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//: StarCraft II: Heart of the Swarm |OT| Like Riding a Bike

K

Ketch

Member
Played a couple ladder matches earlier, won a ZvZ vs some [BYU] player, got a whopping +28 points for it! felt good.

But then I had some bad ZvTs where I got tank rushed and stuff. One game I had a big group of 1/1 roaches vs his 1/0 marines and my roaches just got melted... absolutely melted. Ugh it was gross.

but I had decent creep spread in every game, and good macro for me.

This is kind of a silly question, but you know when you're contained and you're trying to build up some units to bust out.... how do you know when you have enough units? In both the games where I got contained, I kept building up just like ALMOST enough army... after you loosing 2 or 3 waves of almost big enough armies I was really really far behind. If I had just saved up everyone it would have been much better.
 
M

mbmonk

Member
I have a quick Protoss upgrade question. My understanding is as Protoss in PvT I want to upgrade armor first, and against Zerg I want to upgrade attack first. Correct?


Regardless, I am loving VoidRays in PvT ( Silver league ). They chew up Viking, Medivacs, Marauders, and Tanks. Extremely flexible. Also I am so glad oracles have detection capabilities. I would have been ruined by widow mines w/o it since I did not build a Robo.
 
C

Corran Horn

May the Schwartz be with you
mbmonk said:
I have a quick Protoss upgrade question. My understanding is as Protoss in PvT I want to upgrade armor first, and against Zerg I want to upgrade attack first. Correct?


Regardless, I am loving VoidRays in PvT ( Silver league ). They chew up Viking, Medivacs, Marauders, and Tanks. Extremely flexible. Also I am so glad oracles have detection capabilities. I would have been ruined by widow mines w/o it since I did not build a Robo.
Click to expand...

Generally yes, PvT you want armor first if they are going mostly bio (if pure mech then maybe attack first). But usually PvT I go double forge and get both upgrades at same time. If you can get your upgrades quickly, zealots (with charge is even better) will destroy terran with any either colossus or archons/HTs

Against zerg you want attack primarily early due to zealots can kill lings with one less attack (as long as they dont have +armor)
 
M

mbmonk

Member
Corran Horn said:
Generally yes, PvT you want armor first if they are going mostly bio (if pure mech then maybe attack first). But usually PvT I go double forge and get both upgrades at same time. If you can get your upgrades quickly, zealots (with charge is even better) will destroy terran with any either colossus or archons/HTs

Against zerg you want attack primarily early due to zealots can kill lings with one less attack (as long as they dont have +armor)
Click to expand...

Thank you very much. I forgot about the order changing against mech. Thank you for the explanation of the upgrade paths for both match ups. :)
 
P

pompidu

Member
fatty said:
It can help when working on your build (i.e. take an expansion at the 5:00 mark). Also helps to know when to expect a certain timing attack (i.e. cloaked banshees possible at ~ 8:00 or whatever the actual time is).
Click to expand...

xmShake said:
Game time is critical when scouting and reacting to enemy builds. For example, knowing proxy oracle comes around 5:20 means that you would start building your engineering bay around 4:45 and turrets immediately afterwards so you're prepared for it before it comes, greatly minimizing the damage dealt.

When your scouting, you can also look for things that are usually there by a certain time and that can tip you off greatly to what your opponent is doing. For instance, if a protoss player hasn't taken his natural by 5:20 in TvP he is almost certainly doing some sort of cheese.
Click to expand...
that makes sense.so much to learn with this game!
 
K

Ketch

Member
What's the quote about artosis and ncontrol about at the beginning of state of the game? Any one actually know what it says and where it comes from?
 
G

GC|Simon

Member
Finally! 4vs4 random Diamond =)
And yeah, I know, pros play just 1vs1. But I really enjoy playing with team mates. It's just a lot of fun. I'll probably try to achieve the same in 3vs3 next.
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Getting back to this sucker next week.

Excited.
 
S

StayDead

Member
Everyone of my TvZ's recently gets to like the 50 minute mark and thanks to ravens I somehow keep winning. Ultras are just too good for me to ever want to not turtle behind building walls and slow push to new expansion :p
 
S

StayDead

Member
So glad I just saw someone use mech in TvZ who isn't me and is at pro level. QXC had some bad tank positioning and not enough vikings/ravens to deal with the vipers but he held on for a damn lot longer than he would have with bio. Finally someone showing the strength of mech.
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Crimsonlink said:
TB's internet crashed multiple times. Delayed the tournament by over 3 hours.

Idra was a good caster.

Great series of games too.

Kane vs Qxc game 3 is SO GOOD!
Click to expand...
Thanks a lot Crimson!
 
P

pompidu

Member
Whats the best way to deal with mutalisks as a protoss. Just warp in stalkers or pheonix/void rays? I'm terrible at scouting but having mutalisks rushs happen often made me focus on being a better scouter.
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Idle workers icon is now visable?
 
K

Ketch

Member
pompidu said:
Whats the best way to deal with mutalisks as a protoss. Just warp in stalkers or pheonix/void rays? I'm terrible at scouting but having mutalisks rushs happen often made me focus on being a better scouter.
Click to expand...

Blink stalkers are okay, archons are better. Build cannons around your mineral lines
 
K

Ketch

Member
Do you guys think Sara Kerrigan is the long lost descendant of nancy Kerrigan and that's why she's all fucked up in the head?
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
Ketch said:
Do you guys think Sara Kerrigan is the long lost descendant of nancy Kerrigan and that's why she's all fucked up in the head?
Click to expand...
:lol
 
F

FluxWaveZ

Member
W1LpLrBl.jpg


I don't understand ZvP at all. Any Zerg players have any general tips for the MU? I started doing much better versus Terran since I've started playing the race, so I might just try out Protoss and see if that gives me a better understanding of how they work.
 
S

sixghost

Member
FluxWaveZ said:
W1LpLrBl.jpg


I don't understand ZvP at all. Any Zerg players have any general tips for the MU? I started doing much better versus Terran since I've started playing the race, so I might just try out Protoss and see if that gives me a better understanding of how they work.
Click to expand...

I was awful at the matchup until I started doing Blade's swarmhost hydra viper build. The entire matchup revolves around being able to kill P's huge push with 3-4 colossus around 15 minutes, at least on ladder. The basic idea of the build is: gasless 3 hatch, lair at 7:30, scout to make sure P isn't opening with gateway aggression, make hydra den and infestor pit when lair finishes, make 10 hydra to chase away the phoenix/void, start making swarmhost and take a 4th, then just start your hive at 12:30, and you'll 13 swarmhosts, lots of hydra and 3 or 4 vipers out and charged in time to pull the colossus and win the fight. It's actually pretty good against air heavy compositions too.

http://www.youtube.com/user/blade55555?feature=watch
Look for some of the ZvP tutorials on his youtube page.
 
F

FluxWaveZ

Member
sixghost said:
I was awful at the matchup until I started doing Blade's swarmhost hydra viper build. The entire matchup revolves around being able to kill P's huge push with 3-4 colossus around 15 minutes, at least on ladder. The basic idea of the build is: gasless 3 hatch, lair at 7:30, scout to make sure P isn't opening with gateway aggression, make hydra den and infestor pit when lair finishes, make 10 hydra to chase away the phoenix/void, start making swarmhost and take a 4th, then just start your hive at 12:30, and you'll 13 swarmhosts, lots of hydra and 3 or 4 vipers out and charged in time to pull the colossus and win the fight. It's actually pretty good against air heavy compositions too.

http://www.youtube.com/user/blade55555?feature=watch
Look for some of the ZvP tutorials on his youtube page.
Click to expand...

Thanks. I'm familiar with that build and I tried using it a bit during season 1 of HotS, but I never got a handle on it. I'll focus on getting used to it now (as well as Viper micro).
 
K

Ketch

Member
Still funny. Even if you're zerg.

LOL


Edit: Contemplating on this video has got me thinking that I should learn how to cheese.
 
S

suberzat

Member
im a terran player in bronze league(top 5) who wants to get to silver in 1v1. Can anyone give me tips on improving my skills or play some 1v1 with me.
Ill also play 1v1 for fun to.
 
D

darkiguana

Member
suberzat said:
im a terran player in bronze league(top 5) who wants to get to silver in 1v1. Can anyone give me tips on improving my skills or play some 1v1 with me.
Ill also play 1v1 for fun to.
Click to expand...

I watched Filtersc's videos on youtube. They have helped me a lot. I am still at gold, but I am a lot better than I was when HOTS came out.
 
C

Crimsonlink

Member
suberzat said:
im a terran player in bronze league(top 5) who wants to get to silver in 1v1. Can anyone give me tips on improving my skills or play some 1v1 with me.
Ill also play 1v1 for fun to.
Click to expand...

Just add the NeoGAF group and then add us to your friend list. Ask for help and most of us will help if available.
 
K

Ketch

Member
I'm also at gold.

You new guys should join the GAF scrub league too! we're all (basically just me and monk now) lower skilled who like to play practice matches against each other. JOIN US.

edit: Played 5 games tonight. Crushed some terrans. Feels good after loosing to the early tank rushes last time I played. This time I absolutely wiped some terrans out! =) Had one guy try to proxy rax me I guess... or maybe he was just trying to rush to the gold expo with a CC and two rax? It was really weird, but I shut it down, he turtled up, and then I just contained him with ling/bling/muta into ultra for the win.

The other terran I DESTROYED tried to turtle on two base and then sneak around me with a doom drop but I saw it coming and intercepted his medivacs with my mutas. Which was pretty much GG.

Not running into many protoss on the ladder lately =( I guess they haven't seen that JP cannon rush to 4 base mass cannon/void ray build.
 
Yoshichan

Yoshichan

And they made him a Lord of Cinder. Not for virtue, but for might. Such is a lord, I suppose. But here I ask. Do we have a sodding chance?
I don't even know any HotS-cheese as terran... Anyone?
 
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