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[Geometric-Crusher]

Yes the PS1 is efficient for 2D for sure but in some nervous games like shmups or 2D vs fighting the Saturn sometimes get better results.

that common players don't care.
the best 2d game on the ps1 is street fighter alpha 3
on the Sega Saturn street fighter zero 3, Sega Saturn fans can claim superiority but no one cares, the game is the same.
if 2d was Saturn's secret weapon then we can say the impact was mitigated, there wasn't enough 2d power to make the ps1 look outdated in that field. Good Job Hideki Sato.

 

[RoboFu]

No and no ?

The buttons are not colored like the snes buttons. And the snes (and n64 that came out after the PS) have 2 shoulder buttons while PS controllers have 4 since the first one.

So steal what ? No cartridge, different controller, different console design, different hardware. I've seen better rip offs.

Damn Nintendo and SEGA fans are so delisionals... I love SNES and the Saturn, the sat is an AWESOME system with dozens of crazy good games, but man, after all those years, still trying to twist the reality...

The old way to explain the situation is still the best way : PS1 is better for 3D and Saturn is better for 2D. Done.

Umm no .. the PlayStation was built after they already started developing the SNES CD ADD ON. The controller was made with four face buttons and shoulder buttons after they were using the snes controller with the cd add on they were developing. The PlayStation was a snes at one point.

It's clear some fanboys are crazy in this thread but it's not the sega and Nintendo fans.

It literally has PlayStation on the controller.

 

[cireza]

The Saturn was thought for 2D and as usual SEGA was taken by surprise like "what ? oh the new thing is 3D ? are you sure ? ok let's add a 2nd ship that can do a little 3D, I give you 3 months"...

See. This shit has been repeated so many times over the internet it has now become the truth in weak people's minds.

Ignorant people, that don't want to know better, and feel comfortable spreading the same shit over and over again.

The new thing is 3D ? No shit, SEGA were the ones to make a massive push towards proper 3D hardware, and proper engines. They were the driving force behind 3D, released Virtua Racing in 1992, then Virtua Fighter and Daytona. The Saturn was already being reported as being a 3D machine back in 1993. 3 months to add the second "ship to do little 3D" lol ? This shows you have no clue what you are talking about, and obviously don't want to know better. Spread your bullshit elsewhere.

 

[StreetsofBeige]

Saturn stunk as a whole. If you were a big Sega arcade gamer and were big into 2D fighting games, you probably liked the system.

PS1 was way better. As a start, segas legacy in the prior gen was great Sega Sports games. Aside from the last baseball games, the rest all seemed to get F’s in mag reviews back then. NFL, nba, nhl. If a system doesn’t have good sports games, no buy from me. And their EA sports games seemed worse too.

 

[cartman414]

I'm guessing you too haven't read the article, and forget that the entire world of electronics for Sony was using that colour tone, Trinitron TVs, etc.

The SNES and PlayStation controller have completely different design paradigms. The uncomfortable kidney Snes pad is designed with an asymmetric layout and the PlayStation controller is designed with a symmetrical aesthetic to fit a hand like a glove and has distinctly different sets of shoulder buttons for game use like driving games, compared to the total after thought of the Snes' shoulder buttons. Even the symbol meanings for PlayStation to combine colour, shape and meaning into the buttons lead to the pad winning design awards.

The internal electronics of the pad is like day and night different, one looks like an old crystal radio set and the other looks like a PCB out of a ...highend Walkman of the time or a PlayStation controller, as that was the benchmark of the time.

If you said it was vaguely derivative, like all pads are except for the N64 controller, then yeah, but stealing, is just nonsense, it's worlds apart.

Oh my god. The PS controller handles are for baby hands. The claw grip they force is the opposite of ergonomic. Don't get me started on the d-pad. It took the PS4 dual shock to get it right.

Also, Playstation products had poor quality compared to most Nintendo and Sega products, so I don't know what you're smoking.

 

[cartman414]

I don't because that article is heading light on any new info on a story that the likes other print mags covered in detail decades ago. Also, the flip top lid was done out cost savings and what SONY would have seen with other CD gaming systems like with how SEGA and 3DO were able to reduce costs by going to the flip lid instead of more expensive the front loader model for the Mega CD and 3DO. You look at the basic layout of the PS1 system the pad and its colour it's straight from the SNES

In the end had NCL done their due diligence they would have never got into such a mess with the SONY deal in the 1st place over revenue per disc. Not that in anyway excused how NCL allowed SONY to humiliate themselves by going ahead with their CES speech while NCL had already done a deal with Philips behind their back.

No CD for the N64 lost the system a ton of Japanese support from the SNES era and lost it FF7. The days when Nintendo fans could boost their system by having the best Japanese RPGs were well and truly over. The N64 was dire for Japanese RPGs. All that was on NCL

Just admit you didn't read the article. It's ok.

Guess I shouldn't be surprised with the amount of * insert verified controversy * denialists I come across every day.

 

[Drell]

The new thing is 3D ? No shit, SEGA were the ones to make a massive push towards proper 3D hardware, and proper engines. They were the driving force behind 3D, released Virtua Racing in 1992, then Virtua Fighter and Daytona. The Saturn was already being reported as being a 3D machine back in 1993. 3 months to add the second "ship to do little 3D" lol ? This shows you have no clue what you are talking about, and obviously don't want to know better. Spread your bullshit elsewhere.

People keep claiming the Saturn had its 3D capabilities added "last minute" because the saturn uses quads instead of triangles, which can more easily be interpreted as distorded sprites. While the later became the norm and first "sound" weird these days, it was what Model 1, 2 and 3 used. Yes those cutting edge arcade board that no domestic system could match back then. Where these systems made for 2D? I don't think so. And I can't either believe that Sega, one of the pioneer of 3D gaming wanted the Saturn to be 2D only after investing so much in that domain in the arcades.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

See. This shit has been repeated so many times over the internet it has now become the truth in weak people's minds.

Ignorant people, that don't want to know better, and feel comfortable spreading the same shit over and over again.

The new thing is 3D ? No shit, SEGA were the ones to make a massive push towards proper 3D hardware, and proper engines. They were the driving force behind 3D, released Virtua Racing in 1992, then Virtua Fighter and Daytona. The Saturn was already being reported as being a 3D machine back in 1993. 3 months to add the second "ship to do little 3D" lol ? This shows you have no clue what you are talking about, and obviously don't want to know better. Spread your bullshit elsewhere.

Have you ever heard of Hideki Sato? He confirmed that Sega was surprised by the PlayStation hardware. Is revisionism the new goal for Sega fans?

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

People keep claiming the Saturn had its 3D capabilities added "last minute" because the saturn uses quads instead of triangles.

nah, because it's the true.

And I can't either believe that Sega, one of the pioneer of 3D gaming wanted the Saturn to be 2D only after investing so much in that domain in the arcades.

exactly, Sega wanted to keep 3d only in the arcade, they never imagined the 5th gen in full 3d before Sony.
But obviously the Saturn had some 3D potential even in its original version to make games like Bug! possible.

 

[RoboFu]

Have you ever heard of Hideki Sato? He confirmed that Sega was surprised by the PlayStation hardware. Is revisionism the new goal for Sega fans?

The Saturn was built to mimic the model 2 which had the same multi chip set up and also used quads.

the myth that they added a vdp last min doesn't make any logical sense. You can't just throw in a chip and hope it works. It takes months of planning.

 

[cireza]

Have you ever heard of Hideki Sato? He confirmed that Sega was surprised by the PlayStation hardware. Is revisionism the new goal for Sega fans?

Bro, you have been drive-by posting in this thread the exact 3 same things for 15 pages now.

SEGA had their own vision of what a mass produced, cheap enough for the consumer, 2D AND 3D hardware capable, affordable to manufacture... console had to be back then. They followed their own vision from the very beginning and delivered such product. Revisionism happens when people say stuff such as "they threw a 3D processor 3 months before launch". None of this makes any sense. We know for sure, from sources back then, that 3D was supported as soon as 1993, that both VDP2 were there from the very beginning, that both CPUs were always part of the equation and also included in the 32X. Use some common sense. You don't throw a new GPU and/or CPU like this and call it a day because the impacts are gigantic.

Guys giving interviews 30 years later to get a little bit of spotlight (and money) before they retire aren't exactly relevant to my eyes.

 

[Geometric-Crusher]

The Saturn was built to mimic the model 2 which had the same multi chip set up and also used quads.

the myth that they added a vdp last min doesn't make any logical sense. You can't just throw in a chip and hope it works. It takes months of planning.

Think what you want but the console architect was crystal clear ''our system was 2d, I added the second SH2''

 

[Team Andromeda]

Just admit you didn't read the article. It's ok.

Guess I shouldn't be surprised with the amount of * insert verified controversy * denialists I come across every day.

I read it on a night shift actually and it's not saying anything new central point was the deal was put off over what SONY was looking for revenue from software. One would have thought that part of the deal would have been done and scrutinized at the start.
So don't come the denialists

Why don't you admit for once that no CD drive for the N64 was a royal cock up and the real reason why the N64 didn't have FF7.

 

[PaintTinJr]

Oh my god. The PS controller handles are for baby hands. The claw grip they force is the opposite of ergonomic. Don't get me started on the d-pad. It took the PS4 dual shock to get it right.

Also, Playstation products had poor quality compared to most Nintendo and Sega products, so I don't know what you're smoking.

Agreed, the size is only marginally bigger than the petit Snes controller without the handles, and the glove fit of the pad does rely on letting the handles rest on the little fingers and their neighbours, then the shoulder trigger bumpers rest on the set of other two fingers, and as you say, it wasn't until the PS4 dualshock size/redesign that you could grab the pad fully.

It was probably the cube pad that set the ball rolling for a pad that felt good to grip IMO.

 

[SenkiDala]

See. This shit has been repeated so many times over the internet it has now become the truth in weak people's minds.

Ignorant people, that don't want to know better, and feel comfortable spreading the same shit over and over again.

Krrr krrrr... I was there back then and I saw all of this happening... Also asked to a dude who's litteraly video game history teacher and he confirmed this. Of course I'm being hyperbolic when I say "3 months"... it's like when you say "I've been waiting for 36 years", you... don't really wait 36 actual years...

Anyway except being a condescending prick who thinks he knows more than he actually knows, who are you ? I hope you've better than your SMS indie homebrews.

But anyway sure you're right, the Saturn was architectured with first 3D in mind and not at all 2D, ok ok.

 

[lakitu1982]

Man, no man, I pitty the people who actually fall for what you are saying in this post here.

A wrapper told you because that's how a generic API wrapper works, which is not the same as render specific DLLs from TR3 they won't work in any other game at most is maybe compatible with TR2.

There's plenty of Glide exclusive games surely you just need to get a DLL from a DX9 game to get full DX9 support! The community is so stupid writing Glide wrappers for Diablo 2, they should have just copied DLLs from Doom Eternal, *bam* instant Vulkan support....

Even small things, Doom95 is customized for NV1 or DirectX 1 was built with the NV1 in mind... like hell show me where you got that info, fucking show me one source for this (and no CoPilot and ChatGPT don't count). It's hard to parse through your posts because there so many small and big things that are absolutely unfounded that it's almost impossible to form a coherent reply, you just take wild outlandish theories from unrelated concepts that the end result is a narrative that make 0 sense.

I have no idea what you're saying really but you seem to know your stuff

 

[cireza]

Anyway except being a condescending prick who thinks he knows more than he actually knows, who are you ?

I am not the guy spreading his ignorance and needing a video-game teacher. You don't need a video-game teacher when you actually lived through these periods of gaming.

But anyway sure you're right, the Saturn was architectured with first 3D in mind and not at all 2D

See, you finally admit it. And to be more precise, it was architectured for both, not only 3D.

Since I am in a good mood, I will share this video so you can learn a few things.