Gnome Scat
Member
I keep losing respect for this guy now that his true colors are coming out. Glad I got off the bandwagon when I did.
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Sanders campaign requests removal of 2 DNC members, threatens to halt convention
- Thread starter BreezyLimbo
- Start date
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It's basically impossible for him to win right now. He has insistently claimed that we need to wait for the California primary because there's so many delegates there, but polls in the state do not show him getting anywhere near the numbers he needs.
He is demanding that the people he perceives as political enemies be removed from committees they were elected to at the National Convention. He has no grounds to really do this, but is threatening to disrupt the convention if he does not get his way.
His campaign had meaningful discussions with HIV/AIDS activists. When the Sanders camp intimated that these activists supported some legislation that Sanders is in favor of, they clarified that their stance on the bill is currently neutral. A Sanders campaign manager immediately accused the activist group of being bought out by big pharmaceutical companies. This is despite the fact that the activist group actively campaigns for cheaper prescription drug prices.
When questioned on Univision about failing socialist states in Latin America, Sanders pled ignorance and pretty much just said "I'm running for President of the US and can't be bothered to know or comment about stuff like that".
Is that the full synopsis of Sanders' recent fuckups? Or did I miss something?
w h o c a r e s
Do you want his support? Do you think it will help Hillary? Then do what he wants. And from what I can tell, what he wants is meaningless.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
If his poisonous rhetoric causes his most ardent followers to either not vote or vote Trump (or vote third party), and enough of them do that to get Trump elected, he's done major damage.
I'm not saying that's the most likely outcome. But his constant call to arms against the party for which he's running is most certainly going to cause some damage. The extent of that damage remains to be seen.
But if he truly cared about the direction of this country, he'd avoid giving an arsonist like Trump any more fuel to use against Clinton and the DNC in the general.
excelsiorlef
Member
What? The RNC is coalescing around their nominee. As they should because they want to win.
And the DNC tried to give Sanders unprecedented influence and what did he do? Bring in fucking Cornel West and then try to have an inspirational gay and progressive Democratic icon removed because he's been mean to Sanders.
They gave and ge demanded more more more. He's made it clear on TYT that he might not accept anything short if a full scale adoption of his entire platform. So if that's the case fuck it cut him off now. He's just going to distupt the DNC anyway.
His support might be basically worthless now anyway so I don't know what I want.
BuggyDClown
Member
Man. I am still a bernie supporter, and I can get behind him at least staying in so every state gets to vote. I just also can not get behind some of the actions and voice that this campaign has taken.
I may end up voting hillary on the 7th at this rate.
Wish we had another 4 years of Obama :/ or Joe had it in him to run.
I may end up voting hillary on the 7th at this rate.
Wish we had another 4 years of Obama :/ or Joe had it in him to run.
I don't see how you can give him what he wants without burning the real Democrats who have been an ally for decades. I mean if I were in charge I'd certainly ask Frank and Malloy if they wanted to voluntarily step down in the name of preserving the peace.....but if they said "No, fuck Sanders" I sure as hell wouldn't force them out. You don't stab your friends in the back just to win the shaky, temporary loyalty of someone like Sanders.....who is now pretty obviously a turncoat.
The value of "his support" is kind of questionable. Don't the vast majority of Sanders supporters say that they will switch to Clinton anyway?
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Amen, brother.
Aaron Strife
Banned
I just can't believe Barney Frank of all people is being taken to task by the Bernie camp.
Sure, he accomplished the most significant financial regulation reform bill since the 30s but he hurt Bernie's fee fees.
Sure, he accomplished the most significant financial regulation reform bill since the 30s but he hurt Bernie's fee fees.
excelsiorlef
Member
Agreed. If they did it voluntarily it's sad but ok, kicking them off though is a betrayal.
You didn't see that coming after John Lewis and Planned Parenthood?
RCP as of today. I guess the disconnect is that I need more to feel that what they offered Sanders isn't fair. It's completely out of line with how things have worked in the past. It's a concession traditionally he isn't even entitled to, but now its suddenly not fair? I need more convincing on that.
There's also a disconnect in that I see his numbers dropping and they will continue to as we get through CA while Hillarys rises against him. She has almost already made up all the ground she lost on him. That's not going to get better. I don't think she needs his endorsement anymore to win, so feeding the bottomless well seems pointless to me now.
And finally, I disagree that giving him what he 'wants' is going to get him on your side. He was already given more than what tradition says he should get as the loser, and his response was to threaten chaos at the convention and demand to remove 2 other people, one of which solely because of something the guy said 25 years ago. That doesn't sound like someone you give something and they just sit happy and go along, that sounds like someone who gets the inch and demands the mile immediately after. And if he does exactly that they will have tried 2 times to placate him only to end up with egg on their face both times.
You and me both man.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Trust me, its gonna get worse before it gets better.
Saucycarpdog
Member
So if I'm reading the news right he just wants these two DNC members gone because they have a bit of a bias towards Hillary?
Now your just being petty Bernie.
Now your just being petty Bernie.
Intheflorsh
Banned
"Bernie or Bust" is an empty threat, don't treat it like the boogeyman. Most of those people will either vote for Hillary or, more likely, just won't vote. The portion of people who will actually vote *for* Trump is minuscule. In any case, Hillary will cinch the election. If Bernie makes a mess at the convention, oh well. The outcome will remain the same.
At the same time, it's heartening to see more and more folks realizing that these goings-on are not productive towards the end goal.
jack_package_200
Banned
I really don't see how this gets worse unless the campaign started encouraging supporters to resort to violence and harassment at the conventions.
After what happened with and since Nevada, that's not unlikely.
A Link to the Past
Banned
If Bernie ran as an independent, I would be able to safely say that his political reputation would be tarnished. He'd be remembered as the person who allowed us to lose the Supreme Court and the person who halted the progress on civil rights.
jack_package_200
Banned
I suppose. He has already entered this stage of his campaign.
Why the hell would that be a good thing?
Kev is right though, them being removed technically doesn't mean a damn thing.
So I feel like its really weighing between giving Bernie a meaningless gesture and believing that he will act in good faith after getting it and working to unite the party
or
Wondering if giving him this gesture regardless of its impact will just swell him into feeling that he has more power than he thought and him moving the goalposts on you indefinitely, resulting in you looking stupid, news cycles following the circus of bait and switch and in the end having the inevitable happen (Bernie going out in flames as best as he can) despite your efforts. (Please forgive this horrid run on sentence).
You also have to consider that even though the gesture of letting him boot two people off for personal reasons is ultimately meaningless in the big picture; You would be straight up spitting in the face of people who have worked with you, for you, and helped push and pass progressive policy in this country. They EARNED their positions, and now you kick them because this guy who is losing the nomination by millions asked you to?
Dash_Riprock
Member
Thats only cause in the last few weeks the most hardcore Bernies supporters got themselves banned and/or stay out of these threads entirely and flock to the Reddit echo chamber.
Edit: I like how this story is nowhere to be found on Bernie's Reddit page. Its all about Trump pulling out of the debate and how that's some MASSIVE win for Bernie's campaign.
Imperfected
Member
I mean, there are people who are changing sides, though.
I would have voted for Sanders based on his platform and positions.
I now will not vote for Sanders, based on the man he has proven himself to be.
I'm sure I'm not alone.
I've said this before in other threads, but do people namedropping Jill Stein have any knowledge of what she stands for, other than her not being Hillary? She's an anti-science nut who calls autism an epidemic.
IceBringer
Banned
Bonen no Max'd
Banned
Other than the anti-science garbage, Green Party's platform is basically "we're Democrats but magically more progressive and way better", which fits in pretty nicely with Sanders. Actually, the anti-science stuff fits him too.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
I suppose. He has already entered this stage of his campaign.
He's done burning bridges. He's burning down the donkey house now.
A Link to the Past
Banned
For a bit of time I had thought Jill Stein was transphobic, but I mixed it up with Roseanne Barr being transphobic.
The Green Party is for folks who want what the Democrats are pushing (noted exception: science), but for folks who magically want to ignore/bypass the realities of our government structure. Checks and balances? Pish-posh! Procedural requirements? Poppycock! An insane/fierce opposition party? No problem!
It's the party for folks who think that if they clap their hands and believe hard enough, progress will happen, wishes really will come true! As opposed to, y'know, realistically working the gears of government in unsexy, slow, grinding fashion.
Hillary would be closer to another four years of Obama than Biden would anyway.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
Is it still too late for Biden to show up and shut down both Bernie and Hill?
Can we get him drafted at the convention or something?
Can we get him drafted at the convention or something?
BreezyLimbo
Banned
Wait, Roseanne is transphobic? TVs Roseanne?
Shit. Didnt see that coming. Isnt she gay?
whyamihere
Banned
Why do people want Biden to run? He's way to the right of Hillary and there's a reason why he's had two failed presidential bids.
Hillary is the nominee.
Hillary is the nominee.
excelsiorlef
Member
Some of the most virulent transphobia comes from the lesbian community and radical feminists.
echoshifting
Banned
Yeah, it actually came out because of Jill Stein, back in the 2012 race. It boils down to the bathroom issue...again. Ahead of her time once again, I suppose. ;p
SirClinksAlot
Member
People forget/dont know that Hillary is actually more liberal than Uncle Joe.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
But is he bought and paid for by the establishment??
Honestly, I think a lot of it comes down to likeability. He just seems so much more authentic than she does. Whether that makes him more or less qualified to be President is up to the individual, but I think that's why he gets so much more love from some on the left.
Tal Shiar Agent
Member
He is also safer though. I'll be voting for Hill in the general, but she evokes the same vitriol as Obama did (though sexist-fueled instead of racist-fueled) to the point where they are trying to get her arrested for nothing.
Heavy_D206
Member
Bernie was on Bill Maher's show last night and it was fantastic.
That's pretty much because she scares the shit out of them. She's scared the right since the 1990's. To me that's even more reason to go forward with her. Fuck the sexists. Let the GOP face their worst nightmare.
Was he meeting up with Cornell West backstage? Sometimes Cornell leaves his pager in the medicine cabinet and you have to looking for him at the usual pool halls and Maher shows.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
Care to elaborate?
Heavy_D206
Member
He made some great points explaining how free health care and colleges aren't radical ideas and that most of the worlds industrialised nations already have these things.
I believe he called it quasi-socialism.
A pretty swift and concise 'no'. I like it. I wonder how furiously Bernard's team is typing up his response to this and what if anything he will do to follow up on his convention threats.
For people saying to give him what he wants; I don't agree. For a reasonable candidate with reasonable demands I could see giving an inch here or there for their support and backing. But I don't believe Bernard is bargaining in good faith. I think every little bit he gets he's going to ask for more and more and more.
Even though the concessions are meaningless, just ask Trump, this is how you win at making deals. You get your opponent to give you something small and then you ramp up. This works with everything, ask someone to loan you a dollar one day and they are more likely to loan you $5 next week. They are invested in you and are waiting for you to pay off sort of speak.
So the DNC 'invests' in Bernard, offering him meaningless concessions in the hope it quells his rhetoric; then he starts asking for more. Well since we already gave him this, and this is small too, okay. Then he keeps ramping it up. You look at what you've already given him and it starts adding up, and you look a little foolish to not give him the next thing because again you've already given him X and Y, what's the harm in giving him Z as well?
This is already happening. DNC gave him an unprecedented amount of say at the convention, and now he's asking for even more. So let's say they drop the two guys he has a problem with and you pick two new ones. Well suddenly he's got a problem with them too, but don't worry, he's got a list of names that would fit the bill that he feels is 'fair'. So just pick one of them and he'll be happy. Oh except wait, this other person seems a little problematic. Oh and about this party platform, don't think it goes far enough. Oh how about we add this to the party platform as well. And on and on. Trust me, with guys like Bernard it never ends. He's never going to be satisfied until he's in complete control.
Michael F. Assbender
Banned
But those are the same things he's been saying since the beginning. I'm not saying he's wrong. Just that it's not new.
I wonder if the "quasi" is in response to the Univision interview where it was pointed out to him that other socialist states in Latin America are crumbling.
Yeah, I'm not sure this is the hill the Democratic Party wants to die on. Give him some concessions, bring him into line, and bring his supporters into the fold. The end. Not saying that he should get to bring his whole election platform as the party platform, but giving him some significant contributions proportionate to the delegates he won isn't unreasonable.
The "fuck Bernie Sanders and supporters" sentiments here risk costing the Dems everything in November. There's too much at stake, man.
They gave him concessions already, there was a whole thread about it, and he just asked for more. He doesn't get to run the show. He lost. There's limits to what he can ask for.
Dash_Riprock
Member
Feel the Bern...or else!
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