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[dave is ok]

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-05-06-steams-turned-toxic-and-valve-doesnt-care

What a shitty article.

 

[Spirited]

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-05-06-steams-turned-toxic-and-valve-doesnt-care

Steam has it's fair share of problems but really?
Those quotes sounds like steam killed his mother lol

 

[Nzyme32]

I can't argue with a toxicity argument, because it's true, but how's that only steam or PC related problem? It's pretty much the gaming community problem at large, no?

Yeah, it's true for all gaming platforms. "Gamers" in general are toxic. On PC there is the additional issue of cheaters and the more open nature allowing for development of more of these kind of toxic communities - but at the same time it equally allows for the opposite to form, and there definitely are some great communities out there. Still, it's a problem a lot of the time.

 

[Jawmuncher]

I guess I was a bit too subtle.

Steam thread, blah blah blah.

I don't see any problem in discussing other PC games. It's an open platform not like anyone here doesn't have Acess these other clients on their computer. We talk about Origin, Windows App Store, and others. Like most things it'll Peter out after the beta. The beta is the full game in terms of features at launch.

 

[Mivey]

Steam has it's fair share of problems but really?
Those quotes sounds like steam killed his mother lol

You know, when Valve's reaction is to do fuck all about it, you gotta press the point. Imagine how fucked up GAF would be without any kind of moderation. I think at some point Valve will have to get a proper HR department for hiring moderators and customer relations people. There is no way about it, unless they perfect AI, while keeping the risk of an uprising reasonably low.

 

[Atraveller]

I guess I was a bit too subtle.

Steam thread, blah blah blah.

You're going to complain about PC game talk in this thread, really?

 

[dave is ok]

There's been like 100 posts about Persona 5 and that's not even coming to PC.

Ever.

 

[NingenJanai]

calm down guys, let's talk about anime instead.

 

[William Bonney]

You're going to complain about PC game talk in this thread, really?

Right?

The nitpicking on what games we can and can't talk about in this thread is kind of ridiculous.

 

[MulderYuffie]

There's been like 100 posts about Persona 5 and that's not even coming to PC.

Ever.

Maybe one day....

 

[derExperte]

At least Overwatch keeps certain posters from talking about MOBA trash for a few days.

Unfinished: Master of Orion And they're doing a live QL of Stellaris later today.

 

[freshVeggie]

It's the "Steam" thread by name alone. It is defacto the general purpose PC gaming thread unless you enjoy talking to yourself in the Uplay or Origin thread. Why the need to make a fuss about it.

Anyone else having trouble posting reviews? I wrote a fairly lengthy one of an indie, and when I say "post review" the button disappears with no feedback and the review does not post. Is there an error I'm missing? Tried disabling adblock and Enhanced Steam in case they're the culprits, but no dice.

I've had this issue and butchered a couple reviews until they got posted. Only afterwards I learned that it is a bug on Steam's end which can be easily circumvented.
You post a one-word review, go to your reviews tab, click edit and paste the actual, lengthy review. This solved my issues every time.
Mind you, Steam reviews do have a character limit, 8000 iirc.

got punched in the face earlier

that was fun

will bring knife tomorrow

Accidentally I hope.

Is it worth it yet?

I like it more than Win 8.1 and had no issues yet. It's also free, you can now do a regular clean install with no need for upgrade-installation and it is the only OS with official DX12 support. I don't see any worthy reason against going Win10..

 

[Spring-Loaded]

got punched in the face earlier

that was fun

will bring knife tomorrow

Accidentally I hope.

Star Fox: Zero co-op can sure be hectic, but it's rewarding.

 

[gelf]

I can't argue with a toxicity argument, because it's true, but how's that only steam or PC related problem? It's pretty much the gaming community problem at large, no?

I'd say the issue is more front and centre on Steam because of the higher community focus. If it draws the ire of the mob then any games storefront can get plastered by abusive reviewers and curators in a way you don't get on console stores where the toxic community is shunted elsewhere.

Now of course the greater community focus can be a good thing but if your going to give users that much power you should probably police them better.

 

[Lain]

Can Diablo 3 still not be played offline? I was gonna get it a while ago but bought it for PS4 for $15 instead because of the online thing.

Also what's really worth the extra $20 in the $60 copy of Overwatch?

You'll never be able to play D3 offline on PC. It sucks not being able to play it offline, but on the other hand you don't have to deal with the hacked items you end up dealing with on console.

The extra is only worth if you play other Blizzard's games. Otherwise grab the 40$.

 

[Pupo]

calm down guys, let's talk about anime instead.

Ok, your favorite animu is shit (?)

 

[Atraveller]

You'll never be able to play D3 offline on PC. It sucks not being able to play it offline, but on the other hand you don't have to deal with the hacked items you end up dealing with on console.

The extra is only worth if you play other Blizzard's games. Otherwise grab the 40$.

48 for the Origins Edition if you have Amazon Prime.

 

[Baron von Loathsome]

Ok, your favorite animu is shit (?)

This is true by default.

 

[Ban Puncher]

DID SOMEBODY SAY ANIME???

 

[Lain]

So y'all playing Overwatch together or with randoms?

I've been playing alone. No one of you Steam duders are friends with me on bnet!
Though, would one be able to play together with people in other regions? I guess not.

 

[derExperte]

I've been playing alone. No one of you Steam duders are friends with me on bnet!
Though, would one be able to play together with people in other regions? I guess not.

Well I'm in your region if Italy is still correct. derExperte#2628 And you can play cross-region, it's just a pain.

Tho I'm more about that Forza beta right now.

 

[Spirited]

If anyone would like to add me for some rounds of overwatch here's my BNet tag: Spirited#2391

 

[Phawx]

http://www.gamesindustry.biz/articles/2016-05-06-steams-turned-toxic-and-valve-doesnt-care

This article is garbage.

1.) Using the word toxic/toxicity is a catchall buzzword to describe "people whose opinions I don't like and that's harassment" If there is a brigade or an agenda to review-bomb something, the mother effing context of the reviews will let people looking at reviews know what kind of people they are. When the review bomb of Darksiders 2 Deathfinitive edition happened, it was because they had a promotion that screwed the early buyers and favored the late buyers.

Have any of you guys read bigoted reviews and thought, "this seems like a fair and balanced review"? I would bet money you haven't.

2.) The entire article is predicated on the assumption that the world looks at Steam through the lens of the author. Which is untrue, because I have reading comprehension skills.

3.) Steam/Valve should spend money to fix "toxic behavior" because 'my friends and I' are finding it to not be inclusive.

For real? Steam is the most inclusive digital distribution out of the big guys. I think they only block AO games and even then AO games can come in with censors and then have patches to "fix" that problem.

There are real problems with Steam which we all talk about on this forum. Valve doesn't need to spend money on fixing a problem which only requires people to read and understand is bullshit to go and make decisions themselves.

 

[Saty]

West Ham has signed an official esports player - making it the first team in the Premiership to do so.

Sean "Dragonn" Allen, 24, officially joined the Hammers today, when he was given the squad number of 50.

Allen, who regularly streams FIFA on Twitch, will make his West Ham-backed debut tomorrow at the Gfinity Arena in Fulham, where he will compete in this weekend's Play Like A Legend Grand Final.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...premiership-club-to-sign-its-own-esports-star

 

[Grief.exe]

This article is garbage.

1.) Using the word toxic/toxicity is a catchall buzzword to describe "people whose opinions I don't like and that's harassment" If there is a brigade or an agenda to review-bomb something, the mother effing context of the reviews will let people looking at reviews know what kind of people they are. When the review bomb of Darksiders 2 Deathfinitive edition happened, it was because they had a promotion that screwed the early buyers and favored the late buyers.

Have any of you guys read bigoted reviews and thought, "this seems like a fair and balanced review"? I would bet money you haven't.

2.) The entire article is predicated on the assumption that the world looks at Steam through the lens of the author. Which is untrue, because I have reading comprehension skills.

3.) Steam/Valve should spend money to fix "toxic behavior" because 'my friends and I' are finding it to not be inclusive.

For real? Steam is the most inclusive digital distribution out of the big guys. I think they only block AO games and even then AO games can come in with censors and then have patches to "fix" that problem.

There are real problems with Steam which we all talk about on this forum. Valve doesn't need to spend money on fixing a problem which only requires people to read and understand is bullshit to go and make decisions themselves.

I got the impression he was referring to the Steam Community threads, which are admittedly a cesspool. As other have said though, this is really indicative of a larger internet problem instead of one focussed squarely on Valve or even gaming in general.

The main problem with the article, and where this confusion stems from, is the author doesn't use evidence to support his arguments. He doesn't use evidence to show Valve and developers are losing money due to toxic environments, and he doesn't even show examples of the toxic environments.

 

[Lomax]

You know, when Valve's reaction is to do fuck all about it, you gotta press the point. Imagine how fucked up GAF would be without any kind of moderation. I think at some point Valve will have to get a proper HR department for hiring moderators and customer relations people. There is no way about it, unless they perfect AI, while keeping the risk of an uprising reasonably low.

I find it much more likely they'll just remove discussion forums than they'll pay for moderators. That's much more the app store model they seem to want to have.

 

[Backlogger]

The main problem with the article, and where this confusion stems from, is the author doesn't use evidence to support his arguments. He doesn't use evidence to show Valve and developers are losing money due to toxic environments, and he doesn't even show examples of the toxic environments.

This totally. And the part I bolded would have been interesting to see. Remove the emotion and hyperbole and write an interesting article that can help move the conversation forward.

 

[derExperte]

I find it much more likely they'll just remove discussion forums than they'll pay for moderators. That's much more the app store model they seem to want to have.

The devs can and should moderate the Steam forums of their games themselves. Some do and it works fine, others don't or do a bad job and it's a mess. And then there are games which for various reasons attract the scum of the internet and it's almost impossible to handle correctly but I'm not sure what Valve could do, as others have said the problem isn't PC gaming itself.

 

[gabbo]

This article is garbage.

1.) Using the word toxic/toxicity is a catchall buzzword to describe "people whose opinions I don't like and that's harassment" If there is a brigade or an agenda to review-bomb something, the mother effing context of the reviews will let people looking at reviews know what kind of people they are. When the review bomb of Darksiders 2 Deathfinitive edition happened, it was because they had a promotion that screwed the early buyers and favored the late buyers.

Have any of you guys read bigoted reviews and thought, "this seems like a fair and balanced review"? I would bet money you haven't.

2.) The entire article is predicated on the assumption that the world looks at Steam through the lens of the author. Which is untrue, because I have reading comprehension skills.

3.) Steam/Valve should spend money to fix "toxic behavior" because 'my friends and I' are finding it to not be inclusive.

For real? Steam is the most inclusive digital distribution out of the big guys. I think they only block AO games and even then AO games can come in with censors and then have patches to "fix" that problem.

There are real problems with Steam which we all talk about on this forum. Valve doesn't need to spend money on fixing a problem which only requires people to read and understand is bullshit to go and make decisions themselves.

While I would agree that Steam isn't exactly as the author describes it, and Valve should not be held accountable for the behaviour of the internet at large, to say that they couldn't moderate Steam better is overly forgiving of the garbage that goes on with reviews and the forums that don't even get into homophobia and sexism

 

[PepsimanVsJoe]

The main problem with the article, and where this confusion stems from, is the author doesn't use evidence to support his arguments. He doesn't use evidence to show Valve and developers are losing money due to toxic environments, and he doesn't even show examples of the toxic environments.

Thank you.
This is exactly what I was going to post.

 

[Jawmuncher]

This is all we know of the new Battlefield so far
Definitely looking like a alternate WW1 of sorts

 

[KingKong]

This is all we know of the new Battlefield so far
Definitely looking like a alternate WW1 of sorts

finally, the Battlefield moba I've always wanted

 

[Phawx]

I got the impression he was referring to the Steam Community threads, which are admittedly a cesspool. As other have said though, this is really indicative of a larger internet problem instead of one focussed squarely on Valve or even gaming in general.

The main problem with the article, and where this confusion stems from, is the author doesn't use evidence to support his arguments. He doesn't use evidence to show Valve and developers are losing money due to toxic environments, and he doesn't even show examples of the toxic environments.

Agreed. Was going to put this in my list but as I was writing just forgot to include it.

The devs can and should moderate the Steam forums of their games themselves. Some do and it works fine, others don't or do a bad job and it's a mess. And then there are games which for various reasons attract the scum of the internet and it's almost impossible to handle correctly but I'm not sure what Valve could do, as others have said the problem isn't PC gaming itself.

And this is the other portion, well put.

While I would agree that Steam isn't exactly as the author describes it, and Valve should not be held accountable for the behaviour of the internet at large, to say that they couldn't moderate Steam better is overly forgiving of the garbage that goes on with reviews and the forums that don't even get into homophobia and sexism

Outside of the bad-word-filter including other words or becoming more elaborate, what derExperte said above answers this.

I think Steam/Valve deserve to get criticism where it's due. The article is ambiguous, meandering, and ironically elitist.

Edit: to clarify, I didn't look at the article from a community forums on Steam as any angle as you aren't thrust into viewing anything from there unless you choose to go looking in there. The only "toxicity" that is put upon people are the reviews as when they click on the game, it's already on the page.

 

[AbundantChoice]

So after seeing Babymetal live in concert last night, I think i'm going to take a break from Overwatch, HotS and Tree of Savior for the weekend and play some anime-ass videogames.

other than Guilty Gear / BlazBlue, are there any "metal" anime videogames?

 

[shockdude]

The main problem with the article, and where this confusion stems from, is the author doesn't use evidence to support his arguments. He doesn't use evidence to show Valve and developers are losing money due to toxic environments, and he doesn't even show examples of the toxic environments.

I saw your quote before reading the article, and yeah you're totally right. If what he is writing is true, then the evidence should be everywhere - where is it?
Imo the storefront is fairly well separated from the toxicity of the community, with it spilling over to the user reviews occasionally. That being said, the moderation has to come from somewhere, and that's gonna be tough.

So after seeing Babymetal live in concert last night, I think i'm going to take a break from Overwatch, HotS and Tree of Savior for the weekend and play some anime-ass videogames.

other than Guilty Gear / BlazBlue, are there any "metal" anime videogames?

eXceed 3rd is a fun bullet-hell with an awesome synth-metal OST. Unmute the store page trailer to get started.

 

[Knurek]

GOG has finally payments in PLN, which was an absurd situation previously, given that CDPR is a Polish company.

Valve can't be far behind, can it? /s

 

[ExoSoul]

i liked it better, there were less references and they were more subtle and the world of dks2 was more original and had better foundations in itself than dks3's. both games have issues with story and characters, but i think dks2 sparked my imagination a lot more than dks3, and i feel way more attached to dks2 characters than dks3's

dks2 is not defined by its connections to 1 like dks3 is, dks2 stands on its own as an original story that still has big ties to 1, but you can miss those completely and that's ok too. dks3 is just flat out HERE'S

Spoiler

SIEGMEYER

or HERE'S

Spoiler

ANOR LONDO

. it felt lazy to me

dks2 had problems elsewhere, the original characters themselves weren't very interesting or they were riffs on dks1 characters, and the emerald herald is kinda lame (tho much better than whatshername in dks3), and it's just a less memorable game overall compared to dks1. the big bosses in dks1 don't have a shit ton of awesome lore like the ones in dks1

but hey dks1 is one of the best games of all time, it's really hard to compare

I find it interesting you see it like that, I'm not trying to convince you Ill just share how I see it:

DS2 was amateurish, you have this land far away yet somehow the most important souls/key references made it there somehow for reasons that don't really make sense just so they could be in it.

Every Primal Bonfire boss has a

Spoiler

DS1 boss soul

just because, the

Spoiler

statue of the warriors of sunlight

is there just because, the final boss(es with the dlc) is

Spoiler

based on the dlc boss of the first game

cause they couldn't think of anything better. All the while trying to push "nooo, this is its own land with its own history but see how this guy was obsessed with that one from the game you love? and that guy over there was trying to follow in the footsteps of another also from the game you like so much"


While in DS3 you have a continuation, yes it's the same world of DS1 but it evolved and changed and the references actually make sense. The world moved on from DS1, new places were built while others remained, new people appeared that have don deeds worthy of praise or that have a story that's worth being told while at the same time some were influenced by the legends of an age that has passed.

It comes down to 100 years after we die people will be talking about personalities of today and will be changed by their actions while it doesn't make sense for Martians to have a bunch of human relics if you'll allow the exaggeration.

 

[TheLetdown]

I guess I was a bit too subtle.

Steam thread, blah blah blah.

You're going to complain about PC game talk in this thread, really?

I took it that he was being sarcastic across the board with that. I don't think he's actually complaining so much as it is referencing a SteamGAF tradition.

My response, though, stands. You gotta play it if you aren't playing. I'm not saying it's the most innovative shooter I've played in years or anything and it isn't sliced bread, but I was totally blindsided by how enjoyable this game is.

I honestly wish it could be on Steam. Not a fan of the friends list BlizzLauncher has. But in fairness, I haven't used it since StarCraft 2. Though, DerExperte brought up one of the shittier aspects about adding friends, so I doubt it's too far from what it was.

 

[Soulflarz]

eXceed 3rd is a fun bullet-hell with an awesome synth-metal OST. Unmute the store page trailer to get started.

This is the series that ran 5fps on my gtx980 and I didn't want to look into fixing it :x

 

[Knurek]

lol

 

[redlacs]

IndieGala Friday Bundle #32

$1
- TownCraft
- Julai
- Metrocide

$2.99
- Amigdala
- Moustache Mountain
- Tennis in the Face
- Gunman Clive
- Gunman Clive 2
- Dyscourse
- The Lost Souls
- 8BitBoy™
- No Pineapple Left Behind

 

[kagamin]

How could I forget The Idolmaster is on Steam!

Spoiler

(kinda)

 

[NingenJanai]

lol

they are not joking, you better do it.

 

[shockdude]

This is the series that ran 5fps on my gtx980 and I didn't want to look into fixing it :x

oh whoops I forgot about the framerate issues. For me, upgrading from Windows 8.1 to 10 fixed the framerate, and I don't know why.

 

[thesaucetastic]

So after seeing Babymetal live in concert last night, I think i'm going to take a break from Overwatch, HotS and Tree of Savior for the weekend and play some anime-ass videogames.

other than Guilty Gear / BlazBlue, are there any "metal" anime videogames?

Any of the Ys games.

This one's from Oath: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwlMSrzeolg

 

[Soulflarz]

oh whoops I forgot about the framerate issues. For me, upgrading from Windows 8.1 to 10 fixed the framerate, and I don't know why.

I forget what I was on tbh
I recently upgraded to win10, but I tried it on that too. Both of these go under "things tried within the past 3 weeks"

Any of the Ys games.

This one's from Oath: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwlMSrzeolg

Seconded for Falcom having the best OSTs in gaming

 

[Tizoc]

IndieGala Friday Bundle #32

$1
- TownCraft
- Julai
- Metrocide

$2.99
- Amigdala
- Moustache Mountain
- Tennis in the Face
- Gunman Clive
- Gunman Clive 2
- Dyscourse
- The Lost Souls
- 8BitBoy™
- No Pineapple Left Behind

Worth it for Gunman Clive games.

 

[bbd23]

forgot humble monthly unlocks today!

 

[Annubis]

How could I forget The Idolmaster is on Steam!

Spoiler

(kinda)

Well...

 

[shockdude]

I forget what I was on tbh
I recently upgraded to win10, but I tried it on that too. Both of these go under "things tried within the past 3 weeks"



Seconded for Falcom having the best OSTs in gaming

that sucks. eXceed 3rd works perfectly on my laptop on both the Intel Graphics and the GTX 860M. It's a great game marred by lame compatibility issues.
IIRC the fix listed in this community thread isn't that hard to implement.

I should try Ys someday.