Support NeoGAF

[Yoshichan]

Which map?

You need to leave 2 or 3 workers near your Rax as soon as you see the Gas and no Rax in your opponents base. Losing a couple of SCVs is fine since you have double MULE.

One of those 1v1 maps (it's a green, grass-filled map).

Well first of all don't lose that one marine. You want to grab some scv to guard the cliff edge with your one marine and zone until you have 2 marines. When you watched the replay it was just one rax or two? When did they go down? In general don't CC first tvt unless it's on a larger map.

It was two rax, proxied pretty much 3 seconds from my base (reaper speed).

Fuck it, what should I be doing in TvT if I'm not gonna go cc first then? I've done it since WoL :/...

 

[SamuraiX-]

This is the most depressing thread on GAF right now.

konfurmed

 

[Yoshichan]

This is the most depressing thread on GAF right now.

konfurmed

I know, that's why I'm not discussing anything pro SC2-related...

Spoiler

or MKP-related for that matter.

 

[Zen]

For what it's worth Woojin disbanding has nothing to do with the team and everything to do with the parent company being in serious trouble.

 

[Sibylus]

Don't worry gentlemen, FXO still has a Dota team!

 

[Yoshichan]

Virtual Ticket Blizzcon in-game goodies!

 

[Crimsonlink]

One of those 1v1 maps (it's a green, grass-filled map).

It was two rax, proxied pretty much 3 seconds from my base (reaper speed).

Fuck it, what should I be doing in TvT if I'm not gonna go cc first then? I've done it since WoL :/...

I think you are talking about Yuenso which is a 1v1 map bro.

1. You don't go 14CC first on a 1v1 map vs Terran is the first problem. That or you build the CC inside the base.

2.Send SCV as soon as your your Rax starts, maybe as soon as your CC starts because you need to be on the look out for proxies/reaper.

3. Don't be MKP and hope you can get away with your greed, especially if you are being cheesed by the Terran which you were.

The basic way to go is 1 gas Reaper expand into hellion harass right now in TvT.

That or 1 base cloaked Banshee then expand.

Of course the bread and butter opening is 1 Rax Expand into a macro game with either Mech or Bio depending on your preference.

 

[Yoshichan]

Thanks a lot Crimsonlink!

I wish I was MKP though

 

[Hazaro]

I'm glad FXO supported a team for so long. Sad to see them go.
The more non traditional sponsors that can come over and try to find value the better.

 

[Yoshichan]

Asshole Destiny streaming SC2. That's right, SC2.

http://www.twitch.tv/destiny

 

[Zen]

You guys need to watch his most recent video. He spends 5 hours talking to someone that posted nude pictures of their girlfriend on facebook because she played so character in League of Legends. He's basically a textbook sociopath and insane. It's great pseudo intellectual hour but also a little scary.

Also more doom and gloom!

EGTL house closed; Hwanni and trOt part ways with EG
https://twitter.com/SaintSnorlax/status/385319556845035520

 

[Yoshichan]

Dude thinks he's smart though, but he really is an asshole and that's all he is.

 

[Zen]

Disagree 100%, Destiny is far too inquisitive to be 'dumb'. He can still be an asshole, but I'd bet my house on his IQ testing above the norm. Even the way he formulates his sentences shows strong cognitive skills to be able to formulate his thoughts concisely in a way that is easily communicated. I still remember him schooling the old boys club of SCII on inside the game and DJwheat turned into a yelling slobbering infant. It was quite the spectacle. Not to say that simply being able to delineate concepts in a well spoken manner is the only measure of intelligence, but most people who are not smart simply aren't the people that also spend time investigating and retaining information on a broad scale to then apply to their personal beliefs for no other reason than to do so.

I'm not sure how long he will stream SCII, wasn't it tied to donating for that gameheart thing? Either-way it seems like he must be sticking with streaming SCII over that commitment.

Some people are saying his viewership is higher now that streaming League.

According to numbers on TL, Starcraft 2 viewership is also on a gradual decline. Less and less people watching pro player streams, less watching WCS.

Last I saw overall viewership is stable but independent streams are down in comparison.

 

[Corran Horn]

People that use to watch SC2 streamers now just watch LoL/Dota/Speedrunners etc instead. Shrug

 

[Zen]

Wow now we're on the point to threatening murder and stuff. This is so far down the rabbit hole. It makes it even crazier that he's a Brony.

 

[Yoshichan]

DTs if they get the speed buff
vs
Marines with stim

Is this what you want, Blizzard?

 

[Yoshichan]

Wow, that whole Destiny ended up... really fucked.

 

[Zen]

Episode 57, the EG frat-house and Wheats neck vein in full form. Meltdown starts around 1:25 but the whole thing with Destiny is really worth the listen and a great conversation about where we are (or aren't?) now in SCII. The conversation around Destiny's reddit post on why SCII is failing starts around 55:00.

http://www.twitch.tv/onemoregametv/b/336653494

Painuser was the only cognitive voice among the regulars.

 

[Boken]

You guys need to watch his most recent video. He spends 5 hours talking to someone that posted nude pictures of their girlfriend on facebook because she played so character in League of Legends. He's basically a textbook sociopath and insane. It's great pseudo intellectual hour but also a little scary.

what the fuck

 

[Yoshichan]

Episode 57, the EG frat-house and Wheats neck vein in full form. Meltdown starts around 1:25 but the whole thing with Destiny is really worth the listen and a great conversation about where we are (or aren't?) now in SCII.

http://www.twitch.tv/onemoregametv/b/336653494

Painuser was the only cognitive voice among the regulars.

Yup, classic moment. Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_BVpyueqXY

 

[Zen]

Yup, classic moment. Youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_BVpyueqXY

Incontrol saying: 'Thankyou for finally joining the conversation Painuser'- because Pain user finally 'agreed' on something, when Painuser spent the entire time on this topic trying to moderate the three hiuge egos in the room. XD

Man listening to Incontrols 'summation' is full fo so many logic jumps and strawmans and I can't even remember half of the conversation during this episode.

Reminds me of the pre 2013 era of douche lord Incontrol. I'm glad he's grown.

People that use to watch SC2 streamers now just watch LoL/Dota/Speedrunners etc instead. Shrug

Yeah, it use to be that the peak streamers would get 10-7k depending, now the big boys get 3.5-4.5k. Still decent numbers but nowhere near LoL/Dota

Which is kind of Destiny's point

http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/

Idra: "I think we know that we're just in a blip right now, the numbers will go back up and stay up when heart of the Swarm comes out."
Incontrol: "I think the numbers will stay up, and I think you know that Steven."
Stven: "Of course the numbers will go up a bit when in comes out but I think it won't be the rejuvination you're expecting, the numbers will go down to where they were before it released and keep declining" (which they did)
lol

 

[Yoshichan]

I still remember telling InControl that I loved it when he streamed SC2. The day after, he actually did that for a couple of hours, and he hadn't done that for ages!

 

[profit]

According to numbers on TL, Starcraft 2 viewership is also on a gradual decline. Less and less people watching pro player streams, less watching WCS.

There simply is too much SC2 to watch. If you want you can watch the game every day, be it a pro or tournament stream. I love SC2, but I got really burned out on all the streams, to the point I just dont want to watch them anymore.

I get way more hyped right now after a few weeks of no SC2, when I just watch my favorite players and when a big tournaments shows up.

 

[Aaron]

There simply is too much SC2 to watch. If you want you can watch the game every day, be it a pro or tournament stream. I love SC2, but I got really burned out on all the streams, to the point I just dont want to watch them anymore.

I get way more hyped right now after a few weeks of no SC2, when I just watch my favorite players and when a big tournaments shows up.

Yeah, I'm the same way. I still catch a good portion of Korea, but I miss more than half of the EU, and don't watch the AM at all.

 

[Yoshichan]

Why do protoss think they're nifty by going air and force hydra and then switching to colossus? It's WoL-old and even a 3 year old could come up with "brilliant" moves like these.

That one game, the turd won (he had 96 apm, I had 206 apm).

Next game, I get to play him and instead of gl hf, he says "mind over apm ". I put him on ignore and proceed on playing, demolishing him to the grounds after 30 minutes. I unignore him and... well, you can guess the rest.

Sooooooooo satisfying. Protoss scum.

 

[Yoshichan]

Anyone wanna play?

 

[Holden]

Anyone wanna play?

nobody plays sc2

i need some bisu stream in my blooooood

 

[AdventureRacing]

That show was embarrassing :/. Even worse is looking back and remembering all the people looking down on the FGC telling them how they had to follow SC2's model if they wanted to succeed. It's a shame that most of the people with any clout in the community were and are so shortsighted. It's pretty much why the complaints that were being made back then (not just by Destiny) STILL haven't been addressed. Some of which are so god damn simple.

Yeah, it use to be that the peak streamers would get 10-7k depending, now the big boys get 3.5-4.5k. Still decent numbers but nowhere near LoL/Dota

Personally i think WCS was the thing that killed the stream numbers (in fact basically since the start of WCS SC2 has been on a massive decline). After HOTS release we were seeing some pretty damn big stream numbers and they were actually rising right up until the WCS. People like Grubby and Demuslim were getting 10K+. Basically after WCS it felt like no one was able to hit those numbers anymore.

WCS saturated the market with a ton of samey content and strangled out everything else. A lot of what destiny was saying is true as well but i think the WCS format has had a huge negative impact.

I don't want to get too much into complaining as we have all been there before. It just feels like a waste of time even discussing solutions in the community because nothing ever changes.

 

[V_Arnold]

Destiny was horrible back then with his swearing and bullshit. I am glad that that style did not catch on and went mainstream on casters. Luckily.

Leave that bickering, salt and bullshit to FGC's, please. (Which I enjoy occasionally, but for totally different reasons. That is like an adrenaline shot, while SCII is like watching a good strategy game unfold. )

 

[Mr Swine]

I've been having a losing streak in 4v4. Protoss is so damn op thanks to all it's flying units, there is no way to win as Terran :/

 

[Zen]

Choya says team will continue, criticizes WCS system

Woo!

Personally i think WCS was the thing that killed the stream numbers (in fact basically since the start of WCS SC2 has been on a massive decline). After HOTS release we were seeing some pretty damn big stream numbers and they were actually rising right up until the WCS. People like Grubby and Demuslim were getting 10K+. Basically after WCS it felt like no one was able to hit those numbers anymore.

WCS saturated the market with a ton of samey content and strangled out everything else. A lot of what destiny was saying is true as well but i think the WCS format has had a huge negative impact.

I don't want to get too much into complaining as we have all been there before. It just feels like a waste of time even discussing solutions in the community because nothing ever changes.

Pretty much, and good point.

The new GomTV UI is awesome!

 

[SteveO409]

Incontrol saying: 'Thankyou for finally joining the conversation Painuser'- because Pain user finally 'agreed' on something, when Painuser spent the entire time on this topic trying to moderate the three hiuge egos in the room. XD

Man listening to Incontrols 'summation' is full fo so many logic jumps and strawmans and I can't even remember half of the conversation during this episode.

Reminds me of the pre 2013 era of douche lord Incontrol. I'm glad he's grown.



Yeah, it use to be that the peak streamers would get 10-7k depending, now the big boys get 3.5-4.5k. Still decent numbers but nowhere near LoL/Dota

Which is kind of Destiny's point

http://www.reddit.com/r/starcraft/comments/11m21k/starcraft_2_will_be_dead_before_legacy_of_the/

Idra: "I think we know that we're just in a blip right now, the numbers will go back up and stay up when heart of the Swarm comes out."
Incontrol: "I think the numbers will stay up, and I think you know that Steven."
Stven: "Of course the numbers will go up a bit when in comes out but I think it won't be the rejuvination you're expecting, the numbers will go down to where they were before it released and keep declining" (which they did)
lol

I can't believe its been a year since that Destiny post and reflect the current situation of the game. WCS was a band aid but not sure if it really was one for the scene

 

[StayDead]

Choya says team will continue, criticizes WCS system

Woo!



Pretty much, and good point.

The new GomTV UI is awesome!

I really think that there's far much information on the GomTV UI. It was so much better in BW where you didn't really know the exact state of the game, it, along with the mechanics made it much more interesting.

 

[(._.)]

blizzard is awful at keeping this game popular. they have no idea what they're doing. it's not even the balance. it's the accessibility, marketing and how locked down it is. nothing about WCS makes sense. I've even stopped following the SCII pro scene. For the first year and a half, which was vital for success, they didn't even do anything. the only reason why this game hasn't dropped into obscurity, like quake, is because of it's name. It's running on korean pros, old fans from BW and the prestige that game's name has.

game should go F2P here and just copy what LoL is doing.

 

[Sibylus]

Still a casual watcher/player, and holy jeebus is WCS a nightmare. I have no idea what state the tournament is in on any given day, I mostly just fly by the seat of my pants and tune in for games with particular players. It's like the most packed day of the International's group stages, but it never stops. You've got major problems when the pace is such that you'd have to pay your viewership to suffer through it.

Be it balance or the pro scene, I just get the impression Blizzard are way too bloated to turn their ship quickly. They can only plan and react in the most sweeping of manners, and even then only after maddening spans of time. Pick your metaphor: the beast is too big. There are too many cooks in the kitchen.

 

[Mr Swine]

blizzard is awful at keeping this game popular. they have no idea what they're doing. it's not even the balance. it's the accessibility, marketing and how locked down it is. nothing about WCS makes sense. I've even stopped following the SCII pro scene. For the first year and a half, which was vital for success, they didn't even do anything. the only reason why this game hasn't dropped into obscurity, like quake, is because of it's name. It's running on korean pros, old fans from BW and the prestige that game's name has.

game should go F2P here and just copy what LoL is doing.

He'll no, Starcraft should never go F2P, where am I going to get the awesome single player campaign then? I don't want them to do a C&C Generals 2 that is F2P without a freaking single player campaign

 

[(._.)]

He'll no, Starcraft should never go F2P, where am I going to get the awesome single player campaign then? I don't want them to do a C&C Generals 2 that is F2P without a freaking single player campaign

Buy it as DLC? Make it separate from the multiplayer? Make retail copies of just the single player for people like you that don't have interest in seeing the multiplayer succeed?

 

[(._.)]

I've also hate how removed the multiplayer community is from the actual game itself. It's so dumb that you have to essentially delve into message boards and blogs to learn even the basics to advance as a player in SCII. Nothing in the game actually teaches you how to get better at the game. Nor does blizzard integrate some sort of fun social feature that really gives you an idea of what you have to do to get better. For such an intricate experience when actually in-game it does little to motivate, teach, and help you to improve outside. They've done pretty well at promoting tournaments through their UI but that's about it. Very little guidance on how to get better other than reading poorly written guides and message board posts. BW kids had their cafes and friends to learn from. We don't have that here. This game is a bunch of islands. Awful.

 

[SamuraiX-]

Challenger Season 3 not giving direct Premier Seeds?

There's no way Blizzard can be this inept.

I'm gonna be fucking pissed if this means no more Code A.

It might be a step in the right direction with regards to WCS though.

 

[ghst]

blizzard is awful at keeping this game popular. they have no idea what they're doing. it's not even the balance. it's the accessibility, marketing and how locked down it is. nothing about WCS makes sense. I've even stopped following the SCII pro scene. For the first year and a half, which was vital for success, they didn't even do anything. the only reason why this game hasn't dropped into obscurity, like quake, is because of it's name. It's running on korean pros, old fans from BW and the prestige that game's name has.

game should go F2P here and just copy what LoL is doing.

blizzard looked at their esport which was bleeding players while having a hard time competing with F2P games to attract new ones, and added $50 to the price of entry.

 

[SamuraiX-]

blizzard looked at their esport which was bleeding players while having a hard time competing with F2P games to attract new ones, and added $50 to the price of entry.

Wait is that referring to HotS?

 

[(._.)]

WoL was like $60 up until a few months before HotS too which is hilarious

 

[Aaron]

I really liked GOM's schedule before WCS. You got games almost every night, and knew when it would be Code A, S, or GSTL. Also Code A felt like it mattered for something. Now yesterday there was both A and S, while tonight it's GSTL. I have no idea what for the rest of the week, or have a strong sense of how things are shaping up.

 

[Boken]

multiplayer seriously should've been F2P.

blizzard really dropped the ball on this so hard

 

[Crimsonlink]

I really liked GOM's schedule before WCS. You got games almost every night, and knew when it would be Code A, S, or GSTL. Also Code A felt like it mattered for something. Now yesterday there was both A and S, while tonight it's GSTL. I have no idea what for the rest of the week, or have a strong sense of how things are shaping up.

I dislike how WCS has made Code S and stuff kinda meaningless. I mean they call it Premier league in all 3 regions now. Not being able to see the matches in Code A also sucks ass.

 

[Aaron]

multiplayer seriously should've been F2P.

blizzard really dropped the ball on this so hard

I agree. They could have charged for skins or something. Or made funny hats for the units. I didn't buy HotS because I don't play zerg at all, and wasn't going to lay out that much money for a few new units, no matter how good the widow mine is.

 

[HolyCheck]

I dislike how WCS has made Code S and stuff kinda meaningless. I mean they call it Premier league in all 3 regions now. Not being able to see the matches in Code A also sucks ass.

I still try to keep on top of it all, and yes it's now just confusing, i spend half my time working out who's running what tournament and what it's old equivalent is (code A, code S, osl) before caring about it.. gah.

now FXO going

 

[Zen]

Test map is now up. I want to see what these changes would really mean.

Protoss

Oracle
Movement speed increased from 3.375 to 4.0
Acceleration increased from 2 to 3
Revelation casting radius increased from 9 to 10


Terran

Armory
Vehicle and Ship Weapon upgrades have been combined into just one upgrade.

Siege Tank
Siege Mode attack period decreased from 3.0 to 2.7

Widow Mine
Sentinel Missiles splash radius decreased from 1.75 to 1.25


Zerg

Roach Warren
The Tunneling Claws upgrade now increases burrowed Roach movement speed from 1.41 to 2.25


"Bel’Shir Vestige LE (2.0.11 Balance v1.0)"

 

[Wolf Akela]

I just purchased both games on sale and playing through the campaign. My experience with the series so far is really light (beat 3-4 campaigns in SC1, a handful of 1v1 and customs in SC2). I'm playing through WoL campaign right now.

Is there a 1v1 guide completely tailored for beginners? I want to focus on Zerg but I need to study a beginner general guide first. The ones I find are just lists of articles with no inherent order like this. For example, if I was looking for a beginner's guide to LoL, it would first teach about the map layout, general champ archetypes, then map objectives and so on.

 

[Yoshichan]

GG.