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[Jarmel]

Meh. I'd rather be considered an arsehole or a dickhead than walk around on eggshells wondering whether someone's fragile sense of self will become shattered because I criticised the choice of entertainment media.

Why should you get defensive because you like something someone else considers shit? It should add more discussion on why a piece of work can still be enjoyed regardless of some of the elements it it pandering to undesirable subcultures. For example one could say Shirobako is 'Typical moeshit slice-of life only enjoyable by socially underdeveloped losers'. And the response could be to curl up into a ball and cry about how people are dickheads on the internet. Or it could be to launch a discussion about how the shows content is betrayed by it's visuals, how it gives a good look into Japanese work culture and the various hurdles around animation creation in Japan, and also linking this into cultural discussions about Japan's obsession with female youthfulness. You could go into fiscal discussions about how hard it is to launch an animation and how many studios are running after a small pot of dedicated buyers and therefore are somewhat forced to use visual designs and characterisations which are unthreatening to that audience. Instead of pretending everything is fine and dandy, that underage sibling incest subplots have merit, that harems and falling onto girls breasts are aimed at adults, that skimpy 'armour' that somehow manages to expose more flesh than it covers exists for some other reason than base titilation, why not disown the elements you hate whilst encouraging discussion about the stuff you enjoy? You're favourite anime IS shit, but that doesn't stop you from explaining what it does that you liked.

We're not talking about someone criticizing a work but how they criticize it. By saying shit like "Typical moeshit slice-of life only enjoyable by socially underdeveloped losers", what does that add to the discussion? You're certainly not going to convince anyone you're right with that particular tone and the people who do like the show are just going to be pissed off. Now if you want to express your issues with the show then you should be capable of writing down those thoughts in a somewhat coherent and thoughtful manner instead of a post I could find on 4chan. I doubt anyone is saying that works shouldn't be criticized or harshly for what they bring to the table or the effect they could have socially but posts like that aren't even to the level of constructive criticism but rather someone just venting or ranting.

Many elements of harems are definitely designed towards attracting to the base elements of otaku and I don't think anyone is disagreeing that a reviewer should ignore or gloss over that. In fact I imagine most viewers are aware of that when they watch as the target audience for any of these works are old enough to generally know what's going on. Lord knows enough fanservice shows fail every year so it's not just a simple 'show tits and clear 3k in sales' card. However boiling down complex issues into the form of a soundbite doesn't serve to nurture discussion.

I think the difference is that I don't fault people for looking down on anime at all. Why shouldn't they? I seriously cannot see myself taking an insult based on entertainment preferences personally unless I secretly knew them to be true. I know that someone can look at Shirobako or Madoka and turn to the worst conclusion, and I don't blame them. The anime industry has continuously pushed itself into this corner and those of us who partake of it must know what we are doing.

You really pick Shirobako and Madoka as the worst of the industry? Really?

 

[KenjiGlove]

You really pick Shirobako and Madoka as the worst of the industry? Really?

I think he means it in the way that people could glance over it and be put off by the artstyle, not bothering to see what's behind the mask of moe.

That's just my read though.

 

[KirbYuuYuu]

I think he means it in the way that people could glance over it and be put off by the artstyle, not bothering to see what's behind the mask of moe.

That's just my read though.

I'm pretty sure that's what he meant as well. The same even applies to Doremi -_-

 

[Jarmel]

I think he means it in the way that people could glance over it and be put off by the artstyle, not bothering to see what's behind the mask of moe.

That's just my read though.

Despite some issues I have with the character designs in Shitobako, it's in no way near the bottom of the barrel in the industry. Madoka's designs have a very clear intent about them so it's not like they were done for the sole purpose of being cute for the sake of being cute.

Like those are closer to being on the high end when you have shows like High School DXD existing.

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

You have to consider what kind of discussion you're looking to create when you make a comment on the Internet. It's so easy for Internet interactions on message boards, comment sections, and elsewhere to quickly escalate into heated discussions where people are yelling at each other without listening to the other person, just like some political cable news talk show. Yes, it's important to not be overly sensitive to critical comments - and if you are, it's better to not browse places on the Internet that'll only encourage negative emotions to boil up inside you. But at the same time, if your tone is aggressive and confrontational, you can't be surprised when people get defensive and push back. If all you want is to poke people and laugh at them getting upset, which is a favorite pastime of many on the Internet, then by all means go ahead. But if you want to have a substantial and reasoned discourse about a subject, then you need to keep your language from being more emotionally heated than necessary.

 

[Cornbread78]

Hey I'm not encouraging anyone to insult people

Spoiler

other than Key fans

I object.. Bullying is not tolerated.

Clannad is amazing and one of the G.O.A.T, just saying.

 

[John Blade]

Man....should I believe in the hype for Wolf Rain or just keep an open mind when watching this show. Slowly watching it now and kinda liking the story a bit.

 

[jordisok]

I went on holiday for over 2 weeks and the last episode of BBB still hasn't aired? :\ is this right

 

[Cornbread78]

Amagami SS ep.13-16
This time is was the arc with Nanosaki, the swimmer. It wasn't that sappy this time, but pretty interesting overall. At least there was no annoying narrator this time... Always good to end a festival episode in a hot tub, lol. She was definitely the aggressor in this one.

 

[Femmeworth]

What about S.A.C.? Everyone is always talking about that, it seems like.

Spoiler

It's not that good.

 

[PshycoNinja]

Okay. Done with my brothers wedding. That was a great weekend of putting out fires, being a peacemaker, and keeping everyone in line to make the new couple happy. For being a first-time best man, I think I nailed it!

Now back to anime!

Charlotte 7

I am still kind of not convinced that

Spoiler

the little sister is dead.

If she is than I feel bad and still got some feels out of this episode.

Anyways watching Yuus

Spoiler

decent into madness

was pretty great. He definitely won't be the same person he was last week. Still though, this was a great episode to watch with a lot of great imagery.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

I object.. Bullying is not tolerated.

Clannad is amazing and one of the G.O.A.T, just saying.

 

[duckroll]

Man....should I believe in the hype for Wolf Rain or just keep an open mind when watching this show. Slowly watching it now and kinda liking the story a bit.

You should believe in me who believes in Wolf's Rain. As long as your approach to the series is to recognize that it is a mythic fable rather than a blockbuster action series, I think you'll have a fine time.

 

[PshycoNinja]

I object.. Bullying is not tolerated.

Clannad is amazing and one of the G.O.A.T, just saying.

Always bully the Key fans.

Clannad is fantastic! My favorite anime of all time too.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

You should believe in me who believes in Wolf's Rain. As long as your approach to the series is to recognize that it is a mythic fable rather than a blockbuster action series, I think you'll have a fine time.

I also approve of Wolf's Rain. It isn't by any means a masterpiece, but if you're looking for sad anime it's a more than decent watch

 

[duckroll]

I also approve of Wolf's Rain. It isn't by any means a masterpiece, but if you're looking for sad anime it's a more than decent watch

It's a masterpiece, you're a ~baka~.

 

[NaDannMaGoGo]

Nana - 47 [Finale]

So there I'm done, already. @_@

Not in the mood to type much, though. Overall the show's certainly very good and more or less universally recommendable to anyone interested in good romance and drama. As mentioned in my last comment, however, I do feel like it fell off in some regards later down the line. It unfortunately also ends right in the middle and from what I've read Madhouse would've been interested in a second season or so once the rest of the manga is finished...the manga that's now been on Hiatus for 6 years. Step aside Berserk, this one getting finished would take priority for me.

Also, to be fair to this anime, it's 47 episodes long and the longer a show goes the easier it is to find flaws. Still, while the first half was a clear 9/10 for me I'd rate all it 8/10 all together. Ending in, more or less, the middle of nowhere, will always be a detriment, too, even though there's no one really to shove the blame to.

Anyways, everyone who wants to see an actually well written, mature romance, give Nana a try. Only few episodes in you'll realize this is far from your average everyday anime romcom/drama.

As far as OPs and EDs go. First and second ones were good respectively. Couldn't really stand the third iterations though.

OP 1, OP 2

ED 1, ED 2

 

[John Blade]

Well....I will continue watching this show. Just finish watching episode 3 and man, the dialogue with Kiba and Tsume about pride and life when they're surrounded is touching meaning.....and I am liking it a bit more as I am watching. I will keep my expectation in neutral and continue watching this show.

 

[Theonik]

I'm all for insulting people if it keeps us from navel gazing about the purpose of this thread.

Navel you say?!

Low amount of Anna = not worth watching.

There was this, but it just lost its funk I feel.

 

[hosannainexcelsis]

Man....should I believe in the hype for Wolf Rain or just keep an open mind when watching this show. Slowly watching it now and kinda liking the story a bit.

Just let the story of Wolf's Rain come as it comes. Keep an open mind in the sense that you shouldn't try to have preconceived notions of where the story should go. Duckroll is right that you can't expect blockbuster action; the last 4 episodes in particular make an unconventional ending, but that is what makes them so powerful. It's introspective and intimate, yet cosmic and sweeping at the same time. If you can get invested in the central characters and their fate, you should be satisfied with the series by the time it draws to a close.

By the way, make sure you skip the 4 recap episodes (15-18) that were caused by the SARS epidemic. They're superfluous and I wish they had not been included in the episode numbering and on the home releases.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

^ and you should also check out the OVA episodes that finish off the story.

 

[Basileus777]

Navel you say?!

Does that excite you?

 

[duckroll]

You have to consider what kind of discussion you're looking to create when you make a comment on the Internet. It's so easy for Internet interactions on message boards, comment sections, and elsewhere to quickly escalate into heated discussions where people are yelling at each other without listening to the other person, just like some political cable news talk show. Yes, it's important to not be overly sensitive to critical comments - and if you are, it's better to not browse places on the Internet that'll only encourage negative emotions to boil up inside you. But at the same time, if your tone is aggressive and confrontational, you can't be surprised when people get defensive and push back. If all you want is to poke people and laugh at them getting upset, which is a favorite pastime of many on the Internet, then by all means go ahead. But if you want to have a substantial and reasoned discourse about a subject, then you need to keep your language from being more emotionally heated than necessary.

This is absolutely true. People who are making shitty comments are generally not looking to have a discussion and it would be best not to even bother engaging them if that's how it's starting off. Some people just like to vent after watching something bad, and take it out on the fanbase too. Some people are just stirring shit (I'm not innocent of this either!). Some people are just making an insensitive joke or looking to cause to offense for the lulz. These are not things which anyone should be particularly proud of, but it happens. Sometimes it goes overboard. I think it's healthy to just not take it personally unless the insult is specifically personal. Reacting to something is within our own control. What other people say aren't really within our control.

 

[John Blade]

Nana - 47 [Finale]

So there I'm done, already. @_@

Not in the mood to type much, though. Overall the show's certainly very good and more or less universally recommendable to anyone interested in good romance and drama. As mentioned in my last comment, however, I do feel like it fell off in some regards later down the line. It unfortunately also ends right in the middle and from what I've read Madhouse would've been interested in a second season or so once the rest of the manga is finished...the manga that's now been on Hiatus for 6 years. Step aside Berserk, this one getting finished would take priority for me.

Also, to be fair to this anime, it's 47 episodes long and the longer a show goes the easier it is to find flaws. Still, while the first half was a clear 9/10 for me I'd rate all it 8/10 all together. Ending in, more or less, the middle of nowhere, will always be a detriment, too, even though there's no one really to shove the blame to.

Anyways, everyone who wants to see an actually well written, mature romance, give Nana a try. Only few episodes in you'll realize this is far from your average everyday anime romcom/drama.

As far as OPs and EDs go. First and second ones were good respectively. Couldn't really stand the third iterations though.

OP 1, OP 2

ED 1, ED 2

You should know that the creator of the Nana, Ai Yazawa, was sick which is why Nana was in hiatus for a while. A quote from below.

In June 2009, it was revealed that Yazawa had contracted a sudden illness, and had to be sent to hospital for treatment, putting Nana on hiatus.[3] She returned from the hospital in April 2010, although has yet to reveal when or if she will be continuing the Nana manga serialization.[4]

I guess, the best thing you have is to watch the movie that was release for it. I did watch a bit of this show when it was shown in Japan but never finish it. I might want to go back and try to watch it again. Man....those NANA dvd for the anime collection isn't cheap right now....

 

[John Blade]

Just let the story of Wolf's Rain come as it comes. Keep an open mind in the sense that you shouldn't try to have preconceived notions of where the story should go. Duckroll is right that you can't expect blockbuster action; the last 4 episodes in particular make an unconventional ending, but that is what makes them so powerful. It's introspective and intimate, yet cosmic and sweeping at the same time. If you can get invested in the central characters and their fate, you should be satisfied with the series by the time it draws to a close.

By the way, make sure you skip the 4 recap episodes (15-18) that were caused by the SARS epidemic. They're superfluous and I wish they had not been included in the episode numbering and on the home releases.

I will keep that in mind. I guess I might be okay as I like to see how the characters in the show develop during the show. I am guessing it will pay off right at the end even though it might not be the ending people want to see. Still, don't want to spoil me too much right now I am still near the beginning of this show.

As for the recap episodes (15-18), they isn't any reason to watch it right? Just retelling what happened in the past few episode? If like that with no new animation to watch, then I guess I will skip it.

Also, I am watching this show in Eng dub which sound fine. I notice they bring in professional voice actor for this show.

 

[Articalys]

Outside of God Eater, what other shows in the last couple years have had clear production issues beyond the normal sort of "animation on some scenes was rushed so it looks kind of bad but will be fixed on the BD"?

 

[Psycho_Mantis]

Meh. I'd rather be considered an arsehole or a dickhead than walk around on eggshells wondering whether someone's fragile sense of self will become shattered because I criticised the choice of entertainment media.

Why should you get defensive because you like something someone else considers shit? It should add more discussion on why a piece of work can still be enjoyed regardless of some of the elements it it pandering to undesirable subcultures. For example one could say Shirobako is 'Typical moeshit slice-of life only enjoyable by socially underdeveloped losers'. And the response could be to curl up into a ball and cry about how people are dickheads on the internet. Or it could be to launch a discussion about how the shows content is betrayed by it's visuals, how it gives a good look into Japanese work culture and the various hurdles around animation creation in Japan, and also linking this into cultural discussions about Japan's obsession with female youthfulness. You could go into fiscal discussions about how hard it is to launch an animation and how many studios are running after a small pot of dedicated buyers and therefore are somewhat forced to use visual designs and characterisations which are unthreatening to that audience. Instead of pretending everything is fine and dandy, that underage sibling incest subplots have merit, that harems and falling onto girls breasts are aimed at adults, that skimpy 'armour' that somehow manages to expose more flesh than it covers exists for some other reason than base titilation, why not disown the elements you hate whilst encouraging discussion about the stuff you enjoy? You're favourite anime IS shit, but that doesn't stop you from explaining what it does that you liked.



I think the difference is that I don't fault people for looking down on anime at all. Why shouldn't they? I seriously cannot see myself taking an insult based on entertainment preferences personally unless I secretly knew them to be true. I know that someone can look at Shirobako or Madoka and turn to the worst conclusion, and I don't blame them. The anime industry has continuously pushed itself into this corner and those of us who partake of it must know what we are doing.

Monogatari series come to mind....seems to have some great characters and plot but for some reason wants to pander to some of the most deplorable anime sub cultures.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Outside of God Eater, what other shows in the last couple years have had clear production issues beyond the normal sort of "animation on some scenes was rushed so it looks kind of bad but will be fixed on the BD"?

Didn't Attack on Titan also have a bunch of people running around trying to finish episodes in time?

 

[phaze]

Man, that train sequence in Eccentric Family #12 was pretty amazing.

 

[trejo]

You should believe in me who believes in Wolf's Rain. As long as your approach to the series is to recognize that it is a mythic fable rather than a blockbuster action series, I think you'll have a fine time.

I also approve of Wolf's Rain. It isn't by any means a masterpiece, but if you're looking for sad anime it's a more than decent watch

I agree with all of this and would also like to point out its absolutely phenomenal soundtrack.

 

[Dedication Through Light]

God Eater Episode 5

Great episode, Kota was near perfect and had such good moments. Glad he got over his confidence issues finally, really needed it.

Painful episode, almost screamed at Alisa for acting dumb

Spoiler

but at least Lenka showed he has some new ability that could be unlocked if his weapon was stronger. Im just glad kami sama smiled upon him to save him from that Black Varja. Whyd it have a human face and such, and also howd Lenka absorb so much damage. He ought to have no blood left

Favorite Lenka moment.

 

[ColossalLazy]

I agree with all of this and would also like to point out its absolutely phenomenal soundtrack.

You forgot about STRAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

 

[John Blade]

I agree with all of this and would also like to point out its absolutely phenomenal soundtrack.

Yup, liking the soundtrack for this show. Might be the main reason what caught me to look into this show as the ending theme song was sing by my favorite singer.

 

[Taruranto]

What's up with that half-naked chick in God Eater?

Looks like a cosplay who ran out of fabric.

 

[TUSR]

This season of Working!!! has so much character/'plot?' progression.

 

[NaDannMaGoGo]

You should know that the creator of the Nana, Ai Yazawa, was sick which is why Nana was in hiatus for a while. A quote from below.

Yeah I read about that. Even after the hospital stay, though, we're looking at 5 years hiatus. Not like I blame her or anything, it just simply sucks when fantastic works don't get finished : /

That said, looks like I'e got Paradise Kiss to look forward at least! After it getting mentioned here again, having heard about it before and it apparently being adapted by a manga from Ai Yazawa, I might be in for a treat.

 

[VRMN]

This season of Working!!! has so much character/'plot?' progression.

I haven't looked into it, but someone told me the manga has ended or is about to and the anime is adapting that ending, which is why all the long-running threads are being tied up.

 

[duckroll]

Man, that train sequence in Eccentric Family #12 was pretty amazing.

Inoue power.

As for the recap episodes (15-18), they isn't any reason to watch it right? Just retelling what happened in the past few episode? If like that with no new animation to watch, then I guess I will skip it.

They were fill in episodes created for the broadcast slots when production was delayed industry-wide at the time because of the SARS epidemic in Asia. No reason to waste your time on them.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

You forgot about STRAYYYYYYYYYYYYYY

my friends and I still go to each other "STRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAANGE"

What's up with that half-naked chick in God Eater?

Looks like a cosplay who ran out of fabric.

She's wearing both the world's smallest shirt and the world's smallest skirt.

I want somebody to design guys the same way, just a guy running around in banana hammock wearing metal nipple covers.

 

[nintendoman58]

Hey I'm not encouraging anyone to insult people

Spoiler

other than Key fans

Okay, I don't think KEY shows are nearly as good as many of its fans say they are (no offense Pshyco and Cornbread) but I feel like the sheer hatred geared towards their fans is waaaay too extreme.

Even when Corvo posted his two massive rants on why he thought KEY shows were the worst things ever, he never went as far to downright insult the fans!

Watching KEY shows feels like playing on a PvP server in WoW. You have to pick a side.

Are you with the KEY Alliance or the Anti-KEY Horde? Whatever side you choose in this server, there'll always be enemies out to attack you and kill your quest givers, so tread carefully viewer!

 

[Envelope]

my friends and I still go to each other "STRAAAAAAAAAAAAAAYAAAAAAAAAAAAANGE"



She's wearing both the world's smallest shirt and the world's smallest skirt.

I want somebody to design guys the same way, just a guy running around in banana hammock wearing metal nipple covers.

Vaan almost fits that criteria :^)

 

[NaDannMaGoGo]

Watching KEY shows feels like playing on a PvP server in WoW. You have to pick a side.

Are you with the KEY Alliance or the Anti-KEY Horde? Whatever side you choose in this server, there'll always be enemies out to attack you and kill your quest givers, so tread carefully viewer!

KEY Alliancers would actually just stand there with their gigantic eyes, ready to give in to the feels.

 

[Exalted]

Good as usual. Was kinda suprized that there was not an powerup/hero moment, there were atleast 3 moments where i thought for shure that now Lenka would do something and save the day, but no.. They got owned.

 

[striferser]

Outside of God Eater, what other shows in the last couple years have had clear production issues beyond the normal sort of "animation on some scenes was rushed so it looks kind of bad but will be fixed on the BD"?

the most notable is probably Girl and Panzer, last two episode are delayed for several month.
Special mention to: Yoru no yatterman-> Dat final episode quality...it so bad, the animator/staff apologize for it.

 

[duckroll]

Okay, I don't think KEY shows are nearly as good as many of its fans say they are (no offense Pshyco and Cornbread) but I feel like the sheer hatred geared towards their fans is waaaay too extreme.

I will share a personal story with you. When I was younger, I watched an anime called Key the Metal Idol on TV and really liked it. It's kinda niche, so not many people remember it or talk about it today. At some point lots of people in anime communities started taking about Key. Every time these conversations started, I would get excited and want to join in, only to discover that they weren't talking about the cyberpunk thriller I loved, but a bunch of moeified Korean melodramas based on porn games. Every. Single. Time. So Key is my eternal enemy. I am sorry.

 

[Admiral Woofington]

Okay, I don't think KEY shows are nearly as good as many of its fans say they are (no offense Pshyco and Cornbread) but I feel like the sheer hatred geared towards their fans is waaaay too extreme.

Even when Corvo posted his two massive rants on why he thought KEY shows were the worst things ever, he never went as far to downright insult the fans!

Watching KEY shows feels like playing on a PvP server in WoW. You have to pick a side.

Are you with the KEY Alliance or the Anti-KEY Horde? Whatever side you choose in this server, there'll always be enemies out to attack you and kill your quest givers, so tread carefully viewer!

You could always hate watch it or enjoy it but admit it has flaws and it's trashy. There's a difference between enjoying KEY and proclaiming it the best of the best in anime.

I will share a personal story with you. When I was younger, I watched an anime called Key the Metal Idol on TV and really liked it. It's kinda niche, so not many people remember it or talk about it today. At some point lots of people in anime communities started taking about Key. Every time these conversations started, I would get excited and want to join in, only to discover that they weren't talking about the cyberpunk thriller I loved, but a bunch of moeified Korean melodramas based on porn games. Every. Single. Time. So Key is my eternal enemy. I am sorry.

Key also used to give duckroll wet willies and called him 4 eyes.

I mean look at that avatar. 4 eyes, 4 eyes, he needs glasses to see!

 

[Taruranto]

I DON'T THINK THAT'S HOW BREAST WORK #7

Boy, I bet Utsutsu VA is having hella fun this season.

Looks like next episode the action will start. I'm enjoying this season, but I was wondering that was the point of them being Gatchman at this point.

Spoiler

I was kinda expecting Gelsadra to give birth.

 

[SliceSabre]

The past conversation has taught me I should insult the fanbase of a show more.

 

[nintendoman58]

I will share a personal story with you. When I was younger, I watched an anime called Key the Metal Idol on TV and really liked it. It's kinda niche, so not many people remember it or talk about it today. At some point lots of people in anime communities started taking about Key. Every time these conversations started, I would get excited and want to join in, only to discover that they weren't talking about the cyberpunk thriller I loved, but a bunch of moeified Korean melodramas based on porn games. Every. Single. Time. So Key is my eternal enemy. I am sorry.

I don't think KEY VNs have any porn in them.

But as someone who has been though similar experiences, I now understand how you feel completely. Thank you for sharing.

 

[Basileus777]

I don't think KEY VNs have any porn in them.

The older ones do, and even Little Busters has a porn edition.