In the video it goes day by day with all the unlocks.
Super Mario Maker: Not all tools available from the start, unlock over 9 days
- Thread starter ElectricBlanketFire
- Start date
"maintaining quality" Oh boy. They're doing it this way to get people used to the idea that new content is going to be unlocked through the life of the title. There is no other reason you can't use Fire Flower on the first day. It seems to be working for Splatoon, so expect more games-as-a-service stuff from the company.
Forkball's posts in the first few pages of this thread should be collected in a chapbook.
Forkball's posts in the first few pages of this thread should be collected in a chapbook.
Orakio Rob
Member
Booker.DeWitt
Member
like some people said, in 10 days after launch everything will be fine
Scientist Supreme!
Banned
Shame he's going to get destroyed over having a different opinion.
Vital Tundra
Member
Coming back to this topic after a day to think, and I kind of like this method.
Tertullian
Member
It's a level editor. The whole game is literally just a level editor, sold to people dreaming about all the cool Mario levels they're excited to make.
You really can't see the difference? Seriously?
wild wild rice
Member
Parish the voice of reason as usual.
Captain Europe
Member
It seems that when something works the first time Nintendo loves repeating it, just like repeating the Wii name, that sure turned out great.
Really hope they don't do this for the next MK and Smash.
That's not how it works, have you been paying attention? the 9 days thing remains regardless of when you buy it.
Personally, I have no issue with that because I don't think it's so important that people have access to all tools day one if that's the way the game is designed. Just my two cents, though. I understand this is a polarizing issue. To me the counter-point would be to say that you should be able to have access to all levels when starting a game.
If I am the poster you were referring to, I can assure you that is not what I was trying to say at all. I think it's entirely possible the reviewers' copies will have the same limitations as those of the retail copies, but regardless I just don't think it makes a massive difference in the grand scheme of the experience of the game as I understand it.
wild wild rice
Member
I don't think he posts on GAF.
You're doing the Lord's work, Parish.
The unlock schedule image RagnarokX posted is interesting, particularly the variation in the number of things unlocked each day. I'm betting there were countless discussions on how many and which things to present each day.
Incidentally, it'd be nice if we could drop the thought that people who think this scheme is a good idea are "just fanboys". At least some of us have grown to appreciate Nintendo's design choices over the years, and are intrigued by this one as well, curious about the positive impact it could havejust like many other design decisions. It may also backfire, but them's the breaks.
I'm feeling a little bit like it's 2001 and we're seeing Wind Waker's demo for the first time again.
Scientist Supreme!
Banned
I meant the Comment section or Twitter.
Why assume an adult knows what they're doing more than a kid?
Did you see E3? Lots of demos were just people throwing oodles of giant enemies everywhere. Being adult doesn't make you a pro designer.
Or should I say, does anyone ever choose the option that locks them out?
Sho_Nuff82
Member
You mean the game that didn't sell nearly as well as its predecessor or successor?
It doesnt work like that....
The reasonable dissent crowd arent arguing against that progressive unlock content. Thats has been in gaming from the start.
Further more Mario Marker is more of a creation tool, than video game. So it makes since that they should give you everything after you press start.
No as I repeatedly stated in this thread, the argument for "drip-feeding" is very legit. The process is what is nonsensical.
Thats what both extreme sides of the argument is missing.
1. No one is saying that the method is "Not ok" So saying I dont see the problem is missing the point.
2. Its not game breaking, or disastrous, so the inclusion of it shouldnt make you second guess the game.
Point blank the "method" not the inclusion of the "drip feed is what is ridiculous, nonsensical, and arbitrary
As I said earlier
While most people seem to think that the 9 day wait is much worse than having to unlock things while you play I have to disagree. I rather wait those 9 days and play 5 minutes per day than wasting a whole day doing tasks I might not like just for the sake of unlocking things. I wish other Nintendo games would work like that. Playing Mario Kart and unlocking things is a chore. Same with Smash bros.
Of course I wish I wouldn't have to unlock things at all in certain games. Especially in multiplayer games.
Of course I wish I wouldn't have to unlock things at all in certain games. Especially in multiplayer games.
I don't like this because it's an artificial limit on when you get access to content. It's litteraly nothing you can do to get to it faster.
It's completely different to getting to the final boss or unlocking content by playing because the gate to that content is you.
If you are a very skilled player and beat the levels fast you get to content faster.
In Super Mario Maker you can't do anything to speed up getting to new content.
It's completely different to getting to the final boss or unlocking content by playing because the gate to that content is you.
If you are a very skilled player and beat the levels fast you get to content faster.
In Super Mario Maker you can't do anything to speed up getting to new content.
Yeah I'm not sure why Splatoon keeps getting brought up when the best comparison for this sort of thing would be Minecraft. Kids have learned the ins and outs of that game (which is likely far more complex that Mario Maker) without major handholding from Mojang.
Vampirolol
Member
So it's like paying on-disc DLC with time instead of money?... ok I guess.
You can't make advanced stuff in Minecraft from the very beginning, so no. It's the same thing but unlocked in different ways.
I'm sure it was this. It's not a big deal at all.
Plus stuff unlocking feels good. I'm down for this more than ever.
I'm a little surprised at the confusion this is causing. It's not some server unlock with downloads. It's all on disc and you unlock stuff as you play on a day by day basis. The 9 day cycle is unique to every player starting the first time they play the game and requiring them to put in at least 5 mins of play a day.
Would you agree that 9 - 5 minute tasks that you can do at your own pace, that unlock content would be the better implementation. Content is still drip-fed, and if you so chose, you dont have to "waste a whole day doing tasks"
That setup would satisfy both camps.
Captain Europe
Member
What am I even reading, no one is forcing you to waste a day, you can play the game the next day and unlock things then. Rewarding the player with content by progressing is a good thing. Giving a player a gimped game for 9 days isn't, especially cos most gamers binge game a new game on the day they buy it.
Simbabbad
Member
It's sad that someone has to bother making a whole article to explain an obvious, common sense decision in line with everything Nintendo has always stood for.
It's even sadder that some people will yell at him and continue crying and saying nonsense.
*sigh* it has nothing to do with Splatoon. Many if not most construction kits unlock content slowly to help people understand the structure of the creation process and acclimate to each tool.
It won't change anything, you have to use it for at least 9 days. It's to avoid people try to skip the tutorial, and make them design simpler levels at first.
Exactly.
Give it a rest. I'm calling out the "kids" vs "adults" BS.
I have no idea how you could post this and the next post with a straight face
"I'm not on this side of the extreme, but people who say they are okay with this are clearly defending it"
NoKisum
Member
Nintendo should've just followed current gaming trends and set up microtransactions. Those who want to unlock all the tools right away can pay a little more to do so, while those who wish to wait can simply stick with the current method and play around with the tools as they become available.
Nintendo gets more money, and those who want "early access" can do so. Everybody wins.
Nintendo gets more money, and those who want "early access" can do so. Everybody wins.
wild wild rice
Member
What does sales have to do with anything?
If they did that, I can guarantee the outrage would be twice as large. Micro transactions to get all the content in the game you just paid for sounds a lot worse to people than what they're actually doing.
FWIW, even Skyward Sword, which was on a much more popular console, sold IIRC just about the same as Wind Waker. WW has also done quite well in its re-release I think. But gamers (and people) are averse to significant change, especially when it's a perceived-as-kiddy direction.
Well that is a point, but you cannot compare that to people that take their time for games at home. People at E3 are highly stressed, always in front of a camera and then they have to play "good". Of course these people are under stress and won't have the time to grasp everything, because they want to show the game off.
Edit: Did you ever livestream or make gaming YouTube videos? It happens to many people that aren't familiar with doing these things.
I don't like this and I won't buy it now because of this. Nintendo won't even care because it is just one sale less, but my mind does not support this shit.
NoKisum
Member
Well everyone seems to be appalled at the idea of unlocking stuff in games without money, so I figured my idea would've been the better course of action.
thecouncil
Banned
I like this paragraph:
It's my biggest fear with the online community. I expect few straight, inventive level designs and many 'fill the screen with big flying enemies' designs with fire bars and spikes everywhere.
Gunstar Ikari
Unconfirmed Member
I remember hearing a lot of this when I was arguing against unlockable Smash Bros. characters. It doesn't apply there, and it doesn't apply here, either.
This game is a level editor with a few stages bundled in. There is no campaign. There is no "real" progression. Therefore, there is no good reason to lock anything.
Sho_Nuff82
Member
Natural unlocks through discovery or progress is how 99% of games work though.
Hell, the Batman Arkham series and GTA 4 don't let you travel the entire open world or use all the gadgets at the start. Plants vs Zombies doesn't let you use all the units at once. But they, like Minecraft, allow the player to progress at their own skill level and gameplay pace. If you want to spend an evening farming for loot, you can progress faster than your friends who play just an hour a day. Nintendo has removed that option in favor of "you must content yourself with these tools each day, or just leave it running in the background and come back in a week and a half."
Nintendo's choice here eliminates player urgency and tries clumsily to eliminate the talent gap. Some people could theoretically make amazing levels day 1 with all of the tools. Nintendo doesn't want that though. I would hazard a guess that they want to promote more creation over people being passive users of others' content, but no one can force this kind of talent or creativity onto people.
On the bright side, at least, I believe the levels have to be beaten by the creator before being uploaded.
Captain Europe
Member
I'm sorry but Nintendo isn't this perfect entitiy that makes perfect choices all the time. I think they're the best gaming company and I love them for putting gameplay first and being one of the few that care about 60fps. But let's not pretend they don't get brain farts every now and then, like the branding of the Wii U, or blindly following the 3D fad, excluding same sex relationships in that Mii game, etc. They do seem to learn from past mistakes, so I hope this shit stops with SMM and doesn't bleed into Smash and MK.
Stallion Dan
Member
So if it is 9 days from you first play it, can you just change the console's clock? 9 times if need be.
Simbabbad
Member
... and irritating/insulting sounds. I don't understand that Nintendo avoids voice chat but apparently will let you record sounds with the gamepad mic (or did I misunderstand this)?
Anyway, I hope the rating system will work correctly.
Good thing I never said that, then?
wild wild rice
Member
Isn't there some sort of filtering or "Nintendo selected levels" or something? I plan on letting that do the quality control work for me.
I don't think the community will really upvote an overwhelming amount of half asses kaizo levels. Maybe at first, but it will get old quick.
Vampirolol
Member
I'm sure there's plenty of people capable of making Kaizo Mario, we as a community have the duty to find and recommend them to other gaffers.
Captain Europe
Member
Well you sure sound like you find they made the absolute perfect decision with this and the other side are just craycray babies for complaining about it.