[SPOILERS] Star Wars: The Force Awakens - It's True. All of it.

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Anth0ny said:
Hey everyone, The Force Awakens audiobook is available at audible.com

It's 10+ hours long and contains material that is not in the film that is considered canon. Also, IT IS FREE if you sign up to audible.com for the first time. And I'm sure if you signed up in the past it's not hard to create a new account and get it for free anyways.

I'm definitely going to check this out when I get some time. For now, I'm off to my second screening of the film. Imax this time :)
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Interesting, im tempted
 
foxtrot3d said:
You really gonna go that route? Rey IS the classic case of a Mary Sue, she has no flaws and is good at everything. She is the exact definition of the trope.
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No flaws?

She has abandonment issues, she runs out on her friends when told she's special, she has numerous moments of rage.
 
Jarmel said:
Luke doesn't
-Fly the Millenium Falcon better than Han after less than 10 minutes
-Do Jedi mind tricks in ANH. He doesn't use the Force at all besides the training bot and the Death Star trench run in which he still needs a pep talk by Obi-Wan.
-Hell he doesn't even get into a lightsaber battle at all.

Compare that to Rey this film who outpowers Ren in the interrogation scene.
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Luke also had to be saved by Obi-Wan in the Cantina. Rey would have wiped out the whole bar like River in Serenity if anybody tried to test her gangster.
 
jedivulcan said:
If there were one or two things I'd change about this film, I probably would have had Finn get captured in the final act instead of Rey. The Stormtrooper with the electric sword on the planet knocks Finn out. Ren gets Finn (the traitor), Luke's lightsaber, and uses Finn as bait to lure Rey and the Resistance into a trap. Rey owns up to the visions she saw when she held Luke's saber and wants to rescue Finn, retrieve the saber, and blow the Starkiller sky high. Finn could still have "escaped" on his own and faced Phasma, maybe convinced her to join him. Han could have still made a comment about Finn's melee combat skills and still said he was basically a janitor and didn't get that kind of training. This is just me venting a bit about how I didn't like Rey instantly using Force powers and escaping her cell with the Jedi mind trick. They could have saved the "You don't need this ..." helmet reveal for Han/Ben on the catwalk.
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Clearly you have read any of his back story in the Before the awakening book. He was in his top 1% in training class, Phasma had the highest hopes for him, the only reason why he was in charge of sanitation is because he was a cadet like all the others and they all had meaningless jobs to perform before they became Stormtroopers. By his mission in the movie he was an official Storm Trooper with his firct combat mission. But yes his combat skills were the top of his class. just fyi
 
Sanjuro said:
Luke is Lebron in Cleveland.
Rey is Steph Curry.
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YEP

Boke1879 said:
She's a scavenger. She's been picking apart/putting things together probably for most of her life. It's not some stretch that she's knows the anatomy of a ship
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Except she explicitly doesn't know about the Falcon. Both in EU and movie. Look; it's fine, they already cut an hour out of the movie - shit doesn't get explained in a lot of places (Finn rebels from 20+ years of brainwashing! Maz has Luke's lightsaber!) - but it's not misogynistic to admit that Rey is a JJ Abrams Mary Sue and insanely OP. It's a high fantasy / sci-fi movie that is designed for mass consumption. That happens all the damn time.
 
Hollywood Duo said:
Can't believe Phasma was a total throwaway character. All that "omg a woman storm trooper commander" hype was a waste eh?
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I think she was a victim of the film trying to do so much, in terms of introducing new characters and balancing with old ones.

Assuming she's still alive, I can see both her and Poe having much larger roles in Episode VIII.
 
Hollywood Duo said:
Can't believe Phasma was a total throwaway character. All that "omg a woman storm trooper commander" hype was a waste eh?
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I do hope she is actually dead.

Turn off the shields, sure no problem. It was bad. I thought a chrome trooper was awful to begin with but she was all round terrible. I guess she could be constantly pissed at Finn in the next one and hunt him down but there is just nothing there. They need something amazing up their sleeves.
 
Daingurse said:
After he talked about being seduced by the light, yeah I can see it happening. Actually would be funny if Rey and Ren switch places, and Rey becomes some badass darkside force user and Kylo returns to the light. I'd find it entertaining, but so many people wouldn't accept it lol.
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I feel like there's no turning back for Ren now after he killed Han. Like there's just no way the fans will accept him as a protagonist.
 
Ren killed the most beloved character in Star Wars, who happens to be his father. Redeeming him in-universe is one thing. Getting audiences to do the same is quite the task.
 
foxtrot3d said:
You really gonna go that route? Rey IS the classic case of a Mary Sue, she has no flaws and is good at everything. She is the exact definition of the trope.
Click to expand...

Rey was free to explore, and grow as a scavenger. Finn only ever knew order and bitch work. Rey had to carry some of the weight for both of them, since at one point he wanted to run away and leave this all behind. Finn wanted to leave this whole conflict behind, but Rey was getting her first look at a world beyond.

She was succeeding in things because of her force affinity, not because she is a mary sue female character. Are we forgetting young Anakin so soon? Adept at podracing, knows his way around machinery, because he has to work to make a living.

Finn was the first one to take up the lightsaber, and was pretty damn good at it. He was much more of the fighter at first. Rey wanted to join the fight but had her own apprehensions. I think we saw Rey grow in the force, and we saw Finn grow in his convictions. Neither of them being Mary Sues.
 
Sanjuro said:
That's not really the point though. The comparison here is Luke in IV vs Rey in VII. Luke really wasn't anything extraordinary. Rey is shown numerous times having a far larger palette come to the surface.
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Agree 100%, Luke isn't really talented, even Yoda wish Luke was better and more concentrate on his training, Rey is just not only a force sensitive person, but a genie too, she's just more talented.
 
BTW, how worthless was that Captain Phasma character?

They seemed to be hyping this chick up, but ended up being a nobody jobber that makes Boba Fett in ROTJ looks like he deserved top billing in the credits.
 
Just got back from the movie. Really enjoyed it overall. It does kinda rely too much on the originals, especially ANH. I think the new characters had a lot of chemistry and really carried the movie well.

The last shot was odd. Scene went on forever and I was expecting somebody to say something lol. Helicopter pan was kinda weird.
 
Cybit said:
YEP



Except she explicitly doesn't know about the Falcon. Both in EU and movie. Look; it's fine, they already cut an hour out of the movie - shit doesn't get explained in a lot of places (Finn rebels from 20+ years of brainwashing! Maz has Luke's lightsaber!) - but it's not misogynistic to admit that Rey is a JJ Abrams Mary Sue and insanely OP. It's a high fantasy / sci-fi movie that is designed for mass consumption. That happens all the damn time.
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I hope..I hope so much that we will get a longer version of the movie. I would pay so much money for it.
okay not more than 100€
 
Zeliard said:
I want to see them actually take it to the extremes instead. Rey becomes Yoda-esque in her affirmation of the Light side, and Ren goes full Palpatine and never looks back. The conflict would be less inward, retreading Luke and Vader, and more based on the people around them.
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Yes. Thank you. I don't want anymore side switching or morally gray characters in my Star Wars films. I want classic Good vs classic Evil. Use those other techniques and character arcs for the other forms of media.
 
DeathyBoy said:
No flaws?

She has abandonment issues, she runs out on her friends when told she's special, she has numerous moments of rage.
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Really? Because I never saw those issues really come into play. She has "abandonment issues" because we're vaguely told she's waiting for someone and those moments of "rage" are what makes her win even more. Get angry, tap into that Force, overcome everything.
 
I think Rey is the Gohan to Luke's Goku. Natural talent inherited through blood and force.


Also is it me or was there a lot of Trailer scenes and Dialog that didn't make it in the movie?
 
DeathyBoy said:
No flaws?

She has abandonment issues, she runs out on her friends when told she's special, she has numerous moments of rage.
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Seriously. I agree.

Competency does not equal no flaws.

I feel like some people can't handle a female heroine that is actually pretty damn skilled. Without claiming a Mary Sue.

She loses to Kylo at first. She runs out on her friends. She rejects being a force user because she wants to go home and have her family come back.

And this is just the first episode. Let's wait and see where the arc goes before calling her a Mary Sue.
 
Holy shit. This is probably been discussed, but apparently Ewan McGregor provided Obi-Wan's voice for Rey's Force Vision. That's awesome.

TgbAXCF.png
 
foxtrot3d said:
You really gonna go that route? Rey IS the classic case of a Mary Sue, she has no flaws and is good at everything. She is the exact definition of the trope.
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How is she a blatant author insert, you know, the most important trait of a Mary Sue? Certainly less blatant than George "Luke S.".
 
I'm also in the side that it doesn't matter about Rey's power. I'm not especially a fan of video game/power level logic in such movies (unless it's blatantly exposed IN MOVIES, which it never has really been the case in the OT). The force in particular, at least in OT star wars was never really shown as traditional super powers to me. It's always been more of a certain peace/state of mind between light and dark and "visual little miracles" that go with it.

I know some might be tired of some RLM quoting but I think the Plinkett reviews puts it best when it comes to palpatine for example. For me his lightning powers were more about a show of his nature and just his own showing of strength, because he's been around a lot, and that's kinda how he represented his usage of the force (such as he pointed out he wasn't keen on the light saber...until the PT that is when he started swinging his own around).

So i'm not that miffed that Rey suddenly got these powers, or how she's "stronger" than Kylo Ren (which is debatable as he was also wounded, and still has shown a big usage of raw power, but also lack of mental discipline and physical training)
 
jelly said:
I do hope she is actually dead.

Turn off the shields, sure no problem. It was bad. I thought a chrome trooper was awful to begin with but she was all round terrible. I guess she could be constantly pissed at Finn in the next one and hunt him down but there is just nothing there. They need something amazing up their sleeves.
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See her being too confident that they weren't going to be able to do accomplish anything didnt seem ridiculous to me. She didn't seem afraid at any point, more just playing along because she was sure it wouldn't make a difference.
 
I enjoyed this movie. I did like both Rey and Finn, though I do agree with some posters that it did seem that Rey picked up everything fast. I understand the comparison with Luke's trench run, but I felt that was his one "force awakened" moment where he reveals his potential. Rey resisting then pulling off jedi mind tricks of her own is pretty strong, but being adept at the lightsaber whilearning the force pull on tge spot made it seemed she was disciplined to learn things extremely fast compared to the time and effort Luke had to put in (he was a scrub with the lightsaber and his force powers were weak until he met Yoda.)

I did like Kylo Ren. When he stopped that blue blaster shot in the beginning, I thought that established his force potential. But he did seem like a scrub when it came to the lightsaber. I personally liked the Finn vs. Stormtrooper fight tge most because that weapon was pretty slick and it seemed to have weight behind it.
 
TUSR said:
ren is going to go good after the knights of ren get bodied

a sith will get introduced at the end of VIII

and ren and rey will team up to fight them in IX
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I don't think so. Kylo has the teetering on light/dark moment with Skele-Vader. The act perforationg Han completed turned him. He is beyond saving at this point. Killing Han feels like the unforgivable act.
 
CassidyIzABeast said:
Luke also had to be saved by Obi-Wan in the Cantina. Rey would have wiped out the whole bar like River in Serenity if anybody tried to test her gangster.
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So? She's more physically confident? That doesn't make her flawless.

Weakness comes in many forms. We haven't seen what she's like in most situations other than combat yet.
 
DMczaf said:
- The design for Snoke is a huge disappointment. I don't feel like the design belongs in this universe, and was wishing for something more esoteric. A missed opportunity for showcasing something new and not seen before.
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Doesn't Snoke have the exact same facial scar as Rey left on Kylo?
 
injurai said:
Rey was free to explore, and grow as a scavenger. Finn only ever knew order and bitch work. Rey had to carry some of the weight for both of them, since at one point he wanted to run away and leave this all behind. Finn wanted to leave this whole conflict behind, but Rey was getting her first look at a world beyond.

She was succeeding in things because of her force affinity, not because she is a mary sue female character. Are we forgetting young Anakin so soon? Adept at podracing, knows his way around machinery, because he has to work to make a living.

Finn was the first one to take up the lightsaber, and was pretty damn good at it. He was much more of the fighter at first. Rey wanted to join the fight but had her own apprehensions. I think we saw Rey grow in the force, and we saw Finn grow in his convictions. Neither of them being Mary Sues.
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1. Stop, it doesn't matter what you call it "The Force" isn't real, this is a movie, so whatever fictional explanation is behind her being great at everything doesn't change the fact that she is a Mary Sue.

2. Are you actually bringing up PT Anakin? Yes, he was a Mary Sue in TPM and a terrible character.
 
TheOctodad said:
I feel like some people can't handle a female heroine that is actually pretty damn skilled. Without claiming a Mary Sue.
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I don't think this is correct at all. You could have swapped her for Finn and people wo...OH MY GOD HE IS BLACK.

But seriously, I think whoever you used as the primary protagonist having all the abilities Rey had on display would be bringing it up in discussion. I'm also not one of those people who reads into everything far too much, so I'm only curious where the character goes from here.
 
foxtrot3d said:
Really? Because I never saw those issues really come into play. She has "abandonment issues" because we're vaguely told she's waiting for someone and those moments of "rage" are what makes her win even more. Get angry, tap into that Force, overcome everything.
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What are you talking about? She openly rages at Ren that he's a monster. That's a flaw. When she calms down and embraces the force, she kicks his ass.

I'm sorry if you and others don't understand what a Mary Sue is. A character overcoming her anger issues and defeating the villain using sheer will power is not a Mary Sue.
 
If Rey really is the new Luke, I can see her getting bested at some point. Luke was pretty flawless until Vader humbled him. Rey will have her comeuppance for being too sure of herself at some point I'm sure.
 
foxtrot3d said:
1. Stop, it doesn't matter what you call it "The Force" isn't real, this is a movie, so whatever fictional explanation is behind her being great at everything doesn't change the fact that she is a Mary Sue.

2. Are you actually bringing up PT Anakin? Yes, he was a Mary Sue in TPM and a terrible character.
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Mary Sue implies she will continue to be good at everything, and we don't know that. She is clearly going off to train.
 
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