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Star Wars: The Old Republic |OT| EA: "Let's blow this thing and go home!"

Alex

Member
I'm lvl 45 on my Sith Juggernaut and I've only put 80 hours into the game. No way it takes 70+ hours for the last 5 levels.

It's about ~100 average from all that I've seen, always give or take of course. Still, my quote is with the idea of decked out characters, alts, etc, and that's quite a bit of time for a normal person to put into a game in the span of a month, especially if they have other hobbies and games to play, which most of us do.

It's your free time and I'm not going to judge you on how you spend it, it wasn't really meant as a slur, but the idea that people are "slow" because they don't play big blocks of time every day is silly. Plus, I mean most of us just don't want to rush to cap. Why would we, most of us are WoW vets we know exactly what is waiting at the end.

Please. One of my guildies dinged last week and he has a normal job, kids and still raids in WoW. Leveling is not hard or that time consuming.

Dude, I don't give a shit what you or your friends do, I was calling you out for the notion of people being slow when they don't want to binge a game to the end in a month and yes, it is a lot of time, I don't care how yours is spent but for a single title it's a lot.
 

C.Dark.DN

Banned
Too many variables to get into arguments.

If SWTOR logs /played post it to accurately gauge things.

Some people have definitely put in 200 hours because all their free time goes into it, some people are dinging 50 with a very efficient time, and some are only around 30 with a time investment that was spread out since launch because they play other games during free time. And some may be 30 with a very inefficient time.

I'm essentially level 11 with an inefficient time investment (probably 20 hours over 1 week) because I kept changing my mind on classes.
 

usea

Member
Most of us here have jobs and responsibilities beyond kiddy pool 9-3 class time.
I work 55-60 hours a week, I cook dinner, I do laundry, I have a fiance who has her own schedule and we only play when we both have time. All that said, my progress is not that far off from the guy you quoted. There's no need to get defensive and make assumptions. It makes you look like an asshole.
 

Emitan

Member
Please. One of my guildies dinged last week and he has a normal job, kids and still raids in WoW. Leveling is not hard or that time consuming.

This isn't the only game in the world. Some people play at different rates. Some people explore, some people try to figure out holocrons on their own, some people make a lot of alts, etc. No one gives a shit how fast you reached 50.
 

Tacitus_

Member
This isn't the only game in the world. Some people play at different rates. Some people explore, some people try to figure out holocrons on their own, some people make a lot of alts, etc. No one gives a shit how fast you reached 50.

Yes?

Too many variables to get into arguments.

If SWTOR logs /played post it to accurately gauge things.

It does. I dinged 50 at just an hour shy of 5 days /played. Watched all the cutscenes and did a couple of flashpoints. Best ones I've heard are around 4 days /played.
 
Update on ability delay

http://www.swtor.com/blog/georg-zoeller-gives-update-ability-delay

Hi everyone; I wanted to give you all an update on the ability delay situation.

Thanks to constructive feedback from the community, including some great videos, we were able to identify an issue that could cause abilities on global cooldown to appear available to the player, resulting in unresponsive/ignored player input. A fix for the issue is currently scheduled to go to the public test server with our next update.

Additionally, we have located an issue that would cause player input for certain instant abilities to fail in frantic combat situations, resulting in unpredictable and frustrating gameplay issues for the affected player. A fix for the issue is currently scheduled to go to the public test server with our next update.

Finally, our engineers have identified an issue introducing a significant delay between player input and ability execution in certain game situations, most notably (but not limited to) fast paced PvP. The magnitude of the delay varies with a number of factors, including processor hardware, but can, especially on dual core CPUs, result in a very perceivable reduction in game responsiveness. We are in the later stages of testing a fix for the problem and hope to be able to roll it out to the servers very soon.

We're still investigating a number of additional issues, along with some usability and quality of life improvements for responsiveness regarding player input, but the above mentioned developments should provide a very measurable improvement in combat responsiveness.

Thanks again for your patience and support and we hope to see you on the public test server to help us validate these improvements before pushing them to the live servers.

Georg Zoeller
Principal Lead Combat Designer
 

Alex

Member
I work 55-60 hours a week, I cook dinner, I do laundry, I have a fiance who has her own schedule and we only play when we both have time. All that said, my progress is not that far off from the guy you quoted. There's no need to get defensive and make assumptions. It makes you look like an asshole.

Peoples time spent is their own, for some folks a single MMO winds up being their primary hobby (I've been there like... three times) for others we mix it up with TV, other games, etc, everyone has their own playstyle and I just never cared about who played what how much. It's none of my business.

The only thing that bugged me was the one dude making a quip about how apparently we're slow and mediocre for considering the entire leveling portion of an MMO not to be an insubstantial amount of time :lol It is a lot of time,period, but that's not the sole thing, most of us who aren't capped just don't want to rush. Considering the game we're talking about here especially.

In WoW I always rushed to cap, grinded everything into the floor, got sick of it and pissed off guilds time after time by becoming a top member then quitting. This I'm just playing with my wife, going co-op, playing everything duo (including dungeons and 4x elite quests) for some added challenge, etc.

It's a nice change for me, honestly. It'll still take me awhile to cap my main up and I'll goof around in PvP and dungeons for a bit then when Legacy comes out I'll probably re-level a different class then wait and see if they add some more variance in content (as I am a lapsed bleeding edge raider)
 

Tess3ract

Banned
Yeah I think I had about 5 days played to get to 50 as well. I never said anything about you being mediocre, just slow. As you said, you level how you want with the time you have.

16 days 9 hours /played now though.

For me I don't really care about the story other than the class quests, I get fed up with the feeling of around 30+ you stop feeling heroic and the trash (always in packs of 3 normals, 1 strong 1 normal, or 1 elite for every single pull) becomes simply tedious.
 

C.Dark.DN

Banned
Mostly the best part of the game to me is the class quest, I've seen everything on the republic side in beta anyways.

Not really, I did all of that when classes weren't in session :\
Which is not having a life... for a period of time.

When you have a break and can invest a shit ton of time into a MMO, it's amazing.

You just have to slow things down when higher priorities come. Which works out because you're ahead.

I doubt anyone that works full time is as decked out as you are.
 

Arment

Member
Yeah I think I had about 5 days played to get to 50 as well. I never said anything about you being mediocre, just slow.

16 days 9 hours /played now though

That's like the Southpark WoW parody level of time played.

744 hours since release day. You played 393 of them. Holy shit.

If you started day 1 of early access it looks a bit better with 912 hours since then. Still ridiculous to be calling someone slow because didn't didn't invest 1/3rd (more really) of their whole life to the game in the past month.
 

Knox

Member
What I would like to know from those that are already bored at 50 is what game do they plan to go to? The game that these people want doesn't exist. Any game you play like a full time job is going to get maxed out in a month or two.
 

Tacitus_

Member
Here we go.

5 days is pretty normal from 1-top level and not really rushing.

Getting to top level in 6 or 7 is not a big deal if you enjoyed your pace.

Yup. You'll level to 50 in around 5-6 days unless you go off goofing, for example looking for the holocrons or participating in mass /dances somewhere. (not that I'm knocking people who do, whatever they spend their time on is their business)
 

Alex

Member
Yeah I think I had about 5 days played to get to 50 as well. I never said anything about you being mediocre, just slow.

You weren't the one I was callin' out, guy! :p

Anyway, let's just move on and not be a shitty official MMO board-esque topic and just respect each other.

With the queue turned down to .25 the ability delay doesn't really bug me much, it's not really bad for me anymore as of late, somehow a few latency bugs for me have cleared up lately.

But, they do still need to work on it, because it does screw with certain animations in some instances in a really obnoxious fashion (Carbine Burst, ughhh). It also does quirk with chain healing, for example, quite a bit too.

participating in mass /dances somewhere. (not that I'm knocking people who do, whatever they spend their time on is their business)

My respect for people ends at people participating in mass dances, weird RP and riding around on mounts through capitals all day. Do not do these things!
 

Tess3ract

Banned
That's like the Southpark WoW parody level of time played.

744 hours since release day. You played 393 of them. Holy shit.
I might have left the game on for a day or two, especially when there were enormous queues on the servers so I wouldn't have to wait to log into the server again :p

Also I had a life during that time, I don't sleep much in general though.
What I would like to know from those that are already bored at 50 is what game do they plan to go to? The game that these people want doesn't exist. Any game you play like a full time job is going to get maxed out in a month or two.
I'm not completely bored of the game, though I do see the forest for the trees with the game's situation right now. I still have a few things to do, and I'm not going to be able to digest the content fast anymore because college started up again.

Mostly I just play MMOs for the dungeons, raids, and collecting/dressing up characters. I can't say I was ever too interested in any of the other stuff.
 

Alex

Member
I might have left the game on for a day or two, especially when there were enormous queues on the servers so I wouldn't have to wait to log into the server again :p

Also I had a life during that time, I don't sleep much in general though.

I have a horrible, horrible habit of always leaving my games on. There have been times where I've left console games on for weeks. :lol Honestly I think it's been years since I've had an accurate clock time in a game. For MMO's you thankfully auto time out but I constantly log on to check addons or auctions or everything else and just let it idle me out.

I kind of want to RP to troll.

The best way to troll an MMO is by mentioning another MMO, just go onto General chat and be smarmy. Kids lose their shit over the whole "winning team" syndrome.
 

Arment

Member
My respect for people ends at people participating in mass dances, weird RP and riding around on mounts through capitals all day. Do not do these things!

The day I quit WoW was one of those days. I was literally just flying/riding around waiting for raid time. I had one of those introspective moments where I just asked myself what the hell am I doing?

Now I play mobas. Traded one devil for another.
 

mcfrank

Member
Whiners can move onto something else now

After Game Update 1.1 went live, we discovered that the Open World PvP area on Ilum was not working as our PvP design team intended. As many of you know, large groups of players began capturing the Ilum control points, then 'camping' at the enemy's base. This led to a very frustrating experience for a number of players who were unable to leave their base and fight back against their attackers. It was not a fair gameplay experience. In addition, some players on the attacking side gained more Valor points than designed for the time they spent in PvP.

The amount of Valor granted from these activities was significantly more than intended and we are now carefully investigating players who were on Ilum during this period, and present at some of these 'camping' events. I can reassure you that those who were involved and who gained an unfair advantage over other players inappropriately will be carefully reviewed and action will be taken to restore game balance. This could include Valor adjustments or account actions in accordance with the severity of the issue.

We have made the decision not to enact a mass 'rollback' of Valor points for all players in the game, or even on Ilum. This would unfairly penalize some players who may not have been present during this event. Rest assured though, anyone and everyone who is found to have exploited the situation to an unreasonable degree will be investigated and actions taken as needed. Our in-game metrics are able to give us precise details on where players were, what they were doing and what rewards they gained.

We take any sort of situation where one group of players gains an unexpected or unintended advantage over other players very seriously and will act to ensure that all players can have a fair and fun game experience.

Thanks for your patience while we worked to resolve this issue. Our team worked diligently to get a patch ready to address this and other issues, and we're already seeing the results in improved battles on Ilum. As always we welcome your feedback and will continue to improve moving forward!

Jeff Hickman,
Executive Producer – Live Services
 

Tess3ract

Banned
Why would you say "whiners"? A lot of complaints about this game I feel are justified, though the whole ilum situation is more like shooting yourself in the foot on bioware's side though.
 

Arment

Member
Seems like the responsible thing to do. A blanket rollback punishes everyone. This way looks like it'll take forever though.
 

Mairu

Member
Whiners can move onto something else now
??? This only legitimizes the complaints about the Ilum situation.
Seems like the responsible thing to do. A blanket rollback punishes everyone. This way looks like it'll take forever though.

I agree at this point that a rollback isn't the right way, however I still don't really think they responded properly to the situation. If they don't have a method of disabling individual zones, they really should work out a way in the future to be able to do that. A better response would've been to disable entry to Ilum at all shortly after the exploit was discovered and leave it closed until after the patch that happened the following day. In that kind of situation they could've even done a minor rollback without affecting much. The way they handled it was leaving high population servers available for entire factions to basically farm up to Battlemaster in a matter of hours.

I'm pretty happy with the blog update they posted as well as the one about ability delay and I hope in the future they better design these kinds of pvp zones.
 

Tess3ract

Banned
Whiners can move onto something else now
I can understand punishing spawncampers but at the same time, if they banned everyone who did it they'd ban 90% of the empire population
??? This only legitimizes the complaints about the Ilum situation.
I agree at this point that a rollback isn't the right way, however I still don't really think they responded properly to the situation. If they don't have a method of disabling individual zones, they really should work out a way in the future to be able to do that. A better response would've been to disable entry to Ilum at all shortly after the exploit was discovered and leave it closed until after the patch that happened the following day. In that kind of situation they could've even done a minor rollback without affecting much. The way they handled it was leaving high population servers available for entire factions to basically farm up to Battlemaster in a matter of hours.

I'm pretty happy with the blog update they posted as well as the one about ability delay and I hope in the future they better design these kinds of pvp zones.

It's kind of telling that they aren't able to do those kinds of things, and they don't even have the tools available for proper item restoration as an example. You know, features that allow mobility and high level GM functions?
 
I can understand punishing spawncampers but at the same time, if they banned everyone who did it they'd ban 90% of the empire population

The amount of players who actually pvp is generally only a small portion of MMO audiences. And really doubt 90% of empire players went to Illum to exploit valor that day.
 

mcfrank

Member
Why would you say "whiners"? A lot of complaints about this game I feel are justified, though the whole ilum situation is more like shooting yourself in the foot on bioware's side though.


I say whiners because a bug was released in the game that Bioware investigated, commented on, and fixed within 24 hours. But from the vitriol that was being spewed by some on this forum you would have thought Bioware committed puppy genocide. People seem to be looking for any reason to hate on this game (see all the fake Bioware banned me posts on the official forum) and it gets on my nerves. Obviously there have been flaws, which are worth pointing out and commenting on, but that is not what happened. Instead there was page after page of "OMG I AM UNSUBBING" and "WHY ARE THEY TAKING SO LONG TO FIX THIS!!!!111!!"

Wednesday, this place was barely better than the official forums.
 

Tess3ract

Banned
The amount of players who actually pvp is generally only a small portion of MMO audiences. And really doubt 90% of empire players went to Illum to exploit valor that day.
Quite a few empire were on ilum (around 400+ on my server yesterday and the day before) including some lowbies hanging out with the 50s on both republic and empire sides leeching valor
 

frequency

Member
Server group forums are now up. http://www.swtor.com/community/forumdisplay.php?f=318

Designed by the same person who designed the GTN filters.

:-\
This is going to sound cynical and negative and hateful but...

I have a feeling they split the server forums like this because they don't want the give off the impression that some servers are extremely low population. Back when I was restarting WoW to try out WotLK, the first thing I did was look to find active server forums for the best chance at an active community. Dead forum usually means extremely low population or a lack of community.

It seems SWTOR really opened with way too many servers.
 

Varna

Member
Lvl 38 with 5 days 1 hour played.

This is were I am. Leveling up Agent to about 35 right now and I don't think it will take even half the time.

Holy shit those forums are terrible. :/

It already looks like the PVP servers are really low population. They should definitely merge some of them up... but they won't.
 
This fucking random flickering is driving me UP A WALL.

They said they're looking into it, I'm hoping we'll see a fix in what I would assume will be next week's minor patch during maintenance.

I say whiners because a bug was released in the game that Bioware investigated, commented on, and fixed within 24 hours. But from the vitriol that was being spewed by some on this forum you would have thought Bioware committed puppy genocide. People seem to be looking for any reason to hate on this game (see all the fake Bioware banned me posts on the official forum) and it gets on my nerves. Obviously there have been flaws, which are worth pointing out and commenting on, but that is not what happened. Instead there was page after page of "OMG I AM UNSUBBING" and "WHY ARE THEY TAKING SO LONG TO FIX THIS!!!!111!!"

Wednesday, this place was barely better than the official forums.

Eh I dunno about that, while some people are overtly negative or exaggerate the issues sometimes imo, at least 90% of the posts in this thread are readable and alot are about valid criticisms or concerns. The official forums are horrible. Without a proper news site I end up there once or twice a day, and it's a war on my brain. Theres a post over there right now saying they shouldn't punish the Ilum valor people because they were just "dogs digging holes." I mean seriously.

That being said, I've definitely seen what seems to be almost a weird internet smear campaign for this game from some people. It really does feel like these people get there jollies by making up various things(remember the dance zone email) and it's kind of sad. Thankfully that seems to originate more on the cess pool they call the official forums more so then here. As a matter of fact, I can't really remember much of that here outside of people just posting what they found and most shooting it down.
 

StudioTan

Hold on, friend! I'd love to share with you some swell news about the Windows 8 Metro UI! Wait, where are you going?
I don't know, I was the last one to hit 50 out of all my friends. I pre-ordered so in terms of playtime it's been a month for me.

So you're using your friends has a frame of reference. Since you were the last you feel like you level slow. For me hitting cap in a month is very fast leveling, but then I'm old school.

I'm at around 110 hours played on my main and I'm level 37. That's 25 hours a week I've played, which is a LOT in my opinion.
 

falastini

Member

It's good they're addressing it, but it doesn't sound like they're fixing the whole issue. It seems they're fixing instant abilities not firing off properly, but it doesn't say anything about the lag. It's easy to test by summoning your mount. If you move as soon as your cast bar is complete, the effect cancels, because your speeder hasn't finished materializing. That has nothing to do with "frantic combat situations" and it's not an instant ability.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azzv3DTQgyQ

You have to wait a half-second for the speeder to finish loading before the game acknowledges it.

This wasn't that apparent on my Bounty Hunter, until I got Tracer Missile, because up to that point, I was mostly using instant abilities. It seems the game puts a priority on animations completing, before allowing the next ability to go off (even if it is available). It was noticable, when I tried out a Juggernaut and Scoundrel. Because of the nature of their animations, I found my abilities routinely not activating because the game was still waiting for the previous animation to finish. It made the game feel sluggish. It seems like a game design choice, rather then a bug.
 

frequency

Member
It's good they're addressing it, but it doesn't sound like they're fixing the whole issue. It seems they're fixing instant abilities not firing off properly, but it doesn't say anything about the lag. It's easy to test by summoning your mount. If you move as soon as your cast bar is complete, the effect cancels, because your speeder hasn't finished materializing. That has nothing to do with "frantic combat situations" and it's not an instant ability.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=azzv3DTQgyQ

You have to wait a half-second for the speeder to finish loading before the game acknowledges it.

This wasn't that apparent on my Bounty Hunter, until I got Tracer Missile, because up to that point, I was mostly using instant abilities. It seems the game puts a priority on animations completing, before allowing the next ability to go off (even if it is available). It was noticable, when I tried out a Juggernaut and Scoundrel. Because of the nature of their animations, I found my abilities routinely not activating because the game was still waiting for the previous animation to finish. It made the game feel sluggish. It seems like a game design choice, rather then a bug.

I do that all the time. Heh... No patience I guess. So I get punished by having to wait for it to cast a second time.
Worst part is I'm too dumb to learn my lesson so I always take like 3 seconds wondering what just happened before it clicks.

I don't really notice it in actual fighting with my gunslinger though.
 

Tess3ract

Banned
This wasn't that apparent on my Bounty Hunter, until I got Tracer Missile, because up to that point, I was mostly using instant abilities. It seems the game puts a priority on animations completing, before allowing the next ability to go off (even if it is available). It was noticable, when I tried out a Juggernaut and Scoundrel. Because of the nature of their animations, I found my abilities routinely not activating because the game was still waiting for the previous animation to finish. It made the game feel sluggish. It seems like a game design choice, rather then a bug.
Yes, because by prioritizing the animations over the gcd it prevents a less "janky" animation and makes the movements more fluid. The thing is, on raids/pvp/hardmodes, no one is paying attention to their character and how good they look doing something. It's a hindrance to competition, and wont affect those playing casually too much.
 

Carm

Member
My free month expires on the 24th, and I simply don't know if I should stick to it, or not? On one hand, this is the biggest lore-wise sci-fi MMO, nothing else compares. On the other hand, many things are a step backwards to everything in the genre. PvP is a mess, Crafting except Biochem is broken, HM Flashpoints are overtuned, UI is terrible, High graphics are not in, etc.

Someone sell me on Rift. What does it have that WoW doesn't?

I lasted 20 days into my free month at Rifts release, before canceling the account. The public quests, er, Rift spawns, get old very quick by the second zone. Story/quests seemed to be based on WoW vanilla before the revamp, so kinda bad. Plus it's built on the shitty gamebryo engine, which of course, I always have stuttering issues with.


So yea, Rift isn't worth the time or money investment imo.
 

Sent

Member
I say whiners because a bug was released in the game that Bioware investigated, commented on, and fixed within 24 hours.

Part of it is that they say it was a bug, but long before 1.1 the turrets have never one shot anyone so I have a hard time taking that at face value. Ilum as a whole didn't seem to be properly thought out. I don't read the official forums at all, but the hotfix doesn't actually do anything about faction imbalance which we knew was going to be a problem since beta.

People do have legit gripes amongst the rabble and this thread to me seems to wave a lot of them off. I don't know when the thread got like this but whatever.
 

LAUGHTREY

Modesty becomes a woman
Part of it is that they say it was a bug, but long before 1.1 the turrets have never one shot anyone so I have a hard time taking that at face value. Ilum as a whole didn't seem to be properly thought out. I don't read the official forums at all, but the hotfix doesn't actually do anything about faction imbalance which we knew was going to be a problem since beta.

People do have legit gripes amongst the rabble and this thread to me seems to wave a lot of them off. I don't know when the thread got like this but whatever.

It's common sense at this point when you play a game, especially an MMO, for the first month or two you're glorified beta testers.

How are they supposed to fix faction imbalance anyway? Limiting the instances to even up the matches punishes the Empire players, incentivising people to play the Republic will sway it too far in the other direction. The population will even out eventually, like it always does.
 

Sokantish

Member
It's common sense at this point when you play a game, especially an MMO, for the first month or two you're glorified beta testers.

How are they supposed to fix faction imbalance anyway? Limiting the instances to even up the matches punishes the Empire players, incentivising people to play the Republic will sway it too far in the other direction. The population will even out eventually, like it always does.

It's common sense so you're just suppose to accept it? Some of this stuff was easily apparent in the Beta. Seems like they just wanted to rush the game out.

Also population doesn't always even out eventually. I don't know where you get that... They should have just added a queue to the zone, it punishes Empire because they have to wait, but it punishes Republic way more by not even being able to participate in the zone because you instantly die when you landed...
 

LAUGHTREY

Modesty becomes a woman
It's common sense so you're just suppose to accept it? Some of this stuff was easily apparent in the Beta. Seems like they just wanted to rush the game out.

Also population doesn't always even out eventually. I don't know where you get that... They should have just added a queue to the zone, it punishes Empire because they have to wait, but it punishes Republic way more by not even being able to participate in the zone because you instantly die when you landed...


Games in this size cannot exist without the first month being a beta. You can also accept something without liking it.

If these problems are still in the game 5-6 months out then that's a huge problem and I'll probably stop playing. Bugs and getting their legs after 29 days is to be expected in this day and age. Games are much more complex beasts than they have been.

That's also a non-solution to the faction imbalance problem. The players will do it themselves. I don't have like a source or anything but I always looked at the WoW faction pop, it eventually evened out after the Horde dominated for a long time. Imperials won't have fun roflstomping Republics and playing nothing but Huttball all day. If they release a program to switch factions it'll help too.
 
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