• Hey, guest user. Hope you're enjoying NeoGAF! Have you considered registering for an account? Come join us and add your take to the daily discourse.

SEC Filing: MS Will Honor Existing Activision Commitments (Sony, Google, Apple) Post-Close

iamvin22

Industry Verified
Yeah PlayStation will get COD this year and next. 2024 it will be gone though
Doubt it. By 2024 playstations lead will be. Massive. Spiderman 2 will already have been out and wolverine that year as well. Naughty dogs games would most like ha e already launched as well.

Makes zero business sense to pull cod. I believe the end goal for Ms is to have gamepass on both playstation and Nintendo platforms. It's the only way it can come even close to sustainable.
 

HeisenbergFX4

Gold Member
Dude.....70 billion. BILLION!! No ...just no.
Its just my thought and honestly I 100% hope COD becomes a MS exclusive and goes to Gamepass because when I do play COD its on Xbox with crossplay off so would most likely increase my player pool

Doubt it. By 2024 playstations lead will be. Massive. Spiderman 2 will already have been out and wolverine that year as well. Naughty dogs games would most like ha e already launched as well.

Makes zero business sense to pull cod. I believe the end goal for Ms is to have gamepass on both playstation and Nintendo platforms. It's the only way it can come even close to sustainable.

100%
 
Last edited:

Lognor

Banned
I know they made the Bethesda games first party only, I was pretty sure they would, but I actually could see them keeping CoD multiplat. It's not because they can't afford to leave money on the table, but because it makes Gamepass look like an even crazier value proposition if subscribers get the base game for free while everyone else has to pony up $60-70 for one title.
But how is that different from Starfield? It too would make Game Pass look like a crazy good deal if Sony gamers have to pay $60-$70. And yet, here we are with Starfield being exclusive to Xbox
 

Lognor

Banned
Doubt it. By 2024 playstations lead will be. Massive. Spiderman 2 will already have been out and wolverine that year as well. Naughty dogs games would most like ha e already launched as well.

Makes zero business sense to pull cod. I believe the end goal for Ms is to have gamepass on both playstation and Nintendo platforms. It's the only way it can come even close to sustainable.
That's even more reason for Microsoft to not release it on PS! Playstation's lead right now is massive and yet Starfield is not releasing on PS.


All those games you listed for PS are for a certain demographic. COD is not necessarily in that same demographic. The demographic that owns a PS for COD will largely move to Xbox, which is what MS wants.
 

Lognor

Banned
When Sekiro 2 and the next tenchu are excluded from PS or pc or one of the other 5 platforms they would be available on if they were in the deal. But they weren’t. Enjoy your series s!
So you need to move from PS to PC? Hopefully you're PC can keep up! I have a Series X so I will be fine :)

I get that your upset since you are a Sekiro fan. I actually haven't played the game, but at this point I'll wait for it to be free on Game Pass next year! Good time to be a Game Pass user!
 

mansoor1980

Gold Member
I'm just not sure what point you are making. They didn't spent 70 billion because they want to sell more consoles than Sony as the driving factor...lol.
drcox-scrubs.gif
 

Leyasu

Banned
Doubt it. By 2024 playstations lead will be. Massive. Spiderman 2 will already have been out and wolverine that year as well. Naughty dogs games would most like ha e already launched as well.

Makes zero business sense to pull cod. I believe the end goal for Ms is to have gamepass on both playstation and Nintendo platforms. It's the only way it can come even close to sustainable.
Whatever. I am not here to preach or convert, I don’t give a fuck. Business sense or not, we have already seen what has happened with zenimax, and we will see again with activision. Microsoft are growing their brand and gamepass, not paying 70bn for exclusive marketing and putting money in Sonys pocket. PlayStation will be fine, but a a lot of people are going to be moving to Xbox for COD.

Gamepass is obviously plenty sustainable. You think that Microsoft took on all those studios without the means to pay for their running costs?

I am not talking about the acquisition costs. They have only grown so big because gamepass revenue is offsetting the running costs of their studios.
 

iamvin22

Industry Verified
Whatever. I am not here to preach or convert, I don’t give a fuck. Business sense or not, we have already seen what has happened with zenimax, and we will see again with activision. Microsoft are growing their brand and gamepass, not paying 70bn for exclusive marketing and putting money in Sonys pocket. PlayStation will be fine, but a a lot of people are going to be moving to Xbox for COD.

Gamepass is obviously plenty sustainable. You think that Microsoft took on all those studios without the means to pay for their running costs?

I am not talking about the acquisition costs. They have only grown so big because gamepass revenue is offsetting the running costs of their studios.
Well let's wait and see 😆😏
 

Three

Member
Show me what MS game has lost a chucnk of its userbase. Where are the statistics to support this statement?
I think he's referring to popular IPs being bought and made exclusive by them. Anything Rare is a good example. Perfect Dark Zero, Banjo Nuts and bolts, Conker, Killer Instinct etc. Other than that what IP has MS bought and made exclusive to see if it declined or went up? I don't think there are many examples but we have to wait and see some in the future.
 

treemk

Banned
When Sekiro 2 and the next tenchu are excluded from PS or pc or one of the other 5 platforms they would be available on if they were in the deal. But they weren’t. Enjoy your series s!

Sekiro is still From's property, Activision was a one off publishing deal.
 

Gavon West

Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
I’m just reading what is said, I shouldn’t have to think even for a second what this means, it’s their job to do the PR right and give a clear message to gamers and they’re failing at that. Go look at any forum or Twitter or youtube news video out there and this discussion is going on everywhere, and you’ll see that there are PS gamers posting that CoD will keep on coming to PS.
Phil's comments are going to be vague for a while. May as well prepare yourself for it. He cant say anything concrete until the deal is complete. It's not hard to understand whats going to happen though. Look at the Bethesda deal. You can expect the same thing here. They spent $70 Billion for a reason, and its not to keep the status quo. It's to rewrite it.
 

ManaByte

Member
Well hold on here.......like Minecraft? Is Minecraft still available on Playstation?

Yes, but it's on it's own little island. Sony won't allow crossplay with it. So while people can crossplay Minecraft across PC, Xbox, Switch, and Mobile, those on the PlayStation only have access to worlds created on the PS because Sony wants to "protect the children".
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Yes, but it's on it's own little island. Sony won't allow crossplay with it. So while people can crossplay Minecraft across PC, Xbox, Switch, and Mobile, those on the PlayStation only have access to worlds created on the PS because Sony wants to "protect the children".

Okay, so this maybe what happens with CoD then. I'm only saying this due to what Microsoft put in this SEC filing.
 

StreetsofBeige

Gold Member
Honouring commitments can mean two things:

1. Honour it by fulfilling the deal (release a game as agreed to on a contract)
2. Honour the contract that will always (at least should have) exit clauses and outs. And putting up your hand to exit the deal as per clauses is technically honouring the deal too

I've read over my share of contracts at work too. You got annual deals, and ongoing deals that just carryover year over year if nobody brings up changing it.

A good contract will have outs by either side.

It can be, give notice 90 days before termination. Or give notice of xxx days and pay a penalty too.

All comes down to what's in these video game contracts.
 
Last edited:

twilo99

Member
Yes, but it's on it's own little island. Sony won't allow crossplay with it. So while people can crossplay Minecraft across PC, Xbox, Switch, and Mobile, those on the PlayStation only have access to worlds created on the PS because Sony wants to "protect the children".

That's not typical of Sony at all...
 

Evil Calvin

Afraid of Boobs
I would say.....ok Jimmy.......COD on PS5 for Horizon FW on XSX. Diablo 4 on PS5 for God of War 2 on XSX. Elder Scrolls: 6 on PS5 for Spiderman 2 on XSX. If they say no then screw them.
 
Yes, but it's on it's own little island. Sony won't allow crossplay with it. So while people can crossplay Minecraft across PC, Xbox, Switch, and Mobile, those on the PlayStation only have access to worlds created on the PS because Sony wants to "protect the children".
I’m pretty sure PlayStation eventually relented to this back in 2019

 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
I would say.....ok Jimmy.......COD on PS5 for Horizon FW on XSX. Diablo 4 on PS5 for God of War 2 on XSX. Elder Scrolls: 6 on PS5 for Spiderman 2 on XSX. If they say no then screw them.

I don't think that's how any of this works.
 

bitbydeath

Member
So you agree with me, they'll all move because their friends are moving to play COD. You do realize tons of people moved from the 360 to PS4 simply because it was the better place to play COD, you don't think exclusive COD is going to bring them back?
That move had nothing to do with COD.
 
Doubt it. By 2024 playstations lead will be. Massive. Spiderman 2 will already have been out and wolverine that year as well. Naughty dogs games would most like ha e already launched as well.

Makes zero business sense to pull cod. I believe the end goal for Ms is to have gamepass on both playstation and Nintendo platforms. It's the only way it can come even close to sustainable.
"Massive" in what way? They already have Miles Morales, but "only" lead by 3 million units. You can blame that on production capacity issues but there's nothing preventing someone from saying the same for Xbox (especially WRT the X).

Also IMO how well the Wolverine game is received will in part depend on how well Disney-Marvel introduce the X-Men into the MCU. They're already considering not calling them the X-Men anymore because of stupid reasons, and their output last year was mediocre at best (the only decent entries were Shang-Chi and Hawkeye, but if those were Phase 3 they'd be at the bottom end alongside Captain Marvel). If they screw up the X-Men, that can have a negative impact on the Wolverine game, despite who's working on it.

A best bet would be Sony Pictures getting the film rights to Wolverine but it seems like outside of Spiderman they can't do other characters that well i.e Venom. We'll have to wait for the Morbius movie to see if that was a one-off or confirmation that they're mainly a Spiderman house. The rest of your comment's a tad ridiculous tbh.

I think he's referring to popular IPs being bought and made exclusive by them. Anything Rare is a good example. Perfect Dark Zero, Banjo Nuts and bolts, Conker, Killer Instinct etc. Other than that what IP has MS bought and made exclusive to see if it declined or went up? I don't think there are many examples but we have to wait and see some in the future.

The Killer Instinct revival was pretty well-received IIRC, and was one of their stronger launch-period games for XBO. There's still a sizable fanbase for the game, though I'd agree MS dropped the ball on not continuing support for it as long as they should've. The original developer getting purchased complicated that, but that probably also shows if management at the time were better they'd of had the initiative to purchase Double Helix shortly after reception proved highly favorable.
 
Last edited:

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
"Massive" in what way? They already have Miles Morales, but "only" lead by 3 million units. You can blame that on production capacity issues but there's nothing preventing someone from saying the same for Xbox (especially WRT the X).

Also IMO how well the Wolverine game is received will in part depend on how well Disney-Marvel introduce the X-Men into the MCU. They're already considering not calling them the X-Men anymore because of stupid reasons, and their output last year was mediocre at best (the only decent entries were Shang-Chi and Hawkeye, but if those were Phase 3 they'd be at the bottom end alongside Captain Marvel). If they screw up the X-Men, that can have a negative impact on the Wolverine game, despite who's working on it.

A best bet would be Sony Pictures getting the film rights to Wolverine but it seems like outside of Spiderman they can't do other characters that well i.e Venom. We'll have to wait for the Morbius movie to see if that was a one-off or confirmation that they're mainly a Spiderman house. The rest of your comment's a tad ridiculous tbh.

I thought the PS5 had at least an estimated 6 million unit lead at the moment.
 
I thought the PS5 had at least an estimated 6 million unit lead at the moment.
Well officially, their last numbers were 13.5 million at the end of September. We know in both November and December they sold less than Nintendo and Microsoft in NPD, and in December sold less than them in the UK. System sales tend to roll off a bit in January, and IIRC there was a recent story that they would only be producing 15 million units for the FY instead of the 22 million they wanted, due to chip shortages affecting everyone. They're expecting 22.6 million LTD by end of FY 2022 (ending March 2023); if they can produce more, they'll surpass that number.

Spencer recently said they've shipped 12 million; given that all the systems are fairly in-demand they've at least sold 11 - 11.5 million if not all 12 million. Sony had to revise their FY 2021 totals to 15 million at end of November, so they probably only have enough stock to have sold an additional 1.6 million units between December and end of March. It could be a bit more but these are all just going off official statements from both companies.

I know VGChartz likes to track this stuff, but they aren't that good a credible source. Take everything from them with a big grain of salt.
 
I just thought the game was pretty far along, maybe I got that mistaken with the Diablo 2 remake instead.

If that's the case, then yeah there'd be no contractual obligation for Diablo 4. That'll most likely skip PlayStation at this point.
Diablo 4 won't be on Playstation.

CoD Warzone will stay multiplat for MTX.

CoD annual/bi-annual releases will go Xbox exclusive from 2024 forward.
 
Diablo 4 won't be on Playstation.

CoD Warzone will stay multiplat for MTX.

CoD annual/bi-annual releases will go Xbox exclusive from 2024 forward.
Yeah, that seems reasonable. I think World of Warcraft might also get console ports to Xbox and PlayStation, but if they bring out a new mainline Warcraft game that'll be Xbox/PC/GamePass only.

I kinda want to see if they have the cajones to bring back Leisure Suit Larry tbh.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Well officially, their last numbers were 13.5 million at the end of September. We know in both November and December they sold less than Nintendo and Microsoft in NPD, and in December sold less than them in the UK. System sales tend to roll off a bit in January, and IIRC there was a recent story that they would only be producing 15 million units for the FY instead of the 22 million they wanted, due to chip shortages affecting everyone. They're expecting 22.6 million LTD by end of FY 2022 (ending March 2023); if they can produce more, they'll surpass that number.

Spencer recently said they've shipped 12 million; given that all the systems are fairly in-demand they've at least sold 11 - 11.5 million if not all 12 million. Sony had to revise their FY 2021 totals to 15 million at end of November, so they probably only have enough stock to have sold an additional 1.6 million units between December and end of March. It could be a bit more but these are all just going off official statements from both companies.

I know VGChartz likes to track this stuff, but they aren't that good a credible source. Take everything from them with a big grain of salt.

I think your numbers are missing some initial PS5 shipments though. Up through April 2021 I "think" Sony had sold 8 million PS5s started at launch (November 2020).


While the company was expecting to assemble 16 million units between April 2021 and March 2022, that figure is reportedly now at around 15 million.

Sony had publicly predicted that it would sell 14.8 million PS5 consoles this financial year, so while this isn’t a large downward revision, it shows just how tight the supply is likely to be for the foreseeable future. The figure of 16 million units would have allowed Sony to meet that goal while securing additional stock for the following year.
 
Phil's comments are going to be vague for a while. May as well prepare yourself for it. He cant say anything concrete until the deal is complete. It's not hard to understand whats going to happen though. Look at the Bethesda deal. You can expect the same thing here. They spent $70 Billion for a reason, and its not to keep the status quo. It's to rewrite it.
It's amazing and more than a little hilarious to watch SonyGAF go thru the exact same stages of grief they went thru with the Bethesda deal. They've progressed from disbelief right thru anger and into denial rather quickly this time. One would think more people would have learned something from last time, but apparently not...🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️😅
 
I think your numbers are missing some initial PS5 shipments though. Up through April 2021 I "think" Sony had sold 8 million PS5s started at launch (November 2020).



Regardless, both are selling very, very well. And the expected Playstation units sold advantage is nowhere close to the "2.5-3x Xbox" many of the usual suspects were predicting 18 months ago.
 

Gavon West

Spread's Cheeks for Intrusive Ads
It's amazing and more than a little hilarious to watch SonyGAF go thru the exact same stages of grief they went thru with the Bethesda deal. They've progressed from disbelief right thru anger and into denial rather quickly this time. One would think more people would have learned something from last time, but apparently not...🤦‍♂️🤷‍♂️😅
Because they dont look at this deal from a practical point of view. They'd rather get in their feelings about shit. Fuck feelings! $70 Billion dollars says, rather definitively, fuck yo feelings, plainly put. That said, its not hard to see how things will play out. If Microsoft isnt going to give games to their competitor with a 7 billion dollar deal, how in the fuck do you even formulate in your mind that they will do it with 70 billion dollars? It's inconceivable. They'll allow some games already on PS5 to continue. But the juggernauts? Hell no!
 
I think your numbers are missing some initial PS5 shipments though. Up through April 2021 I "think" Sony had sold 8 million PS5s started at launch (November 2020).



Okay, I stand corrected. But like M Memorabilia just said, they're both selling through what they can produce, and Sony themselves gave the 13.6 (or 13.8, some sources have different numbers) million sold-through number back in October of last year. So they either sold roughly 5 million units between April 2021 and late October 2021, or the 8 million was shipped numbers, or their production capacity has been severely hampered by the chip shortages.

Or, some mixture of all three could be true.
 

mckmas8808

Mckmaster uses MasterCard to buy Slave drives
Regardless, both are selling very, very well. And the expected Playstation units sold advantage is nowhere close to the "2.5-3x Xbox" many of the usual suspects were predicting 18 months ago.

Most of the people that predicted the 2.5x Xbox were saying that it'll be that by the "end of the generation". Not within the first year.

Okay, I stand corrected. But like M Memorabilia just said, they're both selling through what they can produce, and Sony themselves gave the 13.6 (or 13.8, some sources have different numbers) million sold-through number back in October of last year. So they either sold roughly 5 million units between April 2021 and late October 2021, or the 8 million was shipped numbers, or their production capacity has been severely hampered by the chip shortages.

Or, some mixture of all three could be true.

Yeah I think it was 8 million from November 2020 to March 31 2021. Then another 5 million from April 2021 to October 2021. Since then, we just don't know what their numbers are. People are assuming they've sold about 4-5 million world wide since September 30th of last year.
 

sainraja

Member




So basically the same as Bethesda. Stuff like Warzone will continue to be supported on PlayStation.

But once that marketing deal ends...?
The easy position to take is MS will keep things exclusive to their platforms once they are able to (past all the agreements, etc); however, the example you are using to support your point here does the opposite — Microsoft continues to support Minecraft across all platforms with new releases as far as I know (Unless new Minecraft games haven't been put on PlayStation?). Anything can be at play here, I think it all depends on how the market is in the next few years, that will ultimately determine if they show up outside of the MS ecosystem.
 
Last edited:

sainraja

Member
Put yourself in MS shoes. You just spent 68 billion on Activision. Now do you…

A. Publish COD on PS. Make some nice profits. Get a cut of the huge micro transactions. Also put it on pc/ xbox/ streaming etc.

B. Don’t publish COD on PS. Putting your foot on the neck of your biggest competitor. Huge COD playerbase now has to buy an Xbox/ PC or get fucked. Most console buyers will sign up for gamepass because why wouldn’t you? Rake in gamepass subs + nobody else gets a cut of the micro transactions.

Now keep in mind you are Microsoft and have unlimited cash at your disposal and are already balls deep in loss leader mode.
Yeah, they will most likely do what is best for their business. Based on how things have been in the gaming industry, chances are, everyone saying things will go exclusive past agreements are correct (99%) UNLESS their end goal is something else. Anyway, I think getting Activision Blizzard was a big move by MS but I don't think it's doom & gloom for Sony just yet no matter how much the diehard Xbox people here want it to be.
 
Last edited:

yurinka

Member
Yup. Pretty much expected

Outside of Warzone support, COD 2023, and maybe Diablo 4 will be the last games on PS.
The SEC filling and on Twitter Activision, MS and Phil Spencer don't seem to say that.


Put yourself in MS shoes. You just spent 68 billion on Activision. Now do you…

A. Publish COD on PS. Make some nice profits. Get a cut of the huge micro transactions. Also put it on pc/ xbox/ streaming etc.

B. Don’t publish COD on PS. Putting your foot on the neck of your biggest competitor. Huge COD playerbase now has to buy an Xbox/ PC or get fucked. Most console buyers will sign up for gamepass because why wouldn’t you? Rake in gamepass subs + nobody else gets a cut of the micro transactions.

Now keep in mind you are Microsoft and have unlimited cash at your disposal and are already balls deep in loss leader mode.
If CoD would go console exclusive, assuming each CoD sells 20-30M, and being generous 10-12M are on PS.
-Remove from these PS CoD players the ones who also have an Xbox or gaming PC and would now would play CoD elsewhere but would continue having a PS.
-Remove the casual ones who bought CoD because saw it due a Sony marketing deal and now CoD would get whatever replaces CoD there.
-Remove the ones who would remain in PS playing older CoD or any other shooter or any other game.

How many players would leave PS because of CoD going exclusive? 5M being generous maybe? PS4 has almost 120M and PS5 is on track to out sell it. To make many fans angry, to stop getting the money from PS and all that money spent to steal around 5M users (let's be generous and say 10M instead) that are only a small part of the competition?

I think it would be easier and more profitable to keep everything as it is but to add CoD on GP day one: they'd continue getting the money from PS as they do with Mojang and Zenimax, fans of these series don't get angry for being forced to move and the userbase+revenue of GP would get increasing anyways.
 
Last edited:

MikeM

Member
COD is as good as gone from Playstation consoles forever past potentially 2023 and 2024. Only the existing games will remain.
Might just mean that the older COD games will just live on for longer. The majority of the typical, one console household won’t buy a new xbox console because little Timmy can’t play COD anymore on PS.

Child: Mom! We need a new *insert price of Xbox in 2024* xbox to play the new COD.
Mom: “We have COD”- points at all other CODs.
Child reluctantly plays earlier COD with other friends in the same boat. Life goes on.
 

Stooky

Banned
All MS cares about is driving people to gamepass at this point. They don’t give a fuck about losing short term money by skipping Sony consoles.
…..40% of sales on Ps5 30% on ps4 , the rest is everybody else……thats short term money? What ever bruh.
 
Last edited:

BennyBlanco

aka IMurRIVAL69
…..40% of sales on Ps5 30% on ps4 , the rest is everybody else……thats short term money? What ever bruh.

Yeah, they have demonstrated time and time again all they care about is driving gamepass numbers up. They will gladly eat a loss up front and have been for years. Chess not checkers.
 

Dolomite

Member
Or lose millions
They need to convince the Playstation userbase to switch without taking it away.
Then they take it away.
ManaByte you're smarter then that
you know exactly what the end result will be, we've seen it time and time again
Shareholders are not gamers. Shareholders don't give a shit about console wars. Shareholders want MS stock to rise so they can sell at a profit or double down and buy more. In the eyes of shareholders more gamepass subs > Licensing royalties from a MS game on Playstation consoles.
 
Top Bottom