ScarJo takes lead role in GHOST IN THE SHELL
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whatever77
Banned
japanese poster said:
LOL, I guess its even worse than Jackie Chan's manga movies.
japanese poster said:
Heh
I have a hard time calling Lucy a "character" in the first place.
It's kind of pitiful how the alternative people are putting up in this thread is basically the only Japanese actress who's had a big role in a recent American movie. For them to REALLY not fuck up the casting in typical Hollywood fashion, they'd probably have to go out on a total limb and find a more fitting Japanese actress, who would probably be someone Americans have never heard of.
When I showed my brother the 1995 anime movie, he asked why it wasn't live action.
This is why. There's no way a Japanese-sized budget would do it justice.
Basically, this shit just shouldn't get made. I'd actually be fine with a totally Americanized transformation if I had the confidence it was being produced by people who give a shit about the source material, but I don't.
And 47 Ronin kinda bombed man.
When I showed my brother the 1995 anime movie, he asked why it wasn't live action.
This is why. There's no way a Japanese-sized budget would do it justice.
Basically, this shit just shouldn't get made. I'd actually be fine with a totally Americanized transformation if I had the confidence it was being produced by people who give a shit about the source material, but I don't.
And 47 Ronin kinda bombed man.
I don't think the 95 movie showed anything that is too complicated or needs a 100 millions budget.
The only major complicated action scene is the final one (which isn't even needed, plot wise) everything else is basically shots of skylines and dialogues between two people or renditions of the net.
If we were talking about Akira i'd agree, that movie has some crazy set pieces that would be hard to replicate without a stellar budget, but GitS (the 95 movie anyway) is pretty tame and tranquil stuff.
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Also, the Rinko Kikuchi suggestions are just dumb to me:
She's asian and she's somewhat (but not really) popular, that's it.
She has none of the gravitas and physical presence Motoko has, and it'd be like Elijah Wood playing Aragorn just because he's white.
If you're willing to let go of the "big name" thing (and you should, imo) then go for a fitting Japanese actress, not the only one you can come up with, 'cause you saw her in a couple of recent movies.
As for the language thing, given the brain implants and all the shit in the GitS universe, it would be pretty dumb to have a character speak broken English, so they should just shoot it in Japanese.
ComputerMKII
Banned
I know an actress who would fit the role:
Personally, I just don't think it can be done at all as a live action film. GitS works because of the suspension of disbelief you have because it's a cartoon. The Major jumping off a skyscraper and into a window below only works because it's in an animated form. When actors do it it looks cheesy and fake.
I'm all for a good cyborg action film, but it needs work within the limitations of film, and, from an artistic perspective, GitS isn't do-able.
Yeah, I agree about Rinko Kikuchim but I disagree about Scarjo ethnic implications aside. The Major is tough as nails, but at the end of the day she's still a gothy pixie girl archetype physically. Scarjo is voluptuous and thick. For Asian actresses I'd go with Faye Wong in her prime or for White actresses Natalie Portman. Unfortunately, neither of them have the athletic prowess to pull it off realistically. She doesn't have the look for it, but Michelle Yeoh is (was in her prime) probably the only female actress I can think of it who has that athletic talent.
Fixed2BeBroken
Member
I dont think anyone is saying that she should speak fluent english.
but her english is tolerable, at least based off pacific rim.
she sounds worse in that interview and I stated why.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
There's no way this would be filmed with everyone speaking Japanese, so there's no reason to have a Japanese actress. There are probably lots of Asian-American actresses who could do a better job than Rinko Kikuchi.
Also, Kusanagi is a robot, not an actual human being born in Japan to Japanese parents. Maybe whatever person invented her gave her a Japanese name and white girl looks.
All of the Dragonball outrage made me laugh too, because Goku isn't even Japanese he's a goddamn space alien.
Also, Kusanagi is a robot, not an actual human being born in Japan to Japanese parents. Maybe whatever person invented her gave her a Japanese name and white girl looks.
All of the Dragonball outrage made me laugh too, because Goku isn't even Japanese he's a goddamn space alien.
This is something that I've seen mentioned a lot as well. People are throwing out lots of asian actresses and some of them can't even speak english.
I think scarjo's a good fit to be honest. They might go with a "warmer" more developed Major, ala SAC, which its something I'd like to see, but then, I always preferred SAC over the film. My fiance' (who is asian) loves the casting.
The Elite
BOSS
Kusanagi was born human.
Depending on what I've read watched she ended up in a cyborg body due to an accident at a young age.
Rise makes it seem like she doesn't even remember having a human body.
Astral Dog
Member
I thought this was cancelled.
No, she's not a robot. It's explicitly stated that she once had a corporal body. It's the whole point of her existential crisis.
edit:
as far as Dragon Ball it's very obvious that it takes place in a fantasy Chinese (not Japanese) world.
ExiledMarkzmen
Neo Member
Plane crash supposedly. Just some small chunks of brain are allegedly all that's organic, although she's placed herself into other bodies/looks.
ComputerMKII
Banned
per SAC she should have her entire brain (assuming she's not presently a ghost dub).
There's the ambiguous line in the first movie where Batou talks about "some piece left in her titanium brain case", but as far as I can tell, that's a bad translation and he doesn't literally mean that she only has a piece of a brain left. Scientifically (as far as the GitS world is concerned), that wouldn't make sense because it's stated (in at least the manga) that cyberbrains are connections into the brain and not removal of pieces of brain (as the other prosthetics are).
Anyway, regardless of the minutiae, she's positively not a robot or android. Proto is an example of a robot in the series.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
Which doesn't really counter my point that her artificial body doesn't need to resemble an ethnically Japanese human.
No, it doesn't have to. But, she's still an ethnic Japanese, who lives in Japan, works for the Japanese government in a story by a Japanese artist, that was written to have explicitly Japanese themes, and in an art style that is characteristically Japanese.
Maybe you would counter that this is an American adaptation, but my counter to that is there are still a lot of Asian-Americans, and normatively it does that community a disservice to continue to neglect them.
Furthermore, as I said on a previous page, Ghost in the Shell is inextricably tied to Japanese (Shinto) philosophy, and to remove that would be the same as removing the soul from the work. It would no longer be Ghost in the Shell.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
Philosophy is not the same as ethnicity. And considering the way Kusanagi trades bodies, a Japanese outward appearance to her character is not the soul of the work, but merely another shell to be discarded at will.
And anyway if you look I suggested that an Asian-American actress would be way better than Rinko Kikuchi.
There was quite a bit more to the Major than just being a "hardass woman that can kick ass" especially if we're talking about the manga where there was an air of mystery around her character.( one thing i loved about the Manga is that Shirow doesn't try to tell the Major's whole back story like the tv series does, even her name is an alias) The Major is a very imposing character as well. Neither Scarjo or Rinko Kikuchi have the screen presence to portray her.
The stoic, robotic version of the Major is for the most part is how Oshii decided to portray her and it stuck for the future anime versions. The Major acted like a regular person for most of the original manga and had more of a personality and rebelious streak. ( Calling Aramaki "ape face" making some ghost hacking a government official and making him punch himself in the face, taking section 9 to strip joints etc)
Perfect reply
Agreed 100%. This will be a generic sci fi flick with the GITS name and nothing more.
I also find it funny that the same kinds of arguments pop up whenever these movies are announced. DB:E The whole "Goku's an alien so he could be White argument"( Also Chichi is portrayed by an Asian actress. funny how that works) The Last Airbender, again similar arguments defending the casting. "It's a fantasy not real so they don't need to be Asian" ( yeah never mind that the "fantasy world and the nations in it were inspired by Asia countries an cultures and featured Kanji, etc)or my personal fave "maybe the actors were the best one for the roles!" Still makes me laugh to this day. In the end those two movies sucked ass, and are considered among the worst films ever produced. Completely missing the point of the source material. Now we have a GITS film in the works and what do you know those same kinds of arguments popping up again! "well she's a cyborg that can switch bodies so she could totally be white!" So this movie will likely be shit and bomb and we can start this cycle all over again with the next adaptation i guess.
Takamura-San
Member
Glad to see that both of you missed my point. 47 Ronin was packed full of Japanese actors. Including some with some experience in other Hollywood films, yet none of them could speak the English fluently. How do you expect any them to carry a movie like this?
TheBryanJZX90
Member
If the movie is in English then hiring someone who isn't fluent in English changes the character more than changing the character's race (at least for this character).
BeatResetsTheWorld
Banned
I don't disagree, but if we accept that she is in fact an Asian female, unless she's changing her appearance all the time, it becomes problematic for her to recast herself as a caucasian without further reasoning. It implies not only that "inside every gook there is an American trying to get out" but also that being caucasian is epitome of racial evolution.
Also, as a matter of plot the Major deliberately maintains the body she has because it gives her a connection to the person she once was.
I agree with you fully about Rinko Kikuchi and casting an Asian American.
Also, as a side, I think it's important to cast an Asian actor for Togusa as well. In particular, because he's the representation of the Japanese family man and an "every man", and I think it would be a great opportunity to show an Asian male in a non-stereotyped and meaningful role.
Black-Wind
Member
Well, Japan doesn't seem to care about her being white ... which is not shocking.
(Outside of that "This is like DBZ again!!!" dude but that's silly seeing how you could say it's like All you need is Kill just as easily)
Yeah I don't understand why people keep picking Rinko Kikuchi. She has zero star power anywhere, can't act, and most importantly barely has the command of the English language even if she had a dialect or linguistics coach in Pacific Rim.
Also Pacific Rim was only a movie about giant robots fighting giant monsters, all the human drama was all boring filler.
I had a buddy who always joked that Rinko wasn't popular because she was totally ok doing nude scenes or something which she did in Babel. Or so I was told, I haven't seen said movie so I can't confirm and I'm at work so no Google.
Edit:
Not really, Edge of Tomorrow had a new character, if DBE had Gazorpazorpku instead of Goku it wouldn't have been as bad.
Also Pacific Rim was only a movie about giant robots fighting giant monsters, all the human drama was all boring filler.
I had a buddy who always joked that Rinko wasn't popular because she was totally ok doing nude scenes or something which she did in Babel. Or so I was told, I haven't seen said movie so I can't confirm and I'm at work so no Google.
Edit:
Not really, Edge of Tomorrow had a new character, if DBE had Gazorpazorpku instead of Goku it wouldn't have been as bad.
firehawk12
Subete no aware
Not for nothing, but even Agents of Shield managed to cast two Asian women. I mean, the show is pretty terrible, but still, there's nothing that says nerd culture and race can't mix or whatever. Do we have to go from "a female led action movie will bomb" to "a female led action movie without a white actress will bomb"?
Japanmanx3
Member
Ugh...
TheBryanJZX90
Member
My wife always said the same thing about Kikuchi, and she spends a lotta time reading up on Japanese celeb gossip. But who knows.
Edit:
Hey someone in Japan had the same point I did:
Hollywood is always whitewashing, but that was my line of thought:
Major Kusanagi's body is fully cybernetic. She chose how she wants to look. At least Johansson looks like the drawn character.
Anyway, they can go with that, as long as they don't whitewash Aramaki and others.
Riposte
Member
That's the nightmare scenario.
Cyborg and robot are not the same thing. Who she really is is debatable but what we do know is that she was born a human.
Riposte
Member
Let's say there was a little asian girl named Motoko. Let's say though some event she becomes entirely synthetic, leaving only her "ghost" (in SAC,
she's one of two survivors of a plane crash
Why does she have to be Motoko, Melissa Kerrigan would be alright with Baird, Thomas and Arronovsky.
Elfforkusu
Member
Please don't be awful
Please don't be awful
Please don't be awful
Please don't be awful
Please don't be awful
Nah, don't underestimate Hollywood, hell look at the many posters in this thread that want the names to remain Japanese.
TheBryanJZX90
Member
I think there's an interesting discussion to be had about race and ethnicity here. I'm not the most knowledgeable about this stuff so I'm probably getting something wrong, but there is both a biological and cultural component to race and ethnicity, right? (Race is biological and ethnicity cultural? Vice versa?) If (for argument's sake) race is a biological construct, does that mean that once you remove all of your biological parts you are no longer a member of that race? How much has to remain for Kusanangi to still be Asian?
unholyrevenger72
Banned
Not to bad
GavinUK86
Member
Okay I've changed my mind, Rinko couldn't play Motoko. She's far too cute and adorable.
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