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Summer Anime 2017 |OT| More streaming services than shows to watch
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Trojita
Rapid Response Threadmaker
Turin Turambar
Member
Speaking of Anno reusing old motifs...
Some weeks ago I watched Re:Cute Honey. To my surprise some of the plot elements of the third episode (the menace of USA launching a nuke to stop the big monster/thing, and the theme of Japan reaching a more mature state by being more independent of the US and taking care of their problems) were re-used in Shin Godzilla.
NaDannMaGoGo
Member
That's why Anno needs to do another RomCom/Drama à la KareKano! He doesn't let go off utility poles even there but otherwise, it's quite refreshing.
Just do something else Anno, and Shin Godzilla does not count because that was just a long live action Eva episode in essence.
Just do something else Anno, and Shin Godzilla does not count because that was just a long live action Eva episode in essence.
Turin Turambar
Member
In truth I agree with Jexhius, because Shin Godzilla showed he is truly a good director beyond NGE, and that also can do good live action. So condemning himself for several years to doing a remake of his own tv series which also is never going to be as good is just a waste of time, and a waste of his talent.
PdotMichael
Banned
Konosuba is art. Literally art!
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
Maybe I'd be more forgiving if they stopped going off-model every scene.
Jex
Member
Okay, so you've clarified your position. I don't think your assumption that being on or off-model directly correlates to animation quality holds much sway in 2017. It's a very outdated way of thinking, a relic from the distant past.
Well, perhaps not that distant past, considering that all classic Western animation used to feature characters 'going off model' to allow them to squash, stretch etc.
I don't even know where this meme about "off model" animation was born. Perhaps a generation of people grew up on shitty, stiff 80's western animation that barely featured any character movement and thought that animation was "supposed" to look like that. Not sure. Even the old Simpsons seasons used to have a ton of charismatic character animation but it got ironed out because the audience thought it looked 'wrong'. Sseems like a failure of education and imagination.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I have no idea what you are talking about.
NaDannMaGoGo
Member
Was that the driving force behind that change as opposed to less work via less animation?
Dedication Through Light
Member
Can't wait to watch my first Persona anime and experience the disappointment the rest of you regularly feel with a Persona anime adaptation.
Maybe ill wait for the anime and play the game afterwards like i did with p4 p4g and DeSu2. My p5 is still unopened and my backlog on ps4 is huge
PdotMichael
Banned
I think this was more a result of streamlining the animation process because the show is animation process is completely outsourced.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I have no idea what you are talking about, either. I'm just noting that I watched Season 1 straight through to Season 2 and it's pretty consistent that in Season 2 any time they're not specifically in focus the characters look like doodles, and its not specifically for comedy.
One Piece Baron Omatsuri and The Secret Island
Having read the manga, it doesn't take long to realize how much potential OP has as an animated series, given how slapstick and cartoon-like it is. This movie caters to that longing albeit its designs and style are noticeably different from how it appears in the manga, I don't mind that, I actually adore Takaaki Yamashita's(?) style. Paired with Sushio and Chikashi Kubota as the animation directors mentioned in the initial credits sequence this was turning out to be something to be excited about just on grounds of seeing the show in animated form (I did however watch bits and pieces of the show on YouTube to see how they've animated some key moments prior to this which were hit and miss). This stuck mostly towards its comedic tone with a lot of visual humor but nothing unseen in another show, the thing that I would say the movie misses out on is the reactions and faces that Oda draws in the manga, they're quite entertaining on their own, this has such moments and they're not bad at all but I'd still prefer Oda's style in this case. Action moments while not many pack a strong punch (excuse the pun) the few times it happens.
It really turned out to be an endearing story deceptive enough to feel like something right off the manga. I need to look up the writers once, they've probably let Oda make some choices or just heavily influenced by him. It's a One Piece story of course but I at some level expected something different. There's something about the atmosphere in the movie at times that's definitely unlike what I had imagined when reading, although, this isn't unusual for a Hosoda movie. The moments I speak of are more silent when the crew or the less noisy crew are on their own with little to do - when Chopper roams the city on his own.
Baron and the toothbrush moustache captain are two extreme entities of a similar situation who made different choices, this contrast was very nice in both understanding Baron's situation and that he could've made a good choice. The pirate family has a fairly simple premise but that didn't stop me from getting emotional over it by the end, it ties in with the finale smoothly.
Having read the manga, it doesn't take long to realize how much potential OP has as an animated series, given how slapstick and cartoon-like it is. This movie caters to that longing albeit its designs and style are noticeably different from how it appears in the manga, I don't mind that, I actually adore Takaaki Yamashita's(?) style. Paired with Sushio and Chikashi Kubota as the animation directors mentioned in the initial credits sequence this was turning out to be something to be excited about just on grounds of seeing the show in animated form (I did however watch bits and pieces of the show on YouTube to see how they've animated some key moments prior to this which were hit and miss). This stuck mostly towards its comedic tone with a lot of visual humor but nothing unseen in another show, the thing that I would say the movie misses out on is the reactions and faces that Oda draws in the manga, they're quite entertaining on their own, this has such moments and they're not bad at all but I'd still prefer Oda's style in this case. Action moments while not many pack a strong punch (excuse the pun) the few times it happens.
It really turned out to be an endearing story deceptive enough to feel like something right off the manga. I need to look up the writers once, they've probably let Oda make some choices or just heavily influenced by him. It's a One Piece story of course but I at some level expected something different. There's something about the atmosphere in the movie at times that's definitely unlike what I had imagined when reading, although, this isn't unusual for a Hosoda movie. The moments I speak of are more silent when the crew or the less noisy crew are on their own with little to do - when Chopper roams the city on his own.
Baron and the toothbrush moustache captain are two extreme entities of a similar situation who made different choices, this contrast was very nice in both understanding Baron's situation and that he could've made a good choice. The pirate family has a fairly simple premise but that didn't stop me from getting emotional over it by the end, it ties in with the finale smoothly.
Maybe ill wait for the anime and play the game afterwards like i did with p4 p4g and DeSu2. My p5 is still unopened and my backlog on ps4 is huge
Persona 5 is already AOTY and GOTY though.
hosannainexcelsis
Member
He is saying (and I agree) that you have an unnecessarily narrow view of what animation should be if you think that deformations of the characters that take them "off model" are unacceptable. I appreciate Konosuba's unapologetically loose approach to animation.
12 and a half hour flights are brutal, especially when you're flying economy. My legs are all sore. I ended up watching some Chibi Maruko-chan movie on the way there. It was okay, but it wasn't as good as the Turkish documentary I watched about stray cats in Istanbul right after.
Anyway, Shinjuku is really cool. Resisting the urge to blow my money at the arcade is tough, but it'll be worth it when I make it to Otome Road and blow my money there instead. I can't wait to be done this initial work stuff so that I can go explore more!
Anyway, Shinjuku is really cool. Resisting the urge to blow my money at the arcade is tough, but it'll be worth it when I make it to Otome Road and blow my money there instead. I can't wait to be done this initial work stuff so that I can go explore more!
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
It's clearly not intentional.
well it's probably budget intentional
Jex
Member
I will return to my original "Oh Boy", except with added emphasis.
It is 100% intentional. There's interviews out there covering this.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
I mean, okay, I don't buy that, but you're free to believe whatever you want. I'm not saying that to belittle you, I'm saying it because you already admitted nothing will convince you so there's no point in having an argument about it. I'm certainly not suggesting that doesn't go both ways because an interview with the creative minds saying they did it on purpose isn't going to convince me either because of course they're going to say it goes off-model constantly on purpose.
Hellwarden
Member
Prey 20 Hours In
Prey is one of those games that I think would almost wholly improved by a reduction of or complete removal of combat from the game. That's a lot to ask of course, but Prey's combat system isn't even half baked, and what little is there isn't satisfying. Fights in Prey boil down to which side can successfully cripple and out DSP the other first. Honestly, Psychoshock+Shotgun will end most fights in seconds, especially since you get a critical hit bonus for sneak attacks, and sneaking up on enemies is stupid easy. The same cripple+DPS mantra basically applies to the player character, as many enemies are capable of stunning you, and many have tracking attacks/can damage the player just by standing near them. So despite Prey being a game that seems to want you mess around with your neat psychic powers, there is no incentive to. Just psychoshock+shotgun your way through the game. All other abilities/items in the game become niche situational "Oh, I guess I could do that if I wanted to" gimmicks.
Also are the poltergeist enemies supposed to be a joke?
Prey is one of those games that I think would almost wholly improved by a reduction of or complete removal of combat from the game. That's a lot to ask of course, but Prey's combat system isn't even half baked, and what little is there isn't satisfying. Fights in Prey boil down to which side can successfully cripple and out DSP the other first. Honestly, Psychoshock+Shotgun will end most fights in seconds, especially since you get a critical hit bonus for sneak attacks, and sneaking up on enemies is stupid easy. The same cripple+DPS mantra basically applies to the player character, as many enemies are capable of stunning you, and many have tracking attacks/can damage the player just by standing near them. So despite Prey being a game that seems to want you mess around with your neat psychic powers, there is no incentive to. Just psychoshock+shotgun your way through the game. All other abilities/items in the game become niche situational "Oh, I guess I could do that if I wanted to" gimmicks.
Also are the poltergeist enemies supposed to be a joke?
PdotMichael
Banned
Enjoy the nightlife in Shinjuku. Kabukichou is a great place to get wasted.
hosannainexcelsis
Member
You should read this interview with character designer and chief animation director Koichi Kikuta from the July 2016 issue of Anime Style.
You don't have to like Kikuta's animation philosophy or Konosuba's approach to animation, but I hope at least you will not believe that Kikuta is lying in this interview for some bizarre reason.
It's understandable.
Kakegurui 5
The facial expressions are seriously the best part of the show, followed by the intoxicated reactions those expressions are attached to.
Angry Grimace
Two cannibals are eating a clown. One turns to the other and says "does something taste funny to you?"
It's not a "bizarre reason," it's that if someone asks "why is this constantly going off-model" the obvious answer an animator is going to give in a series like Konosuba is going to be "stylistic decision" rather than "we didn't have enough money to hire animators who would correct it," because nobody likes the second answer and enough people will buy the first answer.
Like I said, it's not ruining the series or anything, but it's noticeable.
I can't get too wasted tonight at least, I have some work related stuff to get to in the morning.
Maybe another night!Dedication Through Light
Member
Bahamuto Virgin Souls Episode 17
I just want everyone to have a happy end so the ED can be canon. Sweet episode. And Mugaro and Azazel can have happiness too.
I just want everyone to have a happy end so the ED can be canon. Sweet episode. And Mugaro and Azazel can have happiness too.
It doesn't. It's not a subjective thing either. Konosuba looks great and is one of the best animated shows from recent memory. The talent, creativity, and budget are all blatantly apparent, so to deride that aspect of the show is ???
It does from what I remember. Almost all TV anime these days have certain parts that are of lower quality than the others. Some are obvious and some less so. I say that it bugged me in Konosuba but really, it bugs me in just about any anime.
Crimson_Echidna
Banned
It's an Aniplex title so that's not likely.
When we're talking about an industry where even shows which sell literally jack shit have "enough money" to correct scenes which are actually unintentionally off model in the home video releases, it seems highly implausible that they would have to actually lie about something like that for a successful show. If it is something they didn't want to talk about at all, it simply wouldn't be asked in interviews, because that's how the Japanese entertainment press work.
Hellwarden
Member
I think the on/off model discussion is an odd one, because if we define being on-model as being consistent in form and style of animation, then I think shows that have consistently on-model characters are kind of a rare thing. Due to a variety of factors, production demands, outsourcing, animator quirks, etc.
hosannainexcelsis
Member
There's several misconceptions about the way the anime industry works here.
First, consistency in animation is easier achieved by fewer animators, not by more. The more animators that are working on a project, the more inconsistencies will crop up between different personal styles and the harder it is to communicate desired consistencies between all the people drawing various scenes. When the number of animators and animation directors grows, that is not a sign that the animation quality will be better but that the deadline was so tight that the production needed more people to divide the work among simply to get anything out at all by the broadcast date.
This leads to the second misconception here: you imply that budget is the primary limiting factor on animation quality, when in fact schedule is. Inconsistent quality in animation between different episodes and scenes, especially when later episodes of a show have worse animation than earlier episodes - that's not a sign that "the money ran out" but that the schedule became increasingly tighter as the production went on, and thus the animators had less time to polish their own and other people's works. The less time you have to produce something, the harder it is to keep its quality high. The schedule of Konosuba is something Kikuta is frank about in this interview - he states that he was able to review fewer cuts with each successive episode that he oversaw as chief animation director, which is why he decided to take such a hands-on role with episode 9 (of season 1). Look at the common practice of BD corrections - shows such as Samurai Flamenco don't get their animation polished between the TV broadcast and the BD release because the staff found some more yen under the couch to pay for better animation, but because the extra time allows the staff to correct unintended mistakes and poor quality work that they did not have the time to correct before the episode had to air.
Third, you seem to think that animators have some motivation to lie about unintentional poor quality animation in order to make themselves or the production look better. There is no evidence of this. Animators, if they speak up, are usually forthright about their own work - they have their pride as artists after all. When productions end up so behind schedule that they have to air unfinished, animators will often say as much on Twitter. In cases such as Psycho-Pass episode 18 or the finale of Yoru no Yatterman, directors and animators involved stated openly on Twitter that they were unable to properly complete the episode for television, apologized, and implored viewers to watch the finished version when it came out on BD. They didn't lie and say that unfinished, shoddy work was actually intentionally that way. Especially if you consider the source of this interview - the magazine Anime Style, which makes a speciality of in-depth interviews with animation staff which get into the nitty-gritty of the choices made on a production - and examine how detailed and forthcoming Kikuta is about his work in it, there's no reason for Kikuta to lie here.
Ultimately, while artistic preferences will of course very, we can't delude ourselves into believing that all artists share our own preferences and thus if they make a work we don't like it's because they made an accidental mistake.
Valdfellgar
Banned
I think there's also a difference between what Konosuba does and true 'off model' work. Konosuba plays fast and loose with the models of the characters in order to achieve amusing or silly expressions to further aid the comedy of the series and provide a more outlandish, silly and thorough look at its quirky characters, really allowing their personalities to shine.
True 'off model' work is where the characters look clunky, lacking detail, or suffer bizarre deformities in their faces or limbs for extended shots that sit entirely at odds with the overall production. Konosuba, as I recall from S1 and S2, hardly ever looks like that.
If you want to see actual off model, disappointing artwork I think My First Girlfriend is a Gal has looked weak from the start, or the last six episodes of Seven Mortal Sins exhibit this disappointing off model trend far more than anything in Konosuba.
True 'off model' work is where the characters look clunky, lacking detail, or suffer bizarre deformities in their faces or limbs for extended shots that sit entirely at odds with the overall production. Konosuba, as I recall from S1 and S2, hardly ever looks like that.
If you want to see actual off model, disappointing artwork I think My First Girlfriend is a Gal has looked weak from the start, or the last six episodes of Seven Mortal Sins exhibit this disappointing off model trend far more than anything in Konosuba.
Dedication Through Light
Member
RE Creators Ep 16
Nice they used the characters vas as Kanoya and selesia in the elimination chamber festival, mindblown.
The onsen was fun and great for giving us some relaxing moments before serious plot.
Nice they used the characters vas as Kanoya and selesia in the elimination chamber festival, mindblown.
The onsen was fun and great for giving us some relaxing moments before serious plot.
AquaWateria
Member
Can't wait to watch my first Persona anime and experience the disappointment the rest of you regularly feel with a Persona anime adaptation.
They should of did it like Persona 3 through movies.
So much better than Persona 4 Animation.
darkside31337
Tomodachi wa Mahou
Can't wait to watch my first Persona anime and experience the disappointment the rest of you regularly feel with a Persona anime adaptation.
Persona 5 is my favorite game this year but I have absolutely zero interest in watching the anime.
I still don't really get what the point of the Persona anime series are. They're never good and they never match the feel of the games or the style of them. P4 anime was really bad.
AquaWateria
Member
Movies are a better option. Persona 3 was enjoyable for that reason.
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