Bartski
Gold Member
yeah the info on powerpyx is incorrect. They haven't fully tested NG+ it seems. The trophy is for all memos, on NG+ it's just a slightly different list. Good luck!
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Silent Hill 2 |OT| You promised you'd take me there again someday...
- Thread starter cormack12
- Start date
dok1or
Member
Bartski
Gold Member
Yeah "in the water" is considered canon also in the SH2 novel. It's the "bad ending", but a PERFECT conclusion nonetheless for reasons you pointed out. The SPOILER ALERT corpse in the car is just such a legendary twist in all of videogame storytelling history and it's the only ending that "uncovers" it, solidifying what was the real timeline of events was.Just made it out of Blue Creek. My god, the relief. That was a hell of a trial. I'm legit drained (and terrified of the inevitible next otherworld section).
I completely get that. It's a great ending too. This always varies from player to player, and there are great points for both endings, so neither are wrong
Maria ending is factually wrong though idgaf
To me, "In Water" always just seemed more thematically appropriate for such a sad tone/bittersweet game. When you look at all the other characters the town torments, not a single one of them forgives themselves or rises above their respective issues. Eddie gets falls to/repeats his trauma over and over until he just straight up becomes an unremorseful shooter lashing out. Angela submits to the flames and effectively commits suicide. James making it out when she doesn't of all people just rubs me wrong.
There's also this official concept art from SH4, though obviously it never made it into the game so it's nothing concrete.
It doesn't quite matter, but both Cihi and Ito chose 'In Water' as their personal canons too, just because it felt more thematically appropriate.
There's also the fact that both James and Mary were stated to have gone missing in Silent Hill in both The Room and Homecoming. It's possible James went into hiding, but he doesn't strike me as quite capable of dodging a manhunt or going underground with a new identity. Especially with Laura in tow.
It also just made more sense to me in that he ultimately pays for his sins and finds rest with Mary in the lake, In the beginning of the game, Mary's corpse is literally in the backseat of his car. The main thing that always rubbed me wrong in "Leave" is James just taking Laura all hunky dory back to the car with Mary's corpse there to adopt her or whatever is implied. It's weird, and almost dreamlike in how tidy and happy it is. How is Laura going to react to seeing her surrogate mothers week old body in this guys car? Does she just live the rest of her life keeping Mary's murder a secret for him?
I personally think SH2 is the last horror game that should have a happy ending.
Arsic
Loves his juicy stink trail scent
That's not true. Everywhere I read states the creator has never confirmed a canon ending to the game.
Bartski
Gold Member
ok, I haven't read the novel myself but this is what I've seen pointed out in places. Would have good reasons for it, everything else I said about the ending stands.
captainnapalm
Member
About five hours into this and having a great time. First time playing Silent Hill and it shows all the hallmarks of the really solid game design from the Japanese bangers of that era. I love how much effort they put into making the cityscapes look desolate and bleak. And the acting is on point. Great to see quality cutscenes as well for a change.
The game does do that typical modern thing of taking the woman's faces and then contorting them slightly to make them less attractive though. Never with the men - the main character looks totally fine. It's so weird how all devs do this these days, like they're creepy clones of one another.
The game does do that typical modern thing of taking the woman's faces and then contorting them slightly to make them less attractive though. Never with the men - the main character looks totally fine. It's so weird how all devs do this these days, like they're creepy clones of one another.
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Dr.Morris79
Member
The one stand out of the game is the fact most kitchens in the apartment has two openable drawers. It takes you out of the game a bit.
Big Baller
Al Pachinko, Konami President
Thanks, I couldnt find it!
TheDarkPhantom
Member
“I watched a snail crawl along the edge of a straight razor. This is my dream, this is my nightmare. Crawling, slithering, along the edge of a straight razor, and surviving.”
- Colonel Kurtz, 'Apocalypse Now'
One of the greatest lines in cinema history perfectly captures the world of Silent Hill 2, James is the snail, the town is the razor. Crawling and slithering applies to both him and the abominations he faces but ultimately survives. How does it all end? That depends on some choices. For me:
Maria and I lived happily ever after.
I'll begin my assessment proper with 3 statements:
1. This remake eclipses the original.
2. This is one of the greatest survival-horror games ever made and should have a 90+ on metacritic.
3. Everyone who pre-emptively hated on the choice of developer needs to suck the Bloober out of Konami's cock.
Just under 18 hours clocked, fully explored, read every lore entry, no guides. To say that Bloober knocked it out of the park is an understatement. They took a certified classic and somehow, against all odds, made it even better. They managed to do all this while remaining faithful to the original's creative vision while also expanding on and fleshing out a world that deserved the extra TLC, it's a remarkable achievement.
As I said in a previous post, before anything else Silent Hill is all about atmosphere. Yes, the fog but also paint peeling from the walls, the blood and rust, the quiet, the tension, the cacophonous bursts of sound, the inhabitants off-kilter, the detritus blowing in the wind, the static of the radio, the element of the unknown, the intensity of it's monstrosities, the dark allegory, the psychological journey and so much more.
One of the major ways this remake rises above it's source material to bring this atmosphere alive is in it's immaculate sound design delivered through 3D audio combined with the spectacular haptics of the DualSense controller. I hear faint whispers through the walls, I feel the low rumble of a generator. I hear a skittering horror above me, I feel the impact of crushing a head with my lead pipe. I hear the whoosh of wind, I feel the walls collapsing around me. This is one of the most immersive experiences in the history of the medium (heh heh) and if it doesn't win best sound design at TGA we riot. Akira Yamaoka's taut, sinister, forboding, sorrowful soundtrack deserves all the praise in the world too, needs to at least be nominated (though I'd still put Rebirth and Astro OST's above it overall, let's see how Metaphor is).
Combat feels greater than it ever has with the dodge playing a big role in how the enemy is engaged with and ultimately survived. The simple arsenal is a reminder that you don't always need fancy upgrade trees/weapon modifications to make the action interesting and impactful, sometimes less is more. I previously praised the physics which help drive home the damage you are doing but it would mean nothing without the bizarre, hypnotic animations that give life to SH2's cast of horrors. This is special stuff and I've enjoyed reading the posts from those of you new to the franchise reacting to the weird entities the game throws at you! But even for vets like me the UE5 visuals and passage of time meant a lot of it felt completely new, it was like I was experiencing it all for the first time.
Ultimately it is the narrative that forms the bedrock of the entire game and it's oddball characters. We can debate all day long which cast/design is preferable but overall they did a great job with it, James in particular is far superior. The voice cast nailed their roles and slowly unravelling why these people are here and what the fuck is going on is one of SH2's greatest pleasures. It's also a reminder of Silent Hill's influence on the industry large. Take a game like Alan Wake and it's sequel. Sleepy town, everyman protagonist, real world overlapping with the "otherworld", the psychological journey evolving with the physical surroundings, SH is the daddy of a lot of this stuff I hope newbies will gain an appreciation of just how much it pioneered or perfected.
There is so much more I could write but I'll leave it there for now. It's a remake that exceeded all expectations even for a vet like me who was cautiously optimistic to begin with. I truly hope this is the start of a SH revival, we've been deprived of this world for far too long.
- Colonel Kurtz, 'Apocalypse Now'
One of the greatest lines in cinema history perfectly captures the world of Silent Hill 2, James is the snail, the town is the razor. Crawling and slithering applies to both him and the abominations he faces but ultimately survives. How does it all end? That depends on some choices. For me:
Maria and I lived happily ever after.
I'll begin my assessment proper with 3 statements:
1. This remake eclipses the original.
2. This is one of the greatest survival-horror games ever made and should have a 90+ on metacritic.
3. Everyone who pre-emptively hated on the choice of developer needs to suck the Bloober out of Konami's cock.
Just under 18 hours clocked, fully explored, read every lore entry, no guides. To say that Bloober knocked it out of the park is an understatement. They took a certified classic and somehow, against all odds, made it even better. They managed to do all this while remaining faithful to the original's creative vision while also expanding on and fleshing out a world that deserved the extra TLC, it's a remarkable achievement.
As I said in a previous post, before anything else Silent Hill is all about atmosphere. Yes, the fog but also paint peeling from the walls, the blood and rust, the quiet, the tension, the cacophonous bursts of sound, the inhabitants off-kilter, the detritus blowing in the wind, the static of the radio, the element of the unknown, the intensity of it's monstrosities, the dark allegory, the psychological journey and so much more.
One of the major ways this remake rises above it's source material to bring this atmosphere alive is in it's immaculate sound design delivered through 3D audio combined with the spectacular haptics of the DualSense controller. I hear faint whispers through the walls, I feel the low rumble of a generator. I hear a skittering horror above me, I feel the impact of crushing a head with my lead pipe. I hear the whoosh of wind, I feel the walls collapsing around me. This is one of the most immersive experiences in the history of the medium (heh heh) and if it doesn't win best sound design at TGA we riot. Akira Yamaoka's taut, sinister, forboding, sorrowful soundtrack deserves all the praise in the world too, needs to at least be nominated (though I'd still put Rebirth and Astro OST's above it overall, let's see how Metaphor is).
Combat feels greater than it ever has with the dodge playing a big role in how the enemy is engaged with and ultimately survived. The simple arsenal is a reminder that you don't always need fancy upgrade trees/weapon modifications to make the action interesting and impactful, sometimes less is more. I previously praised the physics which help drive home the damage you are doing but it would mean nothing without the bizarre, hypnotic animations that give life to SH2's cast of horrors. This is special stuff and I've enjoyed reading the posts from those of you new to the franchise reacting to the weird entities the game throws at you! But even for vets like me the UE5 visuals and passage of time meant a lot of it felt completely new, it was like I was experiencing it all for the first time.
Ultimately it is the narrative that forms the bedrock of the entire game and it's oddball characters. We can debate all day long which cast/design is preferable but overall they did a great job with it, James in particular is far superior. The voice cast nailed their roles and slowly unravelling why these people are here and what the fuck is going on is one of SH2's greatest pleasures. It's also a reminder of Silent Hill's influence on the industry large. Take a game like Alan Wake and it's sequel. Sleepy town, everyman protagonist, real world overlapping with the "otherworld", the psychological journey evolving with the physical surroundings, SH is the daddy of a lot of this stuff I hope newbies will gain an appreciation of just how much it pioneered or perfected.
There is so much more I could write but I'll leave it there for now. It's a remake that exceeded all expectations even for a vet like me who was cautiously optimistic to begin with. I truly hope this is the start of a SH revival, we've been deprived of this world for far too long.
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TheGreatMusashi
Member
I am so jealous of everyone who’s playing, probably gonna be a while until it’s on sale on PS5.
In the meantime, I installed Silent Hill 2: EE on the Steam Deck. I’m blown away by it. I played the game at launch on PS2, then bought an Xbox for Restless Dreams and that hot 480p. Enhanced Edition is incredible, best version so far. Makes me even more pissed about my replays with the HD Collection.
I've only seen short clips of the game (mostly cutscenes) and screenshots. I figured it'd be either good or bad but I wanted to experience it myself, so I haven't seen much gameplay.
Does James move his head around to look at items and enemies with the new camera angle?
In the meantime, I installed Silent Hill 2: EE on the Steam Deck. I’m blown away by it. I played the game at launch on PS2, then bought an Xbox for Restless Dreams and that hot 480p. Enhanced Edition is incredible, best version so far. Makes me even more pissed about my replays with the HD Collection.
I've only seen short clips of the game (mostly cutscenes) and screenshots. I figured it'd be either good or bad but I wanted to experience it myself, so I haven't seen much gameplay.
Does James move his head around to look at items and enemies with the new camera angle?
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Bartski
Gold Member
TheGreatMusashi
Member
Thank you! That's so awesome. It's one of my favorite things about the original because it added another level of immersion I hadn't seen prior. Super excited!
Dr.Morris79
Member
I did exactly the same thing whilst CD keys and Steam were screwing up my pro order..
But I'll have to put in on my Steam Deck. I didnt think it would play on it. Was it an easy set up?
leonokarin
Member
The game runs a bit sluggishly, maybe my 2060super is time to retired
Madflavor
Member
If you read all the reactions gamers have been having toward the game, you'll know that this will be looked upon quite favorably in the years to come. Critics just haven't been relevant, especially this year. You look at games like Helldivers 2, Silent Hill 2 Remake, Stellar Blade, and Black Myth Wukong as examples of games that scored in the mid to low 80s, but were celebrated by gamers. Even with the original Silent Hill 2, Game Informer gave it a 7/10 back in the day.
At the end of the day it's the players that dictate a game's place in history, and whether or not it stands the test of time. Not some stupid weak ass bitch behind his keyboard, making shit money to post what he thinks is an opinion worth a damn.
Arachnid
Member
No, he's right. The novelization uses 'In Water' as the ending, but it obviously isn't an official source and isn't written by anyone who actually worked on the game.
Gonzito
Gold Member
I agree. I personally believe this game is on par with the quality of the RE2 remake, so it’s a real shame that its Metacritic score is below 90
DirtyBast8rd
Member
Ah fuck it. Bought it through cdkeys 47,50 euro deal. Promised myself I wouldn't buy games full price on PC or until they are patched and working. Then I thought 47,50 is less than the first sale price if I would have gone for the PS5 version and the game is apparently in working state.
Played the original on OG Xbox, never finished it and don't know much about the story. Silent Hill here I come.
Played the original on OG Xbox, never finished it and don't know much about the story. Silent Hill here I come.
Grildon Tundy
Member
So I thought I was on the final section
Labyrinth, but now I think I'm actually on the final section
Lakeview Hotel
Can't wait to finish this amazing game. Should be wrapping it up tonight.
Surprise GOTY candidate for sure.
Labyrinth, but now I think I'm actually on the final section
Lakeview Hotel
Can't wait to finish this amazing game. Should be wrapping it up tonight.
Surprise GOTY candidate for sure.
Kacho
Gold Member
Yep. The hotel is spooky as hell. Did most of it last night. Forgot how long the game was.
GymWolf
Member
Btw i don't know who said that the game has no jumpscares and it's just atmospheric type of horror, because the enemies do their best to hide and blend to make you jump scare all the damn time
I don't remember a re game with so many potential jump scare moments because zombies are slow and stupid, this is more similar to something like condemned 1 where enemies actively try to outsmart you, run away and hide but not quite as stressful as condemned (personally).
I don't remember a re game with so many potential jump scare moments because zombies are slow and stupid, this is more similar to something like condemned 1 where enemies actively try to outsmart you, run away and hide but not quite as stressful as condemned (personally).
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GymWolf
Member
Both Tlou on grounded have way less resources than sh2 on hard tho.
They just have usually larger spaces to fight or stealth on enemies and obvioulsy the combat\controls are way smoother.
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Chuck Berry
Gold Member
The fucking prison holy shit... That jumpscare got me good too. Cant wait to get the fuck out of here
Gonna be awhile homie. The place is fucking massive. I thought I'd be able to get through it with last nights session, but between meticulously exploring and having to clean the dookie out of my drawers, nope.
fart town usa
Member
AITD? I'm curious how it compares with the SH2 remake. Obviously I expect the SH2 remake to be more impressive across the board but I really enjoyed the combat in AITD. I actually completed a deathless run last night and was pretty happy with that considering how many complains were directed at the combat. The final boss in particular was a relative breeze when you're aggressive and smart with ammo usage.
I bought the SH2 remake last night but I'm gonna play through Homecoming first so I can compare/contrast to SH2 remake. Everything I've seen of the combat in the remake makes me think that it vindicates the combat in Homecoming, and thats a thread I would really like to flesh out and present to Gaf.
J3nga
Member
Not sure why would you need that comparison.
KeepThemEyesOpen
Member
I think they're talking about the combat specifically which doesn't vindicate Homecoming. If anything, the combat compares more to Calisto Protocol minus the gadgets.
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J3nga
Member
Yeah that's what I thought as well when playing SH2 remake, combat is similar to callisto especially melee. You can't just smash enemies standing still like in OG, they will punch back real hard nurses especially(played on hard), dodging also has pretty strict timings.
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GymWolf
Member
The combat here is way better than callisto imo.
Maybe not the animations and gore (animations being pretty close tho) but mechanically callisto combat was a turd.
In here you actually have to evade in the right direction and right timing, it's not just a left-right-left-right and you could fucking press the button 30 min before the attack was even starting and still avoid it because both left and right evade worked against the first attack of the enemy and you only had to switch direction between hits, and the soft lock on\camera zoom and slowed movements are not as heavy as callisto, making fighting multiple enemies definitely possible without using gadgets to clear the room first, still not as good and fluid as tlou2 but who the fuck is?
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Big Baller
Al Pachinko, Konami President
Nobody wants a Homecoming homage
Badlucktroll
Member
just finished. it was supercalifragilous. I hope this sells well and gets goty noms. bloober needs to remake 1 and do an original title
Judge Magister
Member
I just played a bit and i'm loving everything except the new characters design / dubs and some cutscenes camera angles. James is perfect but the others I don't know. I got the Maria mod to make it more bearable.
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fart town usa
Member
Because Homecoming is a solid game once you look past the story, and if there's a chance to present good evidence to the Homecoming haters, I'm glad to do it. It's weak to dump on a games' combat for nearly 2 decades because it's not "Silent Hill" and then praise something similar because it's the shiny new game. Maybe my experiment will be fruitless but I think something is there worth analysing.
The Fartist
Gold Member
What is a hipster? Tell me.
ThisIsMyDog
Member
she looks better in remake outfit tho.I just played a bit and i'm loving everything except the new characters design / dubs and some cutscenes camera angles. James is perfect but the others I don't know. I got the Maria mod to make it more bearable.
GymWolf
Member
I think the praise are for how they upgraded the combat, if this was the combat in the old one and they made no improvement to it i don't think people would praise it that much.
It is not an exceptional combat system in any way, shape or form except maybe the sound design, it is just much better than the absolute basic system they had in the first game.
NeverYouMind
Member
Somebody who is trying to stand out by being contrarian to standards of good taste and promoting retired fads often in a context that does not line up with the original intent.
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Bartski
Gold Member
Don't get me wrong I liked AITD enough to play through it twice but it's a totally different league - this is hitbox-based melee and feels incredibly janky and impactless in comparison to the animation connecting system of the Remake. Shooting is ok but I don't recall both systems having real synergy.
SH2R brilliantly expands upon a very limited set of mechanics by introducing new enemies that require a different approach to using them, so it feels very simple at the core but deep enough to remain engaging, challenging and tense, at least on "hard". Blood effects and hit reactions are on another level and that's without even mentioning 10/10 audio and haptics...
I'll give you an example: Lying figure is your basic bitch that teaches you dodging and punishes you for spamming attack if you hit it more than twice is succession. Has a projectile to outmaneuver, best strat is melee with dodge sidestep dance and then beat to death when on the ground. Bit later you face Mannequins, that are undetectable by the radio when hiding in pitch dark for a surprise (heart) attack. When spotted however and aimed at - they charge at you and make your flashlight malfunction! Melee is very risky here since they dodge your attacks just as much as you dodge theirs, so the best approach is to shoot them, ideally in the legs which stuns them so you can go in for a melee finisher. They make you explore dark areas slowly with your gun on constant aim taking every dark corner as are very susceptible to gunfire which has a lot of stopping power against their attacks. But then you introduced to Nurses where your gun has zero stopping power, unless you land a headshot they keep charging at you and are just super lethal in tight corridors... but can be stealth-killed, dropped and beat to death when approached from the back. However in order to do that - you have to switch off your flashlight! Otherwise, they will detect you, turn around and you're fucked. I could go on but we're constantly here at technically 4 basic combat actions - attack, dodge, aim, and shoot.
Homecoming's on the other hand is a 15 year old game which got a lot of shit for it's combat even back when it was new, I didn't hate it, saving grace is above-average enemy hit reactions but at the end, with some exceptions, it mostly comes down to rushing in and light attack spamming every enemy to death with your knife.
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J3nga
Member
Now that fictional character wears skirt in a video game makes it bearable for you?I just played a bit and i'm loving everything except the new characters design / dubs and some cutscenes camera angles. James is perfect but the others I don't know. I got the Maria mod to make it more bearable.
Judge Magister
Member
Yes, because it resembles the original character. It does not feel so much out of place.
Ulysses 31
Member
If it's supposed to be a faithful remake then having the clothing match better is an improvement.
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Exentryk
Member
After a long time of oppressive atmosphere in the apartments, getting back to the streets was such a breath of fresh air. Game does a good job of keeping these balanced. Also surprised by this character Maria and how the game added another facet to its style.
Also, the cutscenes are really well done. It feels really natural and intriguing, like watching a good tv show or a movie. Excellent stuff.
Also, the cutscenes are really well done. It feels really natural and intriguing, like watching a good tv show or a movie. Excellent stuff.
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Bartski
Gold Member
saintjules
Gold Member
Anyone playing on PC with unlocked framerate or 60? It's been a few days since I played but I remember framerate taking before I got to a save under unlocked.
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Ulysses 31
Member
Did they actually get in trouble with her or is a known SH2 joke among hardcore fans?maybe they didn't want to get in trouble again with Christina Aguilera
Bartski
Gold Member
Did they actually get in trouble with her or is a known SH2 joke among hardcore fans?
OmegaSupreme
advanced basic bitch
Heading to the park now. Still loving it. I haven't had the opportunity to play for more than an hour or so at a time but it's fantastic. A little stuttering still even with a mod but nothing terrible.