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Street Fighter V |OTVII| New Generation - Connection To Haters Was Lost
- Thread starter Reizo Ryuu
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TheSpoiler
Member
Yeah I'd be put to sleep too with HEALING every match. Even the blowups in SF4 are fun to me sorry fam.
CountBlack
Member
and no character has givin me the same satisfaction from playing Deejay
or elena hue
I loved playing Honda. Every time I won a match with him I'd ask myself "how do I even win this"
then I remembered sumo splash
Omnistalgic
Member
not everyone, u know how I roll man, let everyone keep (mostly) their nonsense for at least 2 years.
Reizo Ryuu
Member
Smh at the nostalgia for sf4, y'all wild.
lucebuce12
Member
Omnistalgic
Member
Also SF4 is kinda weak, actually no, its just bad. Like, if you are on PS4, just go back and boot-up Ultra, it's bad guys lol. It got too cumbersome with all the systems, backdash was just annoying to fight. Some characters performed outside the rules of the game like Elf or C.Viper (sumo splaying and jumping everywhere/Burn kicks you can't tell where to block etc...) and sooo many other problems. It always felt like the basics of that game were never fundamentally sound. At least in SFV most of the cast has some type of 50/50 or solid mix-up play. You get trapped in the corner, it's bad for you, this is pretty universal no matter who your opponent is.
The only elements I wish Capcom would add back from Sf4 is 1-frame links for top tier players to get a little extra damage/hype, multiple supers, and proximity normals. The robust costumes/stages/characters is just an element of time I guess.
The only elements I wish Capcom would add back from Sf4 is 1-frame links for top tier players to get a little extra damage/hype, multiple supers, and proximity normals. The robust costumes/stages/characters is just an element of time I guess.
Shadoken
Member
Not really. Played the game recently at a local tourney , its still quite fun and rewarding.
There are strong tactics in every game. But I never felt any strat was so strong that you had to basically "hold it". The fact that the game had much more tools , meant there was always more than one way out of a situation.
In SFV , its very one dimensional. While characters do have a lot of variety its often just one particular strat that is Soo good that you just opt for it every time. And likewise there are very limited defensive options against it. It just feels like every match ends up the same way.
SFV has the potential to be much better than SF4 , but as it is right now. The balance is very bad and the game feels one dimensional. The last time someone did something Capcom didnt expect ( Infiltration Nash ) they nerfed the shit out of that character. I really hate the attitude Capcom has towards this game.
TheSpoiler
Member
In reality, while I think SF4 is boring (more so now), it's still decent. Yeah it's got bullshit but it's not bad. It's my least favorite SF, thinking about it, and I'd rather play EX, but it wasn't the worst fighting game in the world.
This isn't a slight to SF4 or SFV or whatever, but people should play more fighting games in general. Once you start dabbling in many fighters, you start realizing how much bullshit every game has across the board.
Doesn't mean things shouldn't get fixed, or deserve to be in, but I feel like I get more tolerant of fighting games as a whole once I've played a few rounds of SFEX2. You can do some dirty ass things in that game and you only need like two bars to close out a round.
I agree with some of your post, but man, lol, balance in V is like not the problem at all. The past few tournaments have been varied as hell in terms of characters, and mid-tier characters are still performing pretty well as of late. Rog is OD for sure, but Brian F is exposing some of that tech so it's a lot more bareable (like jabbing Rog's spin, which nobody did, and then Momo did it with his Ibuki and cleaned Smug's clock).
Yeah some of the characters are weak af, but most of the cast is in a good place right now.
This isn't a slight to SF4 or SFV or whatever, but people should play more fighting games in general. Once you start dabbling in many fighters, you start realizing how much bullshit every game has across the board.
Doesn't mean things shouldn't get fixed, or deserve to be in, but I feel like I get more tolerant of fighting games as a whole once I've played a few rounds of SFEX2. You can do some dirty ass things in that game and you only need like two bars to close out a round.
I agree with some of your post, but man, lol, balance in V is like not the problem at all. The past few tournaments have been varied as hell in terms of characters, and mid-tier characters are still performing pretty well as of late. Rog is OD for sure, but Brian F is exposing some of that tech so it's a lot more bareable (like jabbing Rog's spin, which nobody did, and then Momo did it with his Ibuki and cleaned Smug's clock).
Yeah some of the characters are weak af, but most of the cast is in a good place right now.
Rickenslacker
Banned
Same. Might have a great roster, but the game is terrible.
lucebuce12
Member
I mean I know I'm harping a lot on KI recently, but have you seen Shin Hisako?
Killer Instinct just got the realest moveset ever.
Shin Hisako looks amazing!
This character is insane!
- Long range normals
- fastest dash in game
- huge AA
- huge hitbox moves in general
- dash in moves that cause popups for easy combos and let you left right folks. In other words berzerker slash that you can either stop in front, or behind WITH a launcher tacked on
- THE TRAIL BEHIND BERZERKER SLASH HAS A HITBOX. Try jumping or porting this and you can still get hit by her dash effects like a ghetto rapidslash
- teleport dash that can port above folks for HUGE crossup play
- enormous ability to travel full screen with special moves
- restands
- summon a spirit orb you can position. When Shin hisako hits it she can turn it into a large slow traveling projectile that beats EVERY PROJECTILE. Yes she can berserker slash through it to trigger the projectile on someone's left to move in and end up behind you after the berzerker slash move to left right you.
- shin hisako can HOME in on a placed orb with her specials or dash. She can also curse someone so the orb stays on them no matter where they go. This can lead to her teleporting past or over attacks to hit cursed opponents.
- the amount of orbs she can use before instinct runs out makes her pressure insane given that the orbs convert into projectiles that can be knocked into different angles of attack that allow you to both pressure from air or ground. Nigh unstoppable huge projectiles slowly following up anything shin hisako tries makes her very safe and dangerous pressure in instinct to face off against.
- can cash out the instinct fast to summon hands that move along ground toward enemy to drag them to underworld meaning you could summon orb, berzerker slash through it, cash out on the opposite side with hands and then teleport dash above them to potentially go for both a left right crossup and grab.
This has to be the best rushdown/all purpose moveset I've seen.
Yet she still does not feel broken or like she just has too many tools. Literally every character HAS THE TOOLS to deal with this kind of offense and pressure.
If a game with as much bullshit as KI can have such stuff and still feel completely fair, I don't think that it's too tough for SF5 to accomplish something similar.
Shadoken
Member
Actually that came out wrong. I am not talking about individual character balance , but overall balance.
What i mean is in SF4 you had a balance between Offense,Defense,Neutral,Mixup strategy characters. But in SFV its either RTSD or GTFO. Even chars who are supposedly good at Neutral or defense will be more successful if you just play offense with them. ( Guile being the outlier and all ).
And GTFO is basically Guile The Fuck Out or go home.
TheSpoiler
Member
I dunno, some of my KI friends on Twitter seem to think there are a few characters like Maya (I think that's her name?) that can't stack up to the rest of the cast. But who gives a shit, at least KI can make a character like the one you described feel powerful without feeling unfair. They could be wrong, or maybe I'm misremembering. I don't know enough about KI to call that!
KI also has good system wide mechanics to hold that shit down too, right? That's why better wakeup options would definitely help the whole cast of SFV. Once you start putting those in, it's easier for everyone to compete. So long as they don't start doing things that only help one portion of the cast.
lucebuce12
Member
Yup. Everyone's wakeup options are different, and how much they can capitalize off of those wakeup options but there are 3 options that literally everyone has.
An invincible backdash (which is only invincible for a few frames but it's something), an option for delayed wakeup and the shadow counter.
Shadow counter can only be done while in blockstun but if you get hit by a normal or special while in the shadow counter state, you immediately do a shadow move of your own and start your own combo for a bar of meter. The downside to this is that it fails against rapid hit moves, and can be thrown/command grabbed. You can also bait out shadow counters and get a big punish. If you're opponent is doing things like cancelling their overhead into a move, or abusing multi hit moves like Jago's f+hk or Orchid's overhead then you can just shadow counter the last hit of that and counter it. They can't do anything about it.
Not too sure about the Maya situation, tbh I don't really follow the competitive scene as closely as I'd like. But PinkDiamond plays a mean Maya and while there aren't that many, there are certainly a few Mayas. Character variety is also one thing that's very prevalent in this game. Take a look at almost any tournament and you're bound to see a plethora of characters. Hell, the KI cup had so many different characters and that's as top level as it gets.
I realize that this might be a controversial opinion but I honestly think an invincible backdash would be a good thing in this game, as long as they stay reasonable with the amount of invincible frames it has.
One of my biggest problems with SFV (and SF4 for that matter) is that they opted to make buttons bad. Like..if you dont want me to anti air with crouch fierce then dont give me the fucking move. Instead of giving me a deliberately bad button, give me a good option that doesn't do what you think is 'too good'. I'd rather have 5 buttons that have good horizontal properties than trying to reconcile bullshit animations that dont match the hitboxes. It's one of the reasons why S1 Chun and Ryu were good. Their moves matched the animations and worked properly.
I've played melty before. pretty fun but i didnt know what i was doing
Doctrine Dark
Member
I prefer SF4 over SFV. That's not to say I dislike V because I certainly don't. I like the game. I just hate how mindless the CC system can be at times, especially when some characters can literally keep throwing it out without being punished. I like the idea of CC's on whiffed specials, but it's so stupid in neutral. At least make it more punishable in general to deter the fishing aspect from it.
Don't really like how close normals were removed, either. The combo accessibility is another thing that I don't really care for, though I can understand Capcom's reasoning for simplifying them compared to SF4. I just don't get the same satisfaction in V as I did hitting Sakura's Tatsu loops...among other things.
So overall, I enjoy SFV for what it is. I prefer many other SF's to it, but as a standalone game, it's certainly enjoyable.
Don't really like how close normals were removed, either. The combo accessibility is another thing that I don't really care for, though I can understand Capcom's reasoning for simplifying them compared to SF4. I just don't get the same satisfaction in V as I did hitting Sakura's Tatsu loops...among other things.
So overall, I enjoy SFV for what it is. I prefer many other SF's to it, but as a standalone game, it's certainly enjoyable.
Omnistalgic
Member
SFV is pretty balanced though, that's not really the problem with it being one-dimensional. It just needs more tools, but Capcom is smart to make sure everything is air-tight before adding something like more CA's or additional V-triggers etc...
I would personally have loved an expansion on the 3rd strike gameplay. But base to base, SFV is way ahead of SFlV to me, not even close.
It does need more tools. But it's the modes of play that are questionable at times.
Some characters just walk around pressing their CC buttons until a jump in occurs which they then block because they don't actually have that much recovery and then they play the minigame where they figure out when to press their 3 frame jab to reset the situation and then rinse and repeat.
Meanwhile the attacker plays the game where they may whiff punish someone but it doesn't add up with the cc damage of the attacker and then they just decide a jump in will work better anyway and leap like a lemming freely bc anti-airs aren't wonderful in that situation and then they decide whether to shimmy, throw, or delayed attack.
Some characters just walk around pressing their CC buttons until a jump in occurs which they then block because they don't actually have that much recovery and then they play the minigame where they figure out when to press their 3 frame jab to reset the situation and then rinse and repeat.
Meanwhile the attacker plays the game where they may whiff punish someone but it doesn't add up with the cc damage of the attacker and then they just decide a jump in will work better anyway and leap like a lemming freely bc anti-airs aren't wonderful in that situation and then they decide whether to shimmy, throw, or delayed attack.
sixteen-bit
Member
SF4 is pretty ugly 2 me and i play games for aesthetics
Omnistalgic
Member
yup...I will say it again, S1 nerfs should have been
AA Jab nerf
Ken's hitbox on air tatsu
Chun's Instant Air Legs
That's it! not literally, small little adjustments could have been made to damage, etc...but no one really needed to be beat with a nerf stick, nothing was braindead hard to defend against, and wtf for Capcom taking away Infiltration's ability to exploit a character to a different potential than what was outlined for him. S1 Chun, S1 Ryu, S1 Nash, S1 Ken, current Balrog, Guile, Ibuki, these are the standardize characters Capcom should be building everyone up to, not worrying about nerfing so much. The game just has too much damage potential to worry about balance issues right now, everyone can kill everyone for the most part. Buff Buff Buff Capcom, the nerfs can always come later.
S2.5 looks like they are fixing some of the biggest gripes, but man, I hope S3 they really get back on track. These crap and short normals everyone has is also a pet peeve of mine, like why?
SF4 has always been trash looking
Watching old SFV footage and seeing all the jab AAs is pretty amazing
Give my characters their AA jabs tho
Reizo Ryuu
Member
I thought you quit.
UcchedavÄda
Member
TheSpoiler
Member
I wish I could play KI, but I just don't mess well with that system. I do appreciate it though.
Fighting EX Layer needs to happen. That game could be a great middle ground between games. I just want more fighting games in general, and that game could be kinda similar to SF in style.
Fighting EX Layer needs to happen. That game could be a great middle ground between games. I just want more fighting games in general, and that game could be kinda similar to SF in style.
the thing is it could be 5 years away even if it came
Reizo Ryuu
Member
I bought KI at the end of s1, dropped it after an hour because the xb1 dpad is supreme garbage, you have to press that shit down so hard in order for the game to detect diagonals, rip.
They realised they weren't making humans anymoreUcchedavāda;233688028 said:
Damn i love EX characters more than i thought i did outside the obvious Skullman
Also got S1
Can't play with analog as a padwarrior and didn't play much with that dpad
allintospace
Member
Ucchedavāda;233688028 said:
Why does this remind me of Alex.
backwards legs.
allintospace
Member
There it is.
bob_arctor
Tough_Smooth
TheSpoiler
Member
So many blowups on twitter
I wish my phone would let me copy paste this shit.
-7kFlash vs Alpha Punk
Art vs FChamp
I wish my phone would let me copy paste this shit.
-7kFlash vs Alpha Punk
Art vs FChamp
Break a leg
who is this? Is this balrog's lesser cousin from britain?
CountBlack
Member
remember when jumping in seemed like a bad idea. like "damn he's got meter and ultra, I prolly shouldn't jump"
now its "damn he's got meter and VT.. eh we gon be aight"
now its "damn he's got meter and VT.. eh we gon be aight"
A Dhalsim mirror match? I can't imagine what this would look like.
And unless Flash is using Vega again...well he'd still lose.
"Akuma has full meter, why did I jump?"
*akuma does CA*
*CA has like 10000000 startup frames*
*I land well before it starts and block*
TheSpoiler
Member
Yeah I dunno. They play so differently too.
And even if flash picked up a buffed Vega he'd still get cleaned out. Punks spacing is way too good.
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