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[Will the Thrill]

Did anyone watch Skyfall and think "so this is Mendes' Christopher Nolan film." The similarities in style, pacing, and even characterization were very strong between Skyfall and Dark Knight and Mendes even confirmed the influence without saying he ripped it off.

I feel like this is Villeneuve's "Christopher Nolan" film with the pacing, visual style, teases and reveals, bookending, etc all being very reminiscent of Nolan's style and the thematic similarities to Interstellar. Thankfully Arrival has a stronger emotional core.

Some pacing issues and slightly-too-convenient reveals aside, Arrival is a great movie.

I mean sure, but I've found Villeneuve is just a better director and I think that still shows here. If anything, I'd like him to be the new Nolan that people try to "copy" from here on out, especially considering the movies don't fall under their weight in other aspects like some of Nolan's have. Villeneuve seems to surround himself/get surrounded by people with stronger support in other aspects like writing. Its something Nolan has disappointed me with, Interstellar was very well directed but its core theme just did not come out right within the movie and how they portrayed it. Arrival got its right and as much as it needed to.

He's also 4 for 4 now, Prisoners in 2013, Enemy in 2014, Sicario in 2015 and now Arrival in 2016. Dude just keeps putting in some great work consistently. I never really expected a Blade Runner sequel to actually have the possibility of matching the first film, but with him at the helm, I think we can at least say it won't be a disaster lol

 

[MattyG]

"Abbott is death process."

;_______;

 

[Will the Thrill]

"Abbott is death process."

;_______;

This small part gave me a slight pause during the movie, did Abbott die/start dying because of the explosion? Or can we just assume they were already dying and were now getting closer to it and it was just a small reveal to us and Louise?

 

[Kvik]

He's also 4 for 4 now, Prisoners in 2013, Enemy in 2014, Sicario in 2015 and now Arrival in 2016.

I haven't seen Enemy, but I've seen Incendies (2010) which is also a powerful film. I'll probably blind buy Enemy blu-ray comes Black Friday.

 

[Dany]

I took is that Abbott is in the process of dying, hence why humanity needs to learn their language. In order to save their species.

 

[Will the Thrill]

I haven't seen Enemy, but I've seen Incendies (2010) which is also a powerful film. I'll probably blind buy Enemy blu-ray comes Black Friday.

Oh yeah Incendies is strong for sure, I didn't put it cause it was in 2010 and I meant he just did 4 amazing films all in 4 consecutive years. I still need to go farther back with his work, see if they tend to hold up as much as these recent works.

I took is that Abbott is in the process of dying, hence why humanity needs to learn their language. In order to save their species.

This can work too, only thing is they said 3000 years from now, I guess in 3000 years all of them would be dead and it has started now? I just assumed it was a threat that would start 3000 years from now.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

The film lost me with the phone number twist.

It was simple. Their language allows you to perceive time non-linearly. Her direct exposure to their environment must've allowed her to learn a lot of it. We see flash forwards of her published book called "The Universal Language" and her teaching a class/seminar on it, so it's public knowledge. So, we can assume Shang has learned a little of it. Not enough to fully perceive things as she can, but enough to know that he needed to tell her specific things at that specific point so that she would be able to repeat it to him in the past

No, i understood that. I just felt it was a lazy story device that killed the drama/intensity for me. After all this, she saves humanity by calling Shang? Why didn't anyone try to contact the Chinese government? They decided at one point to share their data, but realised they couldn't because China 'disconnected'? The only thing that disconnected was the monitor to the Chinese site. Why not broadcast their information on television channels? Flood it on social media? Call the Chinese government?

Again, too many silly things.

This film is no where as layered and interesting as it wants you to believe. Contact is still No.1 for this sort of story.

Were you paying attention? They literally said:
1. They could only contact the various countries in person as they had closed off communications. It wasn't just disconnecting a monitor
2. The Chinese wouldn't let anyone through the border
3. She had to call on a PRIVATE number of his

The movie was as explicit about it as possible

 

[Nepenthe]

Just saw the movie. 11/10 great experience would time travel to watch fresh again. However--

It was simple. Their language allows you to perceive time non-linearly. Her direct exposure to their environment must've allowed her to learn a lot of it. We see flash forwards of her published book called "The Universal Language" and her teaching a class/seminar on it, so it's public knowledge. So, we can assume Shang has learned a little of it. Not enough to fully perceive things as she can, but enough to know that he needed to tell her specific things at that specific point so that she would be able to repeat it to him in the past

Wouldn't her future self had known that her past self had called and said those specific words? The way time seemed to work is that while it was on a predetermined path, individuals who knew the aliens' language would've been able to see future events. To future Louise, the world had already been saved, therefore she would've already had known the words she spoke to Shang. So why did she not know in the future that she had called? Borking with the rules of time?

 

[Napoleonthechimp]

This small part gave me a slight pause during the movie, did Abbott die/start dying because of the explosion? Or can we just assume they were already dying and were now getting closer to it and it was just a small reveal to us and Louise?

I took it as it was injured in the explosion and is now dying. Or it's just an odd translation and Abbott is dead.

As for Louise's future self not knowing: I assumed it was her past consciousness in her future self, so she had no access to her future memories.

 

[JaseMath]

Just saw the movie. 11/10 great experience would time travel to watch fresh again. However--



Wouldn't her future self had known that her past self had called and said those specific words? The way time seemed to work is that while it was on a predetermined path, individuals who knew the aliens' language would've been able to see future events. To future Louise, the world had already been saved, therefore she would've already had known the words she spoke to Shang. So why did she not know in the future that she had called? Borking with the rules of time?

That's the rub. You're perceiving time linearly.

 

[watershed]

Gaf always sucks at discussing time travel stuff. There are no multiple dimensions in this film, rather there is perceiving time linearly and non-linearly and that way of understanding reality, through the alien language, is the tool that the aliens talk about.

 

[Nepenthe]

So basically, time acts like a cloud of millions of particles floating around independently and not necessarily on a timeline like a string? Because the big twist doesn't seem to present time like this, but rather the perception of it. The aliens go back to Earth to institute the whole situation because they know for certain that humanity needs to know their language in order to save them in three millenia. So the rules seem to establish predestination, but that there's a way for people to mentally perceive the inevitable ends of predestination. But the conversation with Shang breaks that. So people in the future can not know information their past selves did?

Whet?

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Just saw the movie. 11/10 great experience would time travel to watch fresh again. However--



Wouldn't her future self had known that her past self had called and said those specific words? The way time seemed to work is that while it was on a predetermined path, individuals who knew the aliens' language would've been able to see future events. To future Louise, the world had already been saved, therefore she would've already had known the words she spoke to Shang. So why did she not know in the future that she had called? Borking with the rules of time?

There is no "path". It's a circle. The future can "remember" the past, which can "perceive" the future. Thinking of it in terms of causality just doesn't work and trying to explain it is...an exercise in frustration lol.

Her future self knows she said something in the past. The thing is, she has no way of knowing how she knew what to say because the event where she learns doesn't happen until Shang tells her. So her surprise was at learning where she learned the words, not at the fact that she said them

 

[Nepenthe]

I think "remember" is the wrong word to use specifically in regards to one's future self then, because to "remember" relies on something having already happened. It might be easier for me to fully understand then to- as I said- describe time as a cloud of events and not a linear string. Or rather to say that the past and the future can perceive or "remember" each other with equal verisimilitude.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

I think "remember" is the wrong word to use specifically in regards to one's future self then, because to "remember" relies on something having already happened. It might be easier for me to fully understand then to- as I said- describe time as a cloud of events and not a linear string. Or rather to say that the past and the future can perceive or "remember" each other with equal verisimilitude.

Yeah, that's why I have so many words in quotes. I have no idea what word to actually use, only the general idea what that word should imply

 

[Will the Thrill]

I took it as it was injured in the explosion and is now dying. Or it's just an odd translation and Abbott is dead.

.

That's probably it, other wise they probably wouldn't of felt the need to rise higher up into the air if the explosion didn't cause them some damage or causalities.

 

[piratepwnsninja]

That's probably it, other wise they probably wouldn't of felt the need to rise higher up into the air if the explosion didn't cause them some damage or causalities.

I think that has to be it. I mean, it's part of what makes it sad. With how they perceive time, he very well knew it was going to happen.

 

[denx]

I think that has to be it. I mean, it's part of what makes it sad. With how they perceive time, he very well knew it was going to happen.

That's why Abott took longer to show up at that session. He knew he was gonna die and was taking some time to prepare himself.

I couldn't help but get all the feels when I realized this.

 

[MattyG]

That's why Abott took longer to show up at that session. He knew he was gonna die and was taking some time to prepare himself.

I couldn't help but get all the feels when I realized this.

OH MY GOD. Wow, that's good.

 

[Will the Thrill]

That's why Abott took longer to show up at that session. He knew he was gonna die and was taking some time to prepare himself.

I couldn't help but get all the feels when I realized this.

Oh wooooooow, that's a great notice there. I probably wouldn't of even picked up on that whenever I see it a second time.

 

[brandonh83]

That's why Abott took longer to show up at that session. He knew he was gonna die and was taking some time to prepare himself.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

I've thought of a trippy example to understand circular time, or at least try to understand it.

Let's say you're in your apartment, about to head out, and can't find your keys. You suddenly have a mental image of a note that says "The keys were in my other pants". You decide to check them, and sure enough, you find your keys there. You have no idea how you found them, so you decide to write down everything you do know leading up to finding them. You start at the end and write down "The keys were in my other pants".

So in the context of the movie her knowing what number to call and what to say to Shang is her "finding her keys" moment. The future period with her at the party before their conversation is her "not knowing why she knew where to find her keys" and Shang telling her his private number and about his wife is the "note writing" part. It makes sense that the conversation was such a surprise to her, considering her recollection would be of calling and talking to him, while the reason hadn't actually happened yet.

 

[MrToughPants]

Saw it tonight, me and the gf loved it.

 

[Madrugador]

Saw it with my friends. We all loved it.

I went knowing nothing and had a blast.

 

[Jarmel]

That's why Abott took longer to show up at that session. He knew he was gonna die and was taking some time to prepare himself.

I couldn't help but get all the feels when I realized this.

damn

 

[timetokill]

Loved it. Got Inception vibes from the sharing of the phrase moment. Really loved the realization at the end. The "wrong choice" thing was heavy.

Would love to know how humanity is supposed to help them in 3000 years though.

 

[Mine01]

Just saw it, amazing movie really liked the twist and as soon as she said who is this child the flashbacks made sense.

Anyway, I just dont think the languaje gives her the power to see the future, I mean she saw it before she started to learn their languje plus if the visions came from the language then the husband should be able to see the future too, and well, anyone who buys the book.

Amazing movie and I know probably there wont be a 2nd one but i hope there is one.

edit cause orthography

 

[Monocle]

Just saw it, amazing movie really liked the twist and as soon as she said who is this child the flashbacks made sense.

Anyway, I just dont think the languaje gives her the power to see the future, I mean she saw it before she started to learn their languje plus if the visions came from the languaje then the husband should be able to see the future too, and well, anyone who buys the book.

Amazing movie and I know probably there wont be a 2nd one but i hope there is one.

Language.

 

[Nazgul_Hunter]

I think this is a good way to think about time and how he alien language changes it:

Imagine your life memories are in a straight line from beginning to end. Your mind is at the spot of the present.

When you learn the alien language, that timeline folds unto itself and forms a circle. Your mind is now in the middle of the circle.

From the middle, you are equidistant from any of your memories, including the future ones.

The one thing the movie doesn't address is free will / predestination. It's vaguely alluded when she asks if you would change something about your life if you could. However the complexities of possible futures in a completely free will environment would be overwhelming.

 

[Mine01]

Language.

sorry my mexican slipped away!

 

[Brakke]

Kinda figured you can only properly learn the language if predestination problems don't bother you.

 

[Xion385]

I liked it. Not sure if I'll see it again, but I liked it.

I got a question. In the beginning of the film, we see her entire future. My question is, when she falls asleep does she see those dreams or is it just us the audience that sees it and that she's merely waking up?

Also, to make clearly sure that I'm getting it correctly, the Aliens came to Earth to teach use their language so we can be prepared for the future, right? That's the weapon?

 

[UnemployedVillain]

It's funny, and ironic, that the best way to visualize time as a circle as to think of it as a clock face. 12 is the apex, that point of simultaneous beginning and ending, basically a person's conception and their death. When you recollect the past you're looking at time counterclockwise and when you're perceiving the future you're looking at time clockwise!

 

[Bronetta]

Just saw it with some friends. I loved most of it but the ending didnt really sit right with me.

My friends complained about a lack of action and that we didnt get to see more of the aliens. I saw it as a Lovecraftian Great Ones type of deal. In the end humans didnt really find out who they were, what they wanted, or how to truly communicate with them despite all the military efforts. The aliens and the truth was always just a bit out of reach. It was hard to tell what was real and what wasnt by the end.

The main character did discover the eldritch truth which basically made her a time drifter?

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Just saw it with some friends. I loved most of it but the ending didnt really sit right with me.

My friends complained about a lack of action and that we didnt get to see more of the aliens. I saw it as a Lovecraftian Great Ones type of deal. In the end humans didnt really find out who they were, what they wanted, or how to truly communicate with them despite all the military efforts. The aliens and the truth was always just a bit out of reach. It was hard to tell what was real and what wasnt by the end.

The main character did discover the eldritch truth which basically made her a time drifter?

But they found out all of those things. Maybe not their verbal language, but everything else

 

[Will the Thrill]

I liked it. Not sure if I'll see it again, but I liked it.

I got a question. In the beginning of the film, we see her entire future. My question is, when she falls asleep does she see those dreams or is it just us the audience that sees it and that she's merely waking up?

Also, to make clearly sure that I'm getting it correctly, the Aliens came to Earth to teach use their language so we can be prepared for the future, right? That's the weapon?

I'm not 100% on the beginning part tbh, but the weapon is the ability to see Time Non-linearly. In the film we get an example of a win-win situation or a "Non Zero Sum Game". The aliens give humanity this because they know they will need help 3000 years in the future, that's why they came to earth, to ask for help by giving us the "weapon" we benefit from it while they will as well. edit - I suppose simply, you can look at the beginning of the film as the film itself doing a little bit of the whole non-linear timeline, we believe those moments to be a past event for Louise, and are convinced that when she starts to "remember" them herself a little later on that she is actually just shocked from seeing them (and having them seem almost real as if she was transported back to those moments) and that's why she doesn't talk about it or explain it, when in reality she didn't/wouldn't know how to explain what she was seeing/feeling at first at all, because non of that had happened to her yet, they seemed just like dreams that were slowly helping her.

Just saw it with some friends. I loved most of it but the ending didnt really sit right with me.

My friends complained about a lack of action and that we didnt get to see more of the aliens. I saw it as a Lovecraftian Great Ones type of deal. In the end humans didnt really find out who they were, what they wanted, or how to truly communicate with them despite all the military efforts. The aliens and the truth was always just a bit out of reach. It was hard to tell what was real and what wasnt by the end.

The main character did discover the eldritch truth which basically made her a time drifter?

Except we did, Louise could read the language (And speaking verbally would be impossible) and they straight up in those subtitles say they need help in 3000 years and that's why they came to Earth. To give us the "weapon" in order to help them one day, a Win win.

 

[Bronetta]

Yeah but we still dont know who or what exactly the aliens are. How many are on the ship, whats their hierarchy or control structure. I know thats not the purpose of the movie but audiences will ask these questions. They want help in 3000 years but what kind of help? Whats gonna happen in 3000 years? What does learning their language accomplish? Theyre gone at the end anyways.

 

[CassSept]

A beautiful film. I enjoyed Sicario but was not particularly blown out by it, while Arrival did the trick. Cinematography was not as incredible as in Sicario (still good, just not as great) and some of the characters were too simplistic perhaps, but everything else was great. Music was just on point, I'm glad that spotify exists, I got to listen to it today. Couldn't really do it yesterday, the first contact scene really freaked me out with the way it was framed.

I'm surprised not many people were moved by the ending. 'Do you want to make a baby?' sounds bad (though in context I think it worked) but the whole sequence just wrecked me.

a simplistic world view (was the Chinese general's wife named "Martha"?)

This could have easily been clunky but I think it worked here. It was consistent with the rest of the film. Shang is presented throughout the entire film like we would expect a Chinese general to be presented - cold, merciless, militaristic. Ultimately what gets to him is an appeal to his humanity.

A lot of it could have been clunky in the hands of a less-skilled filmmaker but I think it mostly worked. As others before had said, this movie could have been as painful as Interstellar's love scenes, but I think Villeneuve made it work where Nolan did not.

Yeah but we still dont know who or what exactly the aliens are. How many are on the ship, whats their hierarchy or control structure. I know thats not the purpose of the movie but audiences will ask these questions. They want help in 3000 years but what kind of help? Whats gonna happen in 3000 years? What does learning their language accomplish? Theyre gone at the end anyways.

As you said, none of that matters in the film and an answer to any of these questions could have been detrimental to the movie. Not everything has to have an extended universe with detailed explanation for everything that happens.

 

[Will the Thrill]

Yeah but we still dont know who or what exactly the aliens are. How many are on the ship, whats their hierarchy or control structure. I know thats not the purpose of the movie but audiences will ask these questions. They want help in 3000 years but what kind of help? Whats gonna happen in 3000 years? What does learning their language accomplish? Theyre gone at the end anyways.

Tbh I'm surprised that we got as many answers as we did, the direct 3000 year thing took me by surprise, not in a bad way just I thought it would only be "Help". A lot of stuff doesn't need to be answered, as the answers are typically never what you actually want, I mean just think, they perceive time-non linearly and unlike us that is just how they are as a species overall. The possibilities are crazy to even scratch at just knowing that, so the restraint from having them spell out their whole society among other facts is worth it to me. The movie didn't need those answers to succeed in what it was doing as a movie.

A beautiful film. I enjoyed Sicario but was not particularly blown out by it, while Arrival did the trick. Cinematography was not as incredible as in Sicario (still good, just not as great) and some of the characters were too simplistic perhaps, but everything else was great. Music was just on point, I'm glad that spotify exists, I got to listen to it today. Couldn't really do it yesterday, the first contact scene really freaked me out with the way it was framed.

I'm surprised not many people were moved by the ending. 'Do you want to make a baby?' sounds bad (though in context I think it worked) but the whole sequence just wrecked me.

Kind of surprised to see you say Sicarios cinematography was better, I thought what was here was just as good if not even better (That "one" night time scene in Sicario is still crazy awesome tho), buuuuuut I'm a sucker for science fiction looks so that's probably it for me too. And I just keep forgetting to talk about the ending talking about all the other amazing stuff lol I got wrecked multiple times during the movie but the ending was devastating, like all the previous moments all at once. First time I've cried while at the movies.

 

[watershed]

I can't wait for the prequel that will explain where the aliens came from, how they discovered humanity, and how they relate to the black goo that creates the xenomorphs.

 

[Will the Thrill]

I can't wait for the prequel that will explain where the aliens came from, how they discovered humanity, and how they relate to the black goo that creates the xenomorphs.

lol god dammit do not give them any ideas if this becomes super successful, we're already getting a Sicario 2 apparently.

 

[UnemployedVillain]

Yeah but we still dont know who or what exactly the aliens are. How many are on the ship, whats their hierarchy or control structure. I know thats not the purpose of the movie but audiences will ask these questions. They want help in 3000 years but what kind of help? Whats gonna happen in 3000 years? What does learning their language accomplish? Theyre gone at the end anyways.

How is this relevant to anything at all?? If there were 2 aliens on the ship or 3, what would it change? Literally nothing. It's like watching Alien/Aliens and asking for the exact chemical composition of their blood

 

[piratepwnsninja]

Tbh I'm surprised that we got as many answers as we did, the direct 3000 year thing took me by surprise, not in a bad way just I thought it would only be "Help". A lot of stuff doesn't need to be answered, as the answers are typically never what you actually want, I mean just think, they perceive time-non linearly and unlike us that is just how they are as a species overall. The possibilities are crazy to even scratch at just knowing that, so the restraint from having them spell out their whole society among other facts is worth it to me. The movie didn't need those answers to succeed in what it was doing as a movie.

Yup.

Now, as a parent of three, ranging from currently 15 to 4 months, this movie hit me hard. I was a wreck by the end. If I knew the future of my children and knew an inevitably bad end was there early, would I have prevented them from even being born? Like, the point of the movie isn't learning an alien language or time being nonlinear. It's that moments with who we love are the most important, and being in/experiencing those moments is worth the pain, even if you somehow know in advance what will happen.

 

[Tashi]

Were all of the visions we saw in the beginning with Louise and Hannah just shown to us, or was Louise experiencing them but not understanding?

 

[watershed]

Were all of the visions we saw in the beginning with Louise and Hannah just shown to us, or was Louise experiencing them but not understanding?

That was just for the movie audience and suggests before we learn it in the film, that time does not have to be linear. Its foreshadowing and has the benefit of the film structure matching one major plot device. The first time Louise experiences time non-linearly we see it with her and its visuals without sound, then sound without visuals I think.

 

[Count Dookkake]

I'm glad they were able to stop De Nomolos.

 

[Einchy]

Were all of the visions we saw in the beginning with Louise and Hannah just shown to us, or was Louise experiencing them but not understanding?

Someone said, and I believe it to be true, that you can tell when she starts seeing them because she seems disoriented each time it happens.

I gotta re-watch it soon.

 

[Will the Thrill]

That was just for the movie audience and suggests before we learn it in the film, that time does not have to be linear. Its foreshadowing and has the benefit of the film structure matching one major plot device. The first time Louise experiences time non-linearly we see it with her and its visuals without sound, then sound without visuals I think.

It just occurred to me and it's probably just me looking for something "cool" to add lol but don't the beginning scenes work with how the film ends? The first scene of them is with Louise and Hannah after she just gave birth right and goes linearly from there till Hannah dies, where as the film ends with the idea that her and Ian will conceive Hannah, thus wrapping around to the beginning of the film and looping the movie alongside the audience since we never saw that scene in the beginning parts since it would spoil the reveal. If the beginning parts with Hannah aren't linear I suppose this wouldn't be as neat of an affect though. The first shot of the movie is her house ceiling with night tint right? Which is where she and Ian are in the end when talking to "make a baby"

Spoiler

I'm probably totally crazy and should go to bed now lol

 

[Tashi]

That was just for the movie audience and suggests before we learn it in the film, that time does not have to be linear. Its foreshadowing and has the benefit of the film structure matching one major plot device. The first time Louise experiences time non-linearly we see it with her and its visuals without sound, then sound without visuals I think.

Ok, thanks, that makes more sense now. So we see these visions of the future and think they're visions of her past. She then receives the gift (right before the bomb explodes?), which is the understanding of their language, which gives her the ability to perceive time differently. This ultimately lets her solve present day problems because she talks to the Chinese general in the future and learns what she did to solve the problem.

To answer the original question of, "What is your purpose on Earth?" - the aliens' are threatened by something 3000 years in the future, and need humanity's help. They give Louise the gift, and then leave. I'm assuming the giving of this gift sets off a series of events that will enable humanity to help out the aliens in 3000 years.

I think that's right? haha

 

[Einchy]

Ok, thanks, that makes more sense now. So we see these visions of the future and think they're visions of her past. She then receives the gift (right before the bomb explodes?), which is the understanding of their language, which gives her the ability to perceive time differently. This ultimately lets her solve present day problems because she talks to the Chinese general in the future and learns what she did to solve the problem.

To answer the original question of, "What is your purpose on Earth?" - the aliens' are threatened by something 3000 years in the future, and need humanity's help. They give Louise the gift, and then leave. I'm assuming the giving of this gift sets off a series of events that will enable humanity to help out the aliens in 3000 years.

I think that's right? haha

Yup, that's it.

I feel like the narrative isn't at all confusing if you've heard about fifth dimension beings before.