Sectorseven
Member
Maybe he did tell, but a lot of people -especially imperials, might be in such denial to themselves that they'll believe anything else, and those stories would spread.
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Star Wars: The Force Awakens Final Trailer
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Maybe he did tell, but a lot of people -especially imperials, might be in such denial to themselves that they'll believe anything else, and those stories would spread.
John Dunbar
correct about everything
why would you assume that? do you not think he might have given some explanation for giving vader an honourable burial at the end of jedi? and would he not have shared their father's final moments with leia?
IAmRandom31
Banned
there is more natural emotion in the scene where she is crying then the entire prequel series combined.
its the emotions and the expressions and the general cinematography that is telling me this is going to be a great film.
I want to be a part of the launch weekend movie theatres but I know I will have to go back and watch it again a week later to hear the movie. No doubt the theatres are going to be loud as hell and will have people cheering and clapping and screaming nearly the entire movie
kinda are?
they are. period.
also, the EU was just 20 years of plot holes.
at least now we have the story group reviewing everything
More_Badass
Member
Okay, well the core trio and some Rebels on Endor then. But besides that relatively very small group?
Gunslinger
Member
Nah cause anakin is a force ghost now. He is back to the light side again.
Pretty poor argument. One building, albeit pretty large, in a huge galaxy. They were few in numbers and prefered not to be in the spotlight. Doesnt really matter that they had a nice looking temple in the capital.
D
Deleted member 20415
Unconfirmed Member
The Star Wars Aftermath book starts to hint at this:
At one point, there is a group that starts to purchase artifacts they believe to be owned by Vader - his lightsaber, etc. They idolize him, but aren't exactly force users themselves
Sectorseven
Member
Maybe Kylo is just crazy and hearing voices.
Calcium
Banned
I'm sure Luke told people about Anakin redeeming himself, but with so few people knowing it wouldn't become widespread enough for it to be common knowledge. Look at how the efforts of the Rebellion are just "stories" to people now. The galaxy is a big place, not everyone is going to know what is going on.
ViewtifulJC
Banned
I like that my eyes usually have something to focus on with every wide frame. In the beginning, its a very still environment, so you're eyes are naturally drawn to any sense of movement. Rey rappels down the rope on the left side of the screen, which cuts to a wider shot of her rappelling in almost the same screen space. Your eyes don't have to re-adjust to find the focus in the next shot.
There's the one teaser from Saturday that smoothly moves hands off a one-shot of Poe to Finn, with Poe giving him a gesture of acceptance to this former Stormtrooper and the camera reflects that choice. We get to follow Poe a bit, then we see Finn, they connect, then its soley Finn. And all the while, there's the real sets and actors in the background, going about their business, giving a tangible weight to the world.
My favorite bit from the trailer was here, near the beginning. Once again, we have a still environment, our eyes track any sense of movement. We see a ship launching in the distance, can't quite make it out, its a bit mysterious to us. The wing in the foreground of this shot gives it a bit of depth, a sense of how far away it is. We then cut to Rey, the implication being she is watching this ship too, instantly connecting our reaction with her. As the camera slowly pushes in, her face subtly changes to a bit of melancholy and desire. A quiet evocation of Luke's similar lament to get off this boring desert rock, to be something greater, foreshadowing the adventure ahead of her. Its a very human desire, and those two shots connect us with her character motivations.
It seems that way, certainly. For Kylo Ren, as the only verified Force user, there are still a lot of questions. Who taught him? What is his connection to the Dark Side? How is he using the Force to hurt someone directly (without Force Lightning)?
I'm hyped to finally get these answers come December.
youbastards
Member
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MJ9Fi4izrYc
But suddenly they are forgotten about in the span of a few generations? Palpatine must have deleted the Wikipedia Holocron.
Everybody that Obi-Wan interacted with in the prequels knew he was a Jedi and Jabba had no problem knowing what Luke was trying to pull in RotJ, but fast forward 30+/- years and there is doubt that any of it was real?
John Dunbar
correct about everything
people talk. if you have established a galaxy where there is clearly regular contact between worlds, i see no reason other than "just because" to think vader's fate would have remained a secret. not to mention leia is some kind of princess, so that alone would give a pretty good way to spread the info around. why would she not want to redeem her father?
kaiju
Member
Or maybe the dark side is strong in this one.
Remember what Kathleen Kennedy says: "The Saga films focus on the Skywalker family saga. The stories follow a linear narrative that connects to the previous six films," she said. "The Force Awakens follows Return of the Jedi and continues that generational story."
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Charles Foster Kane
Rosebud
We don't know if they're forgotten.
Regardless, was Luke super familiar with the force and the Jedi? To Han is was like an legend. So it doesn't really matter.
Sectorseven
Member
Right, I'm just wondering if they're going to shoehorn Vader in somehow since he's so iconic.
My bad, I haven't been following this that closely. It's still a desert planet with a main character working on random stuff with a perfectly dirty face.
Seductivpancakes
Member
it's JOHN CENA!!!
I can't wait for that photoshop
More_Badass
Member
People talking and a Rebel leader trying to redeem some infamous Empire enforcer isn't going to have much impact against the propaganda effect and might of a galactic empire
And again, people talking. It's stories that people hear. Hearsay and tales. If anything that makes the whole Jedi and Sith being legendary more realistic
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
Is there a link to this video?
Charles Foster Kane
Rosebud
Weren't they already pretty much forgotten in A New Hope and that's why Obi-Wan was telling Luke about the Jedi?
Look at 9/11. People doubt it was real thanks to the ramblings of idiots and that was a decade and a half ago. Holocaust? fair share of deniers too. Look at the shit Japan tries to pull with history.
People really underestimate the power of media brainwashing
Now go to some remote country and ask anyone what 9/11, or the ww2 were. Rumors and vague stories is what you'll get. At best.
They aren't forgotten, but there was alot of propaganda out there and misinformation.
Finn especially was with the Empire so he was fed all kinds of lies and bullshit.
Rey was on a backwater planet as a vagabond, not exactly connected to the galaxy around her.
Most common people would not know what is true and what is not and it would all sound fantastical. In Star Wars even Han did not believe in any of it which is essentially what that quote was directly a mirror to.
As far as inconsistencies go, they are inevitable. You must keep in mind this is not a series that was planned out in any way. Very rough ideas and treatments have existed several times, but every single film in the series so far was written after the previous film was done and wasn't planned out in advance.
That goes for the Prequels too, which went through just as many radical changes during production as the OT did. As filmed and written, ROTS was a much different film than the one that was ultimately released, as it was altered and revamped during post production. It's not like the Prequels were written out at the same time like LOTR (admittedly an adaptation and one that still had plenty of changes during production), they were written one by one.
That's why there's massive inconsistencies across the films about Jedi, the Force, the Sith, the Republic, the Empire, all of it. When Obi-Wan talks about Vader being an evil Jedi traitor that killed Luke's father in the first film, when released that was absolutely true and to be taken at face value. It wasn't until several drafts into ESB that Vader was retconned into being the father all along.
Multiply that by an exponential amount for all the films and you get a very shaky and uncertain canon.
That said, the depiction of the Jedi and the Force in the PT is still fuckin stupid and veering wildly from what the OT's was.
That goes for the Prequels too, which went through just as many radical changes during production as the OT did. As filmed and written, ROTS was a much different film than the one that was ultimately released, as it was altered and revamped during post production. It's not like the Prequels were written out at the same time like LOTR (admittedly an adaptation and one that still had plenty of changes during production), they were written one by one.
That's why there's massive inconsistencies across the films about Jedi, the Force, the Sith, the Republic, the Empire, all of it. When Obi-Wan talks about Vader being an evil Jedi traitor that killed Luke's father in the first film, when released that was absolutely true and to be taken at face value. It wasn't until several drafts into ESB that Vader was retconned into being the father all along.
Multiply that by an exponential amount for all the films and you get a very shaky and uncertain canon.
That said, the depiction of the Jedi and the Force in the PT is still fuckin stupid and veering wildly from what the OT's was.
That down right corner tho
Yoshichan
And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Yeah we're enemies now.
kaiju
Member
Good questions, and I won't spoil them for you.
professor_t
Member
Really? One of the things I love about it is the common bond it reflects - Boyega and I had almost the exact same reaction (I jumped on my couch, not over it, but still . . .).
Where is that line from again? I've completely forgotten.
edit:Oh nvm. Thank you Google.
Sectorseven
Member
Did the whole script leak?
Also the Galaxy is huge in comparison to things that have happened on our planet.
They are all light years apart so surely a lot of what happened could be attributed to Chinese whispers and so people don't know of what really went on.
Plus couldn't jedi's be a bit of a legend and not very well known or seen in the wild?
kaiju
Member
TheJollyCorner
Member
I love the idea of the 'Jedi Myth' forming post-Clone Wars, then slowly building through the events of the OT with the exploits of Luke.
For example, the history books should clearly have record of 'General Skywalker' during the Clone Wars- so for this young kid 'Luke Skywalker' to come in with little experience, have his legendary run in the trenches of the Death Star- you are already building the "Is he a Jedi?" mystique among those on both sides of the war.
Then through the events in ESB (or just prior or after? I can't recall) he obtains a General rank himself due to his competency as a pilot/tactician, yes? I can imagine all that survive the major battles between ANH through RotJ would be whispering about the possibility of having a Jedi on their side, even if there might not be any concrete confirmation. It definitely feels like something people would tell their kids about post-war, which creates a kind of fairy tale aspect.
Could this young person have really been a Jedi two decades after the Jedi Order was wiped out- or is it just propaganda to instill hope in a rebellion that was severely outmatched and outnumbered by the Empire?
Still, like others have said in this thread, as the audience we follow a good portion of Luke's Jedi advancements- but how many people outside of Han/Leia/Lando are fully aware he's a legitimate Jedi? Most of his big Jedi moments happen fairly privately. If Luke goes off after partying hard with the Ewoks and goes full hermit, that absolutely continues the mythical aspect of any kind of 'modern Jedi'.
I dunno... I just really dig the concept. I love the whole "It's real" line from Han.
For example, the history books should clearly have record of 'General Skywalker' during the Clone Wars- so for this young kid 'Luke Skywalker' to come in with little experience, have his legendary run in the trenches of the Death Star- you are already building the "Is he a Jedi?" mystique among those on both sides of the war.
Then through the events in ESB (or just prior or after? I can't recall) he obtains a General rank himself due to his competency as a pilot/tactician, yes? I can imagine all that survive the major battles between ANH through RotJ would be whispering about the possibility of having a Jedi on their side, even if there might not be any concrete confirmation. It definitely feels like something people would tell their kids about post-war, which creates a kind of fairy tale aspect.
Could this young person have really been a Jedi two decades after the Jedi Order was wiped out- or is it just propaganda to instill hope in a rebellion that was severely outmatched and outnumbered by the Empire?
Still, like others have said in this thread, as the audience we follow a good portion of Luke's Jedi advancements- but how many people outside of Han/Leia/Lando are fully aware he's a legitimate Jedi? Most of his big Jedi moments happen fairly privately. If Luke goes off after partying hard with the Ewoks and goes full hermit, that absolutely continues the mythical aspect of any kind of 'modern Jedi'.
I dunno... I just really dig the concept. I love the whole "It's real" line from Han.
How is that hard to believe, given what we know about palpatine and the empire? The winners are always the ones that get to write the history. That he started to systematically delete and modify information databases isnt exactly difficult to believe. And saying "everybody that obiwan interacted with" is pretty small scale thinking. In a galaxy of maybe trillions, how exactly can it be common knowledge if all proof is wiped and many those who are still alive probably unwilling to challenge the official stance of the empire? Who can be bothered to repeat something that is dead and gone, and could only serve to get you in trouble if you do? Rey and Finn for example are too young to know themselves, and have grown up in enviroments where that kind of information wasnt readily availible, or at all relevant to their day to day lives.
LaserBuddha
Member
....but he did die on Death Star II!
They couldn't even find the location of the secret Rebel Base, how are we supposed to believe they were able to remove the knowledge of every single person on every planet who knows about the Jedi and witnessed a war they were in that spanned the galaxy?
They didn't do that and nothing in the movies implies that, why do you keep insisting that it's the case?
efyu_lemonardo
May I have a cookie?
that was a damn good trailer
on its own its already better than all three prequels put together
on its own its already better than all three prequels put together
BenjaminBirdie
Banned
NeonZ
Member
It's not "removing the knowledge", discrediting them is enough. The fact that they were hunted and wiped out by itself would do a lot to diminish tales and even memories about them and their supposed abilities. Suddenly all the talk about the Force and its abilities, even if remembered, seems to be meaningless considering their ultimate fate.
DiipuSurotu
Banned
lol good point
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