Snoopycat
Banned
He was given 4 months in prison. If you had heard of him you'd have already known that. So, there's the example you wanted. How about you answer the question instead of desperately scrabbling in that hole you've dug for yourself
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School shooting in Santa Fe, TX; the 22nd school shooting so far in 2018
- Thread starter Autoignition
- Start date
He was given 4 months in prison. If you had heard of him you'd have already known that. So, there's the example you wanted. How about you answer the question instead of desperately scrabbling in that hole you've dug for yourself
I didn't ask what he was sentenced. I asked if he went to prison. I knew what he was sentenced. He never went or was taken to prison.
The police arrested him, charged him, and tried, him, but he was never taken to prison. He appealed and died before the appeal process finished.
Snoopycat
Banned
Just going to keep on eh digging man. You wanted an example and I gave you one but you just going to be doing all you can to avoid answering the question eh.
IISANDERII
Member
The NRA is a front for gun manufacturers. This is basic knowledge that I shouldn’t need to post.
rokkerkory
Member
Some info of shooter's online stuff coming out... pic of trench coats and nazi symbols. sigh smh
AngularSaxophone
Banned
Godlessness is where it begins, no moral compass, over sexualized and hyper violent everything, broken family structure, desensitized kids, medicated kids and a lack of common sense from just about every angle.
Oner
Member
And this is why you just can't have honest conversations with some..... The NRA has done more to help protect Americans and their rights than most care to admit. That is a fact based in proven reality and actual action more than your basic knowledge.
Yes, because belief in god never led any people to a place of violence, or broken families, or lack of common sense. Good one.
<+)O Robido O(+>
Member
Such as?
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Northeastmonk
Gold Member
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-...s-pagourtzis-posted-born-kill-t-shirt-n875571
I played this a lot at Aladdin's Castle growing up. The kid was twisted. I feel horrible for the families who had to go through this.
IISANDERII
Member
You're trying to talk about honest conversation when in the same breath you posit a strawman argument. The irony is filthy rich.
Airola
Member
Yeah, the amount of suicides and the amount of school shootings where the motive was to have a revenge because of bullying must've gone higher at least partly because of technological advances.
I'm so glad I lived my childhood in a time where everything wasn't connected 24/7. Back then when you got home, you were safe for the rest of the day (unless of course your mom or dad or siblings were assholes).
I don't know what even can be done with cyberbullying. How can that be stopped? Harsher penalties for the bullies, maybe? Obviously the first step would be encouraging people to talk about bullying but that was a thing already back when cyberbullying didn't exist. I would think it's just as hard for kids to talk about them being bullied than it used to be.
Damn, just imagine a future world where people get messages straight to their eyes and our society depends on people having those things on most of the day... Or getting messages straight to your brain. Then people would be glad they used to live in a time when they at least had to have a separate device and that to be turned on.
Your government has overstepped it reach several times in the past and neither the military or the gun owners did anything to oppose it. In fact they both helped. Internment camps.
bitbydeath
Gold Member
What would the government have to do to cause everyone including their own military to turn against them?
Airola
Member
That dude seemed to go all the way with symbols:
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-...s-pagourtzis-posted-born-kill-t-shirt-n875571
It's like he took every bit of destructive ideas from as many ideologies as possible, ranging from real world ideologies to fiction.
Autoignition
Member
How dare he besmirch Cthulhu's good name.
Gotta wonder what a kid's home life must be like to grow up so hateful.
dropkick!
Member
TBF there is the Bundy ranch standoff as a more recent example.
If you are talking bout minorities being put off by military? More reasons to arm themselves. I do remember minorities arming themselves during civil war era...
Just a quick reminder that 2nd Amendment is not exclusive to white people.
Just saying'
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Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
I take issue with the "22 shootings" being thrown around everywhere.
https://www.snopes.com/news/2018/02/16/how-many-school-shootings-in-2018/
https://www.snopes.com/news/2018/02/16/how-many-school-shootings-in-2018/
"But it's immoral to remove guns."
Autoignition
Member
... This is from February. There have been many more since then.
https://www.cnn.com/2018/03/02/us/school-shootings-2018-list-trnd/index.html
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
Many of those are still a real stretch to call a "school shooting" and it does not help understanding of the national situation at all to throw them under that title. I'm really not into playing such semantics when the mental correlations inspired by using such sensationalist lines in connection to a story like this are blatantly obvious and the only reason to intentionally effect such conceptions is blatant political spin for a particular influence. It's disingenuous and being disingenuous does not engender the kind of bipartisan trust and cooperation that will be required to make any progress on the issue as a nation.
highrider
Banned
You train as a full time job essentially in the Army. It really doesn’t prepare you for it. You have all the tactical knowledge, it’s just not a common character trait to keep your cool at first. That’s kind of like going in to a top level ufc bout but only have sparred, the only way to become a fighter is to fight.
It’s why despite most people citing cases of the good guy with the gun that stops a bad thing from happening, the more common outcome is being paralyzed by adrenaline overload and never even reaching for your gun, and really wanting to run away. We all think we’ll be that dude that’s a great warrior, but the reality of the stuff is much more humbling. Many gun owners in America lack humility.
Edit: and I don’t mean to act like the oracle of combat knowledge, I wasn’t even infantry/ranger or special forces, I’m just relaying my own experience with it. If someone punches you or attacks you you have almost natural reactions, because humans have a frame of reference for a fist fight or wrestling, but small arms combat is much less familiar, it feels completely surreal at first.
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If you want to keep your guns and armed guards/teachers are not going to help the only other solution is to ban school.
In fact just ban anything that can result in large groups of people gathering together making them an easy target so ban sport, ban work, ban shopping centres, ban gyms, ban conventions, ban protests, ban festivals, ban concerts.
If you do all of that the number of mass shootings may go down but you get to keep your guns so it's totally worth it right.
Also if school kids are dying at a faster rate than service members they need hazard pay for going to school.
In fact just ban anything that can result in large groups of people gathering together making them an easy target so ban sport, ban work, ban shopping centres, ban gyms, ban conventions, ban protests, ban festivals, ban concerts.
If you do all of that the number of mass shootings may go down but you get to keep your guns so it's totally worth it right.
Also if school kids are dying at a faster rate than service members they need hazard pay for going to school.
Mohonky
Member
Yeh, sounded like he was pretty out there with some of the things he was posting.
"Born to kill" etc. Dude wasnt in the greatest of head spaces.
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Vicetrailia
Member
Seems like we're in a fairly scary year:
The school shooting near Houston on Friday bolstered a stunning statistic: More people have been killed at schools this year than have been killed while serving in the military.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-than-service-members/?utm_term=.3f9a74765f86
I think the point is that we should really start treating school shootings seriously. Not pull a florida, but do something real.
The school shooting near Houston on Friday bolstered a stunning statistic: More people have been killed at schools this year than have been killed while serving in the military.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-than-service-members/?utm_term=.3f9a74765f86
I think the point is that we should really start treating school shootings seriously. Not pull a florida, but do something real.
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Aintitcool
Banned
I don't understand how american victims of gun violence cant just sue the goverment in masses for change? How can one lady burned by a macdonalds coffee cup cause more change than the hundreds of family dying due to unsafe gun regulation?
Isnt there a point when you can sue the goverment and force them to pay up or change the laws already? How is the NRA so much better than the families of the grieving and hurt? Living in America as a citizen is unsafe and it's because of the constitution being used to arm the nation that is already indipendent. Sueing the goverment until they change the constitution should be possible right? Make the right people pay from their wallets until they change the laws.
Isnt there a point when you can sue the goverment and force them to pay up or change the laws already? How is the NRA so much better than the families of the grieving and hurt? Living in America as a citizen is unsafe and it's because of the constitution being used to arm the nation that is already indipendent. Sueing the goverment until they change the constitution should be possible right? Make the right people pay from their wallets until they change the laws.
Sounds like a good idea. Are you pro-gun? Doesn't Trump, and state governors get sued all the time?
Still weird how Republicans want to a complete ban on abortions. It's just a different subject. Guns vs. Jesus beliefs.
Places like Kentucky want to shut down every single Planned Parenthood clinic. Not one in the entire state! So reverse that, how about we shut down every single gun retailer, shooting range, manufacturer, etc? A complete ban.
Examples:
I've always noticed that conservative politicans in America who are staunch about the 2nd amendment and constitution are the same group who want to get rid of your postal service...that's literally part of the constitution. Which always baffled me.
Japanese internment camps. 2nd Amendment seems pretty exclusive as to say that white Americans don't really believe in it to help fellow Americans who don't look like them. And let's face it the moment Japanese Americans would have opened fire on the military, they most likely would have been slaughtered wholesale with white Americans helping. Small minority groups standing up against a government mistreating them will never work when the majority group sides with the government in that mistreatment.
Japanese internment camps. 2nd Amendment seems pretty exclusive as to say that white Americans don't really believe in it to help fellow Americans who don't look like them. And let's face it the moment Japanese Americans would have opened fire on the military, they most likely would have been slaughtered wholesale with white Americans helping. Small minority groups standing up against a government mistreating them will never work when the majority group sides with the government in that mistreatment.
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Air Zombie Meat
Member
What a stupid take. Only one exit would make it harder for people to escape if he did get the gun inside. Also would be a bad thing if there was a fire.
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It's TX.
We're not really "for the people". We base our policies on a book.
Abbott will win in November. Well maybe this school shooting pissed off enough Republicans to switch sides.
Andrew White, Beto, and others can change this state. Sadly, religion is big in TX. The more religious you are, the more conservative you lean.
All the Houston oil and gas companies govern our politics as well. Where the money is I guess.
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https://www.houstonchronicle.com/ne...ls-for-special-session-on-school-12928204.php
Do you think Abbott will give a damn?
"Stupid liberal. More guns will keep our students safe!"
"These Mexicans bring in marijuana, rape, and murder. We must secure our borders!"
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He did specify entrance, just like many theaters when all people go in through the front, but there are fire exits all over the place. He didn't mention anything about having only one exit.
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Air Zombie Meat
Member
Point taken but thats not entirely true, he did mention exits: “There are too many entrances and too many exits to our 8,000 campuses in Texas. There aren’t enough people to put a guard at every entrance and exit”
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Would be nice if there was a link to the article someone was quoting. Still didn't say that there should only be one exit.
Air Zombie Meat
Member
really? come on man i'm not lying:
https://www.thedailybeast.com/texas...sts-school-shooting-because-of-too-many-exits
http://cw39.com/2018/05/19/texas-lt...ool-shooting-on-too-many-exits-and-entrances/
https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/en...s-school-shooting_us_5aff51a4e4b0463cdba1e09d
https://edition.cnn.com/2018/05/19/us/texas-school-shooting-exits-trnd/index.html
First few results from google, the last of which includes video of him saying it. But like I said I get your point. Your point doesn't change my opinion though, less exits is a bad idea whether he means one, two or three. A reduction in the number of exits is a reduction in the number of escape routes.
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dropkick!
Member
What your point is addressed by proficiency. When I mean proficiency, I mean "you can do it with eyes closed" kind of proficiency.
When a stressful event comes, people will rely on what you learned in muscle memory. You do start to do things in an unconcious way that every step you do is done regardless of adrenaline. Its the same reasons why someone who has driven a car for a long time can either swerve or brake in the event of something in front of them braking (depending on what they are used to do). It is a real great bonus too that engagements in a self defense scenario like this tend to be around seconds to minutes, and not like hours like a typical servicemen do.
That is why people teach quick draws and recommend practicing everyday. Dry firing exercises, quick loading, marksmen training, situation "flowchart" and tactics. I am not saying this because civs gun owners are like glorious guys who cant do anything wrong. What I am saying is as far as preparation goes, its the best you can get. Because if you trust the police and military that just as subject to the same training and just as "unprepared" for the real situation, you should be able to trust a typical gun owner who went to the same training and practice much more on his free time because they love what they do.
Massacre you say? Remember the My Lai massacre? American SLAUGHTERED vietnamese civilians. Guess what, when that happened, everyone in the world knew we were the bad guys in that conflict, and it bolstered the morale of the vietcongs. Numbers multiplied and much more freaking commited to a point of winning the war, despite the seemingly apparent inferiority in firepower (but they got AKs tho).
I can say the same crap about the Middle East or North Korea. We can literally glass them (US Armed Forces I mean) but that one tiny IED or a small nuke and now that army now needs to triple or quadruple their budget and lose some lives just to deal with something that is made relatively cheap. Even a modern abrams can be taken down by good ol' IEDs and RPGs. And that is just armaments. When you do evil stuff, you will face people that will literally lay their lives to get you killed.
This is why I am really baffled about people discounting our chances as a civilian population against our own government. As long as we are an armed populace, not only we have a chance, we can win. Many people who have arguments like these forget that there are multiple fronts in a war, not only in a battlefield, but socioeconomic too. Yahoos in rural areas can easily fortify water, food and power supplies, and fully shut down american economy, and liberal city folk will riot out of starvation. Not to mention the internet who can distribute organic recruit pieces much quicker than before. We are not even going for possible defectors in the military, typical citizens developing their own weapons (XM 556 handheld microgun ftw) and other countries joining in. All it will take is for people to finally get ticked and not bending over when the feinsteins of the world says "Mr. Aerica, give me your guns pls".
Kenpachii
Member
In my view what should happen:
1) Guns need to be seen as Cars. They need to be registered, every year there needs to be a test that tests the condition of the user and there needs to be checks on houses if the guns are stored in save places. Also extensive testing has to be done to even get a gun. If the gun in a mass shooting that is registered to your dad, your dad is going to jail for your actions.
2) Kids that murder up whole schools will most likely be dead after the incident. They do not care about it themselves, there parents probably don't care about these kids and in general nobody does. I personally think that people need to be more alert specially around these people to give tips/hints towards the government so they can step in and do something about it.
How to do this however?
Make parents responsible for the shootings indirect. The only way they can not be accused is if the parents warn goverment instance about there kid being a loony and could derail. This will put a mental barrier towards the kid shooting things up because now his family will get into trouble because of his doing and killing himself wouldn't prevent this. If the kid doesn't care about his family, then parents are better paying attention to what there kids do unless they wanna spend some time in jail. So whenever there son stands with 2 machine guns with nazi outfits shouting i am god and i will murder everybody that doesn't believe in me, they will report him and the government will know about it and can secure those schools better.
3) Metal detectors are going to be a must, and militaire or ex miltaire grade personal has to be at the entrance but also inside the school paroling. 3 armed officers mean nothing if the school is massive. The moment this kid pulls a gun out of his pants at some area where no police is, it's gg and that will happen because obviously he wants to create max carnage. Now the shooting will take place at the front of the building and even if he takes out 2 officers guarding it, the ones patrolling will be on this gun in seconds.
4) Media needs to be limited around these events. Report of this needs to be short and small of information. No names or faces announced so they won't get any recognision which prevents these attention seekers from doing there thing and be seen by people something they probably crave for.
5) Build metal car protectors around the schools to prevent drive ins, but also make reinforced walls around school so he can't move into play yards or other area's that are not guarded easy. Protect these on top of it with motion detectors and extra security personal that check camera's when schools are in.
6) Build bunkers everywhere in those schools that are completely sealed from the outside and heavily reinforce those bunkers
7) bullit proof windows and walls and doors with tear gass area's everwhere that can be enabled by armed reenforcers.
8) instruct parents that pick up there kids to be armed to the teeth and can only pick there kids up inside and walk outside at specific times and checks so the outside area's are protected also.
1) Guns need to be seen as Cars. They need to be registered, every year there needs to be a test that tests the condition of the user and there needs to be checks on houses if the guns are stored in save places. Also extensive testing has to be done to even get a gun. If the gun in a mass shooting that is registered to your dad, your dad is going to jail for your actions.
2) Kids that murder up whole schools will most likely be dead after the incident. They do not care about it themselves, there parents probably don't care about these kids and in general nobody does. I personally think that people need to be more alert specially around these people to give tips/hints towards the government so they can step in and do something about it.
How to do this however?
Make parents responsible for the shootings indirect. The only way they can not be accused is if the parents warn goverment instance about there kid being a loony and could derail. This will put a mental barrier towards the kid shooting things up because now his family will get into trouble because of his doing and killing himself wouldn't prevent this. If the kid doesn't care about his family, then parents are better paying attention to what there kids do unless they wanna spend some time in jail. So whenever there son stands with 2 machine guns with nazi outfits shouting i am god and i will murder everybody that doesn't believe in me, they will report him and the government will know about it and can secure those schools better.
3) Metal detectors are going to be a must, and militaire or ex miltaire grade personal has to be at the entrance but also inside the school paroling. 3 armed officers mean nothing if the school is massive. The moment this kid pulls a gun out of his pants at some area where no police is, it's gg and that will happen because obviously he wants to create max carnage. Now the shooting will take place at the front of the building and even if he takes out 2 officers guarding it, the ones patrolling will be on this gun in seconds.
4) Media needs to be limited around these events. Report of this needs to be short and small of information. No names or faces announced so they won't get any recognision which prevents these attention seekers from doing there thing and be seen by people something they probably crave for.
5) Build metal car protectors around the schools to prevent drive ins, but also make reinforced walls around school so he can't move into play yards or other area's that are not guarded easy. Protect these on top of it with motion detectors and extra security personal that check camera's when schools are in.
6) Build bunkers everywhere in those schools that are completely sealed from the outside and heavily reinforce those bunkers
7) bullit proof windows and walls and doors with tear gass area's everwhere that can be enabled by armed reenforcers.
8) instruct parents that pick up there kids to be armed to the teeth and can only pick there kids up inside and walk outside at specific times and checks so the outside area's are protected also.
dropkick!
Member
^
Number 1 is a no-no. When government decides to say no more guns, they can literally have a list of who has one and get them raided and/or slap a felony. Not to mention additional taxes that guarantees only politicians, rich people and organized crime syndycates have guns. This is established by FOPA.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act
This is why many gun owners refuse to do a background check reform. The background checks right now are already waaaay comprehensive than what gun control groups are saying. And almost all of the gun control politicians proposals for UBCs need to require makeshift gun registry.
Don't blame the gun owners for this... every single time a gun control lawgets passed, gun owners get duped so hard to a point of not budging on anything.
Number 1 is a no-no. When government decides to say no more guns, they can literally have a list of who has one and get them raided and/or slap a felony. Not to mention additional taxes that guarantees only politicians, rich people and organized crime syndycates have guns. This is established by FOPA.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearm_Owners_Protection_Act
This is why many gun owners refuse to do a background check reform. The background checks right now are already waaaay comprehensive than what gun control groups are saying. And almost all of the gun control politicians proposals for UBCs need to require makeshift gun registry.
Don't blame the gun owners for this... every single time a gun control lawgets passed, gun owners get duped so hard to a point of not budging on anything.
Didn't say i didn't believe he said it. Just that when something is quoted it should have a link with it.
I agree on not having less exits. Though I do think that the less entrances the better.
Acerac
Banned
Why did you link a post from February? That is likely not a very up to date count.
I'm pretty confident we've had at least one since then, or else this thread wouldn't exist.
Turbo Killer
Member
Who gives a shit? One is too fucking many. Show me another first world country that had a school shooting so far this year?
Sakura Doritos
Member
ProfessorLobo
Banned
You started off so sensible and then got more and more insane.
Annnnnnnnd of course.
Dice
Pokémon Parentage Conspiracy Theorist
You seem to have overlooked my second post where I explained why it is a problem. I will not repeat myself, but I will add to that post that we need realistic solutions that involve everyone on board. How many countries have rights to own guns written into their constitution and 370 million of them in civilian hands? You can't simply legislate that away. You can't take them away by force without starting Civil War 2, and even if that could be avoided we simply don't have enough servicemen (or funding to pay them) to go get them in any sensible time frame, let alone before they hit the black market. So if there is any fixing of the situation, it takes a cultural decisiveness and consensus that you absolutely will not obtain with partisan enmity and distrust.
We also had several decades where there were plenty of guns in the country and we let kids use them plenty, and even had shooting classes in schools, but we didn't have school shootings like this. Overall gun violence has drastically decreased since the mid 90s even though the number of guns has gone up, but these school shootings are on the rise ever since Columbine. Guns and youth access to them is one part of the issue, but we need to be figuring out all the reasons why, as guns were there before, when they weren't happening.
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grumpyGamer
Member
The only solution is the guns.
But americans prefer children dead than a law for guns
But americans prefer children dead than a law for guns