Florida_Man_5000
Member
Where's this going, you have my attention!
. That's some impressive star wars knowledge!
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Star Wars: In Production [Rumors/SPOILERS for All Films Past, Present, & Future]
- Thread starter inm8num2
- Start date
DiipuSurotu
Banned
I hope they aren't burning down an Ewok village as it was rumored. That would be as unnecessary as bringing back the Midi-chlorians just to point out that they suck.
Oh god. That's a rumour? I don't like that at all.
Sectorseven
Member
Depending on how it's portrayed. It does sound a little too on the nose though, almost like winking at the camera.
GorillaWithDandruff
Member
Lol no yea I'm totally fine and get that. Honestly, I just get caught up in fanboyism sometimes. But real talk the biggest issue is, like many people have said, how it was handled. I'd be fine with those assumptions that it was one of the example of the OR's ignorance and naïveté but the thing is the PT doesn't support that at all. Like if he did more scenes where Qui-Gon was openly opposed to the Senate's method of selection or crap like that and strict by the book teaching I'd be totally fine. That'd be interesting as hell. But no. The word midi-chlordane is literally only mentioned in that tiny scene, with QG showing a baby amount of disapproval and the rest is just speculation from us trying to interpret an interesting and plausible reason for Lucas to have put them in.
Anyway yea. Just to clarify to everyone. I'm not like super pissed ripping my hair out over it. Just kinda sad and disappointed that it turned out the way it did
Bucket Mouse
Member
I agree. For a film that has taken great pains to preserve continuity by securing the original three, it'll be jarring if they suddenly cast Lourd in such an iconic role. I think I would honestly prefer it if they did some janky head replacement using old unused footage (is there any?) if they're doing a flashback.
On the other hand, the Star Trek films didnt balk at recasting the original iconic crew while also having Nimoy show up, so who knows.
It's not much but we do now have confirmation that Mark Hamill was on the newly built Falcon. Of course his wording is such that you can't tell for sure that his character Luke will be seen on the Falcon or not.
http://www.jedinews.co.uk/news/news.aspx?newsID=20244
Talk about breadcrumbs lately...
http://www.jedinews.co.uk/news/news.aspx?newsID=20244
Talk about breadcrumbs lately...
GentlemanCrow
Member
I assume that if we do get a "flashback" to a young Leia, it'll probably be within the narrative or the film rather than a literal flashback. So maybe a force vision that's all smoke and mirrors and trippy as hell. How they shoot it could make her face not be the focal point of the scene. Maybe it's just her presence in the sequence that matters.
Bucket Mouse
Member
If they did a brief and hazy force vision a la Episode III, I wouldn't be against them using present day Fisher and some digital makeup. They wont do it, but that shit's come a long way:
http://youtu.be/1qEtYa94h-Q
If on the other hand it is a crystal clear scene set 35 years in the past, it would be pretty conspicuous if they used Lourd and kept avoiding her face like George McFly in BttF 2. They'd sooner put her in a white gown, slap a couple of buns on her head and say fuck it and fuck you, Lourd is Leia.
http://youtu.be/1qEtYa94h-Q
If on the other hand it is a crystal clear scene set 35 years in the past, it would be pretty conspicuous if they used Lourd and kept avoiding her face like George McFly in BttF 2. They'd sooner put her in a white gown, slap a couple of buns on her head and say fuck it and fuck you, Lourd is Leia.
prag16
Banned
Digital makeup for Fisher was already what I was expecting to begin with, even for her "present day" Leia. -_-
That is what one person interpreted a piece of concept art as portraying.
My guess is that they were probably looking at the same stuff we are now and misunderstood it.
brandonh83
Banned
I personally think it supports it if you think about it, it's just that it doesn't make a big deal out of it or hand it to the viewer on a silver platter so to speak. I mean, this is a very scary thing to say out loud around Lucas haters, but I do think the guy knows his own story and to me it was very apparent that he made the Jedi that way and introduced the Midichlorians with the idea of the Jedi in the PT being too strict and closed-minded (the Midichlorians, Jedi not being allowed to have romantic relationships, Anakin being unable to visit his mother, the list goes on!), but to each his own.
It's a lot more than just the Midichlorians that I feel backs up what I'm getting at. I don't think we're going to change each other's minds, but it was still fun to go over-- especially with the few such as yourself that were willing to have a polite back and forth.
freethought
Member
Where's your evidence Yoda and Obi Wan had changed their minds on these things? Ben tries to get Luke to abandon his family as soon as possible and train as a Jedi, Luke has no romantic relationship in the OT, Yoda encourages Luke to let his friends die and continue his Jedi training, the list goes on!
The only reason George Lucas introduced midichlorians into the PT is he needed a quick short hand for identifying Anakin as potentially the most powerful Jedi ever and it was the best he could come up with. The reason they don't exist in the OT is because he hadn't thought of them yet and the reason they're barely mentioned in the the other PT movies is the same reason Jar Jar is barely in them, namely that people hated them.
Well, to be fair what we know from spoilers/leaks of Episode VII Luke never married and abandoned his friends to go into seclusion so he ended up sort of listening to Obi-Wan and Yoda after all.
Dude probably won't live much longer...he has been in rough shape for awhile.
Doublesith
Member
block tower
Member
im glad thats his attitude. its nice to see he can step back and still enjoy his creation.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
He seems open-minded. Who knows, maybe he will end up liking the film more than some of the other episodes?
oh my god
CreepingFear
Member
That's all cute, unless it's doing it while you are trying to sleep.
Sectorseven
Member
The quote in that article is contradictory to what he said more recently. Didn't he allegedly write the first treatment this new trilogy is based on? He's got to have some idea of what's going to happen.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
The "he wrote a treatment thing" isn't clear in and of itself. The Business Week article most people use to point at that mentions "treatments" alongside a more general "rough sketches," so nobody really knows how detailed anything he wrote really was, other than Iger looked through it and said "We can use this, there's good ideas in here."
We don't really know what Arndt turned that stuff into, and we further don't know how much of it has changed after Kasdan/Abrams got ahold of it, either.
It's possible seeing those out-of-context images had him like "huh. I don't know what this is or how it fits into what I thought it would be."
...or maybe he's just covering because he doesn't want to deal with someone going "tell me tell me tell me"
brandonh83
Banned
I was talking about the Jedi apparently not allowing Anakin to visit his mother. I'm pretty sure that if Luke wanted to visit Owen and Beru, had they not been burned to a crisp, that he would have been allowed to do so because there wasn't some big Jedi Order he was following orders from. Luke didn't have a romantic relationship in the originals but that has nothing at all to do with the Jedi, and there was some romance between he and Leia but we all know how that turned out. Anakin did, and it was nothing but trouble to him.
Yoda only encouraged Luke to not go after his friends because he was afraid of what might happen, and at that point Luke didn't know Vader was his father and Yoda was concerned about that as well. Obi-Wan and Yoda were banking on Luke defeating Anakin and Palpatine, and there was a lot of thin ice that Luke had to skate on and they were being very cautious about that.
Sectorseven
Member
I wish his answers were more consistent. He tells every interviewer something different.
CreepingFear
Member
Lucas is the quintessential unreliable narrator. He's changed history on things so many times that I really don't know what's real.
heh, the man constantly making changes to his films is constantly making changes to his own history too. Some life imitating art shit.
CreepingFear
Member
GorillaWithDandruff
Member
I can respect dat homie. Good shit. And yea I get that. Idk it's just cuz that would've been such a great side plot for the PT to have if it had focused on it more but I mean like I said it honestly just feels like a series of coincidences. Relationships weren't allowed because it makes Anakin/Padme romance feel more R+J-esque, Midis only included to give a reason for Jedi to pick up Anakin, Senate makes wrong decisions only because they were getting played by a legit Sith that had infiltrated their system, etc. Even if they weren't coincidental, none of these feel all that bad. At the most they were just a little too strict and demanding. Nothing severe enough to reason that they were wrong in their ways. And if Lucas did only intend for them to only come off as "slightly-strict", why even include that at all? That's so boring compared to the extreme of a dictatorial iron-ruled government.
I guess in the end for me it's just that there aren't enough examples of it to feel intentional and even if they were, the few that exist are so flimsy and weak that it becomes boring either way. Although you're probably right in that we won't completely convince each other, I have slightly become less annoyed by this particular part of the PT if that's any consolation lol.
Edit: And as far as Obi-Wan and Yoda changing their minds on things mentioned earlier. I don't think the way they act in the OT is reflective of their "hard, cold solid-mindset" from the PT, it's just the fact that Luke is literally the fucking Messiah and can't be fucking around if they have any hope of saving the galaxy, so they tell him to stop fucking around and save the fucking galaxy.
Sectorseven
Member
The Jedi existed for "over a thousand generations" and it would be awfully bold of Obi-Wan and Yoda to suddenly question such an institutionalized system. Not to say they couldn't, such things have happened in reality and they certainly had plenty of time on their hands, but they also would have had to come to these new beliefs independently as they were both in isolation.
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
Bobby Roberts
Banned
TAJ
Darkness cannot drive out darkness; only light can do that. Hate cannot drive out hate; only love can do that.
E-list Lucas cronies and a fanboy essentially have the reins of the franchise?
Didn't something like this already exist at LucasArts?
Before someone is a smartass, I'm obviously not referring to Lucas.
Hardly surprising. Most Star Wars history has been created to give Lucas the ultimate blow job at the expense of everyone that contributed to the franchise and the development of the original movies.
Marcia Lucas is the ultimate example of being written out.
CreepingFear
Member
I see you've read the secret history of star wars as well.
http://secrethistoryofstarwars.com/marcialucas.html
I've been pointing it out to people for years now.
The prequels were reason enough to believe something had been very wrong with the perceived genius of Lucas.
Howard the Duck was a warning no one understand enough of at the time due to Star Wars overall success.
crackhead_bob
Member
I have 2 questions.
Does anyone think that Lucas is aware of the fact that he shit the bed and is being stubborn about it, or does he genuinely believe that the prequels are his magnum opus?
The other question is something that I've been putting some thought into as of late. What are the chances that this new trilogy will eschew the standby archetype formula they tried to recreate in the prequels? All the main characters in episode I were basically redone analogs of the characters from the first Star Wars film. I honestly think that Lucas was trying to make Jar Jar Binks into the new Chewbacca, and had he would have had a bigger role in the sequels had he not taken the pasting he had by fans and critics. The original cast members are basically here to pass the torch to the next generation, but popular consensus is that the droids, R2D2 and C-3PO will always be the main fixtures of this series because of how iconic they are and because storywise they are ageless. But the reality is, Anthony Daniels is not getting any younger, and that he's too deeply rooted in the old trilogy to be seen as a contemporary element in this series.
You think it's possible that they could say..... do away with the obligatory droids and token alien and shake things up abit more, 4 main protagonists instead of 3, Introduce 2 Lando type additions to Episode VIII instead of just one? Scotch the token alien and make the troupe an exclusively human affair? Have a crusty older type who doesn't have to be a martyr, etc....
Does anyone think that Lucas is aware of the fact that he shit the bed and is being stubborn about it, or does he genuinely believe that the prequels are his magnum opus?
The other question is something that I've been putting some thought into as of late. What are the chances that this new trilogy will eschew the standby archetype formula they tried to recreate in the prequels? All the main characters in episode I were basically redone analogs of the characters from the first Star Wars film. I honestly think that Lucas was trying to make Jar Jar Binks into the new Chewbacca, and had he would have had a bigger role in the sequels had he not taken the pasting he had by fans and critics. The original cast members are basically here to pass the torch to the next generation, but popular consensus is that the droids, R2D2 and C-3PO will always be the main fixtures of this series because of how iconic they are and because storywise they are ageless. But the reality is, Anthony Daniels is not getting any younger, and that he's too deeply rooted in the old trilogy to be seen as a contemporary element in this series.
You think it's possible that they could say..... do away with the obligatory droids and token alien and shake things up abit more, 4 main protagonists instead of 3, Introduce 2 Lando type additions to Episode VIII instead of just one? Scotch the token alien and make the troupe an exclusively human affair? Have a crusty older type who doesn't have to be a martyr, etc....
I kind of feel like the last decade has almost swung the pendulum in an equally opposite direction, though, to the point where basically everything good about Star Wars is attributed to everybody but Lucas - as if Lucas wasn't somewhat responsible for choosing and overseeing those he originally collaborated with.
It's an easy narrative that also seems to vindictively take away a lot of what Lucas accomplished. Collaboration is something that happens in every film; we generally attribute it to the director in every other context except for the OT now because its director has fallen out of society's favor.
Nah, its basically some online people that know the details. The average person has no clue and fully believes that Lucas had it all planned out and this was his huge triumph that proved what a great director and creator he is. That likely wont change any time soon at all.
I don't think the average person thinks Lucas is a genius anymore. A decade of vitriol directed at the prequels has definitely spilled over into the mainstream, just maybe not to the same degree or for the same explicitly-cited reasons.
Regardless it doesn't make the online community's attempt to strip away Lucas' achievements any less unfair or overly punitive. It's selective to attribute the good parts of the OT to everybody but Lucas, when we generally credit other directors for the entirety of their work, which are also collaborations.
You are over rating the ability for the average person to know dick squat or care.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
Not caring means no knowledge or opinion one way or the other. I do agree that few people out there praise Lucas as some kind of flawless master of myth anymore.
To be honest I'm not sure they ever really did. Star Wars is mythic in its presence in pop culture, Lucas is a footnote by comparison. Note that that still leaves him very present and very public, but the man has never eclipsed the story in the way that, say, James Cameron has. And I think crediting him with bringing the hero's journey (or even talking about the hero's journey explicitly) into the mainstream is a relatively modern (2000s) development.
He might actually be more famous for 'wrecking' Star Wars than he ever was for creating it, but even that is still mostly the domain of people who care a lot about these sorts of things.
freethought
Member
^^^^George Lucas was behind Star Wars and Indiana Jones, the man was worshipped as a god for two decades. He was one of the most famous movie directors of all time. probably only eclipsed by Spielberg. Cameron's up there of course, especially after Titanic but George Lucas is really, really famous and pre-prequels was definitely held up as one of the greats. Now you're right, seemingly more famous for destroying Star Wars than making it, meanwhile prequel haters grasp in any direction looking for someone else to credit the original film too. Marcia's a pretty good candidate, she apparently gave a lot of script notes and won an oscar for editing the film. She's credited for injecting some humanity in the script and apparently Star Wars was a plodding mess before she got her hands on it, wonder what she thinks of the prequels.
See, I'm pretty sure Ben would never ever have let Luke see them again.
See, I'm pretty sure Ben would never ever have let Luke see them again.
brandonh83
Banned
You're free to think that.