS4 came along.....Next gen will be 4K country...…..both true next gen consoles will do 4k natively on the majority of their titles, even 4K tv content and sub service content will be a massive driver...……….Funny enough, it's also when 4K UHD discs makes most sense......Funny how MS always misreads the market and don't understand when certain specs are viable, when certain marketing monikers are most apt....
Think you’re forgetting something. Enjoy Godfall.
He said console gamers. Everyone owning a TV doesn't game on consoles.
This data is also from 2014-2018. It was very common for people in 2014 to have 1080p TVs, compared to now where 4K TVs can be bought dirt cheap. The data we need now is to see how many console gamers are gaming on 4KTVs.
New Zen CPU is massively more powerful than the Jag in the Xbox One X and the 4TF in the Lockhart is based on RDNA meaning its on par with the One X in terms of raw TF output due to the new architecture but it will also have far more GPU features due to it being RDNA.
You are falling victim to marketing.
You did, but you posted data that doesn't really dispute his point since its not a stat for console gamers. Try paying attention, okay?Isn’t that what I asked him for? Try to keep up ok.![]()