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//: StarCraft II: Wings of Liberty |OT4| Everyone Else Would Beat Catspajamas

C

Corran Horn

May the Schwartz be with you
WedgeX said:
Dang it, I liked Arid.
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boo-man.gif
 
S

Striek

Member
Arid wasn't really given a fair chance. People wont accept maps that don't stick to a formula. Discourages new gameplay discovery.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
Striek said:
Arid wasn't really given a fair chance. People wont accept maps that don't stick to a formula. Discourages new gameplay discovery.
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what the fuck? there are some harsh, inescapable reality's to a map that requires three tumours to reach the natural with creep and grants multiple entrances with los blockers. [hellions are whores when you cant use your main queen for initial defense without giving up on multiple injects or committing to an instant third queen.

low ling or roachless hellion defense was stupid on the map.
 
S

Striek

Member
Case in point ^^ =)

You connect the main to natural on both spawns with two tumors Panda, I just tried. You can also block the ramp with a single queen (!). Not only that theres perfect spots for zergs to place overlords to grant vision behind the LOS blockers so if anything they're presence is neutral for zerg or even good. At least argue that the chokes are too small or something, jeez.

One player comes up with really minor, petty complaints which aren't true or aren't problems and the other never even gave it a shot he could just sniff out the imbalance a mile away.



Funnily enough, most of what I saw on TL was bitching from terrans and tosses about zerg on the map. No one gave it a chance.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
Striek said:
Case in point ^^ =)

You connect the main to natural on both spawns with two tumors Panda, I just tried. You can also block the ramp with a single queen (!). Not only that theres perfect spots for zergs to place overlords to grant vision behind the LOS blockers so if anything they're presence is neutral for zerg or even good. At least argue that the chokes are too small or something, jeez.

One player comes up with really minor, petty complaints which aren't true or aren't problems and the other never even gave it a shot he could just sniff out the imbalance a mile away.



Funnily enough, most of what I saw on TL was bitching from terrans and tosses about zerg on the map. No one gave it a chance.
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lol, you know nothing. i have no interest in entertaining this foolishness.
 
S

Striek

Member
Your arguments just got seriously shut down as grade A bullshit, good choice to discontinue.

Edit: IEM Sao Paulo day 3 is on now for anyone else thats been following this thoroughly unsurprising, rather weakly fielded IEM event.
 
P

Pandaman

Everything is moe to me
Striek said:
Your arguments just got seriously shut down as grade A bullshit, good choice to discontinue.
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you're an idiot talking about things you dont understand, its a waste of time. you act like blocking a ramp with one queen is super special awesome, but you can do that on most maps. you're just too dense to wonder why people don't do it or too ignorant to have known how common it is.

tell me more how LoS blockers are good for zergs, i love building 2 spines and being forced into limited ovie scouting and still getting my mining denied by 2 quick hellions.

lets hear more pearls of map commentary from a protoss who complains about tal'darim.
 
S

Striek

Member
Pandaman said:
you're an idiot talking about things you dont understand, its a waste of time. you act like blocking a ramp with one queen is super special awesome, but you can do that on most maps. you're just too dense to wonder why people don't do it or too ignorant to have known how common it is.
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The vast complicated interactions of early game ZvT are so complex o.o~~

You were wrong, you could've said oh I didn't realise, or I thought otherwise, but you doubled down. Oh well.

You were just complaining about having to make an extra queen because you whilst you were under wrong about how many creep tumours it took to connect the bases. You thought for some reason that would mean you couldn't use your main queen for defence due to that, which I showed to be wrong, so you can.

The queen block is used all the time (both 1 and 2 queens), and on Arid Plateau due to the way the ramp faces means hellions wont be able to take pot-shots at the queens without a spine hitting them, so please illuminate me as to why I'm dense and apparently the zergs I watch are just bad or something. Not that this has any bearing on your original - wrong - point mind you.

Pandaman said:
tell me more how LoS blockers are good for zergs, i love building 2 spines and being forced into limited ovie scouting and still getting my mining denied by 2 quick hellions.
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"Limited ovie scouting"... come on this just gets more and more inconsequential. Against terran your second ovie would be over your natural regardless until it finishes and you will have your third out and there well before any hellions could arrive should you choose to anyway. Even our poor little bronzies will see that for the reach it was.

Needing 2 spines? Oh no, thats just like that metalopolis map, the horror! The need for 2 spines isn't in any way shape or form affected by a LoS blocker btw, so again, really not related to your original argument.


Mountains from molehills. Now the mountains are getting bigger whilst the molehills shrink.
Pandaman said:
lets hear more pearls of map commentary from a protoss who complains about tal'darim.
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Corran?

I like Tal'Darim. In fact most of the stuff I used to not like I've come around on in the last month or two. I think thats perspective from playing random even if only at a shitty level or maybe just the realisation that even if SC2 is imbalanced in some way it doesn't matter because in the end I'm just a scrub player that loses on the back of his own mistakes like every other player who'll never be pro. I'm pretty happy with every ladder map except Shattered Temple tbh.

You've gotten pretty worked up with the insults, this argument isn't that important I'll remind you lol.
 
D

Deadman

Member
Theres like a patch and stuff

MULEs now harvest the same amount of minerals on both high yield minerals and normal minerals.
We’ve been looking into the effects that high yield expansions have on gameplay, in particular how the added efficiency of MULEs on these mineral patches can affect matchups. This is also a common piece of feedback we’ve received from both pro players and the community.

We’ve been closely monitoring several sources of information: GSL tournaments which feature maps that do not have high yield mineral patches at all, major tournaments that still use high yield expansions, and our own ladder maps data now that our 1v1 ladder features a tournament-like map pool.

Based on these observations, we’ve made the decision to keep MULE resource generation the same regardless of mineral type, while allowing high yield mineral patches to remain on our ladder maps. This change helps keep the risk vs. reward the same for all three races when acquiring expansions that feature high yield minerals.

Snipe damage changed from 45 to 25 +25 Psionic
We felt the Snipe ability was countering zerg broodlords and ultralisks slightly too well. Especially at the pro level, we were seeing a lot of games where terran players were playing very defensive games while massing ghosts to counter most of the options zerg players had at their disposal.

While we like to see creative and innovative use of units, we felt that in this case Snipe was becoming too effective against zerg’s most expensive units. When adjusting the ability, we tried to settle on a number that would allow using Snipe to remain a viable tactic, though not as powerful as it is now. With this change, brood lords will fall in ten casts of Snipe rather than six (taking into account health regeneration), while an ultralisk will die in 19 casts, up from 11. This also significantly increases the number of ghosts and stockpiled energy needed to pull this tactic off, which we feel confident about because, previously, terran players rarely needed to consider the energy on their ghosts units.

Phoenix now has a range upgrade at the Fleet Beacon
In the past, we’ve discussed whether protoss needed a more immediate change to give them additional ways of dealing with mutalisks in PvZ, or whether it was more appropriate to make changes to that matchup in Heart of the Swarm. After investigating, testing, and reviewing both community and pro feedback, we’ve decided to include a change in this patch.

The phoenix will now have 6 attack range after purchasing an upgrade, which should allow them to more easily deal with a large number of mutalisks. In the previous patch, when protoss players attempted to move their armies out across the map, their bases became extremely vulnerable. Existing options to cope with massed mutalisks were costly and not always effective. This range upgrade should help even the odds by giving protoss players the option to reactively build phoenixes in smaller numbers, and with some micro, allow them to more efficiently defend against mutalisk swarms. Upgraded phoenixes should also offer protoss players the potential for better map control in the PvZ match up.

Still, we also wanted to make sure that producing mutalisks in PvZ remains a viable strategy, and believe that it is. While it might not be a good idea to brute force a protoss opponent with a ton of mutalisks, pairing them with units such as infestors and/or corruptors will help counter the advantage the new range upgrade provides.

APM / CPM changes
There was a lot of concern and debate regarding whether APM should be an accurate number or it should be a fun, play style distinguishing factor like it has been traditionally. After hearing a lot of feedback from both sides, we decided to bring back classic APM, and change our current APM (that doesn’t count spam clicks) to be called Commands Per Minute, or CPM.

This way, pro players who want to show off how fast their hands move can do so, while at the same time players who really just want to know how accurate and efficient their actions are can look at CPM.
************

As always, we will continue to follow player discussions on our forums as well as fan sites and beyond, and we look forward to your constructive feedback regarding these changes. As with all balance-related changes, we've made these decisions with great care and consideration to ensure a great playing experience for players of all skill levels.
Click to expand...

http://us.battle.net/sc2/en/blog/4448820/Situation_Report_Patch_143-2_10_2012#blog


Snipe change pure sex, phoenix change pure joke.
 
K

Keikaku

Member
There was a lot of concern and debate regarding whether APM should be an accurate number or it should be a fun, play style distinguishing factor like it has been traditionally. After hearing a lot of feedback from both sides, we decided to bring back classic APM, and change our current APM (that doesn’t count spam clicks) to be called Commands Per Minute, or CPM.

This way, pro players who want to show off how fast their hands move can do so, while at the same time players who really just want to know how accurate and efficient their actions are can look at CPM.
Click to expand...
I'm putting this in the running for most passive-aggressively hilarious patch note ever.
 
S

Spl1nter

Member
The good: only 2 snipes now to kill an infestor
The bad: snipe now useless against all other units

Of course no one would do this but 2 snipes to kill a zergling lol
 
D

Deadman

Member
Idra said terran turtling with ghosts was imba last march, blizzard only see it now. Hopefully one day they see the error of their ways and give full control of the game to him.

Spl1nter said:
The good: only 2 snipes now to kill an infestor
The bad: snipe now useless against all other units

Of course no one would do this but 2 snipes to kill a zergling lol
Click to expand...


Yeah its strange how they chose to change the snipe damage vs ghosts, templar, infestors and queens rather than do 45 damage/25 to massive, which would only affect bl and ultra as they are only two biological massive units.
 
S

syllogism

Member
Corruptors will be pretty bad against range 6 phoenixes despite the stats as they are pretty immobile and can't shoot while moving.
 
Q

Q8D3vil

Member
Deadman said:
Idra said terran turtling with ghosts was imba last march, blizzard only see it now. Hopefully one day they see the error of their ways and give full control of the game to him.




Yeah its strange how they chose to change the snipe damage vs ghosts, templar, infestors and queens rather than do 45 damage/25 to massive, which would only affect bl and ultra as they are only two biological massive units.
Click to expand...
blizzard doesn't listen to bad players, they rather wait and see how it turns out.
but yeah, broodlord infestors are back to being unbeatable in zvt.

now both tvp and tvz will be broken late game.
 
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