Scorpio presentation pictured within AMD's Vega/Ryzen booth

El_Chino said:
Matt also said the Scorpio wouldn't be much more powerful than the PS4Pro...
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Well, 6tf vs 4.2? 55% or what have you? We said the same thing about Xbone and Ps4 for the last 3 years no?

If it's still using jaguar in any form, I think that's not too much of a stretch.

Edit: sounds like he didn't even say that anyhow. Got links?
 
We're going around in circles, round and round like a merry go round, round and round like a merry go round.
 
Javin98 said:
There it is! Perhaps this time all the baseless speculations and unrealistic hopes and dreams will stop...... Who am I kidding? This happens every time with every new console launch, only for many people to get disappointed.
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For someone to say what is bolded, I have to ask what is Matt's credentials that the words he said means for sure that Zen wont be used or a version of Zen? I don't know who Matt is, is why I am asking. You seem to take his word like it is 100% factual, so just curious who Matt is and why we should take what he says as fact and 100% accurate? Not trying to discredit Matt, just curious.
 
Hawk269 said:
For someone to say what is bolded, I have to ask what is Matt's credentials that the words he said means for sure that Zen wont be used or a version of Zen? I don't know who Matt is, is why I am asking. You seem to take his word like it is 100% factual, so just curious who Matt is and why we should take what he says as fact and 100% accurate? Not trying to discredit Matt, just curious.
Click to expand...
Well, just reading through the posts on the previous page, you can see that he seems to be an insider who has information on both Sony and Microsoft, even Nintendo if I'm not mistaken. As someone said earlier, he's likely a dev who works on these platforms. Obviously he's not 100% accurate, I can't think of any source that is, even Wall Street Journal has been wrong before. However, Matt is far more often right than wrong, so I think it's fair to take his word for it.
 
Hawk269 said:
For someone to say what is bolded, I have to ask what is Matt's credentials that the words he said means for sure that Zen wont be used or a version of Zen? I don't know who Matt is, is why I am asking. You seem to take his word like it is 100% factual, so just curious who Matt is and why we should take what he says as fact and 100% accurate? Not trying to discredit Matt, just curious.
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Major 3rd party dev from what I recall with more credibility than everyone in this thread combined.
Ignore his comments though if you wanna stay hyped. Cause he will rain on your parade with something fierce usually muahaha.

Edit:
Bits N Pieces said:
So they have been talking about things to developers and you can say what isn't in it, can you say what is?
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That would be NDA territory, wouldn't it? xp
 
Javin98 said:
Well, just reading through the posts on the previous page, you can see that he seems to be an insider who has information on both Sony and Microsoft, even Nintendo if I'm not mistaken. As someone said earlier, he's likely a dev who works on these platforms. Obviously he's not 100% accurate, I can't think of any source that is, even Wall Street Journal has been wrong before. However, Matt is far more often right than wrong, so I think it's fair to take his word for it.
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Yeah, I did not see those posts when I posted my question. Thanks though. Always good to have some insiders giving us some info!!!
 
tuna_love said:
matt just says a lot of vague things and doesnt record rabbits when they dance to taylor swift. extremely untrustworthy
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To be fair, don't most insiders post vague hints? Just look at the E3 threads. Whenever an insider drops hints, they don't confirm something but prefer to tease it. It definitely helps so that people don't crucify them for being wrong and more importantly, prevent any NDA violations whatsoever so they don't get in trouble.
 
Javin98 said:
To be fair, don't most insiders post vague hints? Just look at the E3 threads. Whenever an insider drops hints, they don't confirm something but prefer to tease it. It definitely helps so that people don't crucify them for being wrong and more importantly, protect their identity so they don't get in trouble.
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but the rabbit?
 
hanspampel said:
this guy get's it
usual investor call talk

"Well, I think, if you look today at the semi-custom business, it's been primarily game console driven. And it’s been again very, very pleased with the franchise that we’ve built around that. We do have engagements outside of game consoles, and that will ramp, let’s call it, more in the 2018 timeframe. The other thing you should expect is I talked about our Zen roadmap for our products, so in terms of desktops servers and notebooks. But one should expect Zen in our semi-custom roadmap as well as we go – as we look beyond 2017 into the ’18, ’19 timeframe. And so, we really do view this as we’re developing foundational IP that can go into a number of different markets. And we have good prospects in those areas"

it's totally possible, that she is talking about pure Zen CPU semi custom Chips for non gaming purpose. it's just way to vague and unspecific to make "scorpio will have -" or "scorpio won't have zen technology in its semi custom soc" out of that
that is at least my point of view on this matter
Click to expand...

Okay let's go through this -
Well, I think, if you look today at the semi-custom business, it's been primarily game console driven. And it’s been again very, very pleased with the franchise that we’ve built around that. We do have engagements outside of game consoles, and that will ramp, let’s call it, more in the 2018 timeframe
Click to expand...
Clearly there she is talking about non gaming semi-custom design wins that will happen in 2018 as you said.
The other thing you should expect is I talked about our Zen roadmap for our products, so in terms of desktops servers and notebooks.
Click to expand...
Now she goes away from talking about semi-custom and talks about notebook/desktop roadmap. Possibly referring back to her 2017 talk on these.(I haven't checked the question to see)
But one should expect Zen in our semi-custom roadmap as well as we go – as we look beyond 2017 into the ’18, ’19 timeframe. And so, we really do view this as we’re developing foundational IP that can go into a number of different markets. And we have good prospects in those areas"
Click to expand...
Now she talks about Zen as a whole in the semi-custom roadmap. Note this is different from the first part of the statement where she specifically talks about non gaming design wins in the 2018 timeframe. When speaking about time frames she says "beyond 2017" which can only mean one thing > 2017 then gives a more general time frame of "18 19" in what years to expect these products.

Now look back at the way she starts the sentence "But one should expect Zen in our semi-custom roadmap as well as we go" - That signifies the fact she is continuing her talk of roadmaps from notebook/desktop areas and expanding to talk about semi-custom areas as a whole.

TLDR: Nothing suggests a 2017 time frame for semi-custom products in that quote and it's not that vague if you go through at one at a time.
 
I know how this works here. Lots of people endlessly pretending to be enthusiastic and excited about the prospect of Zen being in Scorpio, only so they can do their fake disappointment trolling drama when it inevitably doesn't happen. We've just seen it happen with Switch, we saw it happen with Pro last year, and now...
 
Inuhanyou said:
We're going around in circles, round and round like a merry go round, round and round like a merry go round.
Click to expand...

correct. and without new information nothing will change.
ms is rumored to have a hardware event in february / march. i would not have high hopes, but maybe they'll at least tease something about scorpio
 
Matt really isn't one of these 'vague' insiders that thirsts for attention. In fact he's always been rather concise and clear about things.

It's only natural to be careful about what you post on here.
 
Kaako said:
Major 3rd party dev from what I recall with more credibility than everyone in this thread combined.
Ignore his comments though if you wanna stay hyped. Cause he will rain on your parade with something fierce usually muahaha.
Click to expand...

Well, like others, regardless of what side you are on the console wars who doesn't want the best possible hardware? I have all consoles and play all types of games on each of them. I do like powerful hardware and been disappointed by both the PS4/Xbox One as unlike most console cycles they were not cutting edge.

With all the talk of "beast", "most powerful console ever" and knowing the downfall that the Jaguar CPU is, of course people are going to want something much more powerful going into the box. So, I don't think Matt making comments is going to deflate hype, if anything, if he has a good track record, those that are so confident that it will have ZEN at all may be a little hurt. For me, I just want the best possible hardware at a reasonable price. If they are not using Zen at all, it just seems weird that they are waiting till the end of 2017 to release it if it is just going to use Jaguar again.
 
El_Chino said:
Please explain.
Click to expand...

You said:
Matt also said the Scorpio wouldn't be much more powerful than the PS4Pro...
Click to expand...

Matt said:

As a point of fact, no I didn't.
Click to expand...

When the only source you have is Matt saying that he doesn't believe Microsoft will blow the 'Neo' out of the water.
And whether it does or not is entirely relative. Do you think the PS4 completely blows the Xbox One out of the water? The difference is about the same.
 
hanspampel said:
this guy get's it
usual investor call talk

"Well, I think, if you look today at the semi-custom business, it's been primarily game console driven. And it’s been again very, very pleased with the franchise that we’ve built around that. We do have engagements outside of game consoles, and that will ramp, let’s call it, more in the 2018 timeframe. The other thing you should expect is I talked about our Zen roadmap for our products, so in terms of desktops servers and notebooks. But one should expect Zen in our semi-custom roadmap as well as we go – as we look beyond 2017 into the ’18, ’19 timeframe. And so, we really do view this as we’re developing foundational IP that can go into a number of different markets. And we have good prospects in those areas"

it's totally possible, that she is talking about pure Zen CPU semi custom Chips for non gaming purpose. it's just way to vague and unspecific to make "scorpio will have -" or "scorpio won't have zen technology in its semi custom soc" out of that
that is at least my point of view on this matter
Click to expand...

We now spinning a straightforward quote? C'mon now.
 
Hoo-doo said:
When the only source you have is Matt saying that he doesn't believe Microsoft will blow the 'Neo' out of the water.
And whether it does or not is entirely relative. Do you think the PS4 completely blows the Xbox One out of the water? The difference is about the same.
Click to expand...
.500 Tflop difference is the same as 1.8 Tflop difference? Lol
 
El_Chino said:
So when did we start claiming a 1.8 Tflop difference isn't that big of a deal?
Click to expand...

Was it ever that big of a deal? Do you truly expect a world of difference between PS4P and the Scorpio?

El_Chino said:
.500 Tflop difference is the same as 1.8 Tflop difference? Lol
Click to expand...

Percentage wise the gap between XB1 and PS4 is about the same as the gap between the PS4P and the Scorpio.
I'm expecting games to run better on Scorpio and certain games rocking higher resolutions or even native 4K, but besides that not much different.
 
Kayant said:
Okay let's go through this -
Click to expand...

Lisa Su
Yes, it's fair to say. So, if you look at our margin profiles today, they are heavily weighted by our game console business. And our game console business tends to have gross margins that are below the corporate average. But frankly have operating margins that are actually very healthy, because it's a model where customers actually paid for the engineering. And so the fall-through is very high. I think at a broader level though, at a broader level, we believe that margin expansion is extremely important in our business, certainly in the semiconductor business margin expansion is critical.
As we get into the higher end segments, such as high-end PCs, high-end servers, high-end GPUs. You will see our margin profile shift up with that product mix. As it relates to the custom business I think it's more market specific than business model specific. So, if we were doing custom in the data center, I think you would see higher margins versus game consoles, which happen to be, let's call it very high volume silicon TAM but tend to be more price sensitive.
John Pitzer
That's a good segue into my next question. I got you're going to pre-announce any new customers in the custom, semi-custom business. But as you think about moving up to those higher market segments within that business, what's the timeline? How do we think about milestones over the next, call it, four to eight quarters?
Lisa Su
Well, I think -- if you look today at the semi-custom business, it's been primarily game console driven. And it's been again very, very pleased with the franchise that we've built around that. We do have engagements outside of game consoles, and that will ramp, let's call more in the 2018 timeframe. The other thing you should expect is I talked about our Zen roadmap for our products, so in terms of desktops servers and notebooks. But one should expect Zen in our semi-custom roadmap as well as we go -- as we look beyond 2017 into the '18, '19 timeframe. And so, we really do view this as we're developing foundational IP that can go into a number of different markets. And we have good prospects in those areas.
Click to expand...

new customer design wins
high margin semi custom business (not console)
future outlook about financial impact.

THAT is what lisa is talking about

Chobel said:
We now spinning a straightforward quote? C'mon now.
Click to expand...
no we don't spin (at least not me). but some here interpret a quote wrong because they don't have or use the full context
 
Round and round, round and round...
umWHTg8.gif
 
El_Chino said:
So when did we start claiming a 1.8 Tflop difference isn't that big of a deal?
Click to expand...
The point is he don't put any kind of assertion to how much more powerful it could be.

"Blowing out of the water" isn't really measurable and means differently for each person.

Also he's comment in that thread could have just been an opinion and no related to any info he might have known.
Ushay said:
Who is Matt (in relation to Microsoft)? Legit question.
Click to expand...
He's a dev with access to both consoles that is all. Ofc he does industry people to get the info he has given in the past.
 
El_Chino said:
So when did we start claiming a 1.8 Tflop difference isn't that big of a deal?
Click to expand...

Whether one considers a 1.8 TFLOP difference a big deal is irrelevant to our back and forth - you misrepresented Matt's post, and that was my point in its entirety. No more, no less.

For the record, I personally do think it's significant. Further, how it's going to manifest will vary depending on game and developer. For many third party devs, I expect them to pour the extra power (relative to PS4Pro) into upping resolution, often to full 4K relative to the Pro's checkerboard approach. For at least some games developed internally by MS, I expect more of that power to be allocated to bolstering non-resolution bells and whistles, which will result in a more perceptible difference in eye candy.
 
Kayant said:
Now look back at the way she starts the sentence "But one should expect Zen in our semi-custom roadmap as well as we go" - That signifies the fact she is continuing her talk of roadmaps from notebook/desktop areas and expanding to talk about semi-custom areas as a whole.

TLDR: Nothing suggests a 2017 time frame for semi-custom products in that quote and it's not that vague if you go through at one at a time.
Click to expand...

But "beyond 2017" doesn't necessarily mean not in 2017. When does AMD's fiscal year end? Even then how much value is there in their partnership with MS? Is MS part of this same roadmap or did they get in there first and make it worthwhile enough to give them a jump in front of AMD's other partners? Either way, I don't see how anyone can get an answer going either way from the statements we have been given. Chill out and wait it out, guys.
 
hanspampel said:
new customer design wins
high margin semi custom business (not console)
future outlook about financial impact.

THAT is what lisa is talking about


no we don't spin (at least not me). but some here interpret a quote wrong because they don't have or use the full context
Click to expand...

Keep on spinning I guess.

Vegetable Lasagna said:
That could still mean 2017 despite her saying "beyond 2017" though. When does AMD's fiscal year end?
Click to expand...

Late December.
 
hanspampel said:
new customer design wins
high margin semi custom business (not console)
future outlook about financial impact.

THAT is what lisa is talking about
Click to expand...
Okay that puts things more into prospective and from the question you can see she answered and talked about these in the first part of her answer before she moved to about talk about Zen desktop/servers then back to Zen in Semi-custom as a whole.
 
anothertech said:
Well, 6tf vs 4.2? 55% or what have you? We said the same thing about Xbone and Ps4 for the last 3 years no?

If it's still using jaguar in any form, I think that's not too much of a stretch.

Edit: sounds like he didn't even say that anyhow. Got links?
Click to expand...

43%
 
Chobel said:
Keep on spinning I guess.
Click to expand...

keep on making just bitching posts and don't contribute anything substantial, i guess
this whole topic is arguing about an answer without even knowing or posting the question that is the reference to that statement one single time. (until now)

Kayant said:
Okay that puts things more into prospective and from the question you can see she answered and talked about these in the first part of her answer before she moved to about talk about Zen desktop/servers then back to Zen in Semi-custom as a whole.
Click to expand...

the whole segment is about semi custom business
the "I talked about our Zen roadmap for our products, so in terms of desktops servers and notebooks" part is just the opening for the zen part and reference to an already given statement about the zen roadmap for desktop, laptop and sever she made before.
 
Kayant said:
Okay that puts things more into prospective and from the question you can see she answered and talked about these in the first part of her answer before she moved to about talk about Zen desktop/servers then back to Zen in Semi-custom as a whole.
Click to expand...

Indeed, and that is plainly obvious to one with critical reading ability.

In hans' quoted passage the context switches multiple times, but by the time it returns to the "beyond 2017" part, she's clearly talking about semi-custom in general, and without restriction to high margin, as you said.

I mean, she immediately shifts back to the context of non-high margin game consoles when she starts answering the question:
Well, I think -- if you look today at the semi-custom business, it's been primarily game console driven
Click to expand...
 
Vegetable Lasagna said:
But "beyond 2017" doesn't necessarily mean not in 2017. When does AMD's fiscal year end? Even then how much value is there in their partnership with MS? Is MS part of this same roadmap or did they get in there first and make it worthwhile to give them a jump? Either way, I don't see how anyone can get an answer from the statements we have been given. Chill out and wait it out, guys.
Click to expand...

12. What are AMD’s fiscal year and quarters?
AMD’s fiscal year follows the standard calendar year. Fiscal quarters for the 2015 year (exact dates are adjusted early):
First Quarter: December 28, 2014 – March 28, 2015
Second Quarter: March 29, 2015 – June 27, 2015
Third Quarter: June 28, 2015 – September 26, 2015
Fourth Quarter: September 27, 2015 – December 26, 2015
Click to expand...
So if am not wrong in saying Q1 2018 would be December 28, 2017 – March 28, 2018 which would mean it would be too late as iirc Scorpio is Hoildays 2017.

Anyways I just like to discuss given we on a discussion forum :p.
 
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