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//: StarCraft II: Heart of the Swarm |OT| Like Riding a Bike

A

AppleSmack

Banned
Oh my god. I need someone to play TvT against me. Gold-Platinum preferred. I'm so bad I can't win to save my life. I lose against people half my APM. I seem to have no understanding of positioning and absolutely no patience. I also easily crumble under pressure. I have been reduced to constantly doing unranked games and leaving every game that isn't a TvT cause I really need to practice that matchup so bad. Left the last 11 unranked games instantly cause they weren't TvT :(

EDIT: Nvm I think I found my answer -- > http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=410203
 
C

Corran Horn

May the Schwartz be with you
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Happiness is good.
 
C

Corran Horn

May the Schwartz be with you
SamuraiX- said:
Welcome back, Corran. :)

FUCK DA SONICZ


On a more on-topic note, fun games in WCS America Group F. :D
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Its been a long 5 years. I honestly barely even watched any games last 2 years as I was for sure thinking they were gone and gave up. This new arena needs to be built now...I wanna go :eek:


I cant watch WCS...artosis is streaming :eek:
 
S

sixghost

Member
What do you guys think about roach/hydra in ZvT? I don't really think I'll ever have the mechanics necessary to play mutaling bane in masters, so I've been thinking about learning a slower timing based style.
 
F

FluxWaveZ

Member
sixghost said:
What do you guys think about roach/hydra in ZvT? I don't really think I'll ever have the mechanics necessary to play mutaling bane in masters, so I've been thinking about learning a slower timing based style.
Click to expand...

Pretty bad composition unless they're going mech. Even then, not all that great if there are a bunch of tanks to defend them; gotta get vipers out and/or swarm hosts.

In my experience, anyways. You really either gotta get infestors out or mutas out in ZvT vs. bio to do well.
 
K

Ketch

Member
sixghost said:
What do you guys think about roach/hydra in ZvT? I don't really think I'll ever have the mechanics necessary to play mutaling bane in masters, so I've been thinking about learning a slower timing based style.
Click to expand...

Doesn't work in gold that's for sure. I'm gonna start using my ZvZ build for ZvT aswell. Every terran I face is going bio/tank... and I don't really know what to do vs tanks besides muta's I guess..

Also, I'm tied in points for 8th place in my division... season ends tonight at midnight, should I play and try to move up to lock in the top 8? but if loose I'll be out of the top 8, and that would suck =(

ladder%20rank.png
 
K

Ketch

Member
Ketch said:
Also, I'm tied in points for 8th place in my division... season ends tonight at midnight, should I play and try to move up to lock in the top 8? but if loose I'll be out of the top 8, and that would suck =(

Ok I got up to 6th place, hopefully that'll keep me until tomorrow. Gotta get them achievements. Next season I'm gonna go for a plat promotion.
Click to expand...
 
T

thepotatoman

Unconfirmed Member
Ketch said:
Doesn't work in gold that's for sure. I'm gonna start using my ZvZ build for ZvT aswell. Every terran I face is going bio/tank... and I don't really know what to do vs tanks besides muta's I guess..
Click to expand...

You'd need swarm hosts or vipers, or just scout for them to unsiege and attack before they siege up again. Vipers are the surest bet, as long as you can make it that far up the tech tree, but with super cheap and quick zerglings at your disposal and the fact that lower leagues rarely try to clear out scouts, it shouldn't be too hard to throw some zerglings around the map to find out when he's moving out, and just a-move everything you got into him right before he gets into position.

Honestly there's almost never a good reason to go tanks over mines tvz anymore for pretty much any league. Mines don't slow your army at all, they don't do near as bad if your army gets caught out of position, they force detection, they rebuild quicker, and their only super hard counter is ultras (which is one tech tier later than tank's hard counter of vipers).

The only time tanks are better are during early game rushes, where you don't quite have enough units to stop them from easily throwing a unit or two into the mine to set them off. But there's almost never enough time to switch into tank after spotting precisely that sort of rush, and if you blindly go one or two tanks, and they don't rush, you're just as behind as a protoss who went 2 cannons for no reason at all. And it's not like mines are terrible at early game defense anyway.

Tanks TvT and TvP aren't as bad without viper, but all those other reasons make mines a pretty darn good choice over tanks.
 
K

Ketch

Member
thepotatoman said:
You'd need swarm hosts or vipers, or just scout for them to unsiege and attack before they siege up again. Vipers are the surest bet, as long as you can make it that far up the tech tree, but with super cheap and quick zerglings at your disposal and the fact that lower leagues rarely try to clear out scouts, it shouldn't be too hard to throw some zerglings around the map to find out when he's moving out, and just a-move everything you got into him right before he gets into position.

Honestly there's almost never a good reason to go tanks over mines tvz anymore for pretty much any league. Mines don't slow your army at all, they don't do near as bad if your army gets caught out of position, they force detection, they rebuild quicker, and their only super hard counter is ultras (which is one tech tier later than tank's hard counter of vipers).

The only time tanks are better are during early game rushes, where you don't quite have enough units to stop them from easily throwing a unit or two into the mine to set them off. But there's almost never enough time to switch into tank after spotting precisely that sort of rush, and if you blindly go one or two tanks, and they don't rush, you're just as behind as a protoss who went 2 cannons for no reason at all. And it's not like mines are terrible at early game defense anyway.

Tanks TvT and TvP aren't as bad without viper, but all those other reasons make mines a pretty darn good choice over tanks.
Click to expand...

So do you yoink with the vipers? or just use cloud on the tanks?
 
C

Crimsonlink

Member
thepotatoman said:
You'd need swarm hosts or vipers, or just scout for them to unsiege and attack before they siege up again. Vipers are the surest bet, as long as you can make it that far up the tech tree, but with super cheap and quick zerglings at your disposal and the fact that lower leagues rarely try to clear out scouts, it shouldn't be too hard to throw some zerglings around the map to find out when he's moving out, and just a-move everything you got into him right before he gets into position.

Honestly there's almost never a good reason to go tanks over mines tvz anymore for pretty much any league. Mines don't slow your army at all, they don't do near as bad if your army gets caught out of position, they force detection, they rebuild quicker, and their only super hard counter is ultras (which is one tech tier later than tank's hard counter of vipers).

The only time tanks are better are during early game rushes, where you don't quite have enough units to stop them from easily throwing a unit or two into the mine to set them off. But there's almost never enough time to switch into tank after spotting precisely that sort of rush, and if you blindly go one or two tanks, and they don't rush, you're just as behind as a protoss who went 2 cannons for no reason at all. And it's not like mines are terrible at early game defense anyway.

Tanks TvT and TvP aren't as bad without viper, but all those other reasons make mines a pretty darn good choice over tanks.
Click to expand...

Too luck based for my taste.

I have better luck vs Z with tanks now that Zergs are being more aggressive with Banelings and busts along with early roaches.

Some are good and they are pretty cheap but it depends on which unit it attacks. If the Mine hits the front of the pack or just 1 ling its worthless for the next 40 secs.

If it hits the middle though, then its a money shot.
 
W

Wunder

Member
Roach/Hydra works quite well vs a mine composition. Against tanks it hurts quite a bit and against pure bio you can get mega dropped if you have bad multitasking/splitting. But I'd say it's a fair bit easier to manage than ling/bling/muta.
 
A

Aylinato

Member
Wunder said:
Roach/Hydra works quite well vs a mine composition. Against tanks it hurts quite a bit and against pure bio you can get mega dropped if you have bad multitasking/splitting. But I'd say it's a fair bit easier to manage than ling/bling/muta.
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I like going lings. Into speedlings. Into 5 bases. Into ultralisks and corruptors and cracklings.
 
K

Ketch

Member
Aylinato said:
I like going lings. Into speedlings. Into 5 bases. Into ultralisks and corruptors and cracklings.
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Yea this is what I (try to) do, but I put a few muta's in there with no upgrades, just to try and harass, snipe tanks, get them to spend some money on turrets... I don't really have a good plan for them. I guess I'll try vipers next time, then I waste time and resources on a spire and mutas... how much does a viper cost? more or less thena muta? how many do you think I'd need with a ling/bling into ultra build? Like 4 - 6? Just go in and drop a bunch of cloud and then A-move my ground army on top of them.... Does the cloud work on turrets? what about widow mines?

I'm really nervous about using caster units in my army... I feel like they cost way to much and I just suicide them too easily.

edit: I think if (more like when!) I get promoted to plat, I'll reward myself by upgrading to the digital deluxe addition for the sweet ultra skin... Anyone know if the other bonuses (wow pet, d3 skin) are codes that I can sell off? Or are they like automatically tied to my account?
 
D

Deadman

Member
haha wow, looks like idra has got demuslim removed from inside the game. demuslim "i dont think ill be on the show anymore" and not saying much more. this is after they had their disagreements last week and last weeks itg was then cancelled.
 
K

Ketch

Member
Deadman said:
haha wow, looks like idra has got demuslim removed from inside the game. demuslim "i dont think ill be on the show anymore" and not saying much more. this is after they had their disagreements last week and last weeks itg was then cancelled.
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I don't understand how Idra thinks he's so good if never fricken wins.
 
K

Ketch

Member
Well I just got fucking stomped.
get%20stomped.png
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I was #6 in my division... now I'm #20, last loss was to a bronze. =(

Shitty night.

The worst part is I have no idea what the fuck happened... I was doing the same builds I always do, but just getting stomped so hard in just sheer numbers... even when I was up on bases, still getting shear crushed in numbers, it felt like no matter what I did somehow they all had more units then me. I was just getting completely shut down. I had a nydus fucking spotted like instantly, Had one guy call a pre-emptive GG on me =( (so then I built a shit ton of hatches and went AFK, then he PM'd me to LOL). I like delayed this terrans natural for a good minute, and then busted his front with ling/bling, AND STILL he had more marines then I did. FUCK.

I guess I'm just gonna dump the replays here.... I haven't looked at any of them yet. Seriously though, like FUUUUUUUUUUUCCK.

Anybody else experience this shitocalypse? Am I really that bad? to be loosing to bronzes?

Edit: Got placed back into silver for the new season =(
 
A

AdventureRacing

Member
f0rk said:
He was mass at hell bat drops or something and demuslim told his stream if he got like 10k viewers or something he would snipe idra and do it to him. Then demuslim said some stuff about idra doesn't like or respect him
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It has been crazy watching his viewer count rise. He used to get somewhere around 3-4K but over the past few weeks he has slowly went up to getting consistently 10K+. Meanwhile Idras stream numbers have dropped by an insane amount. So even in terms of popularity Demuslim is way ahead.

Ketch said:
If I just keep playing I'm gonna get better right?
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Definitely but your focus should be more on just having fun anyway. As always i suggest posting some replays, maybe someone can help you work out where you went wrong. Don't get discouraged, just gotta keep on trying.
 
Z

Zen

Banned
AdventureRacing said:
It has been crazy watching his viewer count rise. He used to get somewhere around 3-4K but over the past few weeks he has slowly went up to getting consistently 10K+. Meanwhile Idras stream numbers have dropped by an insane amount. So even in terms of popularity Demuslim is way ahead.
Click to expand...

Yeah, the never ending no results, poor Reddit publicity, and lack of being engaging/charming on stream have been taking their toll.
 
A

Aylinato

Member
Zen said:
Yeah, the never ending no results, poor Reddit publicity, and lack of being engaging/charming on stream have been taking their toll.
Click to expand...
And idra really doesn't alter his builds at all. His micro was really good this last summer but he must have stopped caring about that.

He just wants to mass roaches all day everyday.
 
M

Mairu

Member
Not sure if anyone was following the lead up to the ladder reset last night in regards to Shoutcraft America. It's pretty cool how the tournament really gave motivation to players to ladder seriously and how dedicated some of them were for making it into the top 16. It also was amusing to see Idra give up earlier than a lot of other American players long before the reset. It's kind of sad how he can't even compete on a regional level.

Top 16 invited for Shoutcraft America: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ap5lSBTuqANidDBFYXFwZVBvRmJwTjQ1VlhsMmtvd0E#gid=0

Even though the level of play will be a lot lower than what we're used to from something like GSL I'll be watching. I hope it proves to be successful for TB and Genna so they end up running it again.


Oh, and even though I had the beta for StarCraft II and I've been rigorously watching games since shortly after release, I never actually got into playing 1v1. I actually bought the game because I enjoyed the single player in SC/BW :O

That is, up until a couple weeks ago when after boredom+lots of pestering by an ex-wow friend to play that I started playing random team games with him + some 1vs AI. So, something like 1000+ days after Wings of Liberty's launch, I went through the five placement matches for 1v1 for the first time last night shortly before the ladder reset. Hooray!
 
A

AdventureRacing

Member
Mairu said:
Not sure if anyone was following the lead up to the ladder reset last night in regards to Shoutcraft America. It's pretty cool how the tournament really gave motivation to players to ladder seriously and how dedicated some of them were for making it into the top 16. It also was amusing to see Idra give up earlier than a lot of other American players long before the reset. It's kind of sad how he can't even compete on a regional level.

Top 16 invited for Shoutcraft America: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ap5lSBTuqANidDBFYXFwZVBvRmJwTjQ1VlhsMmtvd0E#gid=0

Even though the level of play will be a lot lower than what we're used to from something like GSL I'll be watching. I hope it proves to be successful for TB and Genna so they end up running it again.
Click to expand...

It won't be as high quality as the GSL but i find it more interesting than the WCS NA. It's a really great concept and the timing is perfect.
 
K

Ketch

Member
I think I'm done with "trying" to get better and I'm just gonna focus on playing as much as possible regardless of league or win/loss.

I can macro, and I can get the gist of strategies from watching pros. I just need to get better at playing the game. Like control groups and hot keys and camera movement and caster units.... So fuck it I'm just gonna crush it in silver and gold.

Gonna make my goal getting to 300 games played (currently at 107), and beating all of the SC1 in SC2 campaign stuff, and just forgt about divisions and ladder and bonus pool and all that.

And I want to make infestors.

Next 5 games I play I'm going roach infestor. (what upgrades do you get for infestors? (carapace and ranged attack I guess)
 
S

suko_32

Member
Ketch said:
Well I just got fucking stomped.

I was #6 in my division... now I'm #20, last loss was to a bronze. =(

Shitty night.

The worst part is I have no idea what the fuck happened... I was doing the same builds I always do, but just getting stomped so hard in just sheer numbers... even when I was up on bases, still getting shear crushed in numbers, it felt like no matter what I did somehow they all had more units then me. I was just getting completely shut down. I had a nydus fucking spotted like instantly, Had one guy call a pre-emptive GG on me =( (so then I built a shit ton of hatches and went AFK, then he PM'd me to LOL). I like delayed this terrans natural for a good minute, and then busted his front with ling/bling, AND STILL he had more marines then I did. FUCK.

I guess I'm just gonna dump the replays here.... I haven't looked at any of them yet. Seriously though, like FUUUUUUUUUUUCCK.

Anybody else experience this shitocalypse? Am I really that bad? to be loosing to bronzes?

Edit: Got placed back into silver for the new season =(
Click to expand...

Where are the replays!!! :-(

Also no, infestors to not benefit from attack upgrades.

Edit: Infested Marines no longer benefits from evo upgrades.
 
A

Aylinato

Member
Ketch said:
I think I'm done with "trying" to get better and I'm just gonna focus on playing as much as possible regardless of league or win/loss.

I can macro, and I can get the gist of strategies from watching pros. I just need to get better at playing the game. Like control groups and hot keys and camera movement and caster units.... So fuck it I'm just gonna crush it in silver and gold.

Gonna make my goal getting to 300 games played (currently at 107), and beating all of the SC1 in SC2 campaign stuff, and just forgt about divisions and ladder and bonus pool and all that.

And I want to make infestors.

Next 5 games I play I'm going roach infestor. (what upgrades do you get for infestors? (carapace and ranged attack I guess)
Click to expand...


Infested marines benefit from the range attack. However there are two upgrades from the infestation pit. One increases start energy(I find most useful) and the other allows then to take over a unit for a short duration. (There's an achievement for how many kills an neuraled unit gets.
 
M

Mystery

Member
Aylinato said:
Infested marines benefit from the range attack. However there are two upgrades from the infestation pit. One increases start energy(I find most useful) and the other allows then to take over a unit for a short duration. (There's an achievement for how many kills an neuraled unit gets.
Click to expand...

No, there was a nerf towards the end of WoL that eliminated upgrades from Infested Terrans.
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Wow DeMuslim :lol
 
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