Buckethead
Banned
That "self reply" was always there.Koomaster said:
It was there as to not confuse people on my intentions and provide reasoning for said question.Koomaster said:
São Paulo council approves Heterosexual Pride Day
- Thread starter Platy
- Start date
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eznark said:
People feel threatened or offended because it is a threat and a offense. It will be a bunch of people calling themselves "normal" telling the "abominations" that they might have authorization to exist as long as they hide properly. Again, I find very dishonest to pretend that this event will be anything but that.
eznark said:
Don't ignore the historical and social contexts of different social groups. That's the dishonesty.
ZephyrFate
Banned
Bahahaha what.eznark said:
I said that gay people deserve a day to feel good about themselves for being gay.eznark said:
You responded why can't straight people have that - I assume you mean a day where they get to feel good about themselves for being straight.
I'm asking when DON'T straight people feel good about being straight? Why can't they have that? It's because they don't need that. There is no oppression or negative consequence to being straight to where straight people need to have a parade to feel good about their heterosexuality.
RunWhiteBoyRun
Member
Sblargh said:
So white people can't have a pride day because it's racist? People can say <insert color> Pride, but when it's crackers we gotta shut up?
ZephyrFate
Banned
And itRunWhiteBoyRun said:
begins.
eznark said:
If you are a minority and it is not that rare that people get murdered just for being what you are, then yes, you should feel threatened. When someone reports that 260 heterossexuals were killed last year just for being straight, you can start worrying about the gay parade.
Buckethead
Banned
I don't see the connection between persecution and ability to have parades.Sblargh said:
Nor bigotry and inability not to.
The KKK is a blatantly bigoted group and allowed to have a parade, for example.
Anyways this is Sao Paulo, not I don't know... a notoriously bigoted town in the South.
No, I'm saying why can't they have a day set aside to celebrate it. Do whatever it is straight Brazilians do for fun? I really do not understand how it's hateful, at all.Koomaster said:
It's like the 4th of July, but instead of celebrating your country you celebrate your sexuality. Sure, most people are proud of their country on a daily basis but all countries (most/all, whatever) still set aside a day to really do it up.
I don't think a celebration requires a history of victimization.
Plus, another excuse to booze. No one is saying you aren't invited.
Phoenician_Viking
Banned
Ahahahahaha, awesome.JJDinomite said:
ZephyrFate
Banned
Carnavale already fills in this exact same purpose.eznark said:
umop_3pisdn
Member
Buckethead said:
Persecution is like the entire raison d'etre behind "Gay Pride", so any comparison at all makes "Straight Pride" look ridiculous. Therefore, does it warrant a parade? If the intent is like cultivating a presence and strengthening solidarity... why would straight people even want a parade, it would seem kind of self indulgent and like empty pageantry.
Would serve absolutely no purpose. Gay parades have the purpose of educating and enlightening. A straight parade would do what, exactly? (besides making non-heterosexuals feel further excluded, that is). If you want a day set aside to celebrate and get drunk, you can do that on any of the numerous festive days available throughout the year. Actually, you can do that on any weekend of the year.eznark said:
The existence of festive days tie well with my first point too. They all exist for a purpose, or to mark some important historical event. A straight parade would just be wasteful indulgence. Bigoted indulgence, even.
Buckethead
Banned
How ethnocentric of you?umop_3pisdn said:
Irrelevant.Koodo said:
ZephyrFate
Banned
How in the world is that ethnocentric?Buckethead said:
A group of people having a day is the most stupid thing ever to begin with but I don't see why straight people or white people can't have one if everyone else can. It's only fair.
Wouldn't mind seeing a WET channel either, and I guess I should say in before someone says "hurr you have cspan or CMT"
Wouldn't mind seeing a WET channel either, and I guess I should say in before someone says "hurr you have cspan or CMT"
Buckethead
Banned
The terms "self indulgent" and "empty pageantry" are a value judgment from a gay pride perspective.ZephyrFate said:
If some idiots want to have a Heterosexual Get Drunk fest who cares, that is their right.
If it has personal utility to a group of people it has "purpose".
ZephyrFate
Banned
Homosexuality is not an ethnic group.Buckethead said:
Buckethead
Banned
But is a cultural group. Fits the definition.ZephyrFate said:
Buckethead said:
I would be as pissed if there was a KKK parade here too. My point is that bigoted events breed violence and therefore is bad, if you don't think they breed violence, we are discussing the validity of a fact; if you agree they breed violence, but should be allowed anyway, then we have a divergence of values.
Whatever it is, at least I'm happy you are apparently recognizing this as a bigot parade.
speculawyer
Member
whatever
People celebrate the entire history of their countries or great fights their country has been involved in, or like the 4th of July their independence from the oppression of their mother country. So there is a little bit of victimization there, so your analogy isn't spot on.eznark said:
And like I said in my first post, the idea in itself isn't hateful, but the baggage behind it makes it not only unnecessary but also belittling of the actual importance of a gay pride parade.
And vice versa, no one is saying straight people aren't invited to gay pride events. PFLAG exists for a reason. You want an excuse to booze it up; come out, participate, have a good time.
ZephyrFate
Banned
But it is not ethnocentrism anyway, since the claims of self-indulgence would be fact, not just biased opinion. Smart straight people would see it as completely narcissistic. You have every other day in the year to do it, and in the majority of the world gay pride isn't even a blip on your fucking radar so in those areas heterosexuals basically get the day anyway.Buckethead said:
Buckethead
Banned
I'm not though.Sblargh said:
The two aren't mutually exclusive.
I'm not saying I agree either way with a Hetero Pride Day - just pointing out inconsistencies.
Purpose is relative.Koodo said:
4th of July's purpose may be to celebrate the independence of our country.
Most people celebrate in ways inconsistent with this "purpose".
St. Patrick's Day is a religious holiday yet most people celebrate it by breaking biblical precepts and getting drunk.
Just because people deviate from a certain purpose and do unacceptable things according to your own personal beliefs, does not mean they don't have the right to do them nor should their rights be revoked because they can't make "proper" choices.
And btw, there was already a straight "protest" on Paulista earlier this year (or maybe last year, I don't remember), if anyone is wondering, it was just a hate fest with our special breed of miscigenated neonazis and fascists and the like. But I assure you that we are not, as a whole, a bigoted city.
Actually, I feel the pain of americans now when there is news of some little town hating on muslims on whatever and US-gaf has to explain you are not all like that.
Really, we are far from being all like that. Come to São Paulo, go to Paulista, kiss your homossexual partner, see people not giving a shit.
Actually, I feel the pain of americans now when there is news of some little town hating on muslims on whatever and US-gaf has to explain you are not all like that.
Really, we are far from being all like that. Come to São Paulo, go to Paulista, kiss your homossexual partner, see people not giving a shit.
That doesn't answer for these questionable parades being a wasteful indulgence, like I originally said. 4th of July and St. Patrick's Day are ultimately not a wasteful celebration in any way.Buckethead said:
There is a white parade here in Calgary every year. It causes more hardships to the city than benefits since (a) obviously a scant number of people attend, and (b) police must be present to ward off the threat of violence. The latter is a waste of time and resources.
I'm not sure how Sao Paolo would receive a straight parade, but I wouldn't be surprised if it ultimately results in a net loss. If that is the case, I am of the opinion that it should be barred from existing (and this is excluding disagreements with these parades on a moral ground).
Buckethead
Banned
How is a day entirely devoted to getting drunk not a "wasteful celebration" or "self-indulgent" (per your definition)?Koodo said:
Do you only read the first few sentences of my posts? (you seemed to have done the same with the prior post). I gave you financial reasons for my disagreements with the bigoted parades. Unless I'm mistaken, 4th of July and St. Patrick's Day celebrations pull in more gains for the cities they are held in than most festive days on the planet. It is not "wasteful" when a city ultimately benefits.Buckethead said:
Again, I'm excluding all numerous moral reasons I have to be against these parades and focusing on more objective grounds.
ZephyrFate
Banned
St. Patrick's Day is a celebration of Irish culture, dude.Buckethead said:
Buckethead
Banned
Tell that to a person of Irish descent or a real Catholic for that matter.ZephyrFate said:
Getting drunk as a celebration of Irish culture is one of the biggest, most offensive cliches there is out there.
I read all of your post - no need to get lippy.Koodo said:
You mix moral and economic terms and "purpose" is vague, so it's not exactly straightforward.
ZephyrFate
Banned
This still doesn't take away from the fact that a celebration of straightness which is 99.99% of all human history, culture, and society would be complete and utter hedonism. It would be on a level above celebrating drinking on St. Patrick's Day.Buckethead said:
ZephyrFate
Banned
You have everything.AVclub said:
cutmeamango
Banned
I'll enjoy that day like a real straight guy should: like any other day. Or knocking up a girl.
Buckethead
Banned
It doesn't really matter.ZephyrFate said:
What's Mardi Gras?
Wrong. I don't have everything. Not even close to everything. I also don't have a parade. Why should I be denied a parade by anyone for any reason? The fucking Nazis were allowed a parade in some US cities. Why shouldn't straight people who have no malicious agenda be allowed to march down the street proclaiming their happiness about being heterosexual?ZephyrFate said:
ZephyrFate
Banned
An equivalent celebration of drinking and debauchery, doing anything possible, before giving them up for Lent. I would call it hedonism as well.Buckethead said:
AVClub: I'll be sure to weep for you and the loss of your minutiae.
AVclub said:
They have a malicious agenda. Any straight parade will be a gathering of people with a malicious agenda. In the alternate universe where a straight parade isn't gay bashing, the idea would probably not even be considered as in this tolerant universe not even a gay parade would exist.
SouthernDragon
Member
us poor oppressed heteros
wont someone think of the heteros
wont someone think of the heteros
See, but that's a funny jump you just made. You assume that me wanting a parade means that I'm somehow unhappy without one. You assume I'm asking for non-heterosexual people to feel bad for me. I'm not. "Here you can have a parade" doesn't equal "Oh we feel so bad about your situation." So please save your tears. I don't even understand what "minutiae" you're talking about.ZephyrFate said:
I'm just saying a parade for straight people would be nice. "Mardi Gras" is for religious people who plan to give stuff up because of some ritual they believe in. You can't just say "Here straight people, use this parade to flaunt your straightness" anymore than I can say, "Here gay people, you can use the Coney Island Mermaid Parade or Village Halloween Parade in NYC to flaunt your gayness."
I want my fucking parade.
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