Branniganz Love
Member
I'm pretty ok waiting 8 whole months to take full advantage of a TV I will be using for years, in the mean time I can always buy a 1S
. For myself, 4K hardware and content is becoming affordable now so I want to get in on it.
Sony likely saved about $15 by not including a UHD drive in PS4 Pro.
- Thread starter SURGEdude
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I'm pretty ok waiting 8 whole months to take full advantage of a TV I will be using for years, in the mean time I can always buy a 1S
. For myself, 4K hardware and content is becoming affordable now so I want to get in on it.I'm pretty ok waiting 8 whole months to take full advantage of a TV I will be using for years, in the mean time I can always buy a 1S
Well that's what I was going to say is that you should highly think about at least getting a One S during the holiday when it will super cheap anyway and Scorpio really is still a while away.
Gives you time to build your game/movie colleciton too.
If that was the case why were people so mad about the Xbox One initial reveal?
Digital movies weren't even a factor in sales until the studios started releasing digital versions early, because people prefer physical.
ZombiePlatypus
Member
Perfectly stated.
I feel like many of you need to be reminded that business are in business to make money. They are not a charity organization. They have a price point they need to hit, and the have profits they need to make. It's not a perfect system, but it's what runs this train.
That's not just $15 in some Scrooge McDuck's pocket. It's $15 of the hardware cost budget that is set by someone who's entirely livelihood depends on their ability to decide where best to put those resources so as to maximize profit and continue making the products some of you are taking for granted. Money isn't evil, it's just the other side of the coin.
I'm sure, just like every VCR/DVD/Blu-ray player that's ever existed, UHD players will be cheap as hell in no time. Before the end of this console cycle, I'd bet.
That's not just $15 in some Scrooge McDuck's pocket. It's $15 of the hardware cost budget that is set by someone who's entirely livelihood depends on their ability to decide where best to put those resources so as to maximize profit and continue making the products some of you are taking for granted. Money isn't evil, it's just the other side of the coin.
I'm sure, just like every VCR/DVD/Blu-ray player that's ever existed, UHD players will be cheap as hell in no time. Before the end of this console cycle, I'd bet.
old manatee
Banned
The lack of 4k blu ray makes me doubt that entire format. This really solidifies my plan to get an NX and a Vive for my PC.
Boss Man
Member
Yeah come on guys Sony isn't a charity, now just give them your money and stop demanding things in return.
They won't be 15 dollars, or 50 dollars, most optimisitcally around 100 dollars.
You're basically trying to represent a giant corporation as a starving family man or woman who NEEDS to make the right decision here. Come off it, we're not talking about 'the guy who has to make that 15 dollars work' we're talking about Sony. A huge corporation. Nobody is even saying they need to eat that 15 dollars, but they could get it in there if they wanted to.
Before anyone says "I'm glad I don't have to pay for the thing I wouldn't use" too: You pay for a disc drive, presumably you buy all digital if this doesn't affect you, so why don't you argue about that inclusion? I don't use wifi on my systems, but I understand why we have it and I pay for that part of them too. I don't stand my systems vertically, but some guy was paid to design the internals in a way that it worked like that. We all pay for things that we don't use, at the end of the day this is a tiny additional cost to the system that they could've figured out a way to put in, and not taken a huge out of pocket hit either if they didn't want to. It's not some poor fucking marketing or engineering guy who had to make the hard call to make ends meet for his kids, so don't represent it that way.
The Maverick
Member
Having the UHD drive would've made me consider a trade in, but I'm fine otherwise. Unless The Witcher and Bloodborne get support, then I'll have to cave.
BlastProcessing
Member
The point is that we can assume that Sony has research based projections on the future of UHD Blu Rays. The fact that they haven't jumped on board in a large way would indicate that they are pessimistic on the market as a whole.
They could be wrong, but I don't think that betting that the future of 4K media is streaming is a crazy position to take.
PopcornMegaphone
Banned
Please watch this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MVTMol1s7w4
I don't think Sony is scummy here, but this is an odd decision and as a consumer I would have liked to have seen a UHD drive.
Kagoshima_Luke
Gold Member
They will not stay number one with that attitude. We've already seem them fall and have to turn the ship around in the past decade. I mean, if they want to open the door for MS to gain a bunch of ground, then, yeah, they should shoot for the status quo.
AcademicSaucer
Member
First post, best post.
demosthenes
Member
They won't be :lol :lol
Most people stream movies.
Where the hell do you live?! Anyone I know who still buys physical movies buys them out of the bargain bin at Wal-Mart exclusively.
Kagoshima_Luke
Gold Member
Most people I know, if they are actually buying a movie, do it via disc. You get a digital copy in most cases and have that disc for pristine image quality regardless of bandwidth issues or caps. I use Amazon Prime video and Netflix as much as the next guy, but mostly for rentals.
You said they have players, which they don't and won't until next year.
While more movies are streamed than bought, absolutely assuredly, movies that ARE paid for are predominantly disc-based.
If you're talking about high end 4k movies, those are even downloaded rather than streamed typically, since streaming 4k isn't even any better looking than non-4k for your average user due to bitrate.
SinCityAssassin
Member
I've been called a corporate apologist sometimes on this forum and even I think you're going a bit too far with this sort of thing. Jesus.
Well said.
Cannot blame them. The PS3 was a disaster financially.
Oh absolutely. More physical media is still actually bought than downloaded. Though most blu-rays have the benefit of including digital copies.
So much so that I actually wonder what the percentage of people who actually watch their blu-ray copies are compared to those who just redeem the digital copy and watch that.
Rotch Crot
Banned
I think $415 would've Been fine.
Anecdotal, but I've never even known anyone that redeemed the digital copy.
Anecdotal, but I don't know anyone that actually watches their blu-ray discs. My friends still watch DVDs. -_-
Pathfinder
Member
I have one friend who redeems the digital copy for every Blu-Ray he buys. Reminds me of someone who collects stamps.
I have no idea how he keeps track of what service each movie belongs to though.
No-one buys digital movies because they rent them or have access as part of a subscription.
See Ive done it twice and it sucks. I stopped after that.
Killroyskbg
Member
They have lost several customers (probably like me) from giving them a cent now. I already have a PS4 and one of the big reasons I was planning to buy a new one was for UHD support. 15$ is nothing when you consider how they are marketing this as the PRO as in proffesional version of their consoles and they cheap out in this way.
Also this is Sony who always have included the latest formats in their consoles. Sure the 125$ blu-ray ps3 was a real gamble but now they dont even want to risk a tenth of that for UHD when during that whole fucking conference all they talked about was 4k and HDR but no you can only stream that piss poor Streaming 4k which is not even as good as a regular blu-ray, especially Netflix is attrocius.
Was kinda suprised by the the slim not having one but the "PRO" not having it is beyond stupid to me. Cheap ass mother ****** that decided this shit.
Also this is Sony who always have included the latest formats in their consoles. Sure the 125$ blu-ray ps3 was a real gamble but now they dont even want to risk a tenth of that for UHD when during that whole fucking conference all they talked about was 4k and HDR but no you can only stream that piss poor Streaming 4k which is not even as good as a regular blu-ray, especially Netflix is attrocius.
Was kinda suprised by the the slim not having one but the "PRO" not having it is beyond stupid to me. Cheap ass mother ****** that decided this shit.
InsaneTiger
Member
I just realized what I said. The average consumer would buy the Slim and use it mainly for gaming, streaming and are perfectly fine with standard Blu Ray from Redbox.
It's obvious that Sony is still positioning the box as a games first.
It's obvious that Sony is still positioning the box as a games first.
This is also the same Sony that took forever to have 5ghz wifi and wouldn't even include wireless N in their PS3 revisions lol
I have no idea about the American market, but in the Netherlands, the only source for 4k streaming are Netflix and Amazon, neither have 4k movies on right now, while my local store has a dozen of UHD Blu-ray discs.
On top of that, 4k streams have a lower bitrate than 1080p Blu-ray, and physical media stays available where streaming services remove shows and movies continuously.
Streaming might be the future, but I live in the now.
What service allows people to see most new movies? Amazon and Netflix have shit selections on their streaming services.
If I'm a company like Sony selling Blu-Rays seems like a much better revenue stream than $3 digital rentals.
Pathfinder
Member
Really? I often find movies that I can purchase/rent and stream in 1080p from Amazon that I can't actually buy on Blu-Ray to own a physical copy of. Actually, I run into that scenario more often than plain not being able to find a particular movie on the service.
Or they're loosing a ton of money per unit...
Kawika
Member
A few months ago when the specks leaked for the PS4 Neo and MS announced the Scorpio I decided that it was time to build a new PC. If I am going to be on an upgrade cycle, I want to be in control of it. I love Sony's exclusives and I really enjoyed much of what microsoft was offering too before, but I am not down for iterative consoles.
If this is the future, I will just stick with PC.
The one saving grace was that I thought that Sony would add the UHD and that was enough to make me consider selling off my launch PS4 for a better unit, even if it wasn't up to my PC's specs. Sony made their call and suddenly I went from entertaining the idea of something I wasn't pleased about buying to not entertaining it at all.
I can probably get $100-150 for my XBOX One and I will probably just buy the S because I really do care about video quality. You know... because I actually own a HDR 4K set and have a 60MB+ connection doesn't mean I want to deal with using that bandwidth on streaming comparatively poor quality 4K content.
Its like there are aspects of this company that really want to implode. Is the TV sector of Sony really that hard up for 4K sales that they would push this machine out and kill one of the most interesting ideas in gaming since the analog stick? You know next year Sony will match Scorpio's machine and all this was for not. And if they don't, tides can change.
If this is the future, I will just stick with PC.
The one saving grace was that I thought that Sony would add the UHD and that was enough to make me consider selling off my launch PS4 for a better unit, even if it wasn't up to my PC's specs. Sony made their call and suddenly I went from entertaining the idea of something I wasn't pleased about buying to not entertaining it at all.
I can probably get $100-150 for my XBOX One and I will probably just buy the S because I really do care about video quality. You know... because I actually own a HDR 4K set and have a 60MB+ connection doesn't mean I want to deal with using that bandwidth on streaming comparatively poor quality 4K content.
Its like there are aspects of this company that really want to implode. Is the TV sector of Sony really that hard up for 4K sales that they would push this machine out and kill one of the most interesting ideas in gaming since the analog stick? You know next year Sony will match Scorpio's machine and all this was for not. And if they don't, tides can change.
$15 seems like a steal to push a format they have a huge stake in. They spent something like $130 on the early Blu-ray drives and while that's pretty obscene I think it's strongly debatable they turned the tide on the format war and they have been and will continue to reap the profits for years to come.
The genius of bundling a drive is that people who might not have known they want one get a chance to play with it and adoption drives support. And people who want one but won't pay $200 are on board too. The problem with new formats is kind of a chicken or the egg situation. Nobody wants to invest in producing content if there are no players, and nobody wants to build and competitively priced players if there is no content.
My guess is they either project the format to die on the vine. Or they expect it to take hold without the usual support they give.
If UHD goes the way of SACD or DVD-Audio Sony is gonna being paying a ton more per unit making drives and pressing discs than they would if it was a significant player in physical. And they are stuck with physical for the first real 4K generation. Up to 100GB is a ton of space to download and store especially in light of the significant decrease in the HDD industry's attention to mechanical drives in favour of SSDs. Meaning capacity isn't growing like it used to, and costs are coming down slower. That's potentially bad news for the speed at which digital will erase the need for at least the option to use optical discs.
Where do you have that from?
Unknown Soldier
Member
Well...if you still have a 1080p TV, you should get a PS4 Slim or stick with the OG PS4 you already have.
If you have a 4K TV, and want actual 4K gaming, you should bite the bullet and buy/build a powerful gaming PC. The PS4 Pro will not be able to do true 4K in actual demanding games, it's all going to be tricks and nonsense like checkerboard rendering, upscaling portions of the image outside of the center, and other things which will not look that good.
If you have a 4K TV, and want 4K Blu-ray playback, well at this point you either downgrade your gaming experience with an Xbox One S or just sit it out until more standalone 4K Blu-ray players are available next year. Or you can buy that $400 Samsung 4K Blu-ray player which I heard is a kind of buggy.
So...I don't really know who this thing is for to be honest. I already played through Rise of the Tomb Raider in true 4K earlier this year. I'm working my way through Deus Ex: Mankind Divided in true 4K although it's on the shelf right now because the impending DX12 patch. Anyone who actually cares about 4K gaming already has a fire-breathing gaming PC.
There's the wild-card that is VR of course, but the jury's out on that. PC VR is having serious problems right now as sales have stalled out of the gate because of the idiocy of fragmenting a nascent niche market right away between the Oculus Rift and HTC Vive. PSVR won't have that problem but even the PS4 Pro is vastly inferior hardware to a VR-spec gaming PC so we'll see how it looks and performs.
killatopak
Member
Remind me how much sales One S got for having a UHD player.
Kagoshima_Luke
Gold Member
What's lame is that they added a 1TB HDD, as if that's enough for most enthusiasts. I put a 2TB in my PS4 day one and that is filled. The hell is 1 TB gonna do? Should have made it 500GB and used the savings to add the UHD player.
It would have had at least one more if it weren't for the audio issue and I didn't already have an XB1. But realistically I didn't consider it all that closely because I thought I would be getting one with a PS4 Pro.
Pathfinder
Member
Unless people were polled, we can't know exactly why people bought a One S. We can infer because of the prevalence of 4K TV's being sold on the market this year that the fact that it can play UHD media might have something to do with it.