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Street Fighter V |OTVI| The More I Know, The Worse I Play
- Thread starter Reizo Ryuu
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ScraftyDevil
Banned
Good to see the discussion this has spurred already, haha.
Chun-Li's V-Skill is super good for the ambiguous crossups it creates (it can totally steal matches) and it's a good tool for her V-Trigger and Stun combos but I suppose it's not an essential part of her gameplan per se.
I stand by F.A.N.G. and Ibuki's being terrible though. If poison were better than F.A.N.G.'s might be worth using but as it stands it's just filler that puts a hole in his pressure. I've seen a bunch of his mains echoing this sentiment too so I'm definitely not alone in that regard.
Chun-Li's V-Skill is super good for the ambiguous crossups it creates (it can totally steal matches) and it's a good tool for her V-Trigger and Stun combos but I suppose it's not an essential part of her gameplan per se.
I stand by F.A.N.G. and Ibuki's being terrible though. If poison were better than F.A.N.G.'s might be worth using but as it stands it's just filler that puts a hole in his pressure. I've seen a bunch of his mains echoing this sentiment too so I'm definitely not alone in that regard.
CountBlack
Member
What makes Fang's V-Skill annoying is that when you're zoning somebody you can bait them into jumping over it in some capacity then go for an AA. It adds to his mind game while zoning imo
ScraftyDevil
Banned
Its only good after a hard knockdown or a super in the corner. Otherwise its slow as shit. Wouldnt mind some mad buffs to it.
ScraftyDevil
Banned
The problem is that poison's not nearly strong enough to make the opponent have to worry about jumping over it. And even if it does give him V-Meter, so what? F.A.N.G.'s V-Trigger is awful (again, due to how underwhelming poison is) and his V-Reversal is easily baited & grabbed so you have absolutely no reason to fear the V-Skill.
In most matches I see, the other player uses his V-Skill activation as an opportunity to gain some ground against him and will happily dash through the poison ball just to get at him.
Yep, invite me CFN EdziPC
EDIT: Give me a sec and I'll accept.
EDIT2: It says your lounge is full.
GGs man, glad I stole a set with Alex, though I've gotta vent for a sec lol. Ryu vs Alex feels like one of the most bullshit things ever, he owns Alex's soul from full screen, mid screen, close range, the air, everything. And that's on top of the typical Ryu top tier shenanigans.
I love this game, but man, Ryu and Chun demoralize me so hard since I don't actually see a way to overcome them.
I love this game, but man, Ryu and Chun demoralize me so hard since I don't actually see a way to overcome them.
It's actually not that tight. Are you sure you're doing the lightest version of Tragedy Assault? Because that's the only one that will combo (dunno about CH). It's kind of a weird motion, though, so maybe that's throwing you off?
Why do you rate Zangief's V-Skill so highly? Because his other tools are so bad? Because his V-Trigger is good?
Taking white damage for V meter is a bad proposition for a character whose game plan is walking forward.
Yeah I'm definitely doing the lightest one
GGs. I dunno that match well and don't have a solid gameplan yet. Lost to some Alexes recently in ranked thru their patience, spaced pokes, and jabs. Seemed to have options at all ranges and forced me to play close.
Gunslinger
Member
that stage gives me a headache.
yeah I am just starting to get used to it lol
ScraftyDevil
Banned
Wow, lotta people seem entirely incapable of taking the L tonight. I was running a Battle Lounge with FT3 sets and four times already the other player has quit once I get 2 wins. Idk why you'd even join a FT3 lounge if you only had the intention of playing 2 games but w/e.
It's the flex that makes it so good. With the flex he has access to what's essentially an offensive parry, and if you get hit by it he gets a free 50/50 mixup between SPD and anti-air that you have 3 frames to react to at best.
It also builds V-Meter alarmingly fast since you get meter for both the armor and the flex, and because his V-Trigger is actually pretty darn good (it excels at creating even more 50/50 scenarios and can let him confirm his super off of pretty much anything) he benefits greatly from having access to it early on. It also fuels his amazing V-Reversal, which again forces a 50/50 and even combos into his CA in the corner.
Zangief's not the best character, but his V-Skill lets him appear to be much much better than he is in the right hands, and is 100% an essential part of playing him effectively.
It's the flex that makes it so good. With the flex he has access to what's essentially an offensive parry, and if you get hit by it he gets a free 50/50 mixup between SPD and anti-air that you have 3 frames to react to at best.
It also builds V-Meter alarmingly fast since you get meter for both the armor and the flex, and because his V-Trigger is actually pretty darn good (it excels at creating even more 50/50 scenarios and can let him confirm his super off of pretty much anything) he benefits greatly from having access to it early on. It also fuels his amazing V-Reversal, which again forces a 50/50 and even combos into his CA in the corner.
Zangief's not the best character, but his V-Skill lets him appear to be much much better than he is in the right hands, and is 100% an essential part of playing him effectively.
lucebuce12
Member
Yup. His V-skill is situational but it's pretty darn good in that situation since worst case is that it accomplishes nothing but best case is that it hits which causes poison and builds a little v-meter.
If his poison was better then his v-skill and V-Trigger would automatically become better. Though I still think just having the poison always on is a good V-Trigger for him but that's just my opinion.
F.A.N.G's V-system is tied to the poison so obviously if the poison sucks ,then his V-system sucks.
lucebuce12
Member
That's.... actually a decent upgrade when he's in V-Trigger.
But again, the poison would need to be better for this to be even remotely scary/effective.
poison could stagger the enemy and increase startup for some moves.
maybe you could have different poison balls that would shut down/reduce effectiveness of specific buttons/button types
I'm just copying KI at this point but w/e
petran79
Banned
I did also follow the advice on reddit about fixed framerate in the ini (min framerate 5,max 60).
Together with Fast Sync, results are noticable and without tearing. Though I couldnt test it online against PS4 players. I played only against another PC player.
The lack of underwater matches is a bonus.
A damage and stun buff could work. Also stop stun from decreasing until it wears off.
lucebuce12
Member
Is that Spinal lol?
I actually proposed something similar, that when in V-Trigger the poison would cause the stun bar to decrease at a considerably reduced rate. It would be a bit too OP for non-VTrigger poison though, also I don't think it should stop the stun bar from decreasing full stop, since you're already taking damage from the poison.
It's cinder.
He pops a bomb on you and depending on which version you take damage if you use a kick or punch button until the bomb disappears. Something like that.
I just like different mechanics.
"God's Beard!"
Member
FANG should actually be one of the most annoying characters to face in the game. His poison should be really effective, causing opponents to take it very seriously when they're in that status.
He should be slippery as hell to get a hold of, making opponents panic and make mistakes just so they can get that one hit in to remove the poison. And when he decides to close in, even though he doesn't have great damage output, his frame traps and constant pressure makes it so that the poison lasts that much longer without the opponent being able to get a hit in.
It'd be a different form of offense than most (or all) other characters, but the one I think he needs.
He should be slippery as hell to get a hold of, making opponents panic and make mistakes just so they can get that one hit in to remove the poison. And when he decides to close in, even though he doesn't have great damage output, his frame traps and constant pressure makes it so that the poison lasts that much longer without the opponent being able to get a hit in.
It'd be a different form of offense than most (or all) other characters, but the one I think he needs.
lucebuce12
Member
^ EXACTLY.
As it stands, it's easy enough to keep an opponent poisoned but because it's just not worth the damage it currently does, I'm forced to go in and try to play a more offensive game in a lot of matchups, which is not what I want to be doing in those matchups.
It's exactly why his CA does the lowest damage in the game with less than 300 (but it varies a bit because of the poison)
His damage output through his normals and specials is fine, it's just the poison that's lacking.
As it stands, it's easy enough to keep an opponent poisoned but because it's just not worth the damage it currently does, I'm forced to go in and try to play a more offensive game in a lot of matchups, which is not what I want to be doing in those matchups.
It's exactly why his CA does the lowest damage in the game with less than 300 (but it varies a bit because of the poison)
His damage output through his normals and specials is fine, it's just the poison that's lacking.
abstract alien
Member
I still think his poison damage should increase after a short amount of time has passed, and his combo damage scaling is noticeably reduced while in V-Trigger. Also, he should recover much more quickly from his V-Skill. None of that would break the game since at base he is a pretty honest character with obvious strengths and weaknesses. Every bit of damage you cause is well earned, considering quite a few of the other characters in the game.
God's Beard!";224747982][URL="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fvM86_y3oM0 said:
At 2:53, you could have just ended the match there by cancelling into your CA and chipping him out. He didn't have V-Reversal to prevent it. Obviously, you then tried doing it a few moments later, which wasn't the right call.
At 5:22, you challenged Ken's V-Trigger activation when he is absolutely plus on his st.HK xx V-Trigger. Not good; you have to block that or V-reversal it at that point.
At 6:08, you did your second wakeup CA. Which didn't work. Just don't do that; it's not worth it 90% of the time, especially when your health is not at a critical state and neither is your opponent's (like at 9:40).
At 6:34, you missed a very crucial and very obvious SRK punish. Actually, there were several times when the Ken threw out a random SRK at neutral and you didn't whiff punish it. It's important.
Also, Nash is good at running away and all, but you're doing that a lot more than you're going in, even when the pressure is on the opponent. You'll press forward, throw a block string that might hit at the end with no confirm, and then back away to then have Ken try to get in on you. You have to make Ken force you away, not force yourself away when the advantage is yours.
At 9:19: a very important drop for what should have been a simple combo. Gotta practice those more.
Punished_Snake
Member
Most people playing SFV online are morons, they dp a lot on wake up, do a dp after an unsafe moves, scruby play. For example, see how many times this guile dp'ed on wake up:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHkQJP8jZ-A
anyway, any European players (good connection) want to play? my CFN is: Lord_Ahmad , feel free to add me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rHkQJP8jZ-A
anyway, any European players (good connection) want to play? my CFN is: Lord_Ahmad , feel free to add me.
I can play few games. You playing now?
Punished_Snake
Member
I will be online in ten minutes
Edit: I'm downloading the new PS4 update, send me your CFN, I will invite you.
cfn: -myco-
Rather be free on wakeup than have the temptation to mash reversal everytime.
Having garbage wakeup options is definitely eye opening after using a character that has meterless invincible reversal.
Dhalsim can definitely use his V-Skill quite effectively. It isn't something to focus his gameplay around, but it definitely has utility.
Alex's V-Skill also definitely has uses, they just tend to be tethered to dizzying the opponent first.
Marvel
could never
I feel the same.
abstract alien
Member
I remember the first time I played a good Alex and he hit me with that max corner combo post stun, and my life bar was broken in pieces when I looked at it. Yeah, it has its place lol
Punished_Snake
Member
Good games Myco, lets play again later, I play against a good Platinum vega player everyday, you will enjoy playing against him too.
Punished_Snake
Member
Yeah the first set was laggy, next time I will connect ps4 wired, we will not have lag issues.
Block dese command grabs tho
It's pretty surprising that that little hitbox on the jump will beat. Today I was trying to space out some medium tackles with Urien, and the Chun I faced somehow knew that the vskill hitbox would beat it. Very odd, I wanna look at the hitbox on the jump part of the vskill.
I disagree, I think the difference between a good Zangief and a great Zangief is how they use their v-skill. It's a risk, but risk/reward is the game Zangief players play. It's why he has all that extra health.
It makes the post-stun combo more dangerous, that's about all it is good for for 90% of the cast. Throwing it out during a match is only really useful against the slowpokes like Zangief, but even then you're sacrificing positioning for it.
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