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Super Best Friends Thread 10: Frienders Support Straight Shota

S

skLaFarebear

Member
Xiraiya said:
The problem is that isn't a reliable way of judging, because everyone is all over the place convinced of this and that.

There is actually nothing really in TTGL that makes it that much better than say a typical shonen series, it's shorter and animated at higher quality than most, but when you strip everything away, there's not a whole lot of difference in how those things are constructed, so while they praise it relentlessly, they dismiss and rag on other series and get all extreme and agitated about it, from the outside, they look ridiculous and hypocritical in some ways (nothing you can do about that), both Bleach and Naruto are seriously flawed and have moments throughout that are pretty subpar and I do agree that's a problem with a series going on for 10 or so years, but at the same time, there are also really good parts of those series that I think are worth appreciating, even if an arc here or there isn't ideal.

I shill Gintama, I like it a lot because it does a lot of different things extremely well and has what I find to be a great sense of humor, the writing is better than it has any right to be, so naturally I want people to check it out, however it's not everyone's cup of tea, and that's fine.

It's my favorite series, is it the best series? I doubt it. (They're two different things)
Click to expand...

You're also talking to someone who isn't in massive amounts of unfiltered love with Gurren so I can see where you're coming from. Naruto and Bleach obviously have their good moments, but are ruined by the fact that they've been going on for so long. It builds up so much hype that you just end up not caring about it anymore. Naruto is the perfect example with its decade of building up Naruto vs Sasuke, and when it actually happened no one cared anymore because they already moved on to shipping characters instead. Pacing is a very important structure of any game/anime and Naruto and Bleach are severely hurt by their pacing.

Almost any long show suffers from this though. That's just how it is. Not every episode is gonna be as well paced as the last and some arcs are gonna be slower than others because its extremely difficult to keep a well paced show going for 100s of episodes or dozens of hours. Even the good stuff like Ippo and Hunter x Hunter suffer from this and I have to imagine the same for Gintama, as good as you say it is.
 
V

VidulaSaix

Member
croten said:
Don't get me wrong, Gintama sounds great and I would love to watch it. The motivation isn't the problem, it's just that I don't watch long running anime. That's all. I'm sorry I'm missing out on you guys' favorite thing but it's too long for me to give it a chance.
Click to expand...

That's fine.

CthulhuSushi said:
This is my issue with most long running anime.

Usually they have filler that just waste my time by going off from the main story. Plus if it takes me upwards of three months to get caught up..that shit is too long.
Click to expand...

Why are people always on such a rush to get through things? Wouldn't you rather something stay entertaining on a consistent basis instead of end leaving you wanting more?
 
X

Xiraiya

Member
CthulhuSushi said:
This is my issue with most long running anime.
Usually they have filler that just waste my time by going off from the main story. Plus if it takes me upwards of three months to get caught up..that shit is too long.
Click to expand...

Gintama doesn't really have filler because it doesn't flow in the way a normal story does, the only filler was this special double episode that aired in certain areas of Japan when it first began as an anime, so Episode 3 is where the Manga starts.
 
D

demidar

Member
ArclightBorealis said:
This is probably why I'd never use twitter if I were ever in his position. I'd probably go way more fucking raw on them to the point it would prove difficult to get a job afterwards.

So for that, god bless Kamiya and his nigh infinite patience for reading nearly ever tweet and responding to them. As well as the time to do all that while making games.
Click to expand...

Yep, stupid people can't be reasoned with, a Twitter is full of idiots.

skLaFarebear said:
You're also talking to someone who isn't in massive amounts of unfiltered love with Gurren so I can see where you're coming from. Naruto and Bleach obviously have their good moments, but are ruined by the fact that they've been going on for so long. It builds up so much hype that you just end up not caring about it anymore. Naruto is the perfect example with its decade of building up Naruto vs Sasuke, and when it actually happened no one cared anymore because they already moved on to shipping characters instead. Pacing is a very important structure of any game/anime and Naruto and Bleach are severely hurt by their pacing.

Almost any long show suffers from this though. That's just how it is. Not every episode is gonna be as well paced as the last and some arcs are gonna be slower than others because its extremely difficult to keep a well paced show going for 100s of episodes or dozens of hours. Even the good stuff like Ippo and Hunter x Hunter suffer from this and I have to imagine the same for Gintama, as good as you say it is.
Click to expand...

Actually Gintama has very little filler and is on a consistent upwards trend contrary to many long running shows not named One Piece.
 
Z

zedreamcast

Member
Alfebit said:
You mean the parts that were supposed to make you uncomfortable?
Click to expand...
Yeah uncomfortable
giphy.gif
 
C

CthulhuSushi

Banned
VidulaSaix said:
That's fine.



Why are people always on such a rush to get through things? Wouldn't you rather something stay entertaining on a consistent basis instead of end leaving you wanting more?
Click to expand...
It's not that I'm in a rush. I've never watched Gintama so I won't throw it in, but usually the pacing is awful and really drawn out and I just lose all interest in the story.

Xiraiya said:
Gintama doesn't really have filler because it doesn't flow in the way a normal story does, the only filler was this special double episode that aired in certain areas of Japan when it first began as an anime, so Episode 3 is where the Manga starts.
Click to expand...
I'll give it a shot..because you guys are bros..and I trust your judgement.
 
S

skLaFarebear

Member
ArclightBorealis said:
This is probably why I'd never use twitter if I were ever in his position. I'd probably go way more fucking raw on them to the point it would prove difficult to get a job afterwards.

So for that, god bless Kamiya and his nigh infinite patience for reading nearly ever tweet and responding to them. As well as the time to do all that while making games.
Click to expand...

Bless that man's soul. He truly is the hero of our time.

Maragidyne said:
I'm pretty sure most big-name guys have a massive amounts of idiotic followers that ask them the dumbest shit. Doesn't really justify his occasional shitty and really weird behavior. And I say that as a Kamiya fanboy.
Click to expand...

I think it totally does justify it. I wish those other big name guys, regardless of your job would be assholes to their idiot followers. Obviously if you're a small time guy, you can't really say that shit because you can't afford to lose any customers, but if you're as accomplished as someone like Kamiya, then fire away on those dumbasses. I follow Kamiya on twitter and seeing him answer the same question at least 30 times has to take a lot out of him.

If people don't want to educate themselves, then why should he? Block them and telling them to fuck off will do a lot more good for them.
 
A

Aaron-Lagann

Banned
Xiraiya said:
Gintama doesn't really have filler because it doesn't flow in the way a normal story does, the only filler was this special double episode that aired in certain areas of Japan when it first began as an anime, so Episode 3 is where the Manga starts.
Click to expand...

You could easily make the argument that Gintama is all filler between nothing. The best kind.
 
A

Alfebit

Banned
Maragidyne said:
I mean the costume designs after transformation. You do ignore it afterwards and it's there for a reason, but it doesn't make it any better and it's clearly there as fanservice as well.
Click to expand...

Ok. I thought you were talking about
Satsuki/mom bad touch and weird inside Ryuko's mind 3 way.
 
B

Banana Aeon

Member
I won't lie, the sheer insanity of the TTGL fanbase impresses me. And if the show left an impression on that many people, there has to be something.

When I first watched the show, emotionally, I was at the lowest point in my life, so the over the top themes, and the never giving up message, bounced off my like a super ball bouncing of a brick wall of cynicism and bitterness. I did go back to the show, when I was in better spirits, and gave the show another shot.

It's was fine. It was a fun package, but nothing I'm going to rave about. Just a well written shonen, with likable characters.

And that's fine.
 
C

CthulhuSushi

Banned
demidar said:
Just know it's slow going in the beginning as they're introducing characters and establishing personalities.
Click to expand...

Alright well..I'll give it a shot..as long as it's not 30 episodes slow like HxH then I'll be fine.

Banana Aeon said:
I won't lie, the sheer insanity of the TTGL fanbase impresses me. And if the show left an impression on that many people, there has to be something.

When I first watched the show, emotionally, I was at the lowest point in my life, so the over the top themes, and the never giving up message, bounced off my like a super ball bouncing of a brick wall of cynicism and bitterness. I did go back to the show, when I was in better spirits, and gave the show another shot.

It's was fine. It was a fun package, but nothing I'm going to rave about. Just a well written shonen, with likable characters.

And that's fine.
Click to expand...

That show straight up taught me how to be a fucking man.
Kamiya was the closest thing to a role model I had growing up.
 
B

Beloved

Member
skLaFarebear said:
You're also talking to someone who isn't in massive amounts of unfiltered love with Gurren so I can see where you're coming from. Naruto and Bleach obviously have their good moments, but are ruined by the fact that they've been going on for so long. It builds up so much hype that you just end up not caring about it anymore. Naruto is the perfect example with its decade of building up Naruto vs Sasuke, and when it actually happened no one cared anymore because they already moved on to shipping characters instead. Pacing is a very important structure of any game/anime and Naruto and Bleach are severely hurt by their pacing.

Almost any long show suffers from this though. That's just how it is. Not every episode is gonna be as well paced as the last and some arcs are gonna be slower than others because its extremely difficult to keep a well paced show going for 100s of episodes or dozens of hours. Even the good stuff like Ippo and Hunter x Hunter suffer from this and I have to imagine the same for Gintama, as good as you say it is.
Click to expand...

Yeah long series suffer from a lot of issues, it happens a lot with shows as well, while the occasional TV show can go 10 years strong with no subpar seasons, most shows, regardless of how good the story is, usually start running out of steam after 5 seasons.

Manga often ends up with a similar problem.
 
V

VidulaSaix

Member
CthulhuSushi said:
It's not that I'm in a rush. I've never watched Gintama so I won't throw it in, but usually the pacing is awful and really drawn out and I just lose all interest in the story.
Click to expand...

The pacing of the first 30 or so episodes is pretty god damn terrible but that's just the way a lot of anime were back in those days. If you ever feel the want, use Xiraiya's list he posted of recommended episode and just watch those.
 
X

Xiraiya

Member
skLaFarebear said:
Almost any long show suffers from this though. That's just how it is. Not every episode is gonna be as well paced as the last and some arcs are gonna be slower than others because its extremely difficult to keep a well paced show going for 100s of episodes or dozens of hours. Even the good stuff like Ippo and Hunter x Hunter suffer from this and I have to imagine the same for Gintama, as good as you say it is.
Click to expand...
There is no way for me to tell you this that could convince you that it's coming from a more unbiased place, but it really doesn't, not because "It's just that good" but because of the format in which it is written that causes it to be far less suspectable to that kind of decay in quality over time, the author just writes what he wants to write and will continue to do so until he feels like he doesn't want to.

Gintama's final chapter could the most insanely hype battle in Jump, or it might be a chapter where Gin slept all day and it's from a perspective of a fly on a wall where absolutely fucking nothing happens, and then the Manga's done, that's just how Gintama is.
 
S

ShakuganSan

Member
I'm kinda curious, to the people who watched gintama, when did you start getting in to it? The only reason why I got through the whole thing was because I was at a time where I had a shit ton of free time, and that was 4 years ago, now I'm finding that I don't have a lot of time to watch or play anything any more. So I wanna see if the people who watch through gintama started at a time where they were pretty much free
 
S

skLaFarebear

Member
Beloved said:
Yeah long series suffer from a lot of issues, it happens a lot with shows as well, while the occasional TV show can go 10 years strong with no subpar seasons, most shows, regardless of how good the story is, usually start running out of steam after 5 seasons.

Manga often ends up with a similar problem.
Click to expand...

I notice that sitcoms are definitely hit the hardest by this. I actually enjoyed the first few seasons or so of Big Bang Theory, but that show went so downhill fast that I just had to stop. For shows though, it sucks that there are shows that have to live on a season by season basis or I think a lot of them would be better than they actually are. Its not a coincidence that something like Korra is considered not that good when the first two seasons (everyone's least favorite seasons) lived on a season by season basis without the writers ever knowing if it would get a sequel. Then they finally got a S3 and 4 and all of a sudden the show is great. Imagine what could have happened if all four were all guaranteed from the start.
 
A

ArclightBorealis

Member
skLaFarebear said:
Bless that man's soul. He truly is the hero of our time.



I think it totally does justify it. I wish those other big name guys, regardless of your job would be assholes to their idiot followers. Obviously if you're a small time guy, you can't really say that shit because you can't afford to lose any customers, but if you're as accomplished as someone like Kamiya, then fire away on those dumbasses. I follow Kamiya on twitter and seeing him answer the same question at least 30 times has to take a lot out of him.

If people don't want to educate themselves, then why should he? Block them and telling them to fuck off will do a lot more good for them.
Click to expand...
You know what I just realized as super bizarre? Itagaki's facebook responses regarding Devil's Third and anything he's worked on. Other than a couple jabs at Team Ninja after he left regarding NG and DOA, he's been coming off as so much less arrogant than he was in the past. He doesn't really come off as a asshole these days (unless you still count him wearing shades all the damn time as that).

To think a decade ago he was talking massive shit against Playstation, Tekken, or any version of Ninja Gaiden or DOA that did not have his involvement. Now, with how long it's taken for Devil's Third to be made, he's just going on about how excited he is to get it done and show it. Admittedly with worse English than Kamiya's or Harada's. But dammit, his passion is showing way clearer than it did in the past.
 
V

VidulaSaix

Member
Banana Aeon said:
If I want to finish this, I'm going to need to read it.

Long runners are not friendly to me.
Click to expand...

If reading works better for you then that's fine, but I can't vouch for early subs. I only recently started reading the manga.

ShakuganSan said:
I'm kinda curious, to the people who watched gintama, when did you start getting in to it? The only reason why I got through the whole thing was because I was at a time where I had a shit ton of free time, and that was 4 years ago, now I'm finding that I don't have a lot of time to watch or play anything any more. So I wanna see if the people who watch through gintama started at a time where they were pretty much free
Click to expand...

I honestly can't even remember. I'd known about it for years because of Xiraiya's nagging but I caught up when the anime reached the Renho Arc.
 
C

croten

Member
VidulaSaix said:
That's fine.



Why are people always on such a rush to get through things? Wouldn't you rather something stay entertaining on a consistent basis instead of end leaving you wanting more?
Click to expand...

Honestly? No, I want things to be paced properly and end when they should. My biggest problem with Berserk is that it's been going on for so long and there is still no end in sight. TTGL, for example, made me feel content at the end, I didn't want any more than I got because I got enough.

Long running series also have far more time to fuck things up. Look at western shows for example, people are always saying that the newest episodes of X,Y,Z are crap because they've been going on for so long and it's been milked to death. Do you think Firefly would have become as much of a cult hit if it didn't end when it did? I think Joss weadon planned for 7 seasons, even I can say that it would have gone downhill after the first few. I like things that are short because they don't suffer that problem, they end before it goes to shit. Maybe Gintama is prefect all the time, I won't risk it however. I'm not getting invested in that.

I mean fuck, I just started playing Far Cry 4 not too long ago and I'm about 2/3rds into it but I haven't played in weeks and I don't feel like playing it at all anymore, yet I love it. It's simply too long for me too care.
 
B

Beloved

Member
ShakuganSan said:
I'm kinda curious, to the people who watched gintama, when did you start getting in to it? The only reason why I got through the whole thing was because I was at a time where I had a shit ton of free time, and that was 4 years ago, now I'm finding that I don't have a lot of time to watch or play anything any more. So I wanna see if the people who watch through gintama started at a time where they were pretty much free
Click to expand...

It took me forever to watch all of Gintama and it was nearly 3 years ago so there weren't even as many eps as now, granted I rarely marathoned it hard (usually just 3-5 eps in a given day at most). I was working full time and also had a lot of other stuff I was watching in my free time so it was...months, before I caught up.

It became one of my favorite shows ever.
 
X

Xiraiya

Member
ShakuganSan said:
I'm kinda curious, to the people who watched gintama, when did you start getting in to it? The only reason why I got through the whole thing was because I was at a time where I had a shit ton of free time, and that was 4 years ago, now I'm finding that I don't have a lot of time to watch or play anything any more. So I wanna see if the people who watch through gintama started at a time where they were pretty much free
Click to expand...

When I started watching it on my own in I guess 2009/2010, I was entertained by it up until about the 20's, then I really started liking it, and then creeping into the 30's/40's onwards I was like "Okaaay there is definitely something special here"

And then I think the Benizakura arc was the arc that made me be like "This series has everything I want in all the right ways, I love it"
 
R

RecursiveFault

Banned
skLaFarebear said:
I notice that sitcoms are definitely hit the hardest by this. I actually enjoyed the first few seasons or so of Big Bang Theory, but that show went so downhill fast that I just had to stop. For shows though, it sucks that there are shows that have to live on a season by season basis or I think a lot of them would be better than they actually are. Its not a coincidence that something like Korra is considered not that good when the first two seasons (everyone's least favorite seasons) lived on a season by season basis without the writers ever knowing if it would get a sequel. Then they finally got a S3 and 4 and all of a sudden the show is great. Imagine what could have happened if all four were all guaranteed from the start.
Click to expand...
I fucking hate television. Every good shows is drawn out way farther than it ever should be and it's fucking terrible and ruins great shows.
 
C

CthulhuSushi

Banned
skLaFarebear said:
I notice that sitcoms are definitely hit the hardest by this. I actually enjoyed the first few seasons or so of Big Bang Theory, but that show went so downhill fast that I just had to stop. For shows though, it sucks that there are shows that have to live on a season by season basis or I think a lot of them would be better than they actually are. Its not a coincidence that something like Korra is considered not that good when the first two seasons (everyone's least favorite seasons) lived on a season by season basis without the writers ever knowing if it would get a sequel. Then they finally got a S3 and 4 and all of a sudden the show is great. Imagine what could have happened if all four were all guaranteed from the start.
Click to expand...

I could never watch BBT..I was introduced to it in high school and watched it once..it's just nerd fandom dumbed down for people who don't understand it to be able to find it funny.
 
S

skLaFarebear

Member
ArclightBorealis said:
You know what I just realized as super bizarre? Itagaki's facebook responses regarding Devil's Third and anything he's worked on. Other than a couple jabs at Team Ninja after he left regarding NG and DOA, he's been coming off as so much less arrogant than he was in the past. He doesn't really come off as a asshole these days (unless you still count him wearing shades all the damn time as that).

To think a decade ago he was talking massive shit against Playstation, Tekken, or any version of Ninja Gaiden or DOA that did not have his involvement. Now, with how long it's taken for Devil's Third to be made, he's just going on about how excited he is to get it done and show it. Admittedly with worse English than Kamiya's or Harada's. But dammit, his passion is showing way clearer than it did in the past.
Click to expand...

I can only imagine. When you work on a project that long I think his sense of relief is pouring over moreso than his bitterness at others. Its got to be a refreshing time.

Xiraiya said:
There is no way for me to tell you this that could convince you that it's coming from a more unbiased place, but it really doesn't, not because "It's just that good" but because of the format in which it is written that causes it to be far less suspectable to that kind of decay in quality over time, the author just writes what he wants to write and will continue to do so until he feels like he doesn't want to.

Gintama's final chapter could the most insanely hype battle in Jump, or it might be a chapter where Gin slept all day and it's from a perspective of a fly on a wall where absolutely fucking nothing happens, and then the Manga's done, that's just how Gintama is.
Click to expand...

Alright. I put KLK on hold till the full dub comes out. I was thinking of starting Attack on Titan, but I think its about time I got around to starting Gintama.
 
B

Banana Aeon

Member
CthulhuSushi said:
I could throw about 6 Supernatural RomCom animes your way so you can be an emotional wreck for those five days if you'd like.
Click to expand...
Unless these romances have some extremely dark elements, it ain't going to affect me.
VidulaSaix said:
If reading works better for you then that's fine, but I can't vouch for early subs. I only recently started reading the manga.
Click to expand...
I'll give watching it a shoot, I'm just scared that I won't finish it, not because I'm not enjoying, but because I'll take a break, and stop watching.
 
S

skLaFarebear

Member
CthulhuSushi said:
I could never watch BBT..I was introduced to it in high school and watched it once..it's just nerd fandom dumbed down for people who don't understand it to be able to find it funny.
Click to expand...

I was in a foreign country and honestly had nothing better to watch. Its good if you really turn your brain off and decide to just watch it, but yeah its really bad now. Really bad.

Mrgoodwil said:
I fucking hate television. Every good shows is drawn out way farther than it ever should be and it's fucking terrible and ruins great shows.
Click to expand...

When the person licensing your show says "no make more its not allowed to be done" its got to be absolutely frustrating as a writer.
 
B

Beloved

Member
skLaFarebear said:
I notice that sitcoms are definitely hit the hardest by this. I actually enjoyed the first few seasons or so of Big Bang Theory, but that show went so downhill fast that I just had to stop. For shows though, it sucks that there are shows that have to live on a season by season basis or I think a lot of them would be better than they actually are. Its not a coincidence that something like Korra is considered not that good when the first two seasons (everyone's least favorite seasons) lived on a season by season basis without the writers ever knowing if it would get a sequel. Then they finally got a S3 and 4 and all of a sudden the show is great. Imagine what could have happened if all four were all guaranteed from the start.
Click to expand...

Yeah I had a similar issue with BBT, I really enjoyed the first few seasons but ended up losing interest.

However my favorite sitcom of all time is Friends and it managed 10 seasons just fine, there isn't a subpar one in the bunch. I think it ended at the right time though, if it had gone longer it would've gone downhill and it's always disappointing to see a show you love fall flat.

Speaking of series that fall flat, I still get butthurt any time I think about How I Met Your Mother. Goddammit
 
C

CthulhuSushi

Banned
skLaFarebear said:
I was in a foreign country and honestly had nothing better to watch. Its good if you really turn your brain off and decide to just watch it, but yeah its really bad now. Really bad.



When the person licensing your show says "no make more its not allowed to be done" its got to be absolutely frustrating as a writer.
Click to expand...

I seen the one where Jim Parsons gets the Spock figure and loses his shit..

I was just screaming fuck you at the tv the whole time.
Beloved said:
Yeah I had a similar issue with BBT, I really enjoyed the first few seasons but ended up losing interest.

However my favorite sitcom of all time is Friends and it managed 10 seasons just fine, there isn't a subpar one in the bunch. I think it ended at the right time though, if it had gone longer it would've gone downhill and it's always disappointing to see a show you love fall flat.

Speaking of series that fall flat, I still get butthurt any time I think about How I Met Your Mother. Goddammit
Click to expand...
Friends was the one series that stuck for me and that I legit watched from start to finish.
 
S

skLaFarebear

Member
Beloved said:
Yeah I had a similar issue with BBT, I really enjoyed the first few seasons but ended up losing interest.

However my favorite sitcom of all time is Friends and it managed 10 seasons just fine, there isn't a subpar one in the bunch. I think it ended at the right time though, if it had gone longer it would've gone downhill and it's always disappointing to see a show you love fall flat.

Speaking of series that fall flat, I still get butthurt any time I think about How I Met Your Mother. Goddammit
Click to expand...

How I met Your Mother was SO GOOD. And then I heard it was getting bad and jumped ship. I really should get back to it because I hear the last episode is actually pretty good, but damn that's a show that had a lot of potential.

Xiraiya said:
I'd almost say to watch AOT first since it's shorter, I thought AOT was pretty rad.
Click to expand...

You're probably right. I've owned the blu rays for a while and its about time I've seen it. All of Gintama is on crunchyroll anyway whenever I wanna see it.
 
X

Xiraiya

Member
Beloved said:
Yeah I had a similar issue with BBT, I really enjoyed the first few seasons but ended up losing interest.

However my favorite sitcom of all time is Friends and it managed 10 seasons just fine, there isn't a subpar one in the bunch. I think it ended at the right time though, if it had gone longer it would've gone downhill and it's always disappointing to see a show you love fall flat.

Speaking of series that fall flat, I still get butthurt any time I think about How I Met Your Mother. Goddammit
Click to expand...

Me too.

Me. Fucking. Too.
 
C

croten

Member
skLaFarebear said:
How I met Your Mother was SO GOOD. And then I heard it was getting bad and jumped ship. I really should get back to it because I hear the last episode is actually pretty good, but damn that's a show that had a lot of potential.



You're probably right. I've owned the blu rays for a while and its about time I've seen it. All of Gintama is on crunchyroll anyway whenever I wanna see it.
Click to expand...

AoT is pretty decent. Don't go in expecting the most in depth writing or anything. Fun show though
 
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