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Russia begins Invasion of Ukraine
- Thread starter AfricanKing
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And in all those years since, leaders of Russia learned nothing
It’s a sad state of affairs.
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nemiroff
Gold Member
Well.., according to ruZZian MoD they destroyed 5 Patriot missile launchers and a Patriot radar system:
Russia stated that its Kinzhal destroyed 5 Patriot missile system launchers with one attack
The Russian Defence Ministry claims that five launchers of the American Patriot air defence system were "completely destroyed" by a hypersonic Kinzhal strike on 16 May in Kyiv. Source: Russia's Ministry of Defence on Telegram Quote: "According to reliably confirmed data, on 16 May, as a result...
lol
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winjer
Gold Member
And in all those years since, leaders of Russia learned nothing
It's a common issue with all dictators, as they are more concerned about remaining in power, than is advancing the country.
Mind you, I'm not complaining. It's a good thing they fail developments like these.
NoLootBoxDev
Member
Ukraine tells China envoy it won't cede territory to Russia to achieve peace
telegraph.co.uk/world-...
they should have told them: they would do it, if they recognize Taiwan as an independent country, as see their expressions go wild:
Wildebeest
Member
The west could have had hypersonic missiles in the 70s, but they were judged pointless and a waste of resources even for the US military, the number one resource wasting organization around.
Highway Star
Member
Same thing with the nuclear powered cruise missile. The states found it not to be practical.
Russia tries and has a nuclear accident in the process.
Wildebeest
Member
When you let post truth propagandists decide these things, you get impressive sounding nazi wunderwaffen which are only effective in comic books and video games.
Morrie’s wig shop
Banned
What a fucking joke show, holy shit!
Russia arrest three scientists that are part of their “hypersonic” missile system (I can’t even say it with a straight face) because it’s getting decimated by a offensive weapon system created back in the 1970s’.
Anyone on this planet back in 90-91?
Remember the first Gulf war? Remember the state of the art, technology that no other country could possibly possess except Russia? The SCUD missile?
It’s a repeat of SCUD vs PATRIOT all over again.
Russia arrest three scientists that are part of their “hypersonic” missile system (I can’t even say it with a straight face) because it’s getting decimated by a offensive weapon system created back in the 1970s’.
Anyone on this planet back in 90-91?
Remember the first Gulf war? Remember the state of the art, technology that no other country could possibly possess except Russia? The SCUD missile?
It’s a repeat of SCUD vs PATRIOT all over again.
Gp1
Member
Except that todays Patriot isn't the desert storm Patriot and the Khinzal isn't the Scud.
It's worse, the Iskander and the Khinzal were developed to defeat defenses like the Patriots.
A little off topic now: The Scud threat in the desert storm wasn't because of their technological advancement. The Scud series was a glorified V2.
Yes... THAT V2.
The problem was that if Iraq launched a bunch of these at Israel and the US didn't respond. Israel would probably have responded and attacked Iraq and the coalition of Arab countries in the DS would have imploded.
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And in all those years since, leaders of Russia learned nothing
The soviets killed most of their actual elite and replaced them with revolutionaries. Purging and self preservation are all they know.
NoLootBoxDev
Member
Roll Fizzlebeef
Member
NoLootBoxDev
Member
TransTrender
Gold Member
Get fucked
jonnyp
Member
They like to spend money
Tams
Member
Part of it has been stupidity.
But:
- Genuine fears that Russia may escalate in response (and they kind of have with the missile strikes)
- Poor intel in some areas
- An initial image of the Russian armed forces being corrupt by at least somewhat competent in parts (why else would the US have offered to evacuate Zelensky at the start of the war?)
- Uncertainty of the resolve and integrity of the Ukrainian leadership
- Uncertainty of the resolve, capability, and integrity of the Ukrainian armed forces and people
- Massive cultural and political barriers to overcome: Germany and sending weapons, the EU providing military aid, etc.
- Unpreparedness for a war, so needing to increase war materiel production
- Considerations of countries' own defences and their obligations to others other than Ukraine
- Training takes time, and neither 'The West' nor Ukraine want personnel and equipment wasted by not being used properly.
Oh, and it's only been a year and a couple of months. That's really not that long, especially for long held beliefs and stances to change, equipment to be procured (in a good state), and Ukrainians to be trained on it.
I don't want to be too rude, but that's just after some very basic critical thinking and somewhat keeping up with the news.
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FUBARx89
Member
Bit rich though isn't it. Having to rely on Iran to get suicide drones to attack civilian infrastructure, but soon as anything goes to Ukraine they spit their dummy out.
I wonder how many people in the Kremlin get nervous after saying this shit constantly knowing their army has been shown to be incredibly lackluster compared to how they've always presented it.
Lukaku's First Touch
Member
I think after the complete failure of their hypersonic unstoppable weapon, the Russians are even more scared their nuclear arsenal is complete shit and will be shot down before they even cross the bordee.
FunkMiller
Member
Oh, I think they absolutely know their nuclear arsenal is complete shit. And the more time that goes by, the west knows it too.
winjer
Gold Member
That is one good reason for Russia not to use nuclear weapons. If the rest of the world finds out that Russia can't deliver these weapons, it will nullify most of the fear it can project.
And it will mean that a lot of countries will want to buy western weapon systems that can protect them from Russia's nuclear threat.
And it will mean that a lot of countries will want to buy western weapon systems that can protect them from Russia's nuclear threat.
FunkMiller
Member
The pro-Russian shills on social media really are having the biggest meltdown yet about the F-16s. It's fascinating to see what the Kremlin is really afraid of, because it always comes with the biggest backlash of misinformation and derision from the bots and sock puppet accounts. They know that F-16 = complete dominance of the skies above Ukraine.
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winjer
Gold Member
They are lucky the west is only giving Ukraine F-16. If it were F-15s, it would be much worse for Russia. And even worse if it were F-35s.
The likelihood of the USA giving F-35s to Ukraine is close to zero. But if it ever happened, Russians would have the biggest fit ever in their history.
Not even when they were raped hard by the Japanese in 1905, would match the level of copium necessary.
FunkMiller
Member
The F16 is good enough to terrify the shit out of them, I think. Has a wide spectrum of potential armaments and technology available to it, and perhaps most importantly, can carry cruise missiles.
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winjer
Gold Member
The F16 is great. But the F15 would be even better.
And the F35 would be like playing will cheats
Liljagare
Member
Portugal to train Ukrainian pilots
Portugal to train Ukrainian pilots
Portugal has made a decision to join the aviation coalition aimed at strengthening the Air Force of Ukraine
mil.in.ua
Nice to see country after country giving more help.
FunkMiller
Member
The F16 is great. But the F15 would be even better.
And the F35 would be like playing will cheats
I think the F16 might be a better bet in this situation than the F15, given its better manoeuvrability. Pretty limited air space they’ll be operating in, and I doubt the F15’s greater speed and ceiling would matter that much.
The F35 is entirely a different matter though. On another level - but the US aren’t handing any of them over.
Liljagare
Member
I really wish we'd have time to fit the Strf 90 with adativ before we sent them. Would have been hilarious to see the RuSSkies deal with it.
Or, someone order some and lets try out the CV90120-T Ghost in real combat conditions..
CV90120-T Ghost Stealth Tank | Full specifications and history
The Swedish CV90120-T Ghost is the latest version of the CV90120-T medium tank. It features BAE's camouflage technology called ADAPTIV.
fighting-vehicles.com
Hopefully Ukraine will get some of the more advanced systems, planes, tanks, even some of the modern helo's would smack all that WW2 era tech back to the stone age. The Archers are doing extremely well so far, and no losses, that is what we want to see, even if there is a risk of some equipment getting captured, RuSSia is in no state to take advantage for a long time. And, the west is allready well on the way to develop into the next generation.
winjer
Gold Member
The F-16 is a cheap all around fighter. The F15 is the best air superiority fighter ever.
CharmingCharlie
Member
I like to think of it is as NATO and the US applying the boiling frog syndrome to Russia. Most will know what that is, but just in case. If you stick a live frog into a hot pan it will immediately leap out. But if you put the frog into a cold pan and slowly heat the pan up the frog will happily boil alive. I think this is what the Western Allies have been doing. I don't doubt that if we had been doing half the shit we are doing now right at the beginning of the war it would have provoked a more catastrophic response from Russia. However by gradually increasing our military support to Ukraine the good ole Russian Army is slowly being boiled away (sometimes literally inside those shit tanks of theirs).
Admittedly they could have progressed things faster after all we are dealing with a bunch of fuckwits that have less intelligence than a frog.
Gp1
Member
About the F-16 debate.
The F-16 was chosen because it's simply the most common and abundant fighter aircraft of that generation. I believe it's the most produced fighter of the Cold War after the Mig 21. The supply chain, training and the ground crew availability is ample and available in a lot of countries.
This isn't about raw performance, it's all about logistics.
As an example, they could have chosen the legacy Hornet. Performance wise they are very similar to the MIG 29 that Ukraine operates for years and Australia has a huge fleet of these retired, stored and available. But the supply chain of legacy Hornets spare parts is unavailable. (It can still be included in a future package, we'll see)
The most important question now is which armament will be included with F-16. Another example. Some analysts said that old Amraams still are outranged by the Russian's most modern missile, although they are probably available in great quantity, and I don't know if the coalition would be ok to supply the most recent ones.
The F-16 was chosen because it's simply the most common and abundant fighter aircraft of that generation. I believe it's the most produced fighter of the Cold War after the Mig 21. The supply chain, training and the ground crew availability is ample and available in a lot of countries.
This isn't about raw performance, it's all about logistics.
As an example, they could have chosen the legacy Hornet. Performance wise they are very similar to the MIG 29 that Ukraine operates for years and Australia has a huge fleet of these retired, stored and available. But the supply chain of legacy Hornets spare parts is unavailable. (It can still be included in a future package, we'll see)
The most important question now is which armament will be included with F-16. Another example. Some analysts said that old Amraams still are outranged by the Russian's most modern missile, although they are probably available in great quantity, and I don't know if the coalition would be ok to supply the most recent ones.
nemiroff
Gold Member
Some older F-16 A/Bs are close to being nothing but junk by now, but the newer upgraded F-16 C/Ds with upgraded engines, radars, glass cockpits, weapons compatibility etc. (I think the latest ones that was sold was called Block 50/52) they'll be a good fit for Ukraine. /AFAIK
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Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Well, the battle for Bahkmut is over. It's been more than 9 months that have fixed the russian army and wagner against an easily defensible target. It's given Ukraine 9 months to train people, to arm people, for its western allies to deliver pledged equipment and materiel. All for the counteroffensive, whatever shape it takes.
And now we wait, we wait for the moment Ukraine decides to unleash 9 months worth of accumulated military power. Let's hope it bears fruit.
And now we wait, we wait for the moment Ukraine decides to unleash 9 months worth of accumulated military power. Let's hope it bears fruit.
FUBARx89
Member
Thought it was only Wagner leader claiming it's fallen?
Bitmap Frogs
Mr. Community
Ukrainian sources are reporting it as well.
In truth for the past week or so there was no permanent ukrainian presence left, they would go into to defend the last bit, then retreat to trenches outside since in order to take the city the russians demolished it in its entirety and there was no place left for them.
Of the city of Bahkmut only the name, and rubble, remains. It's nothing but a ruin. This link shows the cost of imposing "the russian world" on unwilling subjects.
Forsete
Member
It was only a matter of time, with the tactics the orcs were using defending it is not possible.
Bakhmut is only a pile of rubble now.
RIP to all that gave their lives defending this city. Heroiam slava!
Edit: Many months ago I saw a video from Willy 0AM [Youtube] where he interviewed a man (civilian) living in Bakhmut. The man didn't want to leave the city... and ever since I have been thinking of this man hoping he is alright. I hope he is.
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FUBARx89
Member
Ahhh, nothing on the guardian (I get my news there, I'm lazy).
They've done well to hold it for so long.
It's been equated the Paschendale for conditions & Dresden for destruction. Hopefully when the UA counteract begins they steamroll through it and take Wagner leader out at same time, if Putin doesn't throw him through a window first.
NoLootBoxDev
Member
NoLootBoxDev
Member
shame no bomb was dropped
LordOfChaos
Member
Honestly looks like Putin is trying to shed the countries youngest strongest men sometimes
When there's a lot of them and social unhappiness, overthrows happen.
*looks nervously at China's ambitions with Taiwan*
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